Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Smith & Wesson Revolvers > S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980
GenBiz

Notices

S&W Revolvers: 1961 to 1980 3-Screw PINNED Barrel SWING-OUT Cylinder Hand Ejectors WITH Model Numbers


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:17 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Thanks to ladder13, my hubby 29-1 was able to acquire 3 13-2 3" revolvers shipped to the FBI Academy in Quantico, VA between 1980-1981. ladder13, 29-1 'owes you', I have a small collection of FBI connected firearms that isn't growing all that quickly, but agent/bureau shipped guns are tough to find. These three are what one would expect condition-wise coming out of the Academy; well used but serviceable. If any of my fellow agents or any LEO who was on the job during this period and perhaps was issued/carried this particular model, and would care to comment on the Model 13, I would appreciate your perspective.
Happy Holidays everyone
Eliza

Top to Bottom: All 3 letter shipped to the FBI.
6D87150 shipped 12/29/1980
9D00961 shipped 11/16/1981
6D86967 shipped 4/23/1981






__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #2  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:17 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Thanks to ladder13, my hubby 29-1 was able to acquire 3 13-2 3" revolvers shipped to the FBI Academy in Quantico, VA between 1980-1981. ladder13, 29-1 'owes you', I have a small collection of FBI connected firearms that isn't growing all that quickly, but agent/bureau shipped guns are tough to find. These three are what one would expect condition-wise coming out of the Academy; well used but serviceable. If any of my fellow agents or any LEO who was on the job during this period and perhaps was issued/carried this particular model, and would care to comment on the Model 13, I would appreciate your perspective.
Happy Holidays everyone
Eliza

Top to Bottom: All 3 letter shipped to the FBI.
6D87150 shipped 12/29/1980
9D00961 shipped 11/16/1981
6D86967 shipped 4/23/1981






__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:12 AM
Raider Raider is offline
SWCA Member
Absent Comrade
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,613
Likes: 107
Liked 386 Times in 187 Posts
Default

Congrats on your find. I'll bet you have a fine collection of FBI related firearms. Could you maybe show a photo of all of them together? Thanks!
__________________
SWCA # 2294
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:28 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Raider:
Congrats on your find. I'll bet you have a fine collection of FBI related firearms. Could you maybe show a photo of all of them together? Thanks!
Raider, I'll try and do this over the holidays when I get a break for a day or two. I've been thinking about doing this anyway.
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:40 AM
Andy Taylor Andy Taylor is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains
Posts: 1,370
Likes: 632
Liked 109 Times in 52 Posts
Default

Very nice.
__________________
Formerly know as Lucky Derby
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:55 AM
N_itis N_itis is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

LadyFed,

I share your interest and look forward to a first hand review which this, admittedly, is not.

I have an unfired, boxed 3" barreled M13-2, serial number 8D742XX which your post has convinced me I should get a factory letter for just to see where it was shipped. I have really always wanted a pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65 to actually carry and use but the only ones I have even heard of were issued to the Massachusetts State Police...and I have never actually seen one of them. Sadly, I am a "P&R snob," so the multitude of later 3" barreled M65s will just not do!

My gun is one of only two pinned and recessed 3" barreled M13s I have ever seen in person, and both where in pristine condition which has led me to conclude that very few were made before the 1982 transition. A position that I have to say is reinforced by the middle gun in your photo! Interestingly, the second gun wore what appeared to be a factory nickel finish which I am sure is even less common and was very likely a special order piece.

My purely uneducated opinion/guess, based on the limited amount of second hand knowledge I have gleaned from Federal Agents who served during the early 1980s, is that the 3" barreled, round butt guns were probably contracted (I assume by FBI) as a better concealment option to the 4" barreled, square butt guns sometime around 1980. The M13s were eventually "replaced" by non pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65-3s around 1982 or 1983; but, apparently, both M65s and M13s were issued interchangably prior to the "trials" of various "wondernines" in the mid 1980s. From the comments I have heard, the guns were well regarded but required the immediate addition of Pachmayer grips!

Again, I too would be interested to hear from anyone with first hand knowledge regarding pinned and recessed 3" barreled .357 Magnum M&Ps.

