good evening fellow members, i went by the local gun store today. i have only seen 1 Smith revolver in his shop ever. deals mostly in ARs and semi auto pistols. has a model 14 on consignment that has been there quite some time.

the 14 is curious. looks nickel plated and has what looks like stainless sights, hammer and trigger. should have taken some pics for you all to look at but got distracted.

i was distracted by a PPC revolver. looked really nice. $495 out the door so hear you go. check it out and and let me know what you think. good buy, mistake or something in the middle. thanks, kenny

Attached Images

	P_20200916_185910_vHDR_Auto.jpg (39.9 KB, 433 views)
	P_20200916_185616_vHDR_Auto.jpg (55.0 KB, 436 views)
	P_20200916_185434_vHDR_Auto.jpg (57.2 KB, 456 views)
	P_20200916_185509_vHDR_Auto.jpg (50.3 KB, 457 views)
	P_20200916_185544_vHDR_Auto.jpg (42.6 KB, 352 views)

__________________
Too good

I'll bet it'll shoot! I recall when that was what you had to have to compete in PPC or similar matches, if you wanted to win, anyway.

He’s well known in my neck of the woods. My buddy and fellow forum member, Exchippy, were on the CHP Blue Team together. I’d love to have one of his SMOLTS, preferably a 4”. Bill and his protege were great gunsmiths.

As an aside, Bill Davis Enterprises, made the Speedfeed shotgun stocks. Armscor/Rock Island Armory, previously known as Arms Corporation of the Philippines, manufactured the speedfeed stocks for Bill. Forum member, Exchippy was involved in that project.

__________________
213th FBINA

I got shafted. I have about $800 in mine. I like to bench it with a mag load. Very low felt recoil. Whoever owned it didn't use it much. It was built on a 681 frame.

Attached Images

DSC00443 (2)bill davis 681 5.jpg (77.5 KB, 186 views)

Bill Davis was one of about three guys you went to when you wanted a top-of-the-line PPC gun. Assuming it hasn't been all shot out, that's a steal for that gun. If the lockup is good and the bore looks good, that would be a definite buy for me.

Always wanted a good ppc revolver. Problem is most of the better ones have passed onto their reward or retired. Spent a couple years going to gun shows looking for one done by a great ppc smith. Found exactly one. This w4as done on a Colt trooper MKIII frame and had the heavy barrel with the Aristocrat sight bar. dealer had no idea who made it (and we looked) or how many rounds down the tube. Finally gave up. Frank

My Davis built Model 64-3 got me out of one class and into the next. Finally got me into the Governor’s 20. Never shot into the top 10, those boys and gals could really shoot!

Kevin

Attached Images

	25F8E1D7-AAD6-4567-9F3A-0995770D87FB.jpg (62.2 KB, 162 views)
	203E43C5-549C-41C4-83B4-49A985BEEEA2.jpg (75.7 KB, 132 views)

__________________
Unshared knowledge is wasted.

$495 is a steel for a great gun like that. If you never shoot PPC you will still have an outstanding example of what a revolver should be. Davis' guns were the finest of the lot.

The rib sight had adjustments so that you could use a neck hold on the target and be able to keep them all in the 10 ring. The trigger pulls are nothing but outstanding.

Everyone that shoots revolver should own or at least try one. You will be very pleased and impressed.

I don't know anything about the Bill Davis guns, but I know if I came upon a Smith revolver like that, at $495 OTD, I would not hesitate to buy it provided it was mechanically sound.

The price was low because heavily modified guns are hard to sell to the average gun person.

That would be mine if I saw it, modified or not.

__________________
Made it, Ma! Top of the world!

Just a comment on build philosophy. If I am seeing the picture correctly, the front locking lug under the barrel is absent, replaced by the presence of the two crane lock balls to maintain front lockup of the cylinder, right? That was a fairly common practice with heavy barrel PPC Guns, but I liked the fact that other builders like Fred Schmidt installed that front lock, machined into the underlug of the heavy barrel and the crane lock ball to insure long lasting, positive lockup.

Have any of you long time users of PPC Guns formed similar or opposing opinions on this build concept?

