A curiosity question here, time to put macho ego and boasting aside.

I have been shooting .500s since they came out. I shoot more moderate loads but do routinely fire the maximum stuff and enjoy a few cylinder fulls per range visit. I'll also admit that I don't want anything more potent.

How many people would REALLY enjoy owning and firing a revolver that kicked considerably harder than a max load .500? Thanks, Don

A curiosity question here, time to put macho ego and boasting aside.

I have been shooting .500s since they came out. I shoot more moderate loads but do routinely fire the maximum stuff and enjoy a few cylinder fulls per range visit. I'll also admit that I don't want anything more potent.

How many people would REALLY enjoy owning and firing a revolver that kicked considerably harder than a max load .500? Thanks, Don

I already do. It's called a model 329 with full power loads.

Just so you know where I'm coming from, I'm retired military and range office, match director, NRA Instructor for over 30 years.

Recoil is highly subjective, depending on attitude, technique, physical ability, and the gun. I know a 225# male that does not like shooting full-sized .357 revolvers, and another that took lots of help and coaching to learn to shoot a Redhawk .44 magnum. I've seen the macho types brag about how they like recoil but can't hit the side of a barn from flinching.
I've seen the brash kid with the blood running down his face from holding the .500 incorrectly. I've seen the guy knocked on the ground under his .308 handrifle.
I've seen the 13-year-old girl who could strike a match with a .44 mag. I know one petite lady who is a nationally-ranked competitior with .45s, .40s, or just about any action pistol.
In Alaska, some consider the .44mag too light for safety. No handgun is really too powerful for the big bears.

Personally, where and how I hunt, a .357 is just fine. There are a couple of hunters here who shoot coyotes with the .500 and consider my .357 a popgun. I don't own a .500 and have no use for it. My coyotes are just as dead as theirs.

What do I REALLY enjoy shooting? A long-barreled .38 on a bullseye range, a scoped .357 at varmits. My 686 at an IDPA match.

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Science plus Art

OKFC05, I'm retired military as well, a weapons specialist.

Your post was interesting but didn't address the question.

Of course a .357 will be completely effective on a coyote. It won't hold a candle to a .500 on a coastal grizzly or Africa's big 5. Don

I think my limit is a 3" 629 with full loads. I would love to TRY a .500 or .460 but I'm really not interested in owning one.

I don't personally enjoy shooting anything more than a heavy .357 load in handguns.

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~ S&WCA No.2159 ~

I've not had a chance to shoot a 500 yet. I have shot a 454 and found it to be more comfortable to shoot than my 340pd in .357 The 454, while packing a whallop, feels like more of a push than the 340.

As far as enjoying the recoil of a max load 500, I doubt that I would. If I need more power, I probably will opt for a rifle.

Sir, FWIW, a .500 mag or larger does not sound at all enjoyable to me.

Hope this helps, and Semper Fi.

Ron H.

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Wishin' don't make it so.

I have a 7.5" Casull in .454 and that's plenty for me. I shoot 265g cast .44's over 22g of H110 all the time, but that's my limit and I'm begining to appreciate the .44spl and .45LC a whole lot more these days.

I didn't think I was recoil sensitive but 357's in AirLites are (apparently) my limit.

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NRA Certified Instructor

Ditto Ditto Ditto. I have a 3" 629, have learned to shoot hot 300gr. loads controlled and repeated. Don't want more. My next "step" up in defensive power is a 30-30 with a 20" barrel.

OK, I'm being too subtle. Here it is direct.

The question asked was "How many people would REALLY enjoy owning and firing a revolver that kicked considerably harder than a max load .500? "

NO. I have no use for a .500 and DO NOT REALLY ENJOY shooting one, much less something more powerful in a handgun. I don't want to own one, and do not see the point for hunting in Oklahoma. If I went back to Alaska, I'd want a .375 RIFLE for the big bears, not a handgun.

With a couple of exceptions, the people I've seen shooting the "hand cannons" don't seem to enjoy them and have flinching problems.

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Science plus Art

I enjoy recoil, not pain. 44 and moderate 500 loads are fun, but my body will feel the effects of any heavier pounding!

