In 1977 bought my duty weapon through the city , model 15 , 85.00. Then later at another agency it was an issued model 67.

Yea, the "OK, You're an armed guard" stopped probably not too long after I was doing it. I knew a fellow who ran a company that did armed guard training in the early/mid 80's I guess it was. I'd give him a hand at the range just providing an extra pair of eyes to watch, and lungs to yell at the trainees when they did something dumb (Which I admit wasn'f all that often really. Most of them took it very seriously).

I picked up I don't know how many pieces of 38 brass while doing that, but it was an old paper grocery bag about 3/4 full. I sold it all off when I stopped shooting/reloading and took up tournament bass fishing.

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John 3:16 .

1980ish the local Sherriff carried a 3 1/2 M27. Alternated cylinder chambers with 125 JHP and 158 LSWC. He said if the HP didn't stop the situation the second would shoot through a telephone pole and do it. 1 deputy had 4" Python. City Chief carried a 1911, not sure what ammo City officers got their own usually a 4" 38 of some kind. Knew 1 from another town ex Sea Bee back from SE Asia who carried a 9mm Hi-Power. Told brother officers if they carried as much ammo as he did they would have to wear bandoleers like the " Frito Bandito" .

This has been a nice read and trip down memory lane.

My department issued blued Model 15 S&W, but we could also buy our own for service and off duty use. The Model 15 that I was issued was so beat up that I was embarrassed by it so I bought a Model 19 and used it for a few years till I bought a Model 65 S&W in 1977.

Our issue ammo was the Remington +P 125 grain 38 Special.

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Keep your powder dry.

Upon my separation from the USMC in 1972, I joined the Houston P.D. and was required to purchase your own weapon. I selected the Model 19, 4" blue. As I recall, I used Remington 357 magnum 125 grain hollow points. We were also required to purchase a off duty/back up gun if we wanted to carry one. In the academy, we qualified on a NRA 25 yard slow fire 22 course. For our duty weapons, we fired 6 rounds of 38 special ammo single action and 6 rounds double action and we were good to go. Our other issue gear was the same quality as our duty weapon testing.

Times changed and training improved. After 10 years on the street I was assigned to the downtown range as a firearms instructor for the first year of mandatory firearms qualification. I believe that small cadre of instructors made a difference. One of my proudest moments occurred when an officer approached me and stated that the training he received from me helped save his life in a gunfight. It don't get much better than that !!!

I'll bet you had a hard time forcing them .357s into that Model 10.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Honolulu PD issued 4" blued Model 15s in the 70's. Many of those were reblued, IDK who did the work. IIRC they switched over to stainless 67s in the early 80s and a lot of the 15s were traded in for the new 67s. The authorized S&W dealer that supplied the PD guns sold 100s of the trade ins locally through their storefront. That gunshop also supplied the neighbor islands PDs and other state agencies with their guns as well.

When I worked at that gun shop in the mid to late 80s we would get shopping baskets full of the trade ins. I found a 6" pre-17 from the Kauai PD pistol team and a 4" heavy barreled Model 10 from the state Attorney General's office in those piles; I still have them.

In the early 80's HPD issued the 110 gr. JHP .38 as it's duty load. One night a deranged homeless guy got the drop on 3 cops at a Burger King--the hobo popped 2 of them in the head with a .22 short mini-revolver at point blank range while they were seated, having coffee.

Long story short, the hobo was hit with 18 rounds of .38 before bleeding out on the trunk lid of a parked car. He was trying to shoot one of the cops who was desperately reloading his service piece while taking cover behind the car.

Both cops recovered from their wounds.

I believe HPD soon switched over to the 158 gr. LSWCHP load.

All cool stories, thank you for your service during some historically turbulent times!

For the OP, if you are looking only for a new gun similar to those carried in the 1970s, the three current S & W offerings that come to mind are the 4" model 10-14 and the 4.25" model 19 and 66. However, used examples of the actual types of guns used back in the day, many with police/sheriff department property stamps, are available today for less than the cost of a new gun. Good luck in your decision.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

One of my Model 66s was carried by a Memphis policeman, Patrolman Larry Childress, killed in the line of duty January 14, 1982. My next door neighbor's late husband was a Memphis policeman and his widow wanted it out of her house. Don't know how he acquired it but the revolver is lettered delivered to the Shelby County Sheriffs Department Oct, 1972.