N_itis
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-13-2008, 06:28 AM
VonFatman's Avatar
VonFatman VonFatman is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: KC Area
Posts: 1,619
Likes: 215
Liked 282 Times in 96 Posts
Default

LadyFed,
Great guns and interesting thread!! Thanks for sharing. Like Mr. N_itis, I have a 13-2 w/box and goodies, serial number 8D342xx

I doubt it's an FBI gun, because of the box, but I guess a letter will let me know for sure.

Bob
__________________
"Onward thru the Fog"
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-13-2008, 06:33 AM
Malysh's Avatar
Malysh Malysh is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Central PA.
Posts: 960
Likes: 666
Liked 441 Times in 153 Posts
Default

My Mod 13-2 3"bbl. is ser. # 8D72865. When I bought it in the mid 80s it had a set of Pachmayers on it. I paid $165.00 for it. The only thing wrong with it is I let some schmuck examine it once and he held the hammer back partially and twirled the cylinder, causing a premature ring on the cylinder before I could grab it back! Without the cylinder ring I would rate it as about 90% cosmetically with evidence of little carry. It wasn't shot much either. I doubt it's an FBI gun due to the appearance. It DOES have the finest double action trigger pull of any of my S&Ws, though.
I have no idea who owned it before me. I wanted a practical, concealable 357 with no large sights to catch on clothing during concealment and I thought this model fit the bill admirably.
Maybe I should send a letter request to Mr. Jinks after 1/1/09?

Are Mod 13-2s rare?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-13-2008, 07:06 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Thanks to all for the interesting posts so far. Two of these 13-2s came with Pachmayer grips by the way. I'm going to the range today and try one of these out.
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-13-2008, 07:39 AM
Malysh's Avatar
Malysh Malysh is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Central PA.
Posts: 960
Likes: 666
Liked 441 Times in 153 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by LadyFed:
Thanks to all for the interesting posts so far. Two of these 13-2s came with Pachmayer grips by the way. I'm going to the range today and try one of these out.
Eliza
If it shoots as well as mine does you will be very pleased.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-13-2008, 08:14 AM
Frizzman Frizzman is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: The Old Dominion
Posts: 1,291
Likes: 360
Liked 571 Times in 278 Posts
Default

I well remember when those were the issue weapon for the FBI. I was a city cop at the time and thought that that was one slick revolver(I carried a M10-HB that was issued to me). I am sure you will enjoy it...
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-13-2008, 09:16 AM
ladder13's Avatar
ladder13 ladder13 is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Wake Forest, NC
Posts: 28,017
Likes: 44,104
Liked 45,305 Times in 14,413 Posts
Default

LadyFed, I was more than happy to help you and Chuck secure these M13's. They look much better now than they did in the store.
The gunshop where these were found has alot of old revolvers, as most buyers are looking for the "black" guns.
If I run across any more, I'll let you guys know.
I go to most of the Middletown shows, in case you guys are passing thru.
Regards,
Mike
SWCA 1975
__________________
In memory of Labworm
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-13-2008, 10:31 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Mike, thank you again. Yes, Chuck couldn't stand the Pachmayers on these guns so he put the correct stocks on them. I told him that the Pachs were probably more practical for the Agents who originally carried them, but he didn't want to hear it. We go to the Middletown show every once in a while so we'll have to set up a time to get together for sure.
Eliza
SWCA 2099
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-13-2008, 12:55 PM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Eliza;

I've attached a photo of a fixed sighted Model 19-3:

Here's a piece of the Factory Letter from Roy Jinks.


The first time I saw one of these was in about '76 when I was shooting PPC and at one of the Regional Matches one of the FBI Teams came up from somewhere in Kalifornia - I think from Sacramento but that is just a very old memory. All four Agents were carrying Model 19-3s just like this one. They told us that they had been "Issued" these just recently and that they hadn't had much time to 'Practice' with them. I guess that accounts for our 'Cleaning their Clocks' during the "Duty Gun Team Match". I've wanted one ever since that day because of the three inch barrel which also adds the Full Length Ejector Rod feature.