It took nearly a year to recover from by my broken hand. It was not a shooting accident, but the bones need time to heal.

Now my left rotator cuff is getting back to normal, time to hit the range to test it out. Thank god I'm a righty

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NRA Benefactor Member

I also own a S&W 629 with a three inch barrel and shot the S&W 500 and 460 in several different barrel lengths. I prefer the 500s and 460s. I have to admit that my 629 does have wooden grips which doesn't help in the recoil department.

Dennis

I've never shot a 500 BUT I do own a .460V & enjoy it. So far the heaviest round I've found for it was CorBon 395gr. There is some serious kick behind that bullet but in all honesty it's not much more than Winchester 260gr. 454 Casull rounds I fire through it. The Hornady 200gr 460 rounds have a good kick but the 1st 2 rounds have more. So I can't full answer your question considering I've yet to shoot a 500 much less a full power rounds from it. If there was a stronger 460 round then sure (there may be but I haven't seen it), I've give it a try.

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NRA Endowment Member

Not me. 250 @ 1,200 is plenty.


Okie John

I'd like to make one point here. I don't shoot that many heavy loads and there are plenty of people who will put up with recoil levels I won't.

There are also people who can handle heavy recoil but choose not to.

This was a light hearted thread with absolutely NO intent of being critical of anyone.

I think Okie John hit it about right, once I go past a 240/250 grainer at 1100 to 1200 fps in a six inch N frame, the fun goes away. That threshold gets crossed quicker with a lighter gun or a shorter barrel.

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Randy
SWCA #2468 SWHF #346

If I feel a need for more than 250 at 1200 fps, I too feel the need for more gun than my 29 or 629s. My personal favorite is the Ruger Redhawk or Bisley Blackhawk both in .44 Magnum, .45 Colt or 500 Linebaugh. I shoot a lot more 400+ grain bullets at 800 fps rather than 1300 fps. I don't like pain that much. Past a certain point the wrists and elbows cry enough. If they killed grizzly with a .50 caliber 435 grain bullet at 1200 fps, then it should work in a revolver just as well. A 240 grain bullet at 1000 fps is enough gun for most everything and a .44 Special hot load, 240 grain at 1200 fps, is enough for everything a revolver should be doing. Sort of a .30-06 in a shorter version, just some range restrictions for us mere mortals. Sure glad S&W finally got it right with the .44 Magnum Mountain Gun, since they didn't make enough Model 24s or Second Model Hand Ejectors with modern steel. I can dream can't I?

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Carson

If you love to shoot those big boys, get back to the rest of us in about 20 years, we'd like to know which gave up first: you or the gun.

I feel it ("discomfort") in my elbow as much as my hand after 20-30 rounds of 460mag. It seems the push tries to drive your forearm out of your elbow.

I bought the gunlast year. I want to get good enough with it to hunt with. It is taking a while to get used toit only shooting 20 or so rounds per session. My last session, I could shoot all I wanted and get 4-5 inch groups at 25 yards, but only 8-9 inch groups at 50 yards. someday I'll get a scope.

I don't have any qualifications, I'm just a shooter. I've never shot a .500 but have shot .44 magnum. I'm not particularly recoil sensitive. In fact I like recoil. It's a power thing

Anyway, .44 magnum is fine for me. For me it's a physical issue. I can't see shooting something that is painful and will be sending me to the orthopedic surgeon. I think, for me, given my moderate size, relative small hands and not so thick wrists, anything much over full-power .44mags would be down right painful.

However, I expect if I was likely to meet a bear I'd be glad to have it.

I love my .44 Magnums, but only push the limit with the Ruger SRH (scoped) and the SBH. A 310grs LWNFP at 1155 fps and a 240 gr.HDY HP/XTP at 1400 is the limit for me and my firearms. The model 29 doesn't get fed anything this heavy. I know exactly where the point is between enjoyable shooting, and too much recoil.

