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Old 03-17-2017, 01:01 PM
Jetman22 Jetman22 is offline
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Default K-32 vs model 16

I would like a 32 h&r Mag or 32 long.
Can you guys give a simple guideline of the different models K32 vs Model16
2screw 3 screw etc
Just in case I go to a gun show or pawn shop and find something that's not priced at a
Ga Zillion dollars K-32 vs model 16



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Old 03-17-2017, 01:21 PM
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Hi
First, the Model 16 is a K-32 Masterpiece. Here's how it plays out.

1. In the early postwar period, S&W introduced the K-32 Masterpiece as a companion to the K-38 and K-22. At that time it had only a name - K-32 Masterpiece.

2. In the summer of 1957, S&W decided to add model numbers to the names of various revolvers. The K-32 was given the Model 16 designation, and examples began shipping in 1958. This, then, was the Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. It had both a name and a number. The Model 16 with no dash number is extremely scarce and we assume few were made.

3. In 1961, the Model 16-2 was released. This was the first three screw Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. Apparently there were no Model 16-1 revolvers made.

4. In 1967, the Model 16-2 was replaced by the Model 16-3. It had the same engineering change as the Model 14-3 and Model 17-3 (K-38 and K-22, respectively). The change entailed the relocation of the rear sight leaf screw, to avoid flame cutting at the screw location.

5. In 1974, the Model 16 was discontinued. It should be noted that all the Model K-32 Masterpiece revolvers up to that time (model marked or not) were chambered for the .32 S&W Long cartridge.

6. In 1989, the Model 16 was reintroduced as the Model 16-4. However, at this time it was a slightly different animal. It had a full lug barrel, which it had never had before. And, it was chambered for the relatively new .32 H&R Magnum cartridge. Production lasted until 1993.

I hope this brief history helps you.
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetman22 View Post
2screw 3 screw etc
There has never been a "2 screw." K frame revolvers had 5 screws until c. 1956; 4 screws until c. 1961; 3 screws thereafter.

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Just in case I go to a gun show or pawn shop and find something that's not priced at a Ga Zillion dollars
Good luck! If you find one for less than a gazillion dollars, I'll tip my hat to you. The K-32 is highly coveted and examples in high condition don't sell for under four figures. The 16-4 is likely to show up as the least expensive.
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:33 PM
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Wow !!!!
That's exactly what I was asking for. And all in one post.

I know most would cring at the thought. But if a person found a shooter ( not collectible grade)
Could you ream the cylinder to 32 h&r Mag ?
Or
Would it even strong enough?

Thank You


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Old 03-17-2017, 01:42 PM
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No reason why it wouldn't. But... if a 32 mag is what you really want, in that situation I'd think you'd be further ahead to resell a shooter grade K32 and simply buy a 16-4. The least expensive K32 I've seen was in pieces and stored in a zip lock bag. This was at at a local gun show last year and the seller was still wanting $1400. I've seen 16-4s sell for less.

John
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:44 PM
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Never say never but your chances of finding a K32 at a gun show or pawn shop that doesn't cost a "ga zillion" dollars are about the same as winning the lottery. In the unlikely event you do find a K32 shooter, it will be strong enough to handle the 32 H&R mag but why would you want to reduce the value, regardless of condition, by reaming it for 32 H&R mag? The 16-4 is easier to find, costs 25% of the K32, in my opinion shoots as well, and is already in 32 H&R mag. Like you though, I keep looking for that reasonably priced K32 wherever I shop. However, in the 40 or so years I've been wandering gun show floors, pawnshops and LGSs I'm yet to find one. Good luck.

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Old 03-17-2017, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetman22 View Post
if a person found a shooter (not collectible grade) Could you ream the cylinder to 32 h&r Mag?
Where the heck is that Strongly Dislike button . . . ???
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:55 PM
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I don't believe there is such a thing as a non-collector K-32, no matter the condition.

