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S&W Hand Ejectors: 1896 to 1961 All 5-Screw & Vintage 4-Screw SWING-OUT Cylinder REVOLVERS, and the 35 Autos and 32 Autos


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  #101  
Old 08-05-2011, 01:24 PM
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Here's a couple I often carry. 1957 Mod 38 and 1955 Agent



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  #102  
Old 08-05-2011, 06:47 PM
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Forget this .41 LC Army Special sans front sight and cut down ejector rod.

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Old 08-05-2011, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by 681ismyfavorite View Post
LOBO, who installed, and for how much, that Big Dot Night Sight?
I installed it myself. It's a straight forward process that is easily accomplished with the correct tools. The sight comes with instructions that are easy to follow. I ordered the sight from Brownells.
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  #104  
Old 08-05-2011, 10:06 PM
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Default Here's my candidate for a belly gun

I got this Pre Victory from a friend who needed some money. I would have just gave him the money but he would not allow but said he would sell me this gun he had so I said yes sight unseen he just said it was an old Smith it has been converted to 38 spl barrel cut and refinished now I think I know what I will do with it.
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  #105  
Old 08-05-2011, 11:38 PM
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Here is one of my favorite "Belly Guns". A S&W 1917 D.A. Army (Fitz Special).
It was a wreck when I purchased it. The S&W was rebuilt by Dave Sams, and refinished by Mag-Na-Port.

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  #106  
Old 09-02-2011, 04:48 PM
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Mag-Na-Port Charter Arms BullDog .44 Special.
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  #107  
Old 09-02-2011, 06:14 PM
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Whitecoyote, now you have one "snub nose" for each of your cycle boots.
Hope you never have to ask the question.......

"Now you have to ask yourself, do you want me to shoot you with my right boot gun or my left boot gun?" "Well which one is it punk"
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  #108  
Old 09-03-2011, 09:46 AM
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Default My wife's belly gun

I have seen other Colt Agents here so thought mine appropriate.
Got it with ugly rubber grips and made the Rosewood grips and one of a kind T grip. Holster is also my own design.
10/22.
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Old 09-03-2011, 09:59 AM
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Well another Non-Smith. I had the Colt Custom Shop shorten this one from the stock 3" to a 2". The ivory grips were oversized roughed out panels that I finished myself. I left them a little to large and plan on downsizing them soon. Altough they do absorb recoil quite well like they are. Wyatt Burp did the leather. This gun gets shot with 45 Colt and 45ACP cylinders. Great carry gun open or closed and just to much fun for plinking.



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  #110  
Old 09-03-2011, 10:15 AM
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Ahh...this is my favorite thus far!
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  #111  
Old 09-03-2011, 10:24 AM
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Here are pix of my contrib to the world of BBBGs, before and after. Right now I'm engraving it, next to Turnbulls for blue. Grips I made from ebony.



Last edited by rhmc24; 09-03-2011 at 10:27 AM. Reason: typo
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  #112  
Old 09-03-2011, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
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Well another Non-Smith. I had the Colt Custom Shop shorten this one from the stock 3" to a 2". The ivory grips were oversized roughed out panels that I finished myself. I left them a little to large and plan on downsizing them soon. Altough they do absorb recoil quite well like they are. Wyatt Burp did the leather. This gun gets shot with 45 Colt and 45ACP cylinders. Great carry gun open or closed and just to much fun for plinking.



That is a sick gun. I love the fire blue. You said they shortened a stock 3" gun? Do you know if the custom shop will make a barrel this short from the factory if you order one?
My evil plan is to one day have one just like yours only in nickel.
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  #113  
Old 09-03-2011, 10:59 AM
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That is a sick gun. I love the fire blue. You said they shortened a stock 3" gun? Do you know if the custom shop will make a barrel this short from the factory if you order one?
My evil plan is to one day have one just like yours only in nickel.

Twaits, I do not see the Sheriffs model or the Shopkeepers model listed in the new Colts cataloge. The last years cataloge had them listed as nickel only guns but I had not seen any show up any where for sale so I dont know if they made it to market or not. I'm sure if the still have some of the ejectorless frames they would make you anything you want. They may be making the ejectorless frames from the same forgings as the other SAA's I'm not sure. Heres a picture of what Colt now calls the BP frame with and without the ejector so you can decide. I know it's not traditional but if I was ordering one I would get the 45ACP cylinder at least as an add on. I have got the Custom shop to do things that they dont list in their cataloge before by just asking.

