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  #1  
Old 03-31-2010, 12:55 AM
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Default S&W Kit Guns---Model's 34 and 63 (.22lr)

Handloads.Com website shows Model 34 introduced in 1936 with no date for it's final year of production, although it is not listed on the current S&W website. Model 63 is shown as introduced in 1977 in stainless and it's apparently still being produced today without interruption.

As a recent S&W owner of a graceful little M34-1 I began wondering about the history of these two models which appear the same and seem to preform identical functions.

Perhaps someone would suggest research sources that would be helpful for me to find answers to such questions as:

1) What year was M34 production stopped?
2) What are the essential differences between the M34 and M63 other than the stainless material?
3) How many of each has been produced?
4) Why a M34 and a M63?

Thanks
HAM


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Old 03-31-2010, 06:01 AM
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The Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson by Jim Supica & Richard Nahas (SCSW) is the best source for most questions similar to your questions #1 through #3. It is on the shelf in most Barnes & Noble stores.

Production of model 34s stopped during 1991. Model 63s are still in the catalog. Production numbers for 34s and 63s are not in SCSW and probably not available. They were produced concurrently while the 34 remained profitable. Most non-stainless revolvers were dropped in the 1990s after market demand shifted to stainless guns.

S&W makes the best double action .22 revolvers in the world. Your M34-1 is an excellent little gun.

Best Regards;
Gil
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Old 03-31-2010, 08:06 AM
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They didn’t assign or stamp model numbers until 1957. The “Model 34” was introduced that year and was previously known as the .22/32 Kit Gun. The name refers to a .22 caliber built on a .32 sized frame with a relatively short barrel that makes it handy to have in a field kit or tackle box. The Model 34 was built on the Improved I frame, but in 1960 S&W standardized on the J frame and called it the Model 34-1. The 34-1 was in production until 1988, when it was replaced by the 34-2.

Until 1969, serial numbers (taken off the butt) were numeric only. S&W assigned an “M” prefix that year because of requirements from the GCA-68. The previous series (started in 1953 with the coil spring introduction) reached about 135,000, but it was used for a few different models.
The “M” series didn’t quite make 200,000, but they weren’t all the same model either.

I’ve seen more Model 34’s than all the others that shared the series put together (.22/32 Target, Airweight and Magnum), so I’ll take a wild guess and say they account for 75% of the serial numbers. It may be more. I'm not sure where model numbers started, but I'll guess it's around 30,000 in the 1953 series, so I would think the total number of Model 34’s (all change levels) is somewhere over 200,000. I’ve seen more 4” than 2” and a lot more blue than nickel.
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Old 03-31-2010, 09:13 AM
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You mentioned model 34 and 63, but you left out the 43.

63-43-34
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Old 03-31-2010, 11:19 PM
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Thanks to all the gentlemen for your responses. I'm on the trail of the "Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson" now. Great tip. Should be able to get more information there.

debracin, sorry I left out Model 43. Didn't know it existed. Also nice pictures of the three J frames; 34, 43 and 63. Which reminds me of my question number 2. I'll ask it again another way. Ignoring barrel length, when you examine each model shown in your picture, what differences do you find in them? BTW, my 34-1 has a round butt.

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Old 04-01-2010, 07:09 AM
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HAM;

Ignoring frame and cylinder material and barrel length there are essentially no differences between models 43, 34, and 63 that were manufactured during the same time period. I expect someone will dig into the SCSW or their collection and find some detail to nit-pick that statement with, so when they do, bear in mind I’m just an old target shooter. For all 3 models, target triggers, hammers and stocks and any rear sight other than an adjustable blued rear blade without a white outline were special order only. Model 34s & 43s were standard with blued ramp front sights while model 63s had stainless ramps with a red plastic insert. Recently some fiber optic front sights were put on M 63s and they are currently made with 2 piece barrels. Model 34s, 43s, & 63s use the same stocks and “innards”—you can interchange all the lockwork parts between them, assuming again that they were made in the same time period, so the only difference that affects shooting is the lighter weight of the aluminum frame and cylinder in model 43s. Manufacturing or engineering changes occurred to all 3 at nearly the same time and are detailed in the SCSW.

I hope this answers your question.
Gil
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Old 04-01-2010, 01:02 PM
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I saw a 2" nickel square-butt M-34 at a gunshow here in Florence last Saturday. No box or docs but in good shape, man was asking $550 for it. Didn't check to see if it was a 1- or -2.

I have a 2" blued 34-1, love it but can't quite get it to shoot point of aim at 25 ft. Shoots about 2" high with the rear sight screwed all the way down.
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Old 04-01-2010, 01:21 PM
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Quote: I saw a 2" nickel square-butt M-34 at a gunshow here in Florence last Saturday. No box or docs but in good shape, man was asking $550 for it. Didn't check to see if it was a 1- or -2.

I'll bet that nickel 34 was cute, I would have been tempted to make that a partner to my 2" blue 34.
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Old 04-01-2010, 10:12 PM
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How about a Model 34-1, 2" Nickle, Square Butt with Diamond Grips for $250? Some Red Paint on the front sight that will remove easly.

I saw one today and now on lay away. Good Dealer friend of mine just got it in a few days ago and was about to put it into the used gun case when I arrived. It is in the high 90% range due to a slight clouding in the nickle on the rear of the grip frame. Otherwise in excl. to very excl. condition. No cracks or breaks or other clouding in the nickle finish. Not an April Fools Joke either. Serial #M21789X. Should be mine in a few weeks after I sell some things. No box or paperwork.

