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Old 07-02-2018, 12:07 PM
Doug.38PR Doug.38PR is offline
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Default Movie jaws Smith and Wesson revolver question

Most of us knows that in said movie, Chief Brody is using a Smith and Wesson model 15 with target grips. However what a lot of us may not be aware of is that that gun apparently was giving actor Roy Schider problems.

If you go to the bonus features and look at the outtakes and deleted scenes, there is an outtake that has Roy Scheider trying to fire the revolver presumably at the shark a scene in the movie and constantly having “gun jams”. So frustrated he gets that on the third try he lets out a word that I can’t use on this form and would rather not use in public .

I watch that clip and I’m trying to figure out what’s going on with the gun. The cylinder seems to rotate and all but what is it it’s a revolver it’s a simple device. Is it a misfire or what?
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Old 07-02-2018, 12:50 PM
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I thought it was a Model 28 but could be wrong. Makes me wonder if the actor had any coaching on how to handle the gun, but a revolver should have been pretty simple.
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Old 07-02-2018, 02:15 PM
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Was it a locked model???
just kidding...couldn't resist
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Old 07-02-2018, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug.38PR View Post
.....
If you go to the bonus features and look at the outtakes and deleted scenes, there is an outtake that has Roy Scheider trying to fire the revolver ....

I watch that clip and I’m trying to figure out what’s going on with the gun. The cylinder seems to rotate and all but what is it it’s a revolver it’s a simple device. Is it a misfire or what?
Unless you show us the clip, we can’t really know what you’re talking about.

Movie producers, especially on gun-heavy productions, have gotten pretty good at hiring specialty armorers to provide the appropriate hardware.

Back then not so much. It was a major achievement if the actors ended up using the same gun throughout a movie. It could be something as simple as some ill-fitting blank cartridges jamming up the action.
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Old 07-02-2018, 02:30 PM
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Model 15 and yes it gave him trouble.
Jaws - Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games
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Old 07-02-2018, 02:55 PM
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Cool "Jaws" factoid on that model 15.
I can (& do) watch parts of that movie whenever I see it on. Good flick!
Guess the reliability is directly related to the armorer on set. Shooting movie effect blanks probably makes guns absolutely filthy.
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Old 07-02-2018, 03:01 PM
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Okay, here it is. Right at the beginning.

It’s obviously jammed up and the trigger is not properly pulling through. On the first three tries the cylinder does not move at all, and only partially on the last one.

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Old 07-02-2018, 03:04 PM
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Yeti is probably correct.

The gun no doubt was foul with
use of blanks, lack of proper care
and it being around all that salt
water. Who knows if that gun
didn't take a spray bath more than
once before use.

Prop guns are often in poor shape
as they are passed from movie to
prop house to movie, especially back
in the first Jaws days.
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Old 07-02-2018, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Absalom View Post
Unless you show us the clip, we can’t really know what you’re talking about.

Movie producers, especially on gun-heavy productions, have gotten pretty good at hiring specialty armorers to provide the appropriate hardware.

Back then not so much. It was a major achievement if the actors ended up using the same gun throughout a movie. It could be something as simple as some ill-fitting blank cartridges jamming up the action.
Here it is. Go to 12:10 and watch from there.
Deleted Scenes - Jaws Featurette - YouTube
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Old 07-02-2018, 08:27 PM
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My Navy- Guadalcanal - Carrier Pilot Buddy Frank told me that he only took enough Cosmoline off his Victory Model to so he could see Down the barrel and the cylinder would turn and lock.
Cause if he went down, and he did, it would be in the water.
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Old 07-02-2018, 08:53 PM
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I like how Richard Dreyfus’s character said to Brody “Brody, what are you doing?” As Brody grabbed the M1 Garand to shoot the shark. That .30-06 would have blown a huge hole in that shark and ended the fight.

And then in Jaws 2, Brody is in the watchtower and sees what he thinks is the shark. He empties his Model 15 at what he though was the shark while standing on the shore at about 30 yards.

Hollywood Weapons did a recreation of the scuba tank blowing up the shark. M1 Garand round to a scuba tank on full size replica of shark and it but hissed air.
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Old 07-02-2018, 09:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE PILGRIM View Post
My Navy- Guadalcanal - Carrier Pilot Buddy Frank told me that he only took enough Cosmoline off his Victory Model to so he could see Down the barrel and the cylinder would turn and lock.
Cause if he went down, and he did, it would be in the water.
Many pilots and invasion troops used plastic or rubber envelopes for their guns to avoid getting them wet. I think it was Paladin who posted some pics here of them. But I've seen those in use in period photos.