Stu
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Old 03-17-2017, 01:58 PM
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You guys are right. Doesn't make since to alter a fine gun no matter what the condition.
My eyes are looking.
K-32
Or
16-4
Put the pitch forks away K-32 vs model 16


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Old 03-17-2017, 03:36 PM
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You could ream a K frame of even a J frame 32 S&W to 32 H&R. But, if I ever come across a pre 16-4 K32 I will leave it alone, even a shooter grade one. It would have to be in pretty bad shape before I would modify it and I am not bashful about modifying S&W revolvers. I already have a 16-4 myself, but I bet even a 80 some percent earlier K32 would sell for the price of a nice 16-4 and they usually sell for well over $1000
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Old 03-17-2017, 07:42 PM
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We can all appreciate your wanting one, but "DON"T" ream out any K32, or 16, 16-2, or 16-3. You will be throwing away several hundred dollars in value. Buy a 16-4 which is what you said you wanted a K Frame 32 H&R Mag.



They are very accurate and great fun to work up loads for.
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Old 03-17-2017, 09:18 PM
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I saw a model 16. 4" with box sell on gun broker sell at buy it now for $850. Someone had it bid up to $600 then boom. Buy it now.
I thought about it but I'm more of a 6-8" barrel man.


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Old 03-17-2017, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetman22 View Post
I saw a model 16. 4" with box sell on gun broker sell at buy it now for $850. Someone had it bid up to $600 then boom. Buy it now.
I thought about it but I'm more of a 6-8" barrel man.


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The sellers description for that gun is a little weird, not sure if the pictured gun is the gun he was selling. Picture is a 4" gun, description says 6". If it was the gun pictured (or a 6" in the same condition) the seller left about $500 on the table.
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Old 03-17-2017, 10:50 PM
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Jetman, if you don't have to have a K frame there is also the 2" stainless J frame model 631 chambered in .32 H&R Magnum. They aren't cheap but typically less than a model 16.
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Old 03-19-2017, 04:30 PM
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The 631 was also made with a 4" barrel. Problem is they rival or exceed model 16-4 prices.

John
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Old 03-19-2017, 04:52 PM
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Sir.
You would grind on one of these?? I am not certain there is enough difference between any of the 32 handgun rounds to warrant altering one of them. They are nice revolvers, but a mite puny compared to 357 and up.
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Old 03-19-2017, 05:37 PM
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It would be more for a fun gun to shoot. My K38 Masterpiece needs a friend.


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Old 03-19-2017, 05:56 PM
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Quote:
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Where the heck is that Strongly Dislike button . . . ???
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Old 04-02-2017, 06:57 PM
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Well I went to a major gun show this weekend. I found 3 of the holly grail S&Ws. Yep
K 32
First with box. $3700
Second with box and papers $4300
Third with box papers and letter.
Ta Da. $5500
I was able to hold, and check out the $3700 gun.
Very sweet. With sad eyes I took his cleaning cloth and wiped down the gun with oil and handed it back.
Maybe next year.
Defiantly next year.
Yep Maybe. Defiantly next year.
K-32 vs model 16


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Old 04-17-2017, 09:33 PM
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I picked up a S&W 8 3/8" M-16-4 barrel on auction then the cylinder showed up not long afterwards. Both at the gunsmiths now being put on a M-15 .38 frame. Since it's a conversion piece am having it reamed to .327
For those of us faced with this no long barrel adjustable sight target revolver in .32 for decades there is a new option out there. I picked up a brand new Czech ALFA 6" .32 with adjustable sights last month for $365. Looks much like a Python, shoots as good as I can aim it.
With the .32 cartridge going back to the break top turn of the century era (flying at 675) can understand why the H&R mag came about although the true .32 mag is a
.327
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Old 04-17-2017, 11:35 PM
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My Model 631.
[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

My Model 16-4.
[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]
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Old 04-18-2017, 02:29 AM
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I bought my Model 631 .32 Mangum Kit Gun in 1992. Great little gun. I then hoped feverishly they would finish the Kit Gun series with a 4 inch Model 60 .38 Special Kit Gun.

I've got a donor Model 15 Combat Masterpiece revolver, a nice K-22 6 inch blue barrel and a similarly nice K-22 cylinder

I just don't know where to go next.
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Old 04-18-2017, 07:43 AM
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I watched another K32 sell for
$3500 on gun broker Sunday.
It was a very nice gun with letter.