At the time I was Carrying a 2-1/2 inch, Model 19-3 in a Roy Baker Pancake Holster. I had several of these "in stock" and all four Agents purchased one for there own use. At the time, they were 'issued' a Tom Threepersons style holster with the 'FBI' tilt. The Baker Holster also offered the same angle but didn't stick out from the body near as much and made carrying under a light suit jacket much easier without the same "printing" issues.

Contacting S&W at the time got me a great Big "Huh???" and I was told no such gun had ever been produced and of course, when he then said "No more are available." I took that comment to mean that "yes" such guns were built but not for general LEO use.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-13-2008, 01:03 PM
hoopewlchaser hoopewlchaser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Hi all, I just saw this posting after I put up a new one, anyway I have a model 27 .357 blued and its an FBI Commemorative pistol, I was told it was offered to agents many years ago and it comes in a ver nice wooden velvet lined box, the FBI logo is on the box and the gun, and the serial# starts with FBI, was wondering if I can get some more info. on it and I was possibly looking to sell it, any info. would be great...Bobby
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-13-2008, 01:26 PM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

KKG- what a great story. I'm curious about the French Police variation and what the background on that one was. I now have something else to look for I would like to find a 10-6 in .357 as well as I've been told that was another FBI connected S&W.
Thank you again,
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-13-2008, 01:28 PM
max's Avatar
max max is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: illinois
Posts: 5,971
Likes: 1,640
Liked 6,032 Times in 1,894 Posts
Default

N_itis, I have a nickel 4 inch 13-1 that is P&R. I also have a 3 inch nickel 13-3 which is neither.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-13-2008, 01:43 PM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by hoopewlchaser:
Hi all, I just saw this posting after I put up a new one, anyway I have a model 27 .357 blued and its an FBI Commemorative pistol, I was told it was offered to agents many years ago and it comes in a ver nice wooden velvet lined box, the FBI logo is on the box and the gun, and the serial# starts with FBI, was wondering if I can get some more info. on it and I was possibly looking to sell it, any info. would be great...Bobby
Bobby, the FBI Commem Revolver was ordered through the FBIAA (FBI Agents Association) and sold only to Special Agents, active and retired. Each was specially numbered and most had the agents credential number engraved just above the trigger guard on the left side. Not all were however as some were produced without a number and these are actually quite rare. The full outfit includes the gun, wooden box, outside cardboard box, shipping carton with the agents name written on the side, the cardboard gun box with bar code label and the tools. There is also a white envelope that holds the brass plate for the presentation case and another small envelope for the key. There is also a couple of information sheets explaining the history of the FBI and S&W. All total this can go from 7-1500 depending on completeness. Here's a picture of what I just described.
Regards
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-13-2008, 02:10 PM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by LadyFed:
KKG- what a great story. I'm curious about the French Police variation and what the background on that one was. I now have something else to look for I would like to find a 10-6 in .357 as well as I've been told that was another FBI connected S&W.
Thank you again,
Eliza
The "French" Contract originally called for the the gun to be in 9MM Luger caliber but without requiring the use of Moon Clips. Thus, the Model 547 "Ejection System" was designed. The French were not Happy with the "works sometimes" nature of the system. The major problem is that the 'short' case has a tenancy to get caught under the Ejector unless the 'back side' of the Cylinder is pointed directly at the ground. Of course, this isn't always possible when laying behind cover or on your back or for whatever reason during a fire fight.

As these were going to be used for their version of the "Secret Service" they weren't interested in something that wasn't going to be 100% functional. Using this configuration - Full Length Ejector Rod - the Ejection process is much more positive. For once the French actually got something right!!

Another feature that the French "required" was the Shrouded Ejector Housing. What surprises me is that Smith didn't adopt this 3 inch Barrel and the Fixed Sights as regular Production feature or at least an option, for the Model 19-3s.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-13-2008, 02:18 PM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

KKG,thanks for the lesson on this rare variation. I had to laugh about your comment concerning the French getting it right. You're correct as that is about as rare as the revolver we're discussing.
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:31 PM
RKmesa's Avatar
RKmesa RKmesa is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: AZ
Posts: 6,618
Likes: 23,327
Liked 39,159 Times in 4,128 Posts
Default

Eliza:

Very nice photos of some great guns...

