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  #1  
Old 05-20-2010, 11:22 PM
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Default Indiana State Police S & W 357 Magnum Model 66

I recently purchased a Smith and Wesson 357 Magnum Model 66 at an auction. From the information that I got, it was a Indiana State Troopers weapon at one time. It is a 4" stainless steel. The gun in is very good shape and was in the original box with cleaning kit, warranty card, etc.... On the bottom of the box it also has the State Troopers name who carried the weapon, his Post location and a number (which I think may have been his badge number.) This number is also on the engraved on the gun with ISP 254. Besides having the Smith and Wesson trademark on one side of the revolver, on the other side is the Indiana State Police emblem. On the end of the box there are numerous pieces of information on the sticker in regards to this weapon. One of them is under special features. IND SP F731. This is something to do with the State Police I guess, but the numbers mean nothing to me.

This is the first weapon that I have purchased that is not new out of the box or just a standard used gun. I have never purchased a pistol or any other type that has been used by a police force or that would have any special engravings or markings.

I was just looking for anyone who might be able to enlighten me on any significance that this pistol or one like this might have. What time frame did the Indiana State Police carry this model of weapon? Does anyone know what the ISP 254 actually is. The serial number starts 7K4----. How would I go about finding the age of the gun or information in this regards.

I am sure I paid more then I should have, but thought it was too nice of gun to pass up. Are these a fairly common find where I should fire away, or is this something I could hold on to as a nice collectors type piece in my collection.

Thanks for any help in finding out more about my newest purchase.
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Old 05-21-2010, 12:16 AM
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When I was a deputy S&W gave the Missouri Highway patrol officers a matched pair, a 4" 66 and a 60. It had the MSP HP emblem and their badge number on both guns. Since the MO HP did not buy them they could not wear them on duty. They were told that if the gun showed up at a crime they would be severly disciplined. Some guys sold them and some put them in a safety deposit box. I've always kicked myself for not buying a pair. Perhaps the Indiana guns were a similar thing. Date it by the SN and see if there are any LEO's from that time frame that remember them. The Indiana HP may be able to tell you if it was a gun that was carried on duty. A letter from S&W would help. If you can capture the guns history it should add to the value. I think police marked guns are very neat.
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Old 05-21-2010, 12:54 AM
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Welcome to the Forum! First of all, The Model 66 was a classic of the late '70's & '80's - purchased by many police agencies across the U.S. It was one of the last popular revolvers I saw in LE holsters before the adoption of the semi-auto pistol.

While S&W made commemorative models honoring various police agencies, usually including an agency emblem on the side plate or frame, individual "rack" numbers, like F731, would suggest the guns were issued for use by the department indicated. I, personally, enjoy owning and shooting guns that were used by LEO's and like to find/research a historical connection that may serve to better appreciate the design, manufacture and use in that context.

Now, we would really appreciate some photos & a range report. The Model 66 is not uncommon, and unless you have one that was once owned by someone special - you may certainly enjoy shooting it without diminishing it's value significantly. If you give us the serial number (use "x's" for the last 3 digits), and the Model number from the open crane of the gun, including the "dash" number (ie., Model 66-1, 66-2, etc.), we can help get you close to the year the gun was shipped from the factory.

Jerry
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Old 05-22-2010, 07:30 PM
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Your gun was not an ISP issued gun. It was a commemorative that the ISP Association commisioned in the late 70's or early 80's. While the ISP issued 66's DID have the ISP badge logo, they didn't have the badge number. Those were only on the commemoratives. This info is per a retired ISP Major and certified S&W armorer who has one of the commemoratives
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Old 05-22-2010, 09:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indycar View Post
Your gun was not an ISP issued gun. It was a commemorative that the ISP Association commisioned in the late 70's or early 80's. While the ISP issued 66's DID have the ISP badge logo, they didn't have the badge number. Those were only on the commemoratives. This info is per a retired ISP Major and certified S&W armorer who has one of the commemoratives
Correct! I had an issued ISP 66, that I bought years ago at the gun show at the Stout Field Armory in Indy. It came with the holster, speed loader pouch and 2 speed loaders. Had the Badge logo and NO badge number. Paid the grand sum of $225 for it. I have seen them for sale a couple times since at the Indy 1500 show.