Did S&W even ship Victory Models packed in cosmoline? Seems unlikely.
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Old 07-03-2018, 12:00 PM
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Blanks and salt water can really screw a gun up that much? You'd think somebody would think to at least make a cursory wipe it down occasionally or at least when you pick it up to handle it.
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Old 07-03-2018, 02:21 PM
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I'm guessing the ejector rod was loose and backed off enough to keep the cylinder from turning. Either that or the cylinder gap was filled with gunk (or, as others have said, sea related corrosion) and binding up.
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Old 07-03-2018, 02:31 PM
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Don't know what happened in this movie, but can offer a possible reason. I am an old west re-enactor and I see and shoot a lot of blank cartridges. Some of the guns in our group, no matter what we do with them, have enough head space that we cannot prevent primers from backing out. When the primer backs out the guns will tie up every time.

Dan
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Old 07-03-2018, 02:40 PM
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A loose ejector rod tends to impede opening the cylinder, but not freeze the cylinder movability to the point where the trigger won’t even budge as it looks here. A backed-out primer or gunk in the mechanism itself is a more likely suspect.
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Old 07-03-2018, 03:44 PM
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Funny how he's holding his wrist with the left hand, instead of the gun! NOT a gun guy...
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Old 07-03-2018, 07:12 PM
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“Jaws” is on now on AMC on Direct Tv. Brody just got on the boat to head out. Now back to our regularly scheduled discussion.
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Old 07-03-2018, 07:43 PM
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cylinder hand spring broken or installed wrong, thus cylinder would not turn
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Old 07-06-2018, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S&W Fan View Post
“Jaws” is on now on AMC on Direct Tv. Brody just got on the boat to head out. Now back to our regularly scheduled discussion.
You’re gonna need a bigger boat.👍

In this movie he appears to be wearing a gunbelt with dump pouches and a Jordan holster. In the sequel Jaws 2, he appars to be wearing speedloaders with a swival holster. His speedloaders are holding Remington 125 gr scalloped SJHP which he modifies by dropping poison into the hollow cavities and sealing them with wax (hiding that fact from his subordinate).

First one is great summer blockbuster classic. Second is fun. The rest are stupid. Looks like they are about to release another sequel or remake called Megoladon. 😫

Anyway, you’d think that as expensive as guns and shooting scenes are Hollywood would have an armorer that took care of it’s prop guns for just this reason
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Old 07-06-2018, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolguy View Post
Funny how he's holding his wrist with the left hand, instead of the gun! NOT a gun guy...
I agree.
Was watching old movies the other day and I think it was magnum force where DH was holding the same way while on the range, so maybe more for dramatic effect than marksmanship???
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Old 07-06-2018, 10:03 PM
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I've read that most actors know so little about guns that they aren't handed one until just before a scene is shot. This is for safety and to keep them from damaging a gun.

Others are sent for a basic course at some place like Gunsite, but only if a role demands more expertise. In the 1950's, some cowboy actors were coached by Arvo Ojala. I read that some playing SEALS in the movie about Marcus Luttrell were taught by real Navy personnel.

Now, with Hollywood being so anti-gun, I doubt we'll see many actors being gun savvy in real life. The days of Clark Gable, Maj. Audie Murphy, MH and Jimmy Stewart are past, I guess.

When I saw the final movie of the Fifty Shades trilogy, I was surprised that Anastasia (Dakota Johnson) even knew how to operate that S&W Model 36 that her man's nut former lover had left in his office when she was arrested for her home invasion. She did hit her former boss, Jack (the kidnapper), but only in the leg. But a real Anastasia would do well to manage that.

I was on the Official New Line Cinema board about, The Lost World. I learned that the prop guns were subbed for in scenes when they weren't fired by resin or plastic cast replicas. When Lord Roxton dropped his .416 Rigby on a cave floor, not only did actor Will Snow drop it from too high instead of just laying it down, you could hear the sound it made on the cave floor. Def. the replica rifle! No wonder they didn't trust Snow with the real one when they didn't have to.

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Old 07-06-2018, 11:27 PM
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OMG....Mine must have been on that movie set.
Salt Life issues.

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Old 07-07-2018, 02:45 AM
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My only 2 revolver failures ever!

S&W 629, very cheap factory reload ammo, projectile moved forward in it's case locking up the cylinder, could not rotate or open cylinder, complete failure to function, pushed pushed bullet back into case, fired round, functioned perfectly after that.

Colt Trooper MK3, when I cleaned it I used grease on where the cylinder rotates on the crane, after 50 rounds of .38 special dirty range ammo, it would not rotate in double or single action without manually rotating the cylinder, and that eventually quit working, locked up solid. Cleaned it & oiled it, worked flawlessly.

Don't use grease on rotating parts, and Dont carry re-loads, unless you trust your own re-loads.
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Old 07-07-2018, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doug.38PR View Post
Anyway, you’d think that as expensive as guns and shooting scenes are Hollywood would have an armorer that took care of it’s prop guns for just this reason
They do!
Prop Firearms | The Specialists LTD
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