Attached Images

	1972 m66 SW (2).jpg (226.1 KB, 88 views)
	1972 model 66 plus holster.jpg (52.5 KB, 80 views)

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LIVE FROM THE DAWGHOUSE

I started in 1972. We purchased our own revolvers. Requirements were Colt or S&W, 4" barrel, blued finish, .38 Special or .357 magnum. Law enforcement purchase order price for a new Model 10 was about $80, a Model 15 was about $105, Model 19 was about $125, Model 28 was about the same, Colt Python was about $200.

Adjustable sights were much preferred by most of us. After a couple of nasty incidents the boss banned magnum ammo for duty use. I was present for one of those, a .357 magnum 125-grain JHP went through a bad guy's shoulder joint, struck a concrete curb, went through a 2X4 porch railing, penetrated the exterior wall of a house, went through an interior wall, and lodged in a second interior wall right next to a crib with sleeping baby. That incident convinced me to never use magnums in or around a city environment, sticking with .38 Special +P for years afterward.

I carried a 4" Model 19 most of my time as a uniformed cop. Switched to a 2.5" Model 19 when I went over to plainclothes assignments.

I have always preferred the 1911-type .45 pistol, and I have owned a Browning Hi Power 9mm for over 50 years. I carried one of those for the last 6 or 8 years before retiring, and continued doing so afterward.

Over the past couple of years I have undergone surgeries to a shoulder, elbow, wrist, and cataracts. Handling the semi-autos became painful and very difficult. Reached into the gun safe for my old LE-surplus S&W Model 64 round-butt 2" .38 Special, which continues to do just as well as it did when new about 40 years ago.

I will never feel at any real disadvantage as long as I have a good DA Smith & Wesson revolver handy.

Actually, rechambering .38 Specials (Model 10, 15, etc) to accept .357 magnum ammo was done with some frequency back in the 1970's. Probably not the smartest thing to do, but I knew several cops using those converted revolvers.

Maybe it was a Model 10-6........

The security company I started working for in 1978 handed out some of the saddest looking Model 10's I've ever seen. My first post got me one of the worst, with a rubber grip that was coming apart and had been crazy glued together at the bottom. I asked if I could carry my well worn, but mechanically solid 6+1/2" 28-2, and after the old LT looked it over way too long, they said yes.

When I started working at a nightclub, I carried a Dan Wesson 15-2 4", almost everyone else working there had a 66 or nickeled 19 4" gun. My DW was looked upon as an "oddball". I didn't stay there long, and wound up at a dive casino where I would be for almost 4 years. My boss's gun was the Rohm RG 38, that actually shot OK! Other guard's guns were an ancient looking Model 10, a Star BM which turned out to be missing the firing pin until I fixed it, and a blued 4" Python that I couldn't believe he carried, as any gun I carried had nicks and scratches on it due to the endless fights we had with various life forms. I bought a really nasty DW 15-2 specifically to carry from a pawn shop, so I wouldn't worry about banging it up. One guard, who remains a friend 42 years later, had blanks in his gun, a really nasty looking Model 15. I finally got him to carry live ammo after we had a huge fight with a guy who was carrying an old Iver Johnson .32(I think)that didn't actually fire, according to the Police who took the gun into evidence when he was arrested for being a felon in possession of a weapon. Other pretty sad specimens of 9mm, .380, and .38/357 were carried by guards who didn't stay long. One guy who literally lasted two days had a really slick custom 1911 that I wanted to shoot, but he screwed up and got the boot. Most of the time, I had by far, the best weapons of anyone working there.

I don't think there is a single S&W centerfire revolver in any frame size or finish that has not been carried by law enforcement at one time or another. Several rimfires have also probably been carried and I know Bill Jordan thought the ultimate law enforcement back up gun was an Airweight Chief Special chambered for .22 Magnum with the hammer ground off. I never did understand why he thought that would be better than a .38 when he carried .357 Magnums in his M-19s.

