Welcome to the forum.
You do indeed have a ".455 Hand Ejector - 2nd Model", shipped Jan 6, 1916.
THERE ARE FOUR BASIC VERSIONS OF .455 chambered Hand Ejector revolvers made by S&W under contract to the British for WW I. Three of the versions, 1., 2., & 4. are 'triple lock' models, but those in the 4th group are actually the same as 1st versions. “If” roll marked with the cal., all that are roll marked are only marked 455 because all versions are actually reamed to also chamber the longer 455 MK I cartridge per the British contract. Therefore the ‘book’ references to caliber marking of 455 Mark II for all versions of S&W 455 chambered revolvers is a bit of a misnomer.
This is not to be confused with the British revolver name “MK II” for the “455 Mark II HE – 2nd Model", on which the British stamped “II” on the left rear frame of the revolvers and are known as such by them.
Note: The WWI British contract Colt revolver is marked ".455 ELEY", different than the S&W 455 marking, but the same cartridge.
Revolver markings vary greatly depending on the country of use, military units where they were used, and when/where they were imported, proofed, exported, etc.
There were other ways for these to make their way across the Big Pond to Britain besides thru the usual Remington route; first across the border to Canada, or originally sold here in the states on the retail market and then immigrated somewhere else as evidenced by various and assorted non - USA import, export, approval, or proof stamps. Stamps also vary contingent upon how any particular revolver made the "trip(s)", official vs. unofficial channels, and how long after WWI because stamping protocol changed over time.
THEY ARE:
1. “.44 HE - 1st Model”, ‘Triple Lock’, .455 chambering: 812* factory reconfigured unassembled or any unsold ".44 Spl HE 1st Model", original chamberings unknown but most or all were likely originally .44 Spl. For the British military there are 666 #s 1104 thru 10417 (obviously not all serial #s in this range were used for the 666), the majority shipped Oct 21, 1914. The extra 146 in serial range #s 9858-10007 went to the commercial market; 123 to England Oct 1,1914, and 23 in the US Jan 1, 1918 [N&J pgs. 203-205]. These 812 .455 TLs were serial #’d in the .44 1st Model serial # range of 1104 to 10417. Per Neal & Jinks. Pg. 214, these are known to have been stamped SMITH & WESSON but not including the 455 cal. stamp.
* SCSW reports "over 800", but by shipped serial # count, it’s actually 812, 146 of which are commercial guns [S&W N&J pgs. 203 - 205].
The 666 were shipped in 33 different groups ranging from 4/8/14 to 4/28/16 with the majority delivered 10/21/14. These will often have added lanyard swivels when converted to 455 at the factory by drilling thru the serial # which is factory re-stamped on the left side of the grip frame under the stock.
The 146 .44 HE 1st Models that were converted/built as .455s assembled some time after the first 666 military .44 1st Model .455 TLs and sold commercially; 123 were sold to the British, shipped to Wilkinson Sword 10/1/14 and 23 sold in the US, shipped to Shapleigh Hardware in St. Louis, MO. on 1/1/1918. Some are not seen with lanyard swivels.
The 23 at some point were converted to .45 Colt and it’s unknown if by the factory before shipment to Shapleigh or after delivery to Shapleigh. However even IF converted by the factory (as suggested in a September 2013 Rock Island gun auction narrative and likely just a story), the revolvers would not have a star on the butt or a rework date on the grip frame because they did not go back to the factory for conversion as rework, again, if they were converted by the factory at all. See #9860 here:
Can you help me identify?
2. “.455 Mark II HE - 1st Model TL” in the new .455 British serial # range 1 to over 5800* shipped 1914-15. Thus creating 67** duplicate serial #s with the 666 1st version in #1. above in the “.44 HE 1st Model TL” .455 factory conversion serial number range.
*Previously reported as 1 to 5461. After this shipment there were some of this model sold commercially all in the 5502 - 5857 range, but including a few military issues in that range as well.
Do not post: “The .455 H.E. First Model 5462 is in the last shipment [1915] of the model for the British Government. After this shipment there were some of this model sold commercially. The serial number range actually go[es] to 5800 [at least, and all in the 5502 - 5857 range, but] including a few military issues in that range as well]. Since the factory did not keep any records of the cut off at the end of a model change, it has taken years to put together all the data to obtain the correct serial ranges. I have to tell you that in the game of collecting S&W's for 50 years I still am learning about various models and changes I did not think were possible when I started this research.” Roy 8/25/18
Thank you Roy! That also helps explain why I have no .455 H.E. 2nd Models in the 5000 serial range in my 455 database!
Triple Lock 455 HE 1st Model Discovery/Puzzle
**There are 67 possible duplicates of TL #s of the existing 666 military shipped contract listed numbers of .44 HE 1st Model TLs factory converted to .455 (1st version above), #s 1104-5755 in the .44 HE # range (not all inclusive, known and listed [S&W 1857 – 1945 pgs. 204-205]), with 67 of the .455 HE 1st Model TLs (2nd version) #s 1 to 5800 in the Brit contract # range.
