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  #101  
Old 11-02-2010, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joni_Lynn View Post
If you had a high primer then it may have gone off which might have caused this failure. When the round being fired went off the round next to it also went off due to a high primer already being in contact with the frame.

I'm thankful that you're uninjured and here to tell us about it.
Joni, I think you may be a winner.

A high primer, in a cartridge adjacent to the one being fired, slamming into the recoil shield, COULD possibly detonate and being blocked by the frame, the bullet would cause the kaboom.

It does appear that more than one cartridge detonated. Possibly with the high primer detonation, BOTH bullets reached the end of the chambers nearly simultaneously, with neither as a result getting a clear "shot" at the forcing cone, causing a double kaboom.

I'm no expert, just an armchair commando. Take my opinions for what they are worth.....
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  #102  
Old 11-02-2010, 07:33 PM
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I don't think so.

For a high-primer to be detonated by recoil, that would mean recoil has to be occurring. That would mean a bullet is already on its way out the barrel. That cylinder (the one aligned with the barrel) would not have vanished, such as this one did, nor would the brass be destroyed in the fashion it was.
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  #103  
Old 11-02-2010, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmhoium View Post
... I had shot 30-40rds and on the 6th shot of my cylinder I felt a jerk downward and felt something whistle past my head...
Nope, not a high primer...
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  #104  
Old 11-04-2010, 02:57 AM
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I had another conversation with my friend the ballistics engineer. Most interesting...

He looked at the photos of this destroyed 625 and explained that the topstrap of a revolver, being much stronger than the cylinder, would be the last thing to fail as the gun comes apart over a few microseconds, which explains why the chambers blew out.

He also told me that over his career he has been aware of hundreds of instances where a firearm of some sort came apart; he has read many of the reports associated with these accidents; and he has personally investigated a number of them. Without commenting on this specific case, due to the lack of data, he pointed out that he is aware of only one instance where a gun failed due to a mechanical or metallurgical problem; in every other case there was some human error that caused the failure.

Food for thought for all of us...
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  #105  
Old 11-08-2010, 10:13 PM
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Glad you are ok. Any chance the round before the accident might have been a squib load and the bullet lodged in the throat? That could have caused a chamber rupture and since you found a bullet at your feet ?????? I don't know, just like everyone else, I can only guess
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  #106  
Old 11-09-2010, 06:59 PM
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After reading all of the posts I think one of three things happened:

A too light powder charge - the OP said that he could not seat a bullet with a double charge. A round with too light a charge can detonate. Many reloading manuals mention this phenomenon. I could easily see this happening if a piece of material (like from the seal under the cap of the powder bottle) or an insect got into the powder hopper, charge bar or powder funnel in the powder die. Also if the cases are cycled in the reloader too vigorously between the charging station and the seating station powder can be tossed from the case leading to a low charge weight.

A bullet wasn't crimped properly and recoil set it back in the case being fired increasing the case pressure beyond safe levels.

Some cleaning media was stuck in the case before loading it. The media caused over pressure in the case.

If the round did in fact detonate it would explain the adjacent rounds going off too.
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  #107  
Old 11-11-2010, 12:31 AM
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As unlikely as it seems, you just cannot rule out the possibility of an overcharge.

In my personal experience, using a RCBS Rockchucker, one at a time, slow and careful as I can be, checking powder levels in the loading block before seating the bullet, I have had a squib load.

Fortunately, I realized it, and it did not destroy my revolver.

I must have loaded 500 rounds that day, and several months later, out of the 10 boxes I loaded, one was a squib. That makes all the other rounds from that batch suspect.

It was embarassing, to say the least. And humbling. I carry a copper rod in my range bag so I was able to knock the bullet back out of the bore, no harm done except to my pride and self confidence.
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  #108  
Old 11-11-2010, 08:34 PM
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Your kidding or have me mistaken for another guy. Lets be specific here. I'm a mod on gun sites also. And I see nothing in my statement that deserved this.

This was meant as a private message to the mods and has nothing to do with the statements above. I just can't delete it. I was banned for the only other statement I made on this thread for being argumentative.

jmusic

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  #109  
Old 11-11-2010, 10:25 PM
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Years ago I blew up a model 25. It looked exactly like this 625. I was using light plinking loads, made one at a time on a single stage press.

We attributed it to the detonation theory, possibly having used too light of a charge. (I forget what powder i was using, but when trying to "double charge" a cartridge, it was impossible to seat the bullet).