S&W Mod - 66, 4 inch. Then in the 1980s switched out to the 686.

First, remember small framed and very powerful revolvers in his
day didn't exist.

The specific reasoning was for undercover work and as a
backup SHTF piece. He wrote since such events often happen
under poor lighting and inside rooms, the blast would seem
like a .44 Magnum and it would throw considerable flame.
He looked on the gun as a scare factor that would give the
undercover guy a chance to intimidate or escape.
And the Airweight could hold 6 .22s rather than 5 centerfire rounds.

Was his reasoning sound? Dunno.

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Ubi Est Mea

When I started in 1976, the PD had begun issuing M66s but some M19s remained in service. As a part timer, I was offered a loaner Victory model 38 with 6 assorted RNL rounds. The timing was so bad it rattled badly when cocked, I doubted the safety of the piece.
I opted to carry my nearly new personally owned M19 which now has blue wear at the muzzle despite the lined holster I used.
Supposedly we (part-timers) could order new M66s through the department... it became apparent it wasn't a priority to the chief so I bought the first 4" M66 I found at a LGS.

Not sure when the PD had gone to issue L frame 686s to full time patrolmen.
In 1988 I bought a M645 from the dept armorer... his class gun from Armorer's school... which he had thoughtfully gotten approved for duty use.

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NRA LIFE
Reserve Officer 9yrs

When I joined New Orleans Police Dept in 1971, we had to provide our own firearm.

Most officers carried the Model 19, or Model 66. When I graduated the academy in 1973 I carried a "no-dash" Model 66.

Sorry. They were not dept marked. Left the dept to go federal in 89. Have no clue of their disposition

The department I worked for pretty much carried whatever you brought with you in either .38 or .357 Mag. There were a couple of old WWII era M&P's kicking around for new officers to use until they purchased their own. Around 1984 or so we all were issued M-681's however the detective could carry his Chief's Special and the Sergeant carried his own M-66 with a 2-1/2" barrel which was "the" gun at that time. After that came the 9mm's (6904 or 6906's) then Glock 40's (yuck).

1974 MSP my class 78th was issued 6 inch S&W model 10's. Class behind me (actually overlapped a few months) were issued 6 inch Colt OP's. We shot up the old 158 grain semi-wad cutter stock in practice. We were issued Winchester 110 grain +P+ upon graduation, the Treasury Load, which was being used in the field. 4 inch S&W model 13's were already being used by many Troopers in the field. I believe they were replacing the older Colt OP's first, not sure about that. Officers were issued model 36's and later 2 inch S&W model 10's. Eventually they transitioned to Beretta 92's with Winchester Silver Tip ammunition.

I'm a 3rd generation Officer and I collect duty guns when I can find them.
My Grandfather carried a Model 15 and later swapped to a 67. He had the opinion of it would get the job done until he could make it back to the car then the real man stoppers came out. He also carried a Model 60 as a back up all we're his as they didn't issue much of anything other than a uniform back in those days in poor rural counties.
The Tennessee Highway Patrol issued Model 15s then went to Model 65s.

A friend of mine worked for the Anne Arundel County Police in the '70s and carried a 6" Colt OP.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

Reminds me of some pretty good lines about security guard training from the movie Armed and Dangerous...

"Just remember, when you pull the trigger, the bullets come out going very, very fast. So make sure to keep the weapon pointing away from you. Now that's about it. You are now armed... guards... help us all." - Meg Ryan

"Class of Thursday, 3:30 pm. Congratulations!" - John Candy

"There are only two things that you have to remember - never fall asleep where anyone can see you and make sure your name is very clearly marked on your lunch." - Meg Ryan

I graduated High School in 1974, but being a "gun guy" and knowing police officers, I saw plenty of Model 10's & 64's. The veteran officers were carrying Model 10's, but many of the newer cops were carrying the stainless 64.