Last edited by hiram2005; 05-22-2010 at 09:34 PM.
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Old 08-19-2010, 01:10 AM
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I have a Model 66 ISP 50 year commerative model 66, 6" barrel. Serial #1 of 1117. Commerating 50 years from 1933-1983. Never fired/or cockrd except from the factory. With presentation case and decal. Would like to know more about the value of this fine pistol.
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Old 08-19-2010, 01:57 AM
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Kersh, your model 66 should have been shipped in 1977.
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Old 08-28-2010, 01:32 AM
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I have one of these, I haven't actually seen it in years, but I was always under the impression that it was an issued gun and not a commerative.
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Old 11-05-2010, 01:06 PM
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I have several of these guns and learned a lot about them while trying to get my first one. The 4 inch model 66 that you bought was not a true "commemorative". What happened was in the late 70's they went from blued guns to stainless guns. During that transition the troopers were given the opportunity to purchase one for themselves. The ones that have ISP ### are guns that were purchased by a trooper.
The true commemorative gun is the 6" model from 1983 that came in the wood case. It is the 50th anniversary. All of these guns show 1 of 1117, as there were 1117 of them ordered. I have seen many people list these for sale at an outragous price thinking they have the first one. All of them were marked this way.

In 2008 ISP had its 75th year anniversary and offered a Glock .45. There were only a little over 100 of them ordered so they are a lot more rare. They are marked in gold showing the 7th anniversary.

If you have a 4 inch stainless model 66 with the ISP badge on it and no other special marks (like the ISP###mentioned above) then this would be a gun that a trooper carried.
As far as value goes I have spoke with many people and have been told that their true "book value" is the same as the gun would be without the marks. I have purchased the model 66 4 inch issued guns for between $200-$300. These usually show a lot of wear as they were carried for a long time.

The 50th anniversary 6 inch guns typically sell for about $500.00. What you will find in dealing with these guns is that a trooper or retiree hold them at a higher value then what a gun shop would have them at. I have two of them and have been offered $750.00 each for them by troopers.

I tried to find a 4inch model 66 (ISP gun)for about 2 years and couldn't get one. Then within about a 3 month period I bought 2 four inchers and 2 of the 50th anniversary 6 inchers and put them back for my kids.
So if you decide that you want to sell them talk to a trooper or go to an ISP post and see if anybody wants them, you will get a lot better money from them then just selling to a gun shop or listing them locally.
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Old 11-10-2010, 10:57 AM
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I had not had these guns out for a while so I opened the safe and snapped a few pics. I am not a photographer (obvious) but it should do the trick.


Pic 1011 shows an issued weapon, it has the badge but no other ISP #'s (model 66 4 inch)

Pic 1012 also model 66 4 inch but was purchased buy the officer. The reverse is stamped ISP ### (Pic 1014)

Pic 1015 is the glock 45 cal. 75th anniversary gun

Pic 1016 is the case for the 50th anniversary 6 inch
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Old 11-10-2010, 11:02 AM
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Pic 1019 is the 6 inch barrel showing the anniversary marking.

pic 1020 shows reverse side of 6 inch anniversary 1 of 1117

pic 1021 full shot of the 50th anniversary 6 inch.
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Last edited by flyin-lowe; 11-11-2010 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 12-10-2010, 08:37 AM
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Default Thanks for the info

Flyin-Lowe,

Thanks for the information. I have a 4 inch version that was purchased by the officer. I knew it wasn't a commemorative per the Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson but I also knew it wasn't an issue piece as it had never been fired and was still in the original numbered box. Your post makes sense and sheds some light on the subject. Thanks again...
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Old 02-01-2011, 09:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyin-lowe View Post
Pic 1019 is the 6 inch barrel showing the anniversary marking.

pic 1020 shows reverse side of 6 inch anniversary 1 of 1117

pic 1021 full shot of the 50th anniversary 6 inch.
Very nice, was not aware they came in the 6" for State Patrol use. Love my shooter 6" though.
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Old 02-01-2011, 10:08 PM
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Flyin-Low is pretty close.