However, it is my understanding is that no one has ever been able to intentinally replicate the "detonation" theory with a handgun cartridge.
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  #110  
Old 11-11-2010, 11:04 PM
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I recall back in the '70s or '80s reading about detonation problems associated with using reduced loads of H4831 or IMR4831. But I don't remember anything along those lines regarding handgun powders.
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  #111  
Old 11-11-2010, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RGPM1A View Post

A bullet wasn't crimped properly and recoil set it back in the case being fired increasing the case pressure beyond safe levels.
Recoil tends to pull the bullets out of the case, not set them back.
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  #112  
Old 11-12-2010, 12:14 AM
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The Dillon 550 has manual indexing. Is it possible you double cranked the handle, which double-charged the one case?
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  #113  
Old 11-12-2010, 04:23 AM
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A double charge is always the most likely possibility in these scenarios.

Double bullets being loaded is another, but is pretty impossible in a 45 ACP. There was an article in Handloader a couple of years ago about two 45 Colt SAAs blowing up during the same range session due to double bullets being loaded when using a Dillon 550.

How about an obstruction inside the case? If you had a piece of 22LR brass in the case, or other obstruction like tumbling media, which may move aside enough to allow depriming, it may have the same effect as an excessive charge by reducing the case volume. I have run into that on occasion. It can be difficult to see. I doubt a larger case could be the culprit because it would interfere with depriming.
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  #114  
Old 11-12-2010, 10:54 AM
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Lets say the cause is a way overcharged cartridge.

What is it when 3 chambers of the revolver are exposed and the top strap of the revolver dissapears.................What causes the damage to the empty brass cases adjacent to the expolding fired round?
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  #115  
Old 11-12-2010, 11:08 AM
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My guess would be that the force from the exploding cartridge ruptures the adjacent cylinders as well as the top of its cylinder and the top strap. The cylinder walls all have equal thickness except for the bottom. Shrapnel or gas from the ruptured cylinder could easily destroy the brass of the adjacent rounds, either igniting the powder with the flashover or just dispersing it and dropping the bullet out with little force.
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  #116  
Old 11-12-2010, 01:05 PM
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There seems to be a lot of conjecture on what caused this problem. In all likelihood to me it sure apperars to have been a double charge but, I wasn't there.

Progressive presses are fine for perhaps most but for me, I'm sticking with my old RCBS Jr. Slow but sure and to date(knock on wood) I've never experienced a double charge, double bullet or squib load.
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  #117  
Old 07-31-2011, 08:54 PM
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i know it's an old thread.....did the OP here back from Smith?.....think of buyin' one...
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  #118  
Old 07-31-2011, 09:36 PM
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Groo here
We are having way to many of these K-booms...
I keep going back to a to light charge that gives you a hangfire
and when the bullet sticks in the forcing cone , the base is in the
chamber causing a plug when the powder at last lights limiting the
pressure to the cylinder.
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  #119  
Old 07-31-2011, 09:40 PM
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I haven't read the full thread but IMO this was caused by a double or even triple charge and nothing else. It take a considerable ammount of energy to blow one of these revolvers in half and even the most careful people can make a mistake when distracted. In addition the 45ACP is normally a low pressure caliber so even firing into a squib with a standard charge won't generate this level of energy. Somewhere on You Tube there is a video of an attempt to blos up a 686 with a squibbed barrel and firing a fully charged 357 Magnum into a barrel packet with 6 squibs still didn't manage to blow the gun up, all it did was shoot 3 of the squibs out of the barrel and jam the cylinder solid. Yeah, the barrel was hosed and the frame likely bent but the gun didn't blow up.

Bottomline, if you can actually find a 625JM you really don't have to worry about it blowing up unless you get a bad load.
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  #120  
Old 07-31-2011, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
if you can actually find a 625JM you really don't have to worry about it blowing up unless you get a bad load.
i found one LINB and i have wanted one for a while know.....this is the only one on the net that has went BOOOOMM!!
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  #121  
Old 07-31-2011, 10:55 PM
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I should have left an update here after I found out - guess I let it slip.

Smith told me that they would gladly replace my 625 for $750... In all honesty, it was likely a user error so they had no responsibility to replace it, so it made sense. I will tell you that it was like pulling teeth to get them to send mine back; they really wanted me to buy a new one.

Currently my 3/4's of a 625JM hangs above my reloading bench as a constant safety reminder. It's worth more to me that way then to toss it.

ghitch, when I did shoot it, I really enjoyed it. Shoots great. Although when I eventually replace it's spot in my safe its going to be a 25-2 more than likely. I've had more exposure to older P&R Smiths since and I tend to prefer them - that's just me. I wouldn't let my bad experience shy you away from buying one - you will love it.