Last edited by REP; 09-03-2011 at 11:03 AM.
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  #114  
Old 09-03-2011, 02:56 PM
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U.S.F.A. with a 2" barrel, .45 Colt.
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  #115  
Old 09-03-2011, 03:39 PM
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whitecoyote, Thats real sweet. I've always wanted one just like that sans the lanyard loop as I would want it for CCW. I was told they were next to impossible to obtain. Colt offers a birdshead back strap for the SAA and I've been considering it.
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  #116  
Old 09-23-2011, 11:52 PM
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I know this thread has aged a few days. As I'm new to the forums here, I'm not totally hip on protocol. If my question is out of line as it is off topic, I'm sorry.

I recently found a "belly gun" at a local pawn shop. It's a colt, snub but not sure of the model just yet. It struck me just as I saw this, I had no ideas what I was looking at. I'm going back in the morning to fondle it and wanted some insight into the pistol.
It has a cut back trigger guard, but that's all I know as of now. Is there distinguishing marks I need to look for to know who customized this gun? Is there a collectibility for this gun, I would buy it just for the cool factor, but it would make my wife happy for it to have a profitable track record.

Again sorry if I'm breaking the rules. Please let me know if so.
Deej
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  #117  
Old 09-24-2011, 01:05 AM
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Deej

Your post is perfectly OK.

To really get any help you need to take some pictures and copy down
any markings and numbers.

There is a tutorial for posting pics, if you have trouble, let the forum know and someone will help.

Welcome, be warned, very easy to start-very hard to stop

Not that you would want to.
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  #118  
Old 09-25-2011, 09:45 PM
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[IMG][/IMG]



These are the only pics I could get. There is the serial number. It doesnt have a bobbed hammer. You guys know anything about it?
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  #119  
Old 09-25-2011, 09:50 PM
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Can't tell you much about it, other than it's sweet looking!
Nice catch.
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Old 09-25-2011, 09:56 PM
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I'm liking the looks of it...got some character! Looks like someone did a good job on the trigger guard.

I like the way the bottom of the frame (where the trigger was attached in front) has the resulting "stump" smoothly removed.
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Old 09-25-2011, 10:10 PM
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Haha!
I haven't picked it up yet. I'm not.sure I have the cash of yet. The shop owners a friend of mine, he ran the serial but doesn't know if its a true fitz. He says its a pre war gun, but the hammer is still as it was from the factory. I dont want to post the price set, but wanted to know what a going price would be. If I dont buy it, i want to help him find someone who will appreciate it for what it is. Thanks guys.

Oh, if you can't see the serial is 405389.
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Old 09-25-2011, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocked & Locked View Post
I'm liking the looks of it...got some character! Looks like someone did a good job on the trigger guard.

I like the way the bottom of the frame (where the trigger was attached in front) has the resulting "stump" smoothly removed.

I thought about that as I looked at it. It's totally smoothed as if it was never attached in the front. Felt great in my hands, its something I would live to have, but as a newly wed, and planning on having a baby in the next while, I don't want to put out too much money (at least money she knows about) without knowing the worth. I never buy new guns intown since, thwy are not competitive as online. But I tend to find decent "relics" at good prices around here. It's just I dont know the real world worth of this piece.
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  #123  
Old 09-25-2011, 10:45 PM
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Hi thedeej,


The Revolver in question is an early 1932 Colt Detective Special...

If there is a "Verified Proof'' stamp on the area where the reat top of the Trigger Bow meets the Frame, then it may indeed be a Factory Cut-away.

This stamping normally went on thew front Trigger top meets frame area, and, Factory Cut-Aways tended to have them placed at the rear, since there was no longer a 'front' area for them to go.


If you get it, you might do well to send off to Colt for having it Lettered...to see if it indeed shipped this way.

If you do not decide to get it, I would be interested in it...if you would not mind letting me know?

I have been wanting a Cut-Away 1930s Detective Special and I have not had the Heart to cut up one!

Last edited by Oyeboteb; 09-25-2011 at 10:47 PM.
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  #124  
Old 09-25-2011, 10:54 PM
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You are looking at a Colt Detective Special, or possibly a

factory 2" Police Positive, but also could be a shortened

Police Positive. Dates to 32-33.

A factory Fitz would have a bobbed hammer.

Condition is fair. Check function and lock-up.

If you can get a clear picture of the barrel markings it will
be much easier to determine what it is. Or write them down.

My guess is a cut down police positive.