Froggie

thanks for the replies folks. researching after i bought it, backwards i know, all the info i was able to find was positive. i read that a lot were made double action only. this one works both ways. i haven't had a chance to get to the range yet but hope to fix that soon.

mechanically all seem to be right. bore looks good and lockup is solid. the rifling looks good. needs a good cleaning and should be good to go. looks like it has been shot quite a bit by turn line and recoil shield. hopefully it'll shoot as good as it looks. range report to follow.

oh i almost forgot, gun show in Pasadena this weekend. had good luck at the last 3 out of 4 shows locally. always room for one more. maybe a nice set of grips.

thanks again, kenny

Attached Images

	P_20200605_173000_vHDR_Auto.jpg (98.4 KB, 154 views)
	P_20200605_153429_vHDR_Auto.jpg (88.4 KB, 147 views)
	P_20200605_172933_vHDR_Auto.jpg (85.1 KB, 147 views)
	P_20200605_153528_vHDR_Auto.jpg (94.7 KB, 140 views)
	P_20200605_172742_vHDR_Auto.jpg (92.7 KB, 123 views)

__________________
Too good

I've never seen one with a double detent in the yoke. It should shoot great after a good cleaning. You purchased it at a great price too. The front adjusting Aristocrat rib alone sells for $300+.
Give us a report on how it shoots if you can.

__________________
Ret. LE, FA Instr, S&W Armorer

I shot PPC with stock S&W 586s (4&6"), as I couldn't afford the nice "build" guns some of the other guys had. I always wanted one though. If I ever run across a deal like that, I'll definitely be an owner! Thanks for the pics. :-)

I would have taken it home as well. Nice looking gun with a lot of life.

__________________
Front sight and squeeze

I own 4-1/2 PPC revolvers myself, two of them built by absolute legends. When I first started my “gun life” I was able to watch local cops shooting PPC every Saturday morning on the indoor basement range at my sportsman’s club, so buying and loving them now as a longtime gun guy is a (yet another) method to transform me back to my youth!

If this is the first PPC gun you’ve bought there is something you WILL almost surely need to know:

To have the butter smooth and ultra-light double action feel, it’s got a light-as-possible main spring in it. It was wholly designed to run ammo with the Federal 100 small pistol primer, historically the very softest primer on the market.

My PPC guns are mind blowing, but if I feed them ammo made with the CCI-500 primer I like so much, 2-4 shots out of every 6 in double action simply won’t happen on the first try.

If you are a handloader, your absolute best next step is to find and buy Federal 100’s. If you are not a handloader, you will need to change or shim the spring, or take your shots single action, or be prepared for frustration as a Bill Davis is all but guaranteed to FTF half or more of any ammo that isn’t made with the Federal 100.

Conspiracy theory: this isn’t widely known to folks that weren’t old school PPC shooters and it might get more of these offered for sale as they may frustrate those who don’t know.

Your price was a STEAL! The market isn’t crazy over old PPC rigs, and these aren’t gold mines for gun flippers. But as a gun to own and enjoy, I say they are worth at least double what you paid. I’ve got a Bill Davis and a Travis Strahan and revolver guys that love to shoot are making a big mistake if they pass up good deals on these.

These guns are designed specifically for PPC a form of precision Pistol. The barrels are designed to shoot the 148 grain "Mid Range Wadcutter"! Or put another way, 148 grain hollow base wad cutter. 3.1 grains of W231, Federal Gold Metal Match Primers at around 750 fps! That is if you want 1" groups at 50 yards "all day long"!

20180718_105048.jpg

These two guns are now living in Honolulu shooting PPC by a couple of Cops there!

They took me to Expert Open and State Championships in class and many class awards at the NPSC's in Mississippi!

You can shoot PPC matches but not for awards depending on your state PPC associations!

Smiles,

The PPC/NRA Action revolvers I've owned or otherwise encountered didn't have both the crane lockup and retained the lock at the end of the ejector rod. I'm not sure that the ejector rod lock actually accomplishes anything when the cylinder is properly locked up by the crane lock in the front and the ratchet lock in the back.

These guns are designed specifically for PPC a form of Precision Pistol. The barrels are designed to shoot the 148 grain "Mid Range Wadcutter"! Or put another way, 148 grain hollow base wad cutter. 3.1 grains of W231, Federal Gold Metal Match Primers at around 750 fps! That is if you want 1" groups at 50 yards "all day long"!

Clicking on the thumbnail will make them "bigger"!
Top Bill Davis Wind Master bottom Tanaka Grade III!

Attachment 471149

These two guns are now living in Honolulu shooting PPC by a couple of Cops there!

They took me to Expert Open and State Championships in class and many class awards at the NPSC's in Mississippi!

You can shoot PPC matches but not for awards depending on your state PPC associations!

Smiles,

The Davis revolver I show in my above post shot NBC swaged 148 grain HBWC over 2.8 grains of Bullseye and sparked with CCI primers. Never had a failure. When I discovered my practice ammunition and my competition ammunition were producing the same scores, my competion load became a cast 148 DEWC (from two Lee double cavity molds) over the same 2.8 grains of Bullseye and the CCI primer. Any change in score was purely my fault.