-M
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  #122  
Old 07-31-2011, 11:40 PM
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Like everyone else, I'm glad you were OK. Guns are very replacable. This is the first time I came across this thread and I was shocked at the photos.

Accidents can always happen, but it reafirms (sp) my opinion on reloading...I won't do it. I prefer to shoot less (because of the greater expense), and have it all be factory, than to shoot more with reloads. I simply don't trust myself with some things and reloading is one of them.
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  #123  
Old 08-01-2011, 12:35 AM
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I'm glad you came out of this with all of you intact. TACC1
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  #124  
Old 08-01-2011, 01:11 AM
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One of the things that has always amazed me is how few people have actually been hurt serously when a modern firarm blows up. Fact is that statistically we are pretty safe even when we do make a mistake and cook up a massive load.

As for reloading and it's risks, again you have to consider the statistics. The OP has probably reloaded many many thousands of rounds before making this one single mistake, so I won't fault him for that one error and I suspect it won't ever happen again for him. Personally, I'm not yet reloading but will someday. When I do take that step I plan on making it a 100% distraction free exercise, no phones turned on and a 100% do not disturb rule in effect.
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  #125  
Old 08-01-2011, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmhoium View Post
I should have left an update here after I found out - guess I let it slip.

Smith told me that they would gladly replace my 625 for $750... In all honesty, it was likely a user error so they had no responsibility to replace it, so it made sense. I will tell you that it was like pulling teeth to get them to send mine back; they really wanted me to buy a new one.

Currently my 3/4's of a 625JM hangs above my reloading bench as a constant safety reminder. It's worth more to me that way then to toss it.

ghitch, when I did shoot it, I really enjoyed it. Shoots great. Although when I eventually replace it's spot in my safe its going to be a 25-2 more than likely. I've had more exposure to older P&R Smiths since and I tend to prefer them - that's just me. I wouldn't let my bad experience shy you away from buying one - you will love it.

-M
ok M thanks for gettin' back on this.....i'll go ahead and get it to go with my 25-2 and 22-4...

sure glad you weren't hurt....
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  #126  
Old 08-01-2011, 10:34 AM
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I too have not had time to read all 11 pages, but my experience with the Dillon RL550B is that you likely did have a double charge. Most of the time, 1 case with no powder (squib) is telltale that the next round out of the press was a double charge; however, this is not always the case. If the loader hangs up, usually with a primer tray hanging up about half way back, it sometimes happens that the case gets a partial charge. If you follow through after clearing the primer tray with a 2nd stroke, you can get a double or close to it. For this reason, if the loader hangs up, I remove the 1st and 2nd station cases, check the 3rd station case and finish the 4th station case. I then fix the problem and go from there.

It is also possible to double seat bullets, at least in the 38 Special and 357 Magnum. It happens when the seating die gets full of grease and a bullet hangs up. Telltale is an empty case at the 4th station. The stuck bullet will drive the bullet you just inserted all the way to the bottom of the case, compressed load- KABOOM!

Most of my problems with the RL550B have to do with the primer seating system. Primers get stuck on top of the slider tray and near the press ram. A lot of attention has to be paid to the primer feed adjustment screw.

A digital scale is a worthy investment. To date, I have found 100% of my squibs and doubles- and I have weighed and pulled many bullets in the process.

Don't ever discount the ability of a RL550B to double or squib. This is the reason I advocate turret presses for beginners.
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Old 08-01-2011, 12:27 PM
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Man, I'd be ready to sell that Dillon and get a single-stage press after that. It's probably better that you were using a revolver and not a 1911 when that happened, since it looks like the top strap and cylinder failed and were thrown up and away. You wouldn't have been so lucky with a slide, magazine, and grips between the kaboom and your hand.
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  #128  
Old 08-01-2011, 12:29 PM
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I'm so glad you were not injured, Mmhoium. I agree with Surveyor47 and the double charge theorists. It is very easy to throw a double charge with a progressive, and the leverage is so good you might never feel it when seating the bullet.

I loaded for over 40 years with a single stage Pacific press, completely wearing it out. I went directly to a Dillon RL550B, and the shock of so many things happening on each stroke was so great I felt like a rank amateur.

