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S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 3-Screw PINNED Barrel SWING-OUT Cylinder Hand Ejectors WITH Model Numbers


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  #1  
Old 04-16-2014, 05:00 PM
FlyFish FlyFish is offline
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Default Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update.

I have a 4" Model 25-5 in .45 Colt, vintage 1980, in 98-99% condition. As has been discussed here numerous times regarding this model revolver, it has the oversize cylinder throats - they mike at .458", standard .452" bullets drop through with nary a hitch, and the accuracy leaves a good bit to be desired.

I really like this gun otherwise and also don't want to sell my problem to someone else, but I don't have much interest in keeping any gun that's not at least as accurate as I am, and this one ain't. I can have the cylinder replaced by S&W with a correctly sized one for $200 and a 7-month wait. Now, I've got plenty of other guns to shoot so I don't care about the 7 months, although perhaps at my age I should start getting concerned about such things. And I don't really care about the $200 either, provided it fixes the accuracy problem, which brings me to my question . . .

Has anyone had this repair/replacement done, and were you satisfied with the results? Did the gun end up shooting as accurately as it should? TIA for any info.

Last edited by FlyFish; 08-01-2014 at 04:37 PM.
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:04 PM
05CarbonDRZ 05CarbonDRZ is offline
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Do you reload? If you do just order oversized lead bullets and you have your issue fixed(somewhat)
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:10 PM
FlyFish FlyFish is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 05CarbonDRZ View Post
Do you reload? If you do just order oversized lead bullets and you have your issue fixed(somewhat)
I do, and I'm aware that's an option, although I guess I have a similar question about how well it works (the "somewhat" part). Also, I have several other guns in .45 Colt and I'd prefer not to have to segregate ammunition, I have enough trouble keeping everything straight as it is!
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:13 PM
05CarbonDRZ 05CarbonDRZ is offline
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You are correct,The trouble would be buying special bullets and keeping them seperate.I guess if you can spare the $200 and do without the Gun for 7 months plus,I would go for it.I would think that the blued .45 Colt Cylinders that the Factory has won't be around for ever.....
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:15 PM
series guy series guy is offline
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You might want to try some Rainier plated bullets. These have solved the problem on a few of my guns.
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:17 PM
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Personally, I would jump on the new cylinder. I agree with your thinking re. not wanting to have special ammo for the one revolver with oversized cylinders.
Bottom line; .458" cylinder throats ain't right.
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Old 04-16-2014, 05:29 PM
GBertolet GBertolet is offline
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I had a similar issue on a 25-2. Had .456 cylinder throats. Standard .452 bullets lead like crazy. A couple of options. Buy bullets for original bore size 45 Colt @ .454, or get a proper mold and cast them yourself. Cast the bullets soft, so they will slug up to cylinder throat size upon firing, and easily swage down to the nominal .451 bore diameter.

One other thing you can try if you cast, and have 45 cal molds already. You can "Beagle" your mold. This involves putting a few pieces of aluminum HVAC tape evenly spaced between the blocks. .002 or .003 tape thickness is what you want. The bullets still will cast fine and be slightly larger in diameter. You can tumble lube them and shoot them as cast.

Also getting an oversize expander ball for .454 bullets is a necessity, as seating the bullets in the case using the expander for .451-.452 bullets will swage them down.

$200 is a lot of money to pay for something that should have been done right by the factory.

I had a friend who got one of the original 25-5's, back in the 80's. He had the big cylinder throats also. He complained enough, so he was told to sent it back to the factory, and they refitted it with a recessed case head cylinder @ .453 throating . They also gave him a letter authenticating the special cylinder was done by the factory. Pretty neat.

Last edited by GBertolet; 04-16-2014 at 05:35 PM.
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  #8  
Old 04-16-2014, 07:17 PM
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I have a 25-2 with .455" throats, and the cast bullet accuracy is nothing to rave about. I tried the .454 cast bullets, and all I got was a lot of leading in the forcing cone. I tried Ranier plated bullets, and it shoots great. I had tried it with factory jacketed ball and it did fine, that's why I tried the Ranier plated bullets. It solved my problem. (But I do have to keep them separate from my other 45 ACP).
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Old 04-16-2014, 07:23 PM
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I'd send it in.
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  #10  
Old 04-16-2014, 07:35 PM
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My M25-5 had the reverse problem.
The chambers were .447 to .449.
I had them opened by the LGS to .453 and it shoots fine now.
Had the same proublem with a Ruger SA .45 Colt, chambers too small....
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Old 04-16-2014, 08:54 PM
Mike, SC Hunter Mike, SC Hunter is offline
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i have 25-5 wtih big throats. On a test run it leaded like crazy with my cast .452 bullets. I bought it anyway and bought a .454 dia. mold/sizer. Problem solved.
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Old 04-16-2014, 09:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyFish View Post
I have a 4" Model 25-5 in .45 Colt, vintage 1980, in 98-99% condition. As has been discussed here numerous times regarding this model revolver, it has the oversize cylinder throats - they mike at .458", standard .452" bullets drop through with nary a hitch, and the accuracy leaves a good bit to be desired.

I really like this gun otherwise and also don't want to sell my problem to someone else, but I don't have much interest in keeping any gun that's not at least as accurate as I am, and this one ain't. I can have the cylinder replaced by S&W with a correctly sized one for $200 and a 7-month wait. Now, I've got plenty of other guns to shoot so I don't care about the 7 months, although perhaps at my age I should start getting concerned about such things. And I don't really care about the $200 either, provided it fixes the accuracy problem, which brings me to my question . . .

