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10-04-2017, 01:24 PM
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19-3 cylinder keeps gumming up
I have a 6" nickel model 19-3. The pistol functions just fine except that the cylinder gums up and starts to get stiff after a hundred rounds or so. If I remove the cylinder there's an accumulation of crud built up that cleans off easy and then everything's fine again until you run enough rounds through it and then it happens again. None of my other Smiths are like that. Any ideas? Is this anything you'd need pics of? You know, I'm not sure of the date of manufacture so this might not even be in the right section.
Last edited by 1sailor; 10-04-2017 at 01:27 PM.
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10-04-2017, 01:49 PM
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Gas ring missing?
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10-04-2017, 01:50 PM
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This is not uncommon with a -3 engineering revision or older model 19
The -4 engineering revision moved the gas ring to help prevent hot propellant gasses so they don't foul the shaft of the cylinder
Certain ammunition can exaggerate the problem and certain ammunition loadings can minimize the issue
Is the ammunition being used full power 357 Magnum or some reduced load?
Does it do this with ALL ammunition?
Or only a specific factory/hand load?
If it is hand loads what powder are you using?
Is the cylinder shaft dry, lightly oiled or heavily oiled after cleaning?
What lubricant are you using on the shaft?
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10-04-2017, 01:59 PM
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I hate to admit that I'm not familiar with the gas ring although I've had the cylinder off numerous times. I almost never fire factory ammo. Probably 90% of the rounds I fire are loaded about midway between a 38+p and a 357 starting load. My powders typically are either Titegroup or Longshot. These are the same loads I use in my other 357's without the gumming issue. After cleaning I very lightly oil the shaft. I don't use much oil (remoil) on the shaft because I'm worried that too much will only make it worse. I just did a quick search and wikipedia says the -3 was only made in '67 and '68. Is that right. I thought it was from the mid 80's. guess I should have done a little more research first.
Last edited by 1sailor; 10-04-2017 at 02:04 PM.
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10-04-2017, 02:22 PM
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Other 357s are not the issue here, this one is.
While you do not mention projectiles, can I guess you are using lead?
I will bet money that the problem is worse with the ammunition loaded with TiteGroup.
If you can try some 231/HP38 or Unique and I think the issue will lessen or go away
TiteGroup and lead projectiles are a bad combination.
Do not worry about age of the revolver as this should probably have gone into the Smithing section.
Last edited by colt_saa; 10-04-2017 at 02:24 PM.
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10-04-2017, 02:31 PM
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I have some Universal here that I can try. Didn't make any difference if I was using lead or jacketed bullets. What is there about the -3 that makes it different enough to cause this issue. While obviously fired this pistol came to me looking almost new so I don't think were talking about excessive wear anywhere.
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10-04-2017, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1sailor
I have some Universal here that I can try. Didn't make any difference if I was using lead or jacketed bullets. What is there about the -3 that makes it different enough to cause this issue. While obviously fired this pistol came to me looking almost new so I don't think were talking about excessive wear anywhere.
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All Model 19s from the original no dash through the -3 had the gas ring located on the yoke.
The -4 moved the gas ring to the cylinder. Preventing hot propellant gasses from gumming up the shaft was the major part of the change.
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10-04-2017, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1sailor
I just did a quick search and wikipedia says the -3 was only made in '67 and '68. Is that right.
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No wikipedia is WRONG.
The -3 engineering revision was manufactured for roughly 10 years from it's introduction in 1967 until the -4 replaced it in 1977
Remember wikipedia is a population maintained resource. Anybody can type anything into it, it is not like an Encyclopedia that gets fact checked
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10-04-2017, 02:43 PM
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Okay so probably normal? I don't shoot this one as often as my others so it hasn't been a big issue.
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10-04-2017, 02:57 PM
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Strange!! As all my model 19's are of the -3 variation and never had a problem. I suggest trying some universal cause I use that quite a bit cause I get it local very cheap and it never has caused me any problems. Universal seems to fall right in the middle not the cleanest but certainly not the dirtiest and fairly accurate from my tests. I always put 1 drop of Ballistol on front of my cylinder shafts in and the very lightest amount of grease on the shafts and yoke and it has worked perfectly in all different dash variations of nickel, stainless and blued smith revolvers. See how universal treats you and report back.
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10-04-2017, 07:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colt_saa
All Model 19s from the original no dash through the -3 had the gas ring located on the yoke.
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All Model 19's up to and including early Model19-3's had the gas ring on the cylinder.
It wasn't moved to the yoke until 7K25xxx for square butt and only lasted through 9K99999 (SB)
.....cylinder.............yoke
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10-04-2017, 07:52 PM
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If the "gas ring" is on the yoke (three small slots milled into the yoke) this is a normal result. Some guns with this will run longer before "gum up" some not so much. Mine will get hard cylinder turn at about 100 round regardless of the ammo type. No big deal just remove cylinder clean and lube. I have thought of using grease on the yoke shaft to inhibit gas entry a bit.
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10-04-2017, 08:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colt_saa
All Model 19s from the original no dash through the -3 had the gas ring located on the yoke.
The -4 moved the gas ring to the cylinder. Preventing hot propellant gasses from gumming up the shaft was the major part of the change.
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This is actually incorrect. The gas ring was moved to the cylinder prior to the -4 engineering change. Most likely because S&W had some unfinished 19-3 frames when the change was actually implemented. BTW, I have a "1972" vintage 19-3 per the serial number but it features the gas ring on the cylinder, just like that on my 1988 vintage model 67-1.
As for the cylinder shaft gumming up, this has never been a problem with either the 19-3 or 67-1. However my choice for loading 38 specials is Vihtavouri 3N37 and for 357 Magnums for the 19-3 I use a charge of Accurate #5 that falls into that gray area between +P and the starting charge for 357 Magnum. In a 2 1/2 inch model 19 this very light Magnum not only is nearly 100% flash free it's also distinctly gentle on both my wrist and the forcing cone in my 19-3. Actually a 158 grain jacketed bullet running at about 900-950 fps is distinctly enjoyable to shoot.
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