Then I got too comfortable with it, loading umpteen boxes of 9mm and .45 ACP per hour. That's when clearing fired primer residue buildup from the primer feed slide causes glitches, interrupting your rythm. It usually requires moving the manual advance backward one space. Then, if you forget to advance it again, you are set up for a double charge, if the case/powder combination permits it without overflowing.

On one occasion, I had a bad feeling, not sure whether I might have done that. It was with 9mm, a low charge of Bullseye, and bullets seated far out to feed in a Luger. I decided to err on the part of caution and pulled about 30 loaded rounds. Sure enough, one had a heavily compressed double charge. I guess I saved a nice S/42 Luger.

I recently bought a very nice, new, heavily built Lee single stage press. I use it for almost everything, except when loading large quantities of .45 ACP for a Thompson. Then I load cautiously, carefully, with no distractions, and with great respect for the process. I know that, despite having reloaded for 51 years, I can make a dangerous mistake. And a progressive press, any one of them, dramatically increases the possibility. The Dillon is a wonderful thing, but I strongly urge new reloaders not to start with one, or at least to have a nice and inexpensive single stage press to learn on, and for small quantity reloading.

The odds are about 99.9% that the blow-up in this thread was a result of an overcharge and high pressure, and any one of us could do it. It is not necessarily a matter of careless or any user fault, other than being human. Remember the bumper sticker, "**** happens". (Ever see that one, with the asterisks?)

If you read the NTSB aircraft accident reports, many of them detail how highly experienced, high time airline pilots with military backgrounds are briefly distracted or overlook some minor factor, and the result is many deaths.

So don't throw away your single stage presses. It's reassuring to charge cases one-at-a-time with an old Lyman powder measure, have them in a loading block under good light, and look for overcharges or undercharges. I never missed one for over 40 years, until that time I almost did so with the Dillon.
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  #129  
Old 08-01-2011, 12:48 PM
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Although I haven't read all of the thread, I did read the first several pages, and am glad the OP gave us an update.

I Kaboomed a Glock 21 about 10 years ago.....wrecked the barrel and blew the mag out of the bottom of the gun. It was a night firing exercise, so it was pretty spectacular My right hand was banged up a bit, but otherwise I was able to walk away.

I was loading with a Dillon Square Deal and no doubt had a double charge. Like the 550, it's not auto-indexing.

Since then I've used single stage presses, until I recently bought a Hornady LNL progressive. Not only is it auto indexing, as a case with powder comes to the bullet loading station, I'm able to look into the case and see the powder.

Still, once you've kaboomed a gun, the memory never goes away, and I'm thankful the OP is safe and sound.
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Old 08-01-2011, 10:30 PM
Dave T Dave T is offline
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Originally Posted by Vartarg View Post
I was loading with a Dillon Square Deal and no doubt had a double charge. Like the 550, it's not auto-indexing.
On the contrary, both of the Square Deal presses I've owned are auto-indexing. For that reason I advise anyone asking for a recommendation to go with the SDB or the 650. I'm not sure how someone would go about double charging a case in a SDB?

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  #131  
Old 08-02-2011, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by 617X10 View Post
Man, I'd be ready to sell that Dillon and get a single-stage press after that. It's probably better that you were using a revolver and not a 1911 when that happened, since it looks like the top strap and cylinder failed and were thrown up and away. You wouldn't have been so lucky with a slide, magazine, and grips between the kaboom and your hand.
You know that it is entirely possible to use an RL550B in the same manner as a turret press. I do that a lot with the 45-70. Just load 1 cartridge at a time. That also give you time to figure out what is wrong and adjust the press.
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  #132  
Old 08-03-2011, 08:47 PM
PREMOD70 PREMOD70 is offline
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The dent on the bullet lying on the ground tells me that the bullet was seated all the way down against the powder by a die or other device while loading the round or by rough handling of the loaded round. The powder detonated blowing the cylinder while the bullet(the obstruction) literally fell from the cylinder unharmed. The key is detonation, not a high pressure burn,JMHO.
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  #133  
Old 08-03-2011, 11:46 PM
PhilOhio PhilOhio is offline
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Originally Posted by PREMOD70 View Post
The dent on the bullet lying on the ground tells me that the bullet was seated all the way down against the powder by a die or other device while loading the round or by rough handling of the loaded round. The powder detonated blowing the cylinder while the bullet(the obstruction) literally fell from the cylinder unharmed. The key is detonation, not a high pressure burn,JMHO.
Premod70, that's a very interesting theory. Care to elaborate? Seems to me it would be next to impossible to accidentally seat a bullet that way, unknowingly, and to leave such a mark. But if this would account for such an accident, wouldn't it be obvious to the shooter that he was loading a really bad round, just from its appearance?