Quote:
I have really always wanted a pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65 to actually carry and use but the only ones I have even heard of were issued to the Massachusetts State Police...and I have never actually seen one of them. Sadly, I am a "P&R snob," so the multitude of later 3" barreled M65s will just not do!
N_itis:

Do you mean a 3" P&R 65 like this 65-2? It has a set of custom smoothed and rounded Ahrends FG's on it and one of the smoothest triggers on any Smith that I own - it is the perfect carry smith (at least for me). BTW - it is the only 3" P&R 65 that I have seen in person...



I also have a recessed, but not pinned 3" 13-2. I sure like these guns...
__________________
Richard
Engraved S&W fan
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #22  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:48 PM
Malysh's Avatar
Malysh Malysh is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Central PA.
Posts: 960
Likes: 666
Liked 441 Times in 153 Posts
Default

Quote:
Are Mod 13-2s rare?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 12-13-2008, 04:57 PM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by RKmesa: ...I also have a recessed, but not pinned 3" 13-2...
RK; Recessed is important if for appearance sake if nothing else but the "Pin" hasn't be 'needed' since 1957 and was kept around just kept around because <span class="ev_code_RED">"A thing call tradition." </span>!!! And, this is a direct Quote from the man who holds the S&WCA Badge Number 1.

**********PART II**********

Eliza; It's tough admitting the French ever did anything "right" but then I think about them asking for a 9MM Luger revolver that would work without Moon Clips, to begin with, and have to wonder just how much "they" had to do with the final 'Design' of this gun.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 12-13-2008, 05:08 PM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Malysh: Are Mod 13-2s rare?
They were in production from 1977 to 1982 when the -3 change came around, so, I would guess there were a pretty large number of them manufactured but that doesn't mean there are a lot of them on the "market" because the folks who were buying these were buying them to shoot - strange as that may seem!!! Shooters, especially, LEOs who have been "taught" to 'Point Shoot' understand that Adjustable Sights Aren't really all that 'necessary' and can be just one more thing to have go 'wrong' with a sidearm. Many Agencies still issue guns with fixed sights because that is the way most Law Enforcement shootings go down - no body can even remember seeing the Sights! They're too busy looking at the *** who's shooting at them to care. Hopefully, they've been properly trained to Point Shoot and their 'Training' kicks in.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 12-13-2008, 07:21 PM
SteveM SteveM is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I have a 13 - 3" that I bought in 1981 from J&G Sales. Its a 13-2 and is P & R. serial is 8D74XXX. Do you think this one may also be FBI. J&G was heavily involved with law enforcement sales back then. Mine came with the box and it does have a S&W service depatment stamp on the frame under the grips - I guess either for a repair or a finish correction. At the time J&G alluded to the fact of the gun being a "sample" or "demonstrator" piece and I bought it at a price discounted from wholesale dealer prices. I was not able to get any clear or factual info on their comment from them. At the time I did not really think much of it or put much into its relevance. I was just wanting to by the gun for the price. I cant really tell if its been fired. The recoil sheild does not have a mark on it nor do I see any accumulation between the barrel and frame

At the same time I also bought a Model 10-8 with a 3" barrel Serial 6D58XXX. In the box label under "Stock" - they are listed as "TR" - any idea what this means ?

Any comments by any of the previous posters would be appreciated
__________________
SteveM
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 12-13-2008, 08:03 PM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

SteveM; The ONLY way to truly answer your question would be with a Factory Letter from Roy Jinks. Currently they cost $50.00 and you can expect at least a couple of months worth of wait.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 12-13-2008, 08:17 PM
SteveM SteveM is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Yea, I know - dont know if I want to mess with it right now or not
__________________
SteveM
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 12-14-2008, 12:59 AM
N_itis N_itis is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Texas
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by RKmesa:
Eliza:

Very nice photos of some great guns...