There comes a point where it's not all that much fun, and that's where I draw the line. As mentioned above, that line depends on the individual. Moderate to heavy recoil for me is dependent on the gun. SRH vs Model 29 for example. Obviously, the much heavier SRH allows for heavier loads with the same amount of recoil as lighter loads in the Mod. 29. I can easily reach the limit with the .44 mag. I do not see where I would need to plop down a ton of $$$ for a S&W 500 just to see where the limit is for that particular gun.

The variables seem to be:

The firearms weight/size.

The persons size/strength/shooting posture.

The persons individual threshold for recoil, ie; when is recoil counterproductive to enjoyment.

All these variable come into play, so there is no one answer that will fit all shooters.

BTW, full house 158gr. .357 factory loads are just not fun out of my J-frame centennial. I assume they would be less fun for the bad guy. They do not get shot much at the range for enjoyment!

WG840

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Freedom above all else.

I shoot my 625's for enjoyment with target loads (4.0 grs of Bullseye with a 200 gr SWC or equivalent).

However, in preparing myself for my traditional deer hunting (I did this routinely for several years) I would shoot about 2500 full loads of .44 magnum in my two hunting revolvers (8 3/8" S&W Model 29 and 7.5" Ruger Red Hawk). Both of these have scopes mounted so the extra weight does reduce felt recoil a good bit. Further, I would shoot the .44 magnum with full loads during the year on steel up to a hundred yards from various field positions just to maintain my skill level.

I was reading J.D. Jones' shooting magazine at the time, and became intrigued with the possibilities of heavier loads in the TC Contender platform. I bought several TC barrels evenually, and found the load that exceeded my recoil tolerance. It was the .444 Marlin in a 10" barrel TC Contender. THAT was too much. It had iron sights (no scope weight to reduce felt recoil) and each time I fired it, it would twist from my left (support hand) and bend my right wrist to the point that I realized if I continued, it would physically injure me. I sold the Marlin barrel.

Then I bought a J.D. Jones custom barrel for the TC chambered for the .375 JDJones. Now, this cartridge has the same recoil as the .444 Marlin. It is built on the same case and drives a 270 gr .375 bullet at up to 2000 fps. However, this barrel had JD's porting, and it had JD's super strong scope mount. I mounted a 2X Leupold on this scope and started shooting it. I learned that if I would limit each string to five shots, I could get five surprise breaks (shooting standing two handed). The muzzle brake prevented ANY muzzle rise (but did little for the "come back"). Eventually, I came to shoot the best target I have ever shot with the heavy recoiling pistol. Shooting five shots, then going to another target and shooting my 16-4 S&W with .32 target loads, then shooting the second five shots with the .375, I shot a 100x100, 10"X" possible at 25 yards (on the timed fire target). Now, that was a pretty target. I have not done it since but I CAN shoot that handgun quite well AS LONG AS I LIMIT MYSELF TO FIVE SHOTS IN A STRING).

So, I was armed quite well for hunting. The only problem is that I did all of my deer hunting in Ohio and that handgun is not legal here. So, I never shot anything live with it.

I DID establish my limits however, and from an academic stand point, it was interesting and instructive.

Now, I think I'll go out to the range and ENJOY myself with my 625's and target loads...

Dale53

I have a .41 mag. I do not really enjoy firing. The .357 is more that I really like. The .38 hand loads from my bro are fine with me and the most accurate I have found. Like the man said they are more accurate than I am.

Back in the day, I shot a lot of handgun ammo. From 38 wadcutters to full bore 44 mags. and a lot of the stuff from here to there. I was a good pistol shooter and shot several head of big game with a 44. Today I still shoot a 44 but mostly with 44 special class loads. Just enough magnum ammo to stay hunting proficient, although my maximum range had shortened up considerably..I have the usual pains and conditions that go with becoming a seasoned citizen and if I had known I was going to live this long I might have done things a little different. 44 Mag is my limit and I DON'T enjoy it!

My personal limit was hit about 30 years ago with a 4" M29 and full .44 Magnum loads. Shot .44s in Rugers a while after that but I have ammo for that sitting on the shelf that is probably 20 years old now.