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Old 04-18-2017, 08:06 AM
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I also went the build your own route with a shooter grade Model 19-3 as a donor gun and an 8 3/8" Model 16-4 barrel found on eBay. Also used a K22 cylinder and built it as a .327 Federal Magnum K Frame. Shoots as you would expect. I'm so pleased with the results that I have another at the gunsmith's now being built with a 4" barrel. I know it's a totally different animal than a collectible K32 or Model 16 but the loading and shooting joy is still the same.
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Old 04-18-2017, 07:14 PM
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Would a model 16 be considered a K frame?


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Old 04-18-2017, 07:36 PM
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Yes, a model 16 is indeed a K frame.

Stu
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Old 04-18-2017, 10:46 PM
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Thanks


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Old 04-18-2017, 11:24 PM
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I had the extreme fortune of finding a late 40's mfg K-32 at a gun show in the Seattle area a few years ago for what I would consider to be a bargain price of $2,000. No box, but it does have the LERK feature and is in pretty darn good shape. When I saw it on the guys table he had it tagged at $2,500 and when I asked his best cash price I could not get the $$$ out of my pocket fast enough!

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Old 04-19-2017, 06:59 AM
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There are a couple of K-32's on a large popular on line auction as I type...
JIM...........
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Old 04-19-2017, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JP@AK View Post
Hi
First, the Model 16 is a K-32 Masterpiece. Here's how it plays out.

1. In the early postwar period, S&W introduced the K-32 Masterpiece as a companion to the K-38 and K-22. At that time it had only a name - K-32 Masterpiece.

2. In the summer of 1957, S&W decided to add model numbers to the names of various revolvers. The K-32 was given the Model 16 designation, and examples began shipping in 1958. This, then, was the Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. It had both a name and a number. The Model 16 with no dash number is extremely scarce and we assume few were made.

3. In 1961, the Model 16-2 was released. This was the first three screw Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. Apparently there were no Model 16-1 revolvers made.

4. In 1967, the Model 16-2 was replaced by the Model 16-3. It had the same engineering change as the Model 14-3 and Model 17-3 (K-38 and K-22, respectively). The change entailed the relocation of the rear sight leaf screw, to avoid flame cutting at the screw location.

5. In 1974, the Model 16 was discontinued. It should be noted that all the Model K-32 Masterpiece revolvers up to that time (model marked or not) were chambered for the .32 S&W Long cartridge.

6. In 1989, the Model 16 was reintroduced as the Model 16-4. However, at this time it was a slightly different animal. It had a full lug barrel, which it had never had before. And, it was chambered for the relatively new .32 H&R Magnum cartridge. Production lasted until 1993.

I hope this brief history helps you.
Just to add to Jack's excellent summary - there was a "pre" war K-32 Target, similar to the K-22 Outdoorsman of the era except in .32 Long. If you find one, expect to add another digit to the asking price of a later K-32 (and you shouldn't convert that one to .32 Magnum anything either ).
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Old 04-19-2017, 10:30 AM
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No 32 Mag conversions for me.
I know how sweet the 32 long k32 would be.


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Old 04-19-2017, 12:01 PM
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Question for the experts. This revolver was shipped 10-1952 and is the heavy Masterpiece K-32 model. Which is more prevalent and which is more desirable to the collector? The heavy or the light type? BTW, keep your eyes open on the For Sale ads here. I bought this in 2011 for a little over $2,000. I was lucky to be first in line as the seller had many other folks lined up to buy it. I even had a Forum member send me a box of period ammo for it,FREE. Big Larry
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Old 04-19-2017, 01:35 PM
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I am not the local K-32 expert, but I think the post-war/pre-model K-32s are the most common. As you know none are common or undesirable, but the pre-war and model stamped examples tend to bring the biggest values. There has been discussion of early post-war K-32s with the LERK but I don't recall if anyone has even seen one.
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Old 04-19-2017, 05:54 PM
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I am not the local K-32 expert, but I think the post-war/pre-model K-32s are the most common. As you know none are common or undesirable, but the pre-war and model stamped examples tend to bring the biggest values. There has been discussion of early post-war K-32s with the LERK but I don't recall if anyone has even seen one.
Common? Why then the $3,500 price tags? My question was, which is scarcer, the wide rib or thin rib types? I rather doubt a 4 screw will bring more than a 5 screw. Big Larry
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Old 04-19-2017, 06:02 PM
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I bought my Model 631 .32 Mangum Kit Gun in 1992. Great little gun. I then hoped feverishly they would finish the Kit Gun series with a 4 inch Model 60 .38 Special Kit Gun.