I know the barrels were rifled specifically for the WC bullet. Not sure how they would perform with Aa heavier or lighter bullet.

Kevin

__________________
Unshared knowledge is wasted.

That is a great buy on a Bill Davis gun. He built really good ones. The last Ron Power Grand Master I saw at a gun show was priced at around $1500. And that was several years ago. Fantastic guns all built for a very special game and darn good.

__________________
Richard Gillespie
FBINA 102

Although this chronologically is the incorrect Forum for this gun, I have a Bill Davis 686-3 National Match, a five-inch with an unfluted cylinder that is one of 500 that S&W shipped to Mr. Davis in 1989 for his tuning work. I'm far from a great shutterbug so please excuse the photo quality.

Part of his work included installing his own rubber grip but I bought this gun used eight or ten years ago with a set of standard checkered targets on it. The rubber grips are said to be impossible to find and costly if you do luck into one but I found a like-new one on eBay for $18.00. Since a standard checkered target stock partially covered the target on the side plate, I bought this set of dual-speedloader cutout stocks that while not real highly figured, have perfect bookending of the grain and look nice on the gun.

The gun shoots great and is the S&W revolver I shoot the most.

Ed

Attached Images

	IMG_1183.jpg (104.4 KB, 91 views)
	IMG_1184.jpg (110.5 KB, 80 views)
	IMG_1185.jpg (97.1 KB, 72 views)

I have one with the Bill Davis Custom Sight Rib manufactured by Aristocrat. I understand a number of builders used this on their revolvers.

Mine was built by Master Gunsmith Ken Eversull and is based upon a S&W 10-7.

I acquired mine at auction back in February of 2018 for $584.00. It weights 3 lbs and 10 ozs.

Attached Images

	100_3809.jpg (59.4 KB, 47 views)
	100_3810.jpg (49.9 KB, 47 views)
	100_3813.jpg (96.6 KB, 42 views)
	100_3816.jpg (61.9 KB, 34 views)

Looks like the op got a great deal on specialized gun, should be loads of fun to shoot. Just as aside if you go looking for the Federal primers just look for this box saying small pistol. You should be able to see the striped box from across the room at a gunshow. The box holding 10 of these looks identical.

Attached Images

16003953320258209080878072427687.jpg (82.0 KB, 36 views)

I've the exact same gun - two screws holding the underside of the slab sided barrel on, yes? As nice as the DA pull is on his guns the SA is terrific. Absolutely no over-travel and the stop is fitted, not a screw in type.

Bill Davis operated out of a complex just outside Sacramento Ca and initially was a police supply outfit then went into having a neat machine shop and creating custom revolvers. PPC as we knew it then was competition of police teams against one another later evolving to what it is today. Davis Co. was also the S&W service center for Northern Ca and beyond. I had Davis Co prepare a commemorative pistol for the members of the dept. wooden cased 586 engraved....swapped mine to an officer for something I could not live without ( hope I still have it?).

I will have to shoot some targets and test the SA on mine. I remember using it for a very short time in competition. Several of the top shooters commented on my scores but also remarked that if I wanted to join them in the winners circle, my scores would improve if I shot DA. They were 1/2 right, my scores did improve but I was always 1-2 points back and more importantly 1-2 X’s fewer than the top shooters. Not much separated #1 from #10!

Kevin

__________________
Unshared knowledge is wasted.

Straw hat, Back in ancient times when our team was in the Governors twenty we shot with our duty weapons and often after working all night and traveling to the match. I shot a S&W model 19 4” and could pretty well clean the target but our best shooter fired a model 10 skinny barrel and just made a big ragged hole in the x ring. Bill Davis was with CHP at the time and competed also. You are right one x could put you a winner or in tenth place.

Bill Davis sold the moulds for the grip to Safariland. Safariland did not sell the grips and he bought the moulds back and they can be found at his web site now operated by his widow. I have bought 4 sets from the site. The good news now in pink and green !!

UPDATE: I tried the web site and it is no longer working.

__________________
SWCA 1932 SWHF 135

This was probably purpose built for "Distinguished Revolver" Class matches. I have seen similar models on the line while shooting such matches. It's pretty tough to get "Distinguished" so every little bit helps. I acquired 18 points my first year but degenerative bone disease in my neck led to retirement from PPC!

Smiles,

We saw a Clark custom PPC gun built on a M64 at the Lakeland gun show over the weekend. $1100 was the asking price, IIRC.

__________________
USS Brewton FF1086
SWCA#3597