Quote:
I have really always wanted a pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65 to actually carry and use but the only ones I have even heard of were issued to the Massachusetts State Police...and I have never actually seen one of them. Sadly, I am a "P&R snob," so the multitude of later 3" barreled M65s will just not do!
N_itis:

Do you mean a 3" P&R 65 like this 65-2? It has a set of custom smoothed and rounded Ahrends FG's on it and one of the smoothest triggers on any Smith that I own - it is the perfect carry smith (at least for me). BTW - it is the only 3" P&R 65 that I have seen in person...



I also have a recessed, but not pinned 3" 13-2. I sure like these guns...
Beautiful gun, RKmesa. Exactly what I was talking about.

Thanks for sharing and disspelling my "defensive delusion" that there were no commercially available pinned and recessed 3" barrelled M65s. Deep down I knew better. Know I cannot rest until I find My Grail.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 12-14-2008, 03:00 AM
Texas Star Texas Star is offline
US Veteran
Absent Comrade
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Texas
Posts: 20,376
Likes: 24,283
Liked 16,127 Times in 7,400 Posts
Default

The French variation was designed by Raymond Sasia, head of a police unit there and a man who studied with the FBI here.

I believe that I recall reading that he headed the Presidential Hunting Service, a euphemism for the French President's personal bodyguard.

One photo here shows a One of Fifty legend. I have no idea how many were made, but the fifty may represent guns shipped to non LEO destinations.

T-Star
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 12-14-2008, 03:22 AM
Mickstix Mickstix is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Debary, FL.
Posts: 253
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Great pics of some fine firearms!! Ladyfed, I especially like your arrangement and display!! Looks like a pro background/lighting!!
__________________
Mick
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 12-14-2008, 04:56 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Mickstix:
Great pics of some fine firearms!! Ladyfed, I especially like your arrangement and display!! Looks like a pro background/lighting!!
Mickstix, thanks for the compliment but I have to give credit to the old man, 29-1 for the picture taking. He's been trying to learn how to take better photos this past year and he's doing pretty good with it.

RK:Thank's for the Model 65 photos. I assume this is the gun the Model 13 evolved into? After reading your comment about your 13-2 that is recessed with no pin, the one in the picture that shipped in Nov/81 is like that as well. But, as KKG explains, the pin isn't needed anyway. It looks like it has a function though on the ones that have it

KKG:
Texas Star:
Thanks guys for the continuing dialog and schooling on this subject. It's good to hear from people that have 'been there and done that' and know what they're talking about.
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 12-14-2008, 09:21 AM
Junior Member
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Eliza; You're Welcome I always look forward to your Postings because of your more 'current' knowledge of the FBI.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12-14-2008, 09:33 AM
hoopewlchaser hoopewlchaser is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Hi Eliza, thanks for the info. and the pics, what you posted there is exactly what I have, I'm a TFO here in New York and I found this gun from a retired agent from colorado who now lives in Virginia, the only thing i'm not sure about is the creds# I will pull the gun out and look at it, otherwise like I said everything you have there is what I have the plate was never even engraved, I might just hold onto it, I was thinking about selling it pretty much up in the air, again thanks for the info.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 12-14-2008, 03:46 PM
dnater dnater is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Central AZ, USA
Posts: 145
Likes: 4
Liked 62 Times in 27 Posts
Default

Quote:
The M13s were eventually "replaced" by non pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65-3s around 1982 or 1983; but, apparently, both M65s and M13s were issued interchangably prior to the "trials" of various "wondernines" in the mid 1980s. From the comments I have heard, the guns were well regarded but required the immediate addition of Pachmayer grips!
I attended the FBI Academy in 1986 and was issued a 3"M13, as were all my fellow agents. The M65 was not an issue weapon with FBI, but I believe it was DEA issue at the time. All the issue FBI guns had wood grips and Pachmayr grip adapters. We got the revolver, a Safariland JK-2 speedloader with Safariland pouch, a thumb break holster and a 2x2x2 drop pouch. The leather was tan in color and from Bucheimer(?).
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 12-14-2008, 08:13 PM
RKmesa's Avatar
RKmesa RKmesa is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: AZ
Posts: 6,618
Likes: 23,327
Liked 39,159 Times in 4,128 Posts
Default

KKG:

I also am a P&R snob (not sure exactly why) and the R'd only 13-2 3" is the only non P'd Smith that I own. It's just that those 3" inch tubes are soo cool, that I decided to buy the gun, not to mention that if I recall correctly the the price started with a 2.