I've got a donor Model 15 Combat Masterpiece revolver, a nice K-22 6 inch blue barrel and a similarly nice K-22 cylinder

I just don't know where to go next.
I don't know whether you saw this when it was current. I went through the same process in stainless a few years ago to create Project 616 (see Project 616 ) and AFAIK all of the information contained therein is still current except for the boring of the barrel... I've heard that Clearwater/Delta Gun is no longer in business. If you CAN find someone to rebore your barrel, the rest of the job will be pretty straightforward, and I was/am happy with the job Andy Horvath did for me. BTW, I had dreams of doing what you plan, even to the point of finding a good K-22 cylinder and a narrow rib K-22 barrel cut for a LERK!! but lost interest before I found a suitable donor gun.

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Old 04-19-2017, 06:17 PM
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What is lerk?


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Old 04-19-2017, 06:25 PM
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What is lerk?


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Large ejector rod knob. See the pre-war K-32 at the top of the home page .
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Old 04-19-2017, 06:29 PM
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Common? Why then the $3,500 price tags? My question was, which is scarcer, the wide rib or thin rib types? I rather doubt a 4 screw will bring more than a 5 screw. Big Larry
Didn't say "common", but "'most' common" .

My impression is the narrow barrel rib guns were made in far smaller numbers than the wide. However, there were many more 5-screw K-32 Masterpieces than 4- (or 3-) screw versions. I don't know if this translates to higher selling prices for later guns but if you have a five-figure gun buying budget, let me know...
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Old 04-19-2017, 06:39 PM
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Large Ejector Rod Knob

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Old 04-19-2017, 06:46 PM
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Old 04-19-2017, 07:17 PM
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My Model 631.
[IMG]
[/IMG]

My Model 16-4.
[IMG]
[/IMG]
Tell your 631 that I have his twin brother here with me and we are having a grand time. His nickname is "Turtle Murderer".
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Old 04-20-2017, 11:26 AM
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Didn't say "common", but "'most' common" .

My impression is the narrow barrel rib guns were made in far smaller numbers than the wide. However, there were many more 5-screw K-32 Masterpieces than 4- (or 3-) screw versions. I don't know if this translates to higher selling prices for later guns but if you have a five-figure gun buying budget, let me know...
I have bought a few 5 figure guns in my day. No handguns but a very few rifles. I am retired now and cannot afford 5 figure guns now unless I do some trading. I figured at $2,200 I did well on this 100% matching K-32. I would liked to have gotten a narrow rib, but hey, sometimes you cannot have everything. Would really have liked it to match my 4 digit K-22 with LERK, but those are super rare and probably another 5 figure gun. I have a small 31 gun S&W collection, but I do have some nice stuff. Big Larry
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Old 04-20-2017, 12:16 PM
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Hi
First, the Model 16 is a K-32 Masterpiece. Here's how it plays out.

1. In the early postwar period, S&W introduced the K-32 Masterpiece as a companion to the K-38 and K-22. At that time it had only a name - K-32 Masterpiece.

2. In the summer of 1957, S&W decided to add model numbers to the names of various revolvers. The K-32 was given the Model 16 designation, and examples began shipping in 1958. This, then, was the Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. It had both a name and a number. The Model 16 with no dash number is extremely scarce and we assume few were made.

3. In 1961, the Model 16-2 was released. This was the first three screw Model 16 K-32 Masterpiece. Apparently there were no Model 16-1 revolvers made.

4. In 1967, the Model 16-2 was replaced by the Model 16-3. It had the same engineering change as the Model 14-3 and Model 17-3 (K-38 and K-22, respectively). The change entailed the relocation of the rear sight leaf screw, to avoid flame cutting at the screw location.
I'll add one bit of info here. When the Model 16-3 was in production, orders were few and far between. Consequently there are quite a few 16-3 guns that were made from Model 14 frames, and have an overstamp on the model number on the frame. Mine is such a gun. So if you see one like that don't be scared off.