If it is and function is good, I would call it a $300 shooter,max.
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  #125  
Old 09-25-2011, 11:10 PM
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Thanks Gaucho1.
I'll get another look in the morning, gotta pay on a smith i have in lay-away. 3 is a good bit less than they have on it, & its been sitting in the case since I first went up there a couple years ago. I'll post more tomorrow...
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  #126  
Old 09-25-2011, 11:40 PM
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The Text stampings on the Barrel appear to me to be those of an early 1930s Colt Detective Special.

This would say Detective Special 38 Special on the left side, and, have a 1926 Patent date with some Colt Address info on the right side.

There would be no lettering on the top of the Barrel in this instance.

These texts would not be found if this were a Police Positive Special which had been shortened.

Colt would do a 'Cut-Away' Trigger Bow on request, whether or not it was actually done by Mr. Fitzgerald himself...as well as that Mr. Fitzgerald himself, would do a Cut-away, with or without a Bobbed Hammer, or do a Bobbed Hammer, with or wiothout a Cut-Away Trigger Bow, according to the Customer's wishes.

In theory, when Colt did the Cut-Away Trigger Bow front, they stamped their "VP" Mark on the rear top of the Trigger Bow where it meets the frame, instead of Stamping it in their usual place on the front top of the Trigger Bow ( which front top area of the Trigger Bow of course is absent on the Cut-Away version ).

"VP" will be found on the left side front top of the Trigger Bow, of regular Colt Revolvers and Automatics after about 1905.


Cut-Aways were usually a consideration for Winter Gloves or Motorcycle Gloves, when the Revolver was to be carried in a Holster, whether IWB or Shoulder or whatever.

Some people liked them even if not anticipating Gloves, since they felt it allowed a little faster readyness.

Bobbed Hammer was for 'Pocket' Carry, though some IWB or Shoulder Holster folks also liked a Bobbed Hammer in their own right.

And, a lot of boys and girls used to do their own also, or, they would have their local Gunsmith do it, so there are always old "period" versions of Cut-aways with or without Bobbed Hammers, or Bobbed Hammers, with or without Cut-Aways, which were not done by Colt.
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  #127  
Old 09-26-2011, 12:20 AM
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Oyeboteb is right on the mark.

As far as a factory "Fitz", as far as I am aware both the trigger
guard and hammer would be cut.

Also, Colt would do what the customer wanted, so the guard may or may not be factory.

Some would have a correct DS barrel added later, either by
gunsmith or factory. With the consistent finish wear, it is
very difficult to tell.

A cut barrel will sometimes show little or odd crown.

Also, even a very well done front site installation will usually
have evidence of not being original.

Upon the knowledgeable comments I can see no reason this
could not be a RB modified DS.

I got tangled thinking about square butt DSs from the same period.

Good luck and let us know how it works out.
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  #128  
Old 09-26-2011, 12:57 AM
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Good reminders goucho1,

Indeed, as the Police Positive Special, and, the Detective Special, were in the same Serial Numbering...it is not possible to tell at a glance, if one is seeing a Police Positive Special, which was later re-Barrelled with a Detective Special Barrel of the same period as it's Frame...or, if one is looking at a normal and intact Detective Special.

No doubt this re-Barreling was done at times, and can be done today also, using old orphan DS Barrels elected to match the time poeriod of the PPS Frame.

A Colt 'Letter' would likely solve that question of course.

I myself do not know what a factory Cut-Away would be expected to bring on say Gunbroker, if this Revolver 'lettered' as having left the Colt Factory this way.

As you correctly point out, this is possibly not the same as, nor should be spoken of as, being a 'Fitz Special', since that phrase usually has come to denote a Bobbed Hammer and also a Cut-Away Trigger Bow which can actuall ybe attributed, one way or another, to the actual Hand of Mr. Fitzgerald.

But all this is a little vague or imperfect, since at least my understanding is, that such mods were done by Colts without Mr. Fitzgerald having touched them, as well as that Mr. Fitzgerald himself at times only did the Cut-Away and left the Hammer be as-is, or did a 'Hammer Bob' and left the Trigger Bow intact, and did either to Revolvers sent in for it which had already been in use a while and hence would never 'Letter' as having shipped that way, so...I guess we live with these vagueries of what to call these old variations for now, and even how to decide if a candidate is a Colt modification or a Modification done by someone else.