1. Not a commemorative, and not a issued carry piece. Sold to ISP employees only in November 1974 for $150.

2. The number in addition to the serial number was the PE (personal employee) number of the unit purchasing it. S&W would only inscribe 3 numbers. Most units had a PE number in the 4 digit range but S&W only printed the first 3. ISP PE numbers are only used once and can be used to estimate length of service. My guess is this unit's PE number was 254? which would make his hire date somewhere in mid-1970s. Badge numbers were never used on these guns.
3. The first true "commemorative" was the M66 6" with presentation box in 1983. These were followed by a Ruger .223 stainless rifle, a Glock, a Baretta, and a some kind of knife. There were no numbers other than the serial on these guns. I've never seen any numbers on the box that did not pertain to the gun, maybe some kind of inventory number, but I don't think it was added by the ISP.

Many guys thought these guns would become collectors items at sky high prices. This did not happen. Presently both of these S&Ws can be purchased for about the same as the same model without the bells and whistles.

Let's just say I was there.
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Old 04-06-2011, 02:15 PM
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dkees
Were did you work at. I noticed you said I was there. I am there right now, have been since 99. I didn't know that about the PE number but that makes sense.
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Old 04-06-2011, 05:33 PM
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Default ISP Model 66

kersh75, carelesslove, here!

If you are going to own and maintain a fine LEO-type firearm, would you be interested in a fine, period correct, Don Hume, Jordan belt & holster rig?

You have to be a waist size 36.

Thanks, carelesslove
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Old 04-06-2011, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer View Post
Kersh, your model 66 should have been shipped in 1977.
Since I keep my 66-1 in the computer desk what would 76K5xxx check out to be?
Thanks,
Mc
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Old 03-14-2012, 10:40 AM
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I have my Dad's old Model 66. I (hope) included some pictures. This is a commemrative for 125 years of the Chicago Police Department. I remember when my Dad got this in the early to mid 80's he had an offer to include his star number instead of the years of service on the right side of the gun, but didn't want to spend the extra $50 to have it done. I enjoy looking at the gun although it has only been test fired at the factory. We have never shot it.
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Old 03-14-2012, 03:42 PM
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I grew up in Terre Haute . One of my mother's neighbors was a city fireman with a State Police brother in law. He had in 1974 or very early 75 picked up one of the model 66 in question. He told me it was possible for the department member to order two at that time. His was the "extra" from the BIL. Any ideas how the numbering would have been handled? The employee number would not have been unique on the second.
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Old 03-16-2012, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dkees View Post
Flyin-Low is pretty close.

1. Not a commemorative, and not a issued carry piece. Sold to ISP employees only in November 1974 for $150.

2. The number in addition to the serial number was the PE (personal employee) number of the unit purchasing it. S&W would only inscribe 3 numbers. Most units had a PE number in the 4 digit range but S&W only printed the first 3. ISP PE numbers are only used once and can be used to estimate length of service. My guess is this unit's PE number was 254? which would make his hire date somewhere in mid-1970s. Badge numbers were never used on these guns.
3. The first true "commemorative" was the M66 6" with presentation box in 1983. These were followed by a Ruger .223 stainless rifle, a Glock, a Baretta, and a some kind of knife. There were no numbers other than the serial on these guns. I've never seen any numbers on the box that did not pertain to the gun, maybe some kind of inventory number, but I don't think it was added by the ISP.

Many guys thought these guns would become collectors items at sky high prices. This did not happen. Presently both of these S&Ws can be purchased for about the same as the same model without the bells and whistles.

Let's just say I was there.
dkees is right, and I declined the offer to purchase a new Glock commemorative in 2007.
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