I keep my home defense 686+ loaded with +P 38 special ammo rather than 357 for a number of reasons. I live in a neighborhood with houses fairly close together and am concerned about over penetration with the 357. The 686 may be used by other family members who can shoot well but are not used to 357 recoil and noise. I also like the fact that I can get back on target more quickly with 38 ammo than I can with 357. What is right or wrong with my thinking on this ?

In my house the 686 is loaded with 357 why?? It hurts and like you said the noise just may scare the shiat out of the intruder and they just may flee !!! While in Alaska thats all we carried and things worked fine!!!!

7Shooter,
I had a .357 for home defense for years and do as you say for the same reasons. If I would add another for the +P it would be a lower flash.
S

As long as you, or other members of your family are hitting where you're aiming under stress, absolutely nothing wrong with your choice of loads, or 22lr's for that matter.
But that takes training.
...and then more training.

Whatever ammo you choose, practice, practice, practice.

If you think overpenetration is a problem, try figuring out where the bullets are going if you miss your intended target and put the round out a window or thin wall!

If you decide to go 357, look at loads designed not to overpenetrate.
i.e. Glasser Safety Slug, MagSafe ( or even multi-ball rounds.)

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Dave

I keep my Model 60 loaded with +P. I actually shoot .357's in it just as well, but the Mod 60 goes from belt to nightstand even though I have better options. Excessive muzzle flash is the reason.

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"Give me Liberty..."

Same here, mainly because the wife dosen't really like the magnums with this gun. She was ok with a 4" 586, but I had to part with that one.
Chuck

For the application you mentioned, the 38+P makes the most sense to me. Mine is loaded with the Speer 135 grain Gold Dot +P.

Any round which reliably penetrates flesh enough to reach the vitals of a human attacker WILL penetrate multiple interior or exterior walls. Nothing you can do about it.

Just extra incentive to use the best-performing round you can acquire and makes the bullets go where they need to.

For home defense I would go with the proven FBI load. My number one home defense revolver is the model 10 but I have several 357s that would function just as well. I have always been able to hit were I aim better with the model 10 than any of my other revolvers. It is probably me. A person that is very experience with 357s rounds would use the proven 125g HP. But I am small and the recoil of the 357 hampers my accurately.

roaddog

Trying to predict penetration with either round is a waste of time. It totally depends on what the round hits. Drywall? A stud? A door frame. A light switch. Impossible to predict how your round will do with a missed shot. Same with a hit. Sometimes a .38 will go through and through and sometimes a .357 will stop in the flesh.

If everyone in the house can shoot the .38 well, be satisfied with that.

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Centennial Every Day

I once read somewhere that a person who can accurately shoot a .380 will have better results defending himself than someone who can not accurately shoot a .357. As others have said, practice is very important. I would also think that a hollow point would help prevent the bullet passing completely through the target and thus waste the extra energy of the .357.

+1 Photoman44

I wouldn't worry about a .357 round over penetrate a wall as long as you have JHP loaded in there.

I keep my 357 loaded with full power 158 gr. 357 JHP.
Because in your own house where you know the lay out, you might just want to send a round through the wall,or maybe even the floor.

38+P does the job for me, I just don't see any other reason to use anything else. That is for 2 legged varmits only.

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May God Bless The USA

I believe this question cannot be accurately answered by anyone on this forum, unless one has actually pulled the trigger on a firearm inside an enclosed structure; without ear protection, in the dark of night, under extreme stress. I'm guessing (like everyone else) a gun you are comfortable shooting accurately, the number of family members in your home, their location and the interior structure/layout makes a difference in your firearm/ammo selection.

I have Federal 158gr. LSWC-HP +Ps in all of my .38s and .357s. It's accurate, and controllable. We don't get a lot of grizzly bears up around Cleveland, so I don't expect to run into anything or anyone in my home that the FBI load won't deal with.

one word: shotgun

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Forum consigliere

Two better words: .223 softpoints

See the Box O' Truth website for wall penetration experiments with handguns, shotguns and rifles. You'll be amazed.