If it has the "VP" where it belongs to be a Colt Factory item, probably we would be alright to call it a "Fitz Special", if it in fact 'Letters' as having shipped that way, when it falls within the period when Mr. Fitzgerald was known to have been active at Colt...or if there is a chain of provenance which specificially mentions the modification or term, in cases where a Revolver was sent in for the mods, rather than having been ordered that way.

Where, Revolvers sent in for the modification some time after they had been bought and carried a while, to have the modifications done by Colt or done by Mr. Fitzgerald, would never 'letter' as having shipped that way...and might not have gotten a little 'Star' stamped on to them either, so, it is all a little messy! And, those s-h-o-u-l-d have the "VP' at the rear, but they may not.




So I am out of my depth on the aspect of proposing an evaluation for Value, as for whether on a gamble it would be a good investment or not at whatever the present Seller's price is.


I myself like old 'period' Cut Downs and Modifieds, whether done privately or by Colt's...so I would be happy, regardless.

I made a tribute to 'Fitz' out of a 1960s S&W Model 36 many years ago for Pocket Carry when I was riding my Motocycle a lot.

Does not work as well of course with the '5 Screw' era S&Ws...

Last edited by Oyeboteb; 09-26-2011 at 01:14 AM.
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  #129  
Old 09-26-2011, 01:23 PM
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[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

Ok. For some reason, Photobucket really degrades my pic quality. But...
The right side above the rear of trigger guard there is a fancy engraved. Looked like a vr to me. The left side above the rear of the trigger guard is a 3. It is a detective special and looks to be the original length of the barrel. Kinda cool little gun. The lock up is good. The guy told me, an older lady brought it in.

Last edited by thedeej; 09-26-2011 at 02:46 PM. Reason: wrong picture put up
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  #130  
Old 09-26-2011, 07:18 PM
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I looked it up too, I could see it after seeing this...
http://www.milsurps.com/images/impor...1/colt17-1.jpg
It looks like NO triangle, but its a gun made in 1932-33, right? Thanks.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:13 PM
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Looks like a DS with a modified trigger guard.

Go to gunbroker and search Detective Special. You can go to advanced search and see what the market did in the last 90 days.

That will give you a feel for the market and you can compare value.

Unless you are able to verify factory modification, I still
see this gun as a fair condition shooter, assuming lockup and function are in good shape.

Proof house confirms dating based on serial number.

Hope this is helpful and best of luck whatever your decision.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gaucho1 View Post
Looks like a DS with a modified trigger guard.

Go to gunbroker and search Detective Special. You can go to advanced search and see what the market did in the last 90 days.

That will give you a feel for the market and you can compare value.

Unless you are able to verify factory modification, I still
see this gun as a fair condition shooter, assuming lockup and function are in good shape.

Proof house confirms dating based on serial number.

Hope this is helpful and best of luck whatever your decision.
Thanks gaucho.
Looks like a lot of fish without many bites. For the price I can get it, I would not make a profit, much less getting it lettered, heck, I would be in the black.
Thanks guys for all the feedback. I'm sorry to high jack the thread.
It's wild you join a site dedicated to singular brand only to ask about another (pretty bold for only 11 posts) brand all together. Thanks again.
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Old 10-06-2011, 09:38 PM
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1915 Colt Police Positive Special.

Before:



After cutting the barrel to 1 1/4" and spending hours polishing then nickel plating:





Here's a couple with black grips installed. These are vintage gun grips repros but I think they look great on the nickel.




Last edited by twaits; 10-07-2011 at 10:09 PM.
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Old 10-06-2011, 10:24 PM
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Now that's without a doubt a belly gun!
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  #135  
Old 10-06-2011, 11:47 PM
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Bet you get some muzzle flash from that flingot!
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Old 10-06-2011, 11:48 PM
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Too bad the original gun had to die to make this one, but man it's a sweet piece. Any accuracy and chrony tests? I mean even with the short sight radius....oh wait....
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Old 10-07-2011, 01:15 AM
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That is one sweet revolver twaits!
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Old 10-07-2011, 06:39 AM
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Too bad the original gun had to die to make this one, but man it's a sweet piece. Any accuracy and chrony tests? I mean even with the short sight radius....oh wait....
I actually had a hard time cutting it up at first but I'm glad I did now. There are hundreds of thousands of Police Positive Specials around and they don't have much collector value unless they are in really high condition. This one I bought from gunbroker for $175
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Old 10-07-2011, 07:01 AM
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Default My Big Bore Belly Re-Creations

First one is .45ACP the other .45 Colt

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Old 10-07-2011, 09:01 PM
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Model 36 "no dash"


Chiefs Special Airweight


Model 12 "no dash"
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Old 10-27-2011, 11:40 PM
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10-8 with a 2 1/2"




29-4 with a 3"

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Old 11-25-2011, 09:53 AM
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I need to get my bellygun up on the board. (not a big bore) But I have a question about midgetizing my '37 Brazillian. Would a board member wish to PM me to talk at length about making it into a bellygun? TIA Packy
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Old 11-26-2011, 12:02 PM
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I love this thread, it's like opening a present every time it pops up 'cause you never know what you'll find inside!