I also remember reading #1's comments on the pin and its purpose, or lack thereof - very interesting. I'm sure glad that we still have him around.
__________________
Richard
Engraved S&W fan
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 12-15-2008, 02:56 AM
LadyFed's Avatar
LadyFed LadyFed is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Alexandria, VA
Posts: 61
Likes: 4
Liked 36 Times in 10 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by dnater:
Quote:
The M13s were eventually "replaced" by non pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65-3s around 1982 or 1983; but, apparently, both M65s and M13s were issued interchangably prior to the "trials" of various "wondernines" in the mid 1980s. From the comments I have heard, the guns were well regarded but required the immediate addition of Pachmayer grips!
I attended the FBI Academy in 1986 and was issued a 3"M13, as were all my fellow agents. The M65 was not an issue weapon with FBI, but I believe it was DEA issue at the time. All the issue FBI guns had wood grips and Pachmayr grip adapters. We got the revolver, a Safariland JK-2 speedloader with Safariland pouch, a thumb break holster and a 2x2x2 drop pouch. The leather was tan in color and from Bucheimer(?).
dnater, thanks for more good info. I now know the holster/ammo setup I need to locate.
Eliza
__________________
Eliza:)
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 05-13-2010, 11:18 AM
FlaCat FlaCat is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFed View Post
Bobby, the FBI Commem Revolver was ordered through the FBIAA (FBI Agents Association) and sold only to Special Agents, active and retired. Each was specially numbered and most had the agents credential number engraved just above the trigger guard on the left side. Not all were however as some were produced without a number and these are actually quite rare. The full outfit includes the gun, wooden box, outside cardboard box, shipping carton with the agents name written on the side, the cardboard gun box with bar code label and the tools. There is also a white envelope that holds the brass plate for the presentation case and another small envelope for the key. There is also a couple of information sheets explaining the history of the FBI and S&W. All total this can go from 7-1500 depending on completeness. Here's a picture of what I just described.
SCS&W says that 3200 were made.
Any idea, LadyFed, how much these cost the agents in 1983 when they were sold?
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 05-17-2010, 10:10 PM
tac803's Avatar
tac803 tac803 is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: South of Buffalo, NY
Posts: 501
Likes: 25
Liked 40 Times in 23 Posts
Default

I finally acquired a mod 13-2, nickel, 3" rd butt recessed and not pinned, sn 9D33XXX. I'm guessing it's "transitional", and I can't find any useful info about this variant in the SCSW. The frame is marked N, so it's factory nickel. Does anybody know if the FBI used any nickel guns at all?
__________________
Rough waters ahead.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 05-17-2010, 11:38 PM
armadillo's Avatar
armadillo armadillo is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 931
Likes: 1,026
Liked 886 Times in 310 Posts
Default

That is an amazing find.

I know that the FBI bought a lot of M-13s, but the federal government rules on disposition of fireatms does not allow them to be resold. When they went to semi-autos, many of the revolvers were disabled and made into "red handles" for training.

I guess it is possible that it could have been "surplused" and dontated to a non-fed agency that later traded it for a newer model.
__________________
6/23/2022
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 05-18-2010, 11:58 AM
ENGINE18 ENGINE18 is offline
US Veteran
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Arizona
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 0
Liked 21 Times in 15 Posts
Default

Well, you all made my day! IMHO, the 3-inch fixed-sight k-frames are perfect. The 13/65 configuration is my favorite. Although I confess to owning "only" a 65-5, a 13/65 P&R is on my list.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 09-13-2010, 12:55 AM
gkitch gkitch is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Charleston SC
Posts: 1,481
Likes: 3,389
Liked 1,582 Times in 431 Posts
Default

What about famous guns from famous FBI agents? I know George Zeiss's 357 magnum is on the wall of the Globe & Laurel Reseraunt, and 104 year old Walter Walsh still has his registered magnum. Rumor has it that Hoover was presented with several special firearms that have mysteriously never resurfaced since his death.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 09-13-2010, 01:20 AM
up196 up196 is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Default 3" Model 65 P&R

Quote:
Originally Posted by N_itis View Post
Quote:
Originally posted by RKmesa:
Eliza:

Very nice photos of some great guns...