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VIVERE MILITARE EST

I carry an S&W 360 loaded with +P .38, but at home I have my .45 auto loaded with hollow points. I carry the .38 because it is so light I hardly know I have it on. I wish it was a .45, but comfort rules sometimes. At home I feel more comfortable with the .45 near by.
I don't worry too much about what may or may not happen, I use what I feel comfortable with and feel safe with. I am happy with what I own and use and for now cannot think of anything I would change. I can get 5-6 inch groups with that 360 at 40 feet at the range. When I bought that gun I was outraged by the price and now I understand why it is expensive. Accurate and very light. Can't ask for much more.

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Support the 2nd Amendment it is not negotiable!

I mix and match. My nightstand backup is a 357 five-shot. First three rounds are +p 38's, last two are full-house .357's. I fire that same sequence at the range when I'm practicing.

At 5 ft, I doubt if there would be a lot of difference in the end. Of course as cage said a shotgun is more effective, although they are unweildly in close quarters and less handy than a good handgun. Racking a pump has good physicalogical effect and may keep you from haveing to kill the miscrant, not that it is a bad idea.

My home defense guns (I live in a single-family dwelling house in an older part of town where houses are very closely spaced) at present are a 12 gauge shotgun and an FN FiveseveN. Neither are likely to penetrate very many walls of sheetrock.

I have a Model 60 with 125 gr +P loads for in the house.

I personally agree with your line of thinking. The ammo I keep for "at home" use is 125gr JHP .38 Spl +P with low flash powder (Buffalo Bore makes them). On the street/trail... I load my 586 with 125gr JHP .357 rounds but I'm also not worried about my wife having to use it or excessive penetration like you stated.

I have a 10, 64, and 642 that state they are .38's, as well a 60, 627, and 686P which are marked as .357 Magnum. They all sport 158gr LHPSWC +P's for SD/HD. I now live in a brick single level garden home community, so unless I hit a window, my shots should be contained, at least with +P's. I bought the .357 Magnum chambered revolvers due to their style and capacity, not for their higher than .38 Special +P KE capability. I do reload and shoot thousands of .357 Magnum cases - obtained for free - reloaded at +P levels.

Stainz

Re: OP. Your thinking on this matter is very wise and well informed.

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How does one reconcile this with the studies that show that the hollow cavity of a JHP often fills with the wall material and does not expand? Rather, the JHP performs like FMJ.

I agree with your choice of .38 +P for home defense. Over penetration aside, if you fire a .357 Magnum from your hallway it may very well be the last thing you ever hear. The .38 will be bad enough and more than adequate to stop an intruder.

What?

like others have said before shot placement is important if i ever had to use i will make sure no one in the house will be affected.

Groo here
If you can physically shoot 357 mag in a specific gun you may use them.
I have 30some years with a 5 pointed star.
The flash is much overrated [we trained to USE the flash at night
and it will not blind you.
I have capped of 357mags inside [ from a snub no less] and you are not
shocked.
When you are in fight/run mode , you will not hear blast, see flash or feel kick.
You will react as you have trained.
You don,t even need to train with mags as the kick and blast will not effect your shooting , you will shoot as you train.
The faster you drive a HP the faster it will open up and slow down.
So don't think that a 38 will not go through as many walls as a 357.
Train with the gun you hit best with , and trust.
Use a good hp.
Hit in the middle.
Pray you don't ever need to.

Groo here
If you can physically shoot 357 mag in a specific gun you may use them.
I have 30some years with a 5 pointed star.
The flash is much overrated [we trained to USE the flash at night
and it will not blind you.
I have capped of 357mags inside [ from a snub no less] and you are not
shocked.
When you are in fight/run mode , you will not hear blast, see flash or feel kick.
You will react as you have trained.
You don,t even need to train with mags as the kick and blast will not effect your shooting , you will shoot as you train.
The faster you drive a HP the faster it will open up and slow down.
So don't think that a 38 will not go through as many walls as a 357.
Train with the gun you hit best with , and trust.
Use a good hp.
Hit in the middle.
Pray you don't ever need to.

Do you keep hearing protection next to your .357? If shot indoors without it, I would think that it would destroy your eardrums.

Same gun in my house, by my bedside. Same reasons. I didn't even read the rest of the posts because you're right so if there are posts that disagree I'll just get irked so why bother?

***GRJ***

Sounds like you need to pickup a 38 Special kit gun (or beater) like a vintage Smith 67-1.

My house gun is a Glock 22 (.40 S&W, 4") with a laser and flashlight on the tactical rail. It also has night sights that I can actually see. A couple other good options would be my reworked Stoeger Coach Gun in .410 buckshot, which is roughly equivalent to 41 Magnum. I try to keep a hand free for a flashlight. I am not too comfortable firing a revolver with one hand.