I've posted this gun in another thread or two but it deserves to be in this one as well. It's a Mag-na-port custom "Backpacker", number 128 of 250 built from .44spl Charter Arms Bulldogs back in the late 70's. They chopped and ported the barrel, shaved the front sight, bobbed the hammer, gave it a very nice action job, and then hard chromed it. They came in a Mag-na-port embossed leather gun rug with Pachmayr grips. I swapped the Pachmayrs for current production boot grips from Charter Arms.



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Old 11-26-2011, 12:37 PM
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Very nice WC145!
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Old 11-26-2011, 05:48 PM
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Another cut down Victory owned, converted and operated by FBI SA George Gillum who started out his FBI career in Rock Springs, Wyoming and after getting married in 1948, was transferred to Las Vegas where he served until he retired in 1970. He served in NV at the time when Vegas was becoming Vegas with all the Mafia ties and influences. His neice Cami Hay, from whom I acquired George's revolver described him as the "tough, silent type that no one messed with, at least more than once." He must of been having served and survived in Vegas all those early years.
Chuck


This looks a great deal like a gun once owned by the late Geoffrey Boothroyd, and used on the cover of the hardback edition of Ian Fleming's Bond novel, "From Russia, With Love", if I recall the right book.

There is a story behind it. Artist Richard Chopping was loaned the gun to illustrate it, and someone was murdered with a .38 at that time. The cops came around to see Boothroyd's gun and there was some red tape to be cleared up, as Chopping had no UK firearms permit allowing him to possess it.

Boothroyd modified the gun as there were no new US guns available there due to currency/import restrictions at the time. That was about 1956.

Fleming bought his Centennial (maybe the Airweight?) in New York on a US visit. Boothroyd had advised him to get that model, suggesting that it was the ideal James Bond gun. Fleming chose the Walther PPK instead, as he liked small autos. But he definitely bought an S&W Centennial for himself.

BY the time his superb, "The Handgun" appeared in the late 1960's, the Model 60 was available, and Boothroyd recommended it as the ideal Bond gun, due to the stainless construction. But Ian Fleming was dead by then, and nothing ever came of that idea.

Last edited by Texas Star; 07-07-2012 at 05:35 PM.
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Old 11-26-2011, 07:18 PM
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Great thread and some fine examples of "real" world CYA!
This little "squeezer" is the only current gun to fit the bill.
There'e another getting a new rebound spring, but it'll have to wait.
The pic of the two behemoth revolvers are post-war and are factory
belly guns.
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Attached Images
File Type: jpg 32 New Departure, 2nd model 001.jpg (85.3 KB, 220 views)
File Type: jpg 32 New Departure, 2nd model 002.jpg (74.4 KB, 201 views)
File Type: jpg 32 New Departure, 2nd model 003.jpg (58.3 KB, 213 views)
File Type: jpg improved i-frame 002.jpg (70.5 KB, 212 views)
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  #147  
Old 11-26-2011, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by WC145 View Post
I love this thread, it's like opening a present every time it pops up 'cause you never know what you'll find inside!

I've posted this gun in another thread or two but it deserves to be in this one as well. It's a Mag-na-port custom "Backpacker", number 128 of 250 built from .44spl Charter Arms Bulldogs back in the late 70's. They chopped and ported the barrel, shaved the front sight, bobbed the hammer, gave it a very nice action job, and then hard chromed it. They came in a Mag-na-port embossed leather gun rug with Pachmayr grips. I swapped the Pachmayrs for current production boot grips from Charter Arms.



Very cool WC145, a true belly gun.
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:47 PM
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Default Couple of Colts

Colt Signature Series - 3rd Generation with 2 serial numbered matching barrels Quirt by Jesus Cadena


Colt M1917 45 acp


rayb
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Old 07-04-2012, 11:19 PM
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Very nice.
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Old 07-07-2012, 03:49 PM
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this is my 1978 model 19 belly gun
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