Has anyone had this repair/replacement done, and were you satisfied with the results? Did the gun end up shooting as accurately as it should? TIA for any info.
Just me, but I would find a proper new model cylinder and fit it to the gun.
It is not rocket science and you will have that experience under your belt.

If I wanted a custom built shooter built I would sent it to Hamilton Bowen
and have him open out a model 29 cylinder and at the same time re work the whole gun to shoot.

Or just sell it 'as 'is' and move on to a newer model 25-7, 25-9 ,
25-10, or 25-11. All excellent shooters out of the box.

I would be interested in finding one like yours for a project gun if the
price was reasonable.

Allen
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Old 04-16-2014, 09:25 PM
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I have one that had the oversize cylinder and I tried all of the previously mention options with mixed results. The old Remington 255 hollow base bullet shot OK but I still had an occasional keyhole. I called S&W and they told me they did not have any cylinders in stock. My gun is nickel so I purchased a new stainless cylinder from Numerich and fit it to my revolver. I can say from personal experience the difference is like night and day. I shot my 25-5 yesterday and it now shoots 2" groups offhand at 25's versus 10" groups. If you want to shoot it it's worth the $200.00.

Mike
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Old 04-17-2014, 09:48 AM
FlyFish FlyFish is offline
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Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update.  
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Thanks for all the responses, and especially for those (including one PM) that recommended fitting a new cylinder myself. Based on all the input, my plan is to send the gun back to the Mothership and have it done properly. In the words of the immortal Harry Callahan, "a man's gotta know his limitations" and, although not a total klutz, my mechanical skills are better suited to mixing martinis than fitting revolver cylinders. Much as I'd like to have a go at learning some light gunsmithing, I'd prefer my first attempt to involve a beater Model 10 or the equivalent, not a near-pristine Model 25. If all goes well, I'll report back on the experience in 7 months or so.
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Old 06-24-2014, 07:57 AM
FlyFish FlyFish is offline
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I thought I'd resurrect this thread to update anyone interested, or anyone who might be contemplating a similar cylinder change, on where things stand.

As I indicated above, I was quoted a price of $200 and 7 months wait to have the cylinder replaced. I requested a shipping label from S&W, which arrived (via email) a couple weeks after my request. I shipped the gun on May 15. Yesterday (June 23), I received a quote indicating the gun had been inspected and a new cylinder would be $92 for the part and $90 for labor, for a total of $168 including $13 shipping. Today I'll be sending my authorization and payment info back to them.

We'll see how things go from here, but I'm optimistic that this means they'll do the work reasonably soon after receiving my go-ahead and my wait will be considerably less than the 7 months.

Correction: The labor RATE is 90/hr, but the labor estimate was for 0.7 hrs, so the actual labor cost was quoted at $63. $92 + $63 + $13 = $168

Last edited by FlyFish; 06-28-2014 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 08-01-2014, 04:45 PM
FlyFish FlyFish is offline
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Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update. Model 25-5: New cylinder? COMPLETED! Final Update.  
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I received my 25-5 back today (August 1) with its new properly throated cylinder (they also returned the old cylinder). Roughly about 10 weeks from when I initially sent the gun to receiving it back from S&W, which beats the heck out of the 7 months I was quoted originally.

The work was done beautifully. The new cylinder has no noticeable movement, either side to side or front to back, and although I haven't taken out my feeler gauges to measure the B/C gap, I would estimate it's no more than a few thousandths. The bluing is absolutely a perfect match for the rest of the gun, which strikes me as a pretty good trick considering the original bluing was done almost 35 years ago. I have no doubt the new cylinder will correct the accuracy issues I and others have had with M25s of similar vintage.

There seem to be a good number of complaints about S&W Customer Service floating around lately, but you sure won't get any from me!

Last edited by FlyFish; 08-01-2014 at 04:47 PM.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:44 PM
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Good for you!

I was lucky. My 1980 vintage M25-5 had correct sized throats.
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Old 08-03-2014, 02:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyFish View Post
I have a 4" Model 25-5 in .45 Colt, vintage 1980, in 98-99% condition. As has been discussed here numerous times regarding this model revolver, it has the oversize cylinder throats - they mike at .458", standard .452" bullets drop through with nary a hitch, and the accuracy leaves a good bit to be desired.

I really like this gun otherwise and also don't want to sell my problem to someone else, but I don't have much interest in keeping any gun that's not at least as accurate as I am, and this one ain't. I can have the cylinder replaced by S&W with a correctly sized one for $200 and a 7-month wait. Now, I've got plenty of other guns to shoot so I don't care about the 7 months, although perhaps at my age I should start getting concerned about such things. And I don't really care about the $200 either, provided it fixes the accuracy problem, which brings me to my question . . .

Has anyone had this repair/replacement done, and were you satisfied with the results? Did the gun end up shooting as accurately as it should? TIA for any info.
I did exactly that a few years ago. Turnaround then was just 6 weeks and cost was $180. They did a great job and the piece shoots as it should.



The original cylinder.

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Old 08-03-2014, 05:41 AM
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Good to hear your positive feedback. Of course you know it didn't happen until we see the pics!
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Old 08-04-2014, 03:08 AM
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Default 25-5 New Cylinder

Glad to hear you're happy with it so far.

Let us know how it shoots with some lead bullets too.
.
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