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Only a cold warrior

When I started in the late 70s with Denver PD, we could use any S&W, Colt or Ruger .38 or .357, 4" or 6" barrel, fixed sight or adjustable, nickel, blue stainless, didn't matter. Most of the departments in metro Denver were the same IIRC.
You didn't ask, but the only requirements for leather were it had to be plain black, no basketweave, with brass buckle and snaps. Minimum of a holster, cuff case, ammo holder of any type, and a mace case. Many other departments used the 'weave, however, and Jefferson Co. SO on the west side of town used brown leather back then (I think 'weave.) We were issued uniform pants with belt loops that were either snap closure or velcro, so we used to wear just the one 2 1/4" belt, no skinny pants belt, although that was optional, too. (Hell, in the 60s and early 70s, the issue uniform shirt was cut like a cowboy shirt. Talk about unique....)

We had a guy who was very pristine in his uniform. He sewed his pockets, pants, shirt etc. All his shirts were tailored. You could cut your finger on the crease in his trousers. He hated the double basket speed loader carrier and refused to wear it even after they were allowed. He got into a gun fight with two armed robbers, fired all six of his rounds, and promptly dumped his reloads into a mud puddle. His partner shot both robbers and saved his life while he frantically tired to retrieve his dropped bullets in the puddle. Nothing beats speed loaders, except for high capacity magazines!!!!and a partner who can calmly shoot two armed robbers in the midst of a gun battle!

One of our guys had his house broken into and his Model 66 was stolen. It ended up in Texas and was used in a murder there.
We got the gun back, but the Officer didn't want it re-issued to him due the history. I think I just put it back in inventory for issue to a new Officer.

"Nothing beats speed loaders, except for high capacity magazines!!!!and a partner who can calmly shoot two armed robbers in the midst of a gun battle!"

In a revolver, full moon clips beat speed loaders.

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

I'm told my department was using the 10 through most of the 70's, and the metro department across the river was using 15s and... yes.... 29s. I happen to have a department marked example of each I picked up in the 80s. Another member here posted pictures of his a few years ago.

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BT
EGO VOLUNTAS HAUD OBEDIO

A couple of years ago, I made a pilgrimage to a gun store I have bought several items from over the years in Phoenix, AZ. They had a used model 15-5, 4 inch in the used case. I asked to see it and fell in love. Virtually mint condition. My wife saw that I was in love with it and bought it for a birthday present for me. It came with the former owner's full duty rig. Belt, holster, keepers, handcuff case WITH handcuffs, handcuff key, baton holder (no baton), three sets of grips and a well used cleaning kit. I have no idea where the former owner was an LEO, could have been anywhere since Phoenix is a retirement haven. But at least one department used that model 15. So early to mid 1980s.

And it shoots like a dream. One of my favorite revolvers, made even more special since my wife gave it to me.

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Ray
SWCA 3472

Now that I think of it, the Orange County (CA) Marshals issued dept. marked M15s well into the mid-80s. I recovered one of their guns from a traveling criminal a long way from home.

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I need ammo, not a ride.

Started out in '71 SO Dept. Mostly Jail. Dept would hand out an ancient Mod 10 for prisoner transport etc. You could buy your own..Colt or S&W gun could be .357 but ammo 158Gr Rn .38 sp. None of those stinking Automatics were considered lol. Later employers supplied each officer a gun only for him. .38sp .357 9mm 40 S&W then the big R came. Oddly, 3d dept issued .357 colt revolvers but did not specify ammunition. Most officers seemed rather lackadaisical & used .38 spl RN. Some of us figured in the absence of a rule since the gun said .357 thats what we would use. 158gr JSP was preferred at the time as hollow points were still in the cursed "DumDum" category & were inhumane & violated the Geneva Convention, still never "got" that. Politics and newswriting had their way & lo & behold around the time the 9mm guns arrived hollow points had become the greatest thing (go figure)

My father carried a 4” 19 and later a 66, until he transitioned to a Sig P226 9mm. Off duty/back up was a 2” 36. When he switched to the Sig, his back up switched to a PPK .380 briefly, but he went back to the 36. He served from the late 60 until the early 90s.

To the OP: As you can see, there is no one answer. .38/.357 was by far the most common, but all other calibers were used too. San Antonio and San Francisco both issued .41 Magnums.
Another point. You said you want “new” and “identical” weapons to the ones carried back then. You have a choice. Do you want new? Or do you want identical? A lot of the models are no longer made. The ones that still are, have changed over the years. Features added and features deleted. Frames modified. From a functional point it really doesn’t matter. But it won’t be the same as that M10 carried by the lawmen in your city all those years ago.