I would only use my weapon if someone is trying to kill me. That being the case, I keep full power .357 mags ready to go. Nobody touches my weapon but me. Yah, I might damage my hearing. I won't shoot unless I think I can hit the target but over penetration can always occur. I try to use situational awareness, locked doors, alarm system, escape and evasion. If I really HAVE to use a weapon I want it to be powerful.

Keep it loaded with whatever ammo you can shoot accurately and fast with. Six misses with a 357 magnum are not near as good as one hit with a 38 special. Accurate rapid fire will keep you alive. Pumping shots into the walls will not. I keep my 38 J-frame airweight loaded with 148 grain hollow base target wadcutters...why I can put 3 rounds into a 4 inch circle real fast. I just can't do that with any +P or magnum loads.
Hitting your target is goal number 1.
All that said I do keep a 12 ga. pump shotgun handy for home defense and feel real confident with it in my hands.
Gary

As to the noise of .357 magnum, I can attest that a pair of earbuds protected my hearing when I had a ND in my apartment last year. The gun was loaded with full-power 125 grain SJHP loads, and yet my hearing wasn't distorted in any way. It might have been the shock of the episode, and also the 12 pack of Pabst Blue Riboon I had before hand...

But still, I now don't hesitate to keep full-power magnums in my gun. The weapon has a 6" bbl.

There is nothing "necessarily" wrong with your thinking, but after reading a story of a woman in Georgia who (last year) shot an intruder 5 times with her .38 special, striking him in the face and neck with all 5 rounds...and he was still standing...I would go with .357 rounds.

She was able to bluff him into leaving by saying she would shoot him again if he didn't leave. She KNEW she was empty, but he obviously didn't. The police found him on his knees in her neighbors front lawn, pleading for help.

Yes, the gun stopped the attack, but had he been a more determined (or knowledgeable) attacker she would have been in trouble.

When urban police carried .357's, they often used 125 gr bullets, which have more velocity and shock power, but are less likely to penetrate a soft target. 158 grain bullets are preferred when more penetration is needed, like automobiles, glass and light cover.

If you miss, any bullet will cause unwanted damage or injury. The object is to not miss. In the words of Yoda, "Try not! Do!" In any case, train! Draw, rotate, combine and push. In a crisis you will perform at the level of your training.

To the OP, your thinking is sound. Based on your posted capability with 38+P vs 357 and concerns of other family members shooting the gun, I think 38+P is a good choice for you.

As to penetration & over penetration, most handgun rounds will punch through more walls than you think. This includes 38 Special. The key is to know where family members are and where your safe shooting zones are located.

For those who worry about excessive penetration after hitting the bad guy, your concerns are misplaced. Don't kid yourself with your ability to hit with every shot in a life-or-death situation. The rounds that concern me are the ones that miss and zip downrange at full velocity.

Edmo

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TRUTH: Don't delete my posts!

You have other effective options with larger calibers without the hazards of blinding flash and stunning noise. Being in denial about the reasons not to use a Magnum indoors and in the dark is not necessarily as manly as some might think.

I have fired .223 SP at 3/8 " steel. It passes
through but fragments.
7.62x39 will not even with AP. I suggest using neither in your home unless there is no other option.

I grab my revolver with FBI 38 loads and 12 ga if needed.

If I am about to die, the last thing I will be thinking about is "blinding flash and stunning noise." You should write a Hollywood movie.

Any reason to mix a few 38 in with the 357s at the same time in a 357 revolver. I have a 627-5 which holds 8 rounds. I was thinking if I load a few 38s at first (warning shot or to get my bearings at night), then the 357s can go next if I need more stopping power.

Thoughts???

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Lifetime NRA Member

Yes, I keep electronic ear muffs next to the shot gun, a round in the chamber and use a low recoil load.

My alarm system goes off as soon as a door is opened on the first floor so I will have warning. Also keep the cell phone next to the bed. And I have a revolver there if needed.

Like intheburbs, I have a mix in my HD gun. The first 3 are 38 spl JHP and the next 3 are 158 gr JHP 357 Mag. I don't use the +P because most of my ammo is reloads and I've only seen +P rarely in the stores.

158gr JSHP 357mag for me!