There can be ~ 4988 2nd version .455 TLs duplicated serial #s with.44 TLs.
There’s also duplicate #s of the .44 HE 1st Model TL .455s #5801 to #15375 (the last .44 HE 1st Model TL serial # known), of ~796 with .455 HE 2nd Models (3rd version) #s 5801 up thru #10007 in the Brit range, but the exact #s of duplicates is unknown because not all #s are known to have been used in either range.
3. “.455 Mark II HE - 2nd Model” (sans extractor barrel shroud and 3rd lock), and the cylinder ctr pin hole in the extractor star is reduced .020” with the associated Ext Rod rear tip reduced .020” in diameter from the TL versions, the ".44 HE 1st Model Triple Lock" factory converted to .455, and the ".455 HE 1st Model Triple Lock" produced in .455 (documented in Neal & Jinks Pg. 215-16.) This version was referred to as the MK II revolver by the British and stamped ‘II’ by them, upper left rear side of frame. The 2nd Model continued in the .455 1st Model TL Brit serial range and beginning ~ after #5857 (previously thought to be 5462) to #74755, shipped 1915-17.
By Feb 1916 724* were manufactured for the Canadians, chambered in 45 Colt, without a cartridge roll mark on barrel, presumed for the RCMP [H of S&W, 3rd ed., pg. 203]. #74744
Another 15** in 45 Colt were sold commercially in 1916; likely “over run” guns from the above order with consecutive #s. Only#46748 is known.
The Canadian military also bought 14,500*** .455 2nd Models [H of S&W, pg. 203].
And 1105 2nd Models were released for commercial sales in the US, shipped Dec 1917 to Shapleigh Hardware in St. Louis [S&W, N&J pg. 216].
*”Roy's comments on that model might be helpful here [regarding an original Factory .45 Colt # 74744 that shipped on May 4, 1917]:" Bob 'Bettis1' #74301 also known.
Do not post: “Between April and June 1917 Smith & Wesson manufactured 700 plus units of 2nd Models that are listed in the manufacturing records as .45 Colt caliber. Unfortunately the manufacturing records did not record serial numbers. The shipping records for this model list, in this same time period, the sale of 703 units, but the shipping records do not list the caliber. I am positive that the sale of these 703 units are the .45 Colt listed in the manufacturing records. The extra 3 units [or 24 units] could have been manufactured from revolvers that had already been assembled." Roy Jinks
“The 727 [724]number could be correct but there have only been a small number that are from this shipment, less than 20 documented.” Jim Fisher ‘bmg60’ post #8 here:
2nd Model Hand Ejector - 45 LC?
**“The run of 15 with consecutive serial numbers, made in 1916 are all commercial, #46748 from that range is documented and owned by Jim Fisher. There is no cal markings on this gun and the only other markings are the standard. Roy had to research the build records to find them because the shipping records didn’t list the cal. The front sights on these factory chambered for.45 Colt is a little higher [than 455 revolvers]. This is the only one of the 15 that is known. Roy said he guessed the other 14 were for a shipment to some other country.” Jim Fisher ‘bmg60’ post #18 here:
2nd Model Hand Ejector - 45 LC?
***Canadian military shipments of 14,500 .455s:
-1500 Shipped after Aug. 1915
-850 Shipped thru December 24th, 1915
-150 Shipped thru March 31st, 1916
-6000 Shipped thru July 22nd, 1916
-6000 Shipped February 10, 1917
At least 1 #728XX shipped July 29th, 1916, see post #10:
.455 Hand Ejector 45 Colt
4. “.44 HE - 1st Model”, ‘Triple Lock’, same as #1. above, but not likely converted .44s, just assembled into .455s:
“As the Brit contracts were finishing up in April, 1916, [H of S&W pg. 203] S&W found enough [HE 1st Model TL frames, possibly already numbered as .44s, and .455 barrels and cyls] to build 691 .44 HE 1st Model [per Roy Jinks in various letters] Triple Lock frames [for chambering in .455* like #1. above]. These guns are numbered in the .44 Spl serial number series. I have no idea why they were not just numbered in the .455 series. Perhaps it was .455 barrels and cylinders that the factory found, and they simply turned again to existing 44 HE 1st Model TL frames to use them up. They were sold commercially.” Lee Jarrett
11/3/15 “In April, 1916, the Factory found enough parts to assemble 691 Triple Lock 455s. They were assembled from April to Oct of 1916. They were numbered [late] in the 44 HE series. All I have seen are numbered from the 12,000 to 14,000's. [in 1916 and 1917 - 325 were sold to Shapleigh Hardware Co. and some to Simmons Hardware Co., St. Louis, MO.]
Some letter as being commercial sales, but I have long suspected that S&W simply slid many into the last of the British shipments at the standard price for the 455-2nd Models. I say that because I have observed several now with Brit ordnance marks and/or commercial proofs.” Lee Jarrett
Gun ID help please .455
Linear Mode