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Formerly know as Lucky Derby

I started in 1975 and we were issued Model 64 4" heavy barrel stainless steel 38 special revolvers and we reloaded via dump pouches. Speed loaders didn't exist. Still have my issued gun as we were allowed to buy them for a whopping $65.00 when we went to Glocks in 1987.

When I became an officer in 1972, the department issued model 15's. We were allowed to purchase, and carry our own model 19's if we so desired. Just as an aside, if we did so, the first three rounds were required to be 38 Specials. The last three could be .357's

In "79, when came on, had to purchase own... S&W Model 10, with pencil barrel...then to bull barrel...in bureau was issued Model 66...but had to carry .38 ammo...went to Beretta 92's then Sig P220...have them all...but still love my 10...

When I swore-in in 1979, we had to buy our own weapons, and it had to be a 4 or 6 inch S&W or Colt revolver. I bought a very slightly used model 15 revolver and used it until the model 66 arrived. Carried that until 1984 when the department switched to Beretta 92 SF. Nowadays, they can carry about anything from 9mm to .45 if they can qualify with it. I waited like 2 years for a S&W model 60 revover to arrive, and it was really a crudely finished and functioned the same way until a gunsmith friend worked it over and polished it up like a nickelled model 36. Still have them all in the safe at home too!
We had to carry .38 Spec. +P for a while after getting out of the academy (Remington 125 Grain JHP) until we had fired .357 magnums on the range a few times. When we switched to 9mm it was Fiochi 124 gr +P, then Federal 124 gr. 9mm +P+.

I don't know how many thousands of .357 mag. rounds I've fired through my Mod. 28 S&W 4" and I've never noticed much recoil at all. In fact, it's more accurate with .357 rounds. When I first went into law enforcement we had to provide our own weapons and were only authorized to carry S&W or Colt (with emphasis on S&W) and were issued .38+P semi-wadcutters and the option of carrying ONE (1) speedloader of .357 jacketed soft-points (125 or 158 gr.). I did carry the one speedloader of .357s along with one speedloader of the .38+P semi-wadcutters. (I ALSO carried an MTM Ammo Wallet with 18 rounds of 158 gr. jacketed HOLLOW POINTS in my right back pocket). This was NOT ALLOWED, but I figured IF I NEEDED THEM... I could find another job!!!

I started my LE career in the late '60's. Started wtih Model 10 4" bull barrel, then later a Model 19 4", then a Model 66 2" (or maybe it was 2-1/2, can't remember) when I was a supervisor. Later we transitioned to Sig-Sauer Govt spec semi-autos. Carried the Sig in .40 cal until I retired about 20 years ago.

WHY??? To give the bad guy a fighting chance to take YOU out???

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John 3:16
WAR EAGLE!

The MTM ammo wallet. I had forgotten all about those. Not want you would call one of the better ideas of the seventies...but...you know....I had one.

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk

When my father started with the state in 51 he was issued a Colt New Service in 45 Colt, then a 6"in OP, 4'OP, 4" Model 10 in .357,4" Model 13, 4" Model 28 and finally the 4" 681. When he made Lt. he got a Colt Detective special and then a 3" 65. I have the 28 and the Dick Special. When I started in 83 I was issued the 4' 681. As I recall we could carry our own if we wanted but it had to be American made, blue or stainless 4" or 6" 38spl or 357. Then we went to the plastic fantastic and the world ended for a while. I just made captain in one of the 4th departments I've worked for since retiring and the boss lets me carry whatever I want so I carry either a 4" M19 or a 1911 in uniform. 6" Model 14 or 2" Detective Special when plain clothes, weird I know.

Back in the 1970s the Boise Police Department (BPD) issued the Model 10
with 4" barrel to uniformed officers. Plain cloths cops got the Model 10
with 2" barrel. Both shown in photo below.

