The owner of these guns will be along shortly, to talk about them. If he
posts these pictures, I will delete this message.










Later, Mike Priwer

The owner of these guns will be along shortly, to talk about them. If he
posts these pictures, I will delete this message.










Later, Mike Priwer

Thanks Mike for posting the pictures! Letter states the gun was shipped to Sr. Don Guillereo Clements, Mexico city Sept.22 1931. It shows heavy use, note the wear on the right corner of the hammer spur.Front sight has had a silver bead added,and the silver grips with Mexican snake &eagle overlay in brass, otherwise all matching.It has the best single and double action of any Smith I have owned.Every time I pick it up I think that "We don'need no stinking badges" Regards, Bart

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H.E;Bart

Those are K frame grips, but put on an N frame gun - often seen that way in Mexico. Are the grips hollow or solid siver. I used to make those as a kid on the border. Used melted down pesos poured into a sand cast mold that I made using K frame grips. The brass emblems made the same way with pieces of brass from old door knobs, etc. Por hombres pistolers muy malo y muy macho! Cuidado!

What a neat old .44 ... and what stories it could tell! Thanks for the post,

Jerry

Yes, I agree with Ed, those are K frame size, post war Magna style grips. They would look nice on an early post war K frame, maybe nickel finished. I also like the revolver, but those grips make it look a bit odd. If it were mine, I'd find some stag pre war service type grips or at least the correct factory grips for it. Perhaps a pair of pearl steerhead grips, in keeping with it's history. It's well worth the cost.

I've seen an awful lot of those Mexican made grips for revolvers and 1911's. Some were well made, some were pretty crude. Those look very nicely done. Best of luck!

I like the fact that it is a target model. I also don't recall seeing serated straps on a 2nd model before but I guess that went along with it being a target model. It has all the earmarks of a gun of that era, with patent info on the hammer and probably trigger too.
Very intersting gun.

Roger

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Eph 2:8-9

opoefc--Grips are hollow, probably made of peso silver,as you say, "McGivern" bead is a piece of the same silver. Lefty--I wont change any thing on the gun, but might add a nice old Mexican holster,if I knew someone who had one Regards, Bart

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H.E;Bart

It's exciting to see your .44 and to contemplate its history. Thanks for showing it to us!

Bart,

I applaud your decision not to change anything about the gun.

The grips, even though they were initially made for a different frame size, have been adapted to the .44. The gun, by itself, is just an old gun; perhaps a "shooter". The condition, when looked at alone, is less than collector quality. However, when the gun with those grips is put with the letter it lets the imagination soar!

To change it out would simply destroy the most important aspect of the gun...its history. In my opinion, to replace those grips with the correct ones,(even worn, correct ones) would be like replacing the rawhide and brass tacks on an Indian era Winchester with a fiberglass stock.

Bob

Bob;

.44 2nd. Targets aren't exactly falling out of the sky. I would opine that it is quite a worthy example, in and of itself, despite it's lackluster grade or condition. The known provenance shared by Mr. Bartlett in this post, consists of information that reflects the weapon was shipped to a Mexican gentleman, there is no reference in the historical letter to the Mexican silver and brass stocks. I assume the letter from Jinks would likely have indicated the type of factory stocks it was shipped with. That being the case, the grips could have been added at anytime, by anybody, after K frame Magnas were introduced, from which these are copied. Obviously sometime after it was shipped to the original owner, or any time thereafter, possibly by succeeding owners? But anytime thereafter notwithstanding provenance to the contrary. I am not suggesting they are irrelevant to it's history or unattractive. I heartily agree with your observation that they do cause one's "imagination to soar". Especially considering the geographical provenance to Mexico City and the gent to whom it was originally shipped. Apparently it has changed ownership through the years.

On the other hand, if there were clear surviving evidence such as a period photo of the original owner wearing that piece with those grips, or perhaps if the small panels placed on the stocks for engraving ones initials had been personalized, I'd be inclined to agree that replacing them would be inadviseable. Although they are attractive and have significant character, I believe they were more common at one time than most of us might imagine. Personally, I have seen very similar, if not identical stocks on dozens of 1911 autos and various revolvers here in New York, bought by tourists visitng Mexico and the southwestern U.S. during the 50's through the 70's. It may be the photos, but there doesn't seem to be much handwear on the applied brass stock embellishments and that seems to my eye, incompatible with the otherwise well worn overall condition of the weapon. Maybe they were only used for special presentations or occasions? Say, a fiesta or a BBQ? In any event, Mr. Bartlett will do, as he should, as he pleases.

Edited to add:

Just to avoid any misunderstanding concerning my remarks, I want to say that this is the typical type of specimen I admire. It's seen considerable service but is otherwise clean. It's "been there, done that."

Points well taken, Lefty. You and I usually agree on the desirability of retaining the history of these old timers and we certainly still do in this case.

Bob

BTW, I've got a beautiful pair of those "Mexican Folk Art" N frame grips that I got from LawandOrder. I was waiting for the appropriate old southwestern gun to put them on. This thread has motivated me to get them out and try them on several old guns. Perhaps a 100 years from now, some collector will post here that he got them from some crazy old Texan and he "just wishes they could talk".

B.

Bob;

We all seem to live "in the moment". Most of us forget that today is tommorows history. A Narc I worked with many years ago was of Mexican descent. He visited his family there a few times each year, an Irish Mother and Mexican Father and extended family. When he came back to NY he alway's had a few pair of those stocks to give for gifts and would delight in seeing the younger guys eyes light up when they saw them. He personally carried a pair of Colt Commanders that were nickel plated with gold trigger, hammer and slide release and man I gotta tell you...those grips looked like they were born on those shooters! I look forward to seeing yours. Cheers!

Thats a fine looking old revolver and the grips compliment it. It would look good in a Mexican holster.

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SWCA # 2294