Quote:
I have really always wanted a pinned and recessed 3" barreled M65 to actually carry and use but the only ones I have even heard of were issued to the Massachusetts State Police...and I have never actually seen one of them. Sadly, I am a "P&R snob," so the multitude of later 3" barreled M65s will just not do!
N_itis:

Do you mean a 3" P&R 65 like this 65-2? It has a set of custom smoothed and rounded Ahrends FG's on it and one of the smoothest triggers on any Smith that I own - it is the perfect carry smith (at least for me). BTW - it is the only 3" P&R 65 that I have seen in person...



I also have a recessed, but not pinned 3" 13-2. I sure like these guns...
Beautiful gun, RKmesa. Exactly what I was talking about.

Thanks for sharing and disspelling my "defensive delusion" that there were no commercially available pinned and recessed 3" barrelled M65s. Deep down I knew better. Know I cannot rest until I find My Grail.
I have a 3" Model 65-2 that is pinned and recessed also. I bought it new in October of 1981 and still carry it occasionally. It's a very versatile revolver. Ironically, after I bought it, I sold the 3" Model 13-2 that I had, which was also pinned and recessed.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 09-13-2010, 01:52 AM
cz93x62 cz93x62 is offline
Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Ridgecrest, CA USA
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

I was loaned an FBI-issue Model 13 x 3" for a short time to test the platform for my agency--this was during the mid-1980s. My impression then and now is that the K-frame 357 Magnum with 3" barrel is a VERY FINE "soft-clothes" carry gun. If I located a M-13 or M-65 x 3" for sale at reasonable cost, I would pounce like a cat on it. For now, a M-19 x 2.5" takes its place nicely.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 09-13-2010, 06:53 AM
gkitch gkitch is offline
SWCA Member
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Charleston SC
Posts: 1,481
Likes: 3,389
Liked 1,582 Times in 431 Posts
Default

This thread got me looking at my pinned and recessed 13-2 I bought used with Pachs on it. Could this be another FBI gun? I gave it some thought while examining the wheelgun closely. I came to the conclusion that there will be no need to get a letter on this one. It has been carried a bit and shows some blue wear, but does not show the evidence of having been run through the FBI's extensive Academy training. I would assume just one agent packing this gun through the academy alone would show wear from a few thousand rounds at least? Unless it was swapped out with an existing agent when the FBI adopted the 13 it would certainly be well shot-in.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 01-16-2012, 09:47 AM
hickok45 hickok45 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
Default

That is so cool. I'd love to find one of those that was used by the FBI. I love a 3" K-Frame heavy barrel, and having one with this history is additionally cool. :-)
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 07-14-2012, 10:01 AM
nipster nipster is offline
Banned
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 2,026
Likes: 5
Liked 386 Times in 272 Posts
Default

I bought one recently, it's a 3" 13-2, serial 8D72xx. P&R with the proper RB magnas. I may letter it to see if it's a FBI gun, but I am guessing it's not considering the condition it is in.

I know of a place locally I can buy a 3" 13-3, it's not in as-good of a condition as the 13-2 I bought, I would say 85%
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 04-11-2021, 11:12 AM
rustednbustedchuck rustednbustedchuck is offline
Banned
Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI Model 13-2 FBI  
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 40
Likes: 3
Liked 29 Times in 11 Posts
Default

Does anybody have an idea how many 13-2 3" revolvers were sold to "Uncle Sugar"? I have one, with the pachs, that bounces around those numbers. but don't really have the dough to gamble on a $100 letter if its a long shot. Thanks from the slavery state.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
357 magnum, 547, ahrends, bodyguard, ejector, engraved, jinks, leather, m13, m65, model 10, model 19, model 65, model 66, pachmayr, ppc, presentation, recessed, registered magnum, safariland, speedloader, zeiss

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Tulsa Gunshow this Saturday: Model 63, Model 60, Model 351PD, Model 500 retiredsquid GUNS - For Sale or Trade 1 04-08-2010 04:29 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:30 AM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)