My model 10 with 4" barrel is a 10-6, and the barrel is the Heavy Barrel
or Bull Barrel. Made sometime between 1967 and 1976. It was interesting
to me to read a post on here somewhere, a while back, explaining that
the older Model 10s barrels were not 4", but actually 3 & 7/8". Of course
I had to check it out. Low and behold my 10-6 barrel is 3 & 7/8".

BPD directed uniform officers to use the Jordan Border Patrol holster,
either plain or basket weave, for their Model 10.

The Speer 140-Gr. soft nosed hollow point was directed for duty use.

Attached Images

SAM_0351.jpg (55.5 KB, 40 views)

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In Omnia Paratus

I've still got a MTM ammo wallet from back then. I thought it was very handy, but I wasn't a cop, just a guy bumming around in the woods. With six rounds in the gun, and eighteen in the wallet, I was set for day. No loose rounds rattling around in a pocket.

BTW. They still make it. I haven't seen one in a store in years I don't think, but they're still listed on the website.

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John 3:16 .

The ammo wallet is a great option for hiking or woods bumming... back pocket of your Wranglers ... just grab and go ......or in the glove box of the side by side.

or a couple in a go bag to reload mags.

Also the old plastic camera film containers..... will hold 6 rounds of .38 or .357 or more in 9mm/.380

I’m not a cop but my uncle was. CHP and he carried a 6” Python on his hip and a 39 in his motorcycle boots. When the CHP did away with motors he became an investigator for the DMV where he carried only the Python. In his footlocker were tons and tons of wadcutters for training and two speedloaders for 357. He was also 6’4” and maybe 200 during his service so the Python never looked out of proportion on his big body. Sadly he never had children so I inherited both weapons and had both papered. Also had several custom made grips for the Python since we was a southpaw.

.22 Magnum: I've seen some writing by very savvy people I respect in places where one might find very serious hard men (and women) who have for sure BTDT that supports the .22 magnum as a good round for certain purposes, including for those who are aging and can't use a more serious round. It apparently has performance potential that is fart greater than one might expect.

The appearance over performance officer who would not carry speedloaders: In a serious department, that incident would have been a lengthy suspension or even firing for the safety violation. It is also an example of why I get annoyed with those folks who like old school uniforms and gear for cosmetic reasons. Performance is all that matters, and if the gear does not work reasonably well under all conditions, especially a fight, it is a no go and should be prohibited. When I first got into a jumpsuit, I worked very hard to never ever get an assignment that required a standard 2 piece uniform. The functionality difference is amazing. Hats? No. Not ever. Clownshoes at best. Period - other than foul weather or protective headgear.

First 3 rounds of .38, then .357 allowed: I have no idea what would make that become a policy, although I fear it is the usual ignorance of administrators. As one wise man (attribution lost to the ages, but quite possibly Chuck Haggard) said: "... the road to command rarely goes through the range or the mat room." On the other hand ... as we have learned more about shooting performance issues and the importance of placement over the last 35 or so years, the research really supports the mid-size/mid-power rounds as being the best all-around choice. I can and have qualified with some really hot loads - as far up as .41 Magnum hunting loads. Do I consider my performance good enough? No. In the real world, a 900 FPS SWC is a better choice. I shoot better and faster with .38 SWC than any warm/hot .357, and the research shows that the 1+ second difference in firing a burst of 3-4 rounds from a handgun is a huge difference in a fight. (We also know that handgun rounds suck, and that in reality, it might take 4-6 rounds OR MORE to stop a determined adversary. Read the relevant chapter of the Patrick and Hall text I have cited many times.) The split difference in those 3 rounds of .38 might be lifesaving. Truly elite shooters, who train a LOT and are actually professional athletes (SOCOM, LAPD Metro D, and a very small group of others) might be good aspirational models, but for the rest of us mere mortals, we are not going to get there and need to compromise in the interest of doing the best we can.

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NHI, 10-8.

When I joined the police department, we were required to buy our own duty weapon which had to be one on an approved list.

I started my career with a Smith & Wesson Model 15-3, 4-inch, blued finish, which I traded in for a Model 19-4, 4-inch, nickel finish nine years later. I carried that awesome Model 19 until I retired in 2001.