.44 and .45 250 grainers at 900 fps suffice and are still fun and accurate. The only time I spent time in grizzly country I carried a .375 H&H.

I carried a .357/125 for work for years, and IMHO it's still a top choice. I don't mind it in a medium frame DA so I am still ok with that. Of late I really like the GP-100 with those loads--just a piece of cake. And .38 SWCs are just the thing for plinking.

Have zero interest in the super-sized bombards. As I recall Taffin did an article some years back detailing the damage the hard kickers did to his wrists. It wasn't pretty.

But then there is the possibility that I am just a wuss.

A few comments.

Aside from the fact that different folks have different hand sizes and hand strengths and recoil tolerances, grips are EVERYTHING. I generally consider .44 Magnum a medium-recoil cartridge, but it depends on the gun and the grips. With excellent grips (Hogue Goodyears), the Mountain Gun is not painful, but not very fast on the second shot, either. I wouldn't even consider a 329 with full-house loads. While I find most heavy .44 Magnum loads OK in my 4" 29 with Pachmayr SN-S Presentations and my 3" double-Magnaported 629 with Fishpaw copies of the Pachmayr Compac Professionals, only slightly fatter, the only load which ever injured me was the .357 125gr factory load in a Model 19 with Magna grips and a Tyler. After firing less than a box of these, in the 19 and probably in my same-configured 66, my hand was sore for a couple of weeks, although it obviously didn't hurt me enough to keep me from shooting as much as I did. Strangely, the same load is acceptable in my 686 with the same grip setup. There is clearly some very distinct threshold here, probably practically related to gun weight.

Also, in recently shooting both my 4" 29 and my 3" 629, I find the 3" MORE comfortable with the same heavy 240gr loads. It seems that the one Pachmayr design is better than the other. enough so that I now notice the difference.

I still don't l;ike my 342PD with 158gr bullets, and my H-S precision in 7mm-08 is still OK.


????

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Formerly Model520Fan

Don; I was just wondering had when "<span class="ev_code_RED">coastal grizzly or Africa's big 5</span>" made the Transition in to New Mexico??? During my last Trip to NM I might have seen few Elk that would have had me thinking about adding a .44 Magnum but certainly I saw nothing that would have stood up to a well loaded .357 Magnum especially in the hands of someone who does spend 'enough' time Practicing with they're choosen "Hunting Rig". And, I think that is what was the 'point' OKFCO5 was making.

Some of the first "Game" taken with the original .357 Magnum handguns were Grizzly & Polar Bear and Moose!!!

We used to have a "Metal Gong Target" at the Range where I've been shooting for lots of years and back a few years ago I was running the Hunter Sight-in Program and would help these guys get their .300 Win Mags, 7MM Remington Mags and even their .338s sighted in from the "bench" and many of them were well able to put 5 shots inside MOA at 200 yards. Well even once on a while I'd suggest they step over to the end of the Range where the Gong was set up and try a few shots "Off Hand"!!! Well, 9 out of 10 of then couldn't keep 1 shot in 5 even on the Gong and it was 18 inches in diameter!!! And, ONLY 175 yards away!

I would hall out my Model 27 with an 8-3/8 inch barrel and a 4X Leupold scope and would show them that the target was real by putting 6 out of 6 on the Gong and generally with-in a 6 inch "X" Ring painted on it and, yes, I was shooting Off Hand. But, I had also practiced doing that and not just once a year before Deer Season.

KKG, I would assume that anyone on this forum would be quite sure that if I mentioned a coastal grizzly, they would know I meant Alaska not NM.

Here in Albuquerque, we get small blackies coming down from the Sandias in times of limited food to prowl neighborhood back yards. Animal Control darts and relocates them.

Yes, short of elk which can be very large in n. NM, a good shot with a .357 can take any animal here but that wasn't the question I asked.

The intent of the original post was to see if someone would REALLY like to shoot a .600 or .700 S&W IF they made such a beast. Herb Belin, S&Ws head revolver guy, said a larger caliber than the .500 was apparently briefly considered and rejected for a variety of reasons. I for one would not care to shoot one. Don