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Old 04-02-2010, 12:20 AM
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J.Solo: Nice snag, congrats!
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Old 04-02-2010, 12:15 PM
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"Also nice pictures of the three J frames; 34, 43 and 63. Which reminds me of my question number 2. I'll ask it again another way. Ignoring barrel length, when you examine each model shown in your picture, what differences do you find in them?"

HAM:

The Model 34's, and most earlier Kit Guns, have steel frames and cylinders, weighing about 24 ounces with a 4 inch barrel, and came in both blue and nickel finishes, round and square butts, irrespective of the "dash" number, if there is one on a particular gun.

The Model 63's are constructed primarily of stainless steel, and weighed about the same as a Model 34 of the same configuration.

The Model 43's are known as "Airweight Kit Guns" and have frames and cylinders made of an aluminum alloy, 14-1/2 ounces.

Looking at my examples, the main difference you will see between an older 4 inch Model 63 and, say, a 4 inch Model 34-1 is the front sight base, or lack thereof. The blue or nickel M-34 has a tall sight blade, sitting directly on the barrel's top rib, while the stainless M-63 has a ramped base on the barrel's top rib and a shorter blade on top of the ramped base.

Generally, the Model 43's were 3-1/2 inch barrels in the pattern of the Model 34's, as far as the front sight went.

Generally, of course!

Fine little pistols, indeed!
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Old 04-02-2010, 04:06 PM
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Thanks Buff for your input. This forum is a jewel. Great folks.
HAM
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Old 08-31-2016, 11:35 AM
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do they print a list of SN's of the 34-1
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Old 08-31-2016, 01:36 PM
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I bought my model 63 new. It is the last gun I would ever sell.
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Old 08-31-2016, 02:00 PM
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Just to throw in another wrinkle, how about the .22 Magnum Kit Guns?

Model 51 (carbon steel) - 1960-1974
Model 651 (stainless) - 1983-1988; 1991-1999

And the fixed sight Kit Gun Stainless: Model 650 - 1983-1988
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Old 08-31-2016, 02:39 PM
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FYI, Jim Supica & Richard Nahas have written the Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson"Edition 4", which will be released for sale sometime in Oct. the last I heard. It will be the same book as the Third Edition, but with some updated information and new models introduced since the 3rd edition was introduced.
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Old 08-31-2016, 04:02 PM
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Old thread but needs a freshening. My 63-1 and Bianchi 5bhl marked Kit Gun



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Old 08-31-2016, 04:04 PM
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saemetric
Nice stocks on that one!
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Old 09-01-2016, 10:24 AM
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Really like my 4" M63 and intend to keep for some time.

But I have to admit, every time I take it out to shoot I envision some guys in the Massachusetts S&W cylinder-making room chuckling to each other, saying, "Gee, let's see how small we can bore and polish these chambers and still be able to force a .22 round into it".
The other guy says "Nah, let's make it to where ya gotta clean it after shooting it 18 times".
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Old 09-01-2016, 12:42 PM
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Reading all these posts about difficult extraction on the Kit Guns makes me realize I must live a charmed life. Between my wife and me, we own several Kit Guns of various ages and configurations. None of them have ever given us any extraction problems. I feel for you guys, but apparently the problem is not universal.
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Old 09-01-2016, 01:09 PM
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My .22/.32 Kit Gun is pre-34. Probably shipped early in 1956. In the picture it is wearing Hogue grips, but I have the original diamond magnas, as well as the box and tools (have to hunt for the screwdriver).



Adios,

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Old 12-28-2016, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by k22fan View Post
HAM;

Ignoring frame and cylinder material and barrel length there are essentially no differences between models 43, 34, and 63 that were manufactured during the same time period. I expect someone will dig into the SCSW or their collection and find some detail to nit-pick that statement with, so when they do, bear in mind I’m just an old target shooter. For all 3 models, target triggers, hammers and stocks and any rear sight other than an adjustable blued rear blade without a white outline were special order only. Model 34s & 43s were standard with blued ramp front sights while model 63s had stainless ramps with a red plastic insert. Recently some fiber optic front sights were put on M 63s and they are currently made with 2 piece barrels. Model 34s, 43s, & 63s use the same stocks and “innards”—you can interchange all the lockwork parts between them, assuming again that they were made in the same time period, so the only difference that affects shooting is the lighter weight of the aluminum frame and cylinder in model 43s. Manufacturing or engineering changes occurred to all 3 at nearly the same time and are detailed in the SCSW.

I hope this answers your question.
Gil


Gil,

I picked up a 22/32 kit gun made between 1955- 1957 and it needs a rear sight. will either a J frame or I frame sight fit on that gun based on your statement above?
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Old 12-28-2016, 04:38 PM
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The 34's do not turn up often around these parts. So when I ran across this overpriced 34-1 nickeled, four inch, square butt I snatched it up. The little critter shoots right along with my K-22/M-17's, off the bench that is. Enjoy yours!
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Old 12-28-2016, 08:36 PM
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My 1975 Model 34-1. With a new Altamont stock.



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Old 12-29-2016, 12:07 AM
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J solo nice snag. I recently moved from western New York to Arizona- so far a great move ( better taxes cost of living and gun freedom plus more) but ironically back when I lived in WNY it was easy to find used s&w revolvers at fair prices. In Arizona you can go to five shops and maybe see 3 used smith revolvers at high prices.
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