Traded a brand new Merwin Hulbert for a S&W Model 16-3 (sorta)



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5. In 1974, the Model 16 was discontinued. It should be noted that all the Model K-32 Masterpiece revolvers up to that time (model marked or not) were chambered for the .32 S&W Long cartridge.

6. In 1989, the Model 16 was reintroduced as the Model 16-4. However, at this time it was a slightly different animal. It had a full lug barrel, which it had never had before. And, it was chambered for the relatively new .32 H&R Magnum cartridge. Production lasted until 1993.

I hope this brief history helps you.
I will also comment that the Model 16-4 was available in 4", 6" and 8-3/8" barrel lengths. The earlier K-32/Model 16s were all 6". There are also a precious few (10, built in 1949) 4" revolvers in .32 S&W Long, considered as the .32 Combat Masterpiece.
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Old 04-20-2017, 12:32 PM
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I have bought a few 5 figure guns in my day. No handguns but a very few rifles. I am retired now and cannot afford 5 figure guns now unless I do some trading. I figured at $2,200 I did well on this 100% matching K-32. I would liked to have gotten a narrow rib, but hey, sometimes you cannot have everything. Would really have liked it to match my 4 digit K-22 with LERK, but those are super rare and probably another 5 figure gun. I have a small 31 gun S&W collection, but I do have some nice stuff. Big Larry
Why yes, that is a very good price for a NIB K32. Did I mention they are uncommon?
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Old 04-20-2017, 06:41 PM
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I bought my Model 631 .32 Mangum Kit Gun in 1992. Great little gun. I then hoped feverishly they would finish the Kit Gun series with a 4 inch Model 60 .38 Special Kit Gun.

I've got a donor Model 15 Combat Masterpiece revolver, a nice K-22 6 inch blue barrel and a similarly nice K-22 cylinder

I just don't know where to go next.
They came awfully close with the Model 60-4. They just missed your 4" barrel length requirements by shortening it down to 3".

I'm actually quite fond of my 60-4.
[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]
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Old 04-22-2017, 07:18 PM
Jersey Doug Jersey Doug is offline
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There is in all hobbies the desire to want the rare, allusive hard to obtain discontinued items over the plentiful.. Would be wise to ask yourself before you fork over $3,500 to $5,000 on a mint Model 16, what really is the benefit of this revolver over a nice model 14,,,, not much, if any at all !
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Old 04-22-2017, 10:11 PM
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The early K 32s are the grail gun for a lot of people. Good luck finding a model 16 or a 32.

I am lucky enough to have found a 16-2 ANIB. A beautiful gun for sure. The only thing I have considered is getting a second cylinder set up for .327 Federal. But there are so many other things ahead of it that I doubt I will get around to it.

I have the J frame 631 snub in the 327 caliber. I am sure that K frame model 16 would make the 327 a pleasant round to shoot. And the K Frame is strong enough to handle it. A lot of people doubt that the 631 J Frame will hold up over the long run firing 327s. The jury is still out. The 631 & 632 are just fine for the 32 or 32 magnum if that is what you want..

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Old 04-22-2017, 10:30 PM
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what really is the benefit of this revolver over a nice model 14,,,, not much, if any at all !
Well . . . because it is a K-32.
If you already have more than a dozen K-38 Masterpiece revolvers and you have no K-32, I can think of lots of reasons to want one!
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Old 05-03-2017, 11:02 PM
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I am not the local K-32 expert, but I think the post-war/pre-model K-32s are the most common. As you know none are common or undesirable, but the pre-war and model stamped examples tend to bring the biggest values. There has been discussion of early post-war K-32s with the LERK but I don't recall if anyone has even seen one.
I have a post-war K-32 with a ship date of Feb 1949 and it has the LERK.
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Old 05-04-2017, 01:51 AM
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Question for the experts. This revolver was shipped 10-1952 and is the heavy Masterpiece K-32 model. Which is more prevalent and which is more desirable to the collector? The heavy or the light type? BTW, keep your eyes open on the For Sale ads here. I bought this in 2011 for a little over $2,000. I was lucky to be first in line as the seller had many other folks lined up to buy it. I even had a Forum member send me a box of period ammo for it,FREE. Big Larry
Ya know, Larry, I was born in October, 1952. Hint, hint. Nudge, nudge.
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