And yes, I know guys who would shoot it anyway, thinking that is the easy and harmless way to get rid of it. But I have to doubt that was the case here.
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  #134  
Old 08-04-2011, 04:10 AM
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williamlayton williamlayton is offline
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At this point in the conversation it is what it is and how and why are armchair conversation.
The satisfaction of knowing that the shooter is unscathed is ample enough satisfaction.
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  #135  
Old 08-04-2011, 08:37 AM
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With a little steel wool, a lot of those scratches will rub out.
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  #136  
Old 08-04-2011, 11:09 AM
redbos redbos is offline
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I saw that happen once, it scared the **** out of me. We just kind of all looked at each other, and we where all right, but a little scared for a moment.

Glad you are unharmed...
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  #137  
Old 08-04-2011, 11:23 AM
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M3Stuart M3Stuart is offline
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Glad you are ok!
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  #138  
Old 08-04-2011, 07:42 PM
PREMOD70 PREMOD70 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilOhio View Post
Premod70, that's a very interesting theory. Care to elaborate? Seems to me it would be next to impossible to accidentally seat a bullet that way, unknowingly, and to leave such a mark. But if this would account for such an accident, wouldn't it be obvious to the shooter that he was loading a really bad round, just from its appearance?

And yes, I know guys who would shoot it anyway, thinking that is the easy and harmless way to get rid of it. But I have to doubt that was the case here.
I don't know this guy that had the incident but I do know myself enough to think anything is possible when it comes to reloading cartridges on a progressive reloader. I don't mean to bash progressives but I tried one for several years and through that time I produced several deep seated rounds and one of the problems that I had was misplacing the errant round after I found it. I would continue to reload and for some reason that errant round would find itself back in my good to go bucket. Stuff happens and from my point of view it happens in bunches with the progressive loader, there too many things happening at one time for a pea brain such as myself to keep from making mistakes. I would like to see a picture of the bullet from different angles just to see if I may be on the right track but either way the OP is safe and well.
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  #139  
Old 08-04-2011, 07:45 PM
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Maximumbob54 Maximumbob54 is offline
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So is it fixed yet?
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  #140  
Old 08-04-2011, 08:45 PM
amazingflapjack amazingflapjack is offline
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I like the previous posters prospective. I remember a similar incident a year or so ago, and it was the same kind of loading set up. The bottom line for me is that, if something like this did happen, I would not want any lingering doubt about what happened, or the least possible. That's why I load them one at a time. And although I don't always do it, I will sometimes weigh a propperly loaded bullet, and then quickly run a hundred or so at a time accross a digital scale to pick up any thing other than small varyations in weight from one to another. go safely. Flapjack.
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  #141  
Old 08-05-2011, 08:54 AM
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As with the other posters, I'm glad you're A OK.

I reload myself and while I'm envious of the speeds an automated set-up can bring, I'm also a big fan of the checks and double checks I can do with my set-up.

Additionally, I've "lucked" out with my current calibers and loadings. A double charge of powders in many of my reloads would result in case over flow. A nice "idiot" proof back-up for me

Last edited by pageophile; 08-05-2011 at 08:59 AM.
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  #142  
Old 08-05-2011, 10:14 PM
Practical Practical is offline
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Originally Posted by mag318 View Post
WOW! We're just glad you weren't injured. It will be interesting to see what S&W has to say and I'll bet they'll want to look at your revolver. The vast majority of kabooms like this are caused by overpressure loads. A friend of mine did the same thing to a beautiful Colt Python. He sent it back to Colt and they concluded that the powder charge in his reload detonated instead of burned, and ofcourse since he was shooting reloads it voided any warranty. Let us know how things turn out.
I don't see how powder can detonate.

It burns. Some burn faster some slower and all produce gas.

Overpressure is the cause here.

I still most likely think a double charge. I have seen it happen on Dillon presses due to operator error.

OR could something have been stuck in the shell to reduce case volume?
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  #143  
Old 08-06-2011, 01:46 PM
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Yikes! That could have been ugly. Glad you're okay.
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  #144  
Old 08-07-2011, 12:31 AM
ExMachina1 ExMachina1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Practical View Post
I don't see how powder can detonate.
this is one of those old wives tales that makes it around every once and a while, but that never comes with any scientific evidence.

fact is no reloading manual that i have ever seen (or heard of) makes mention of it (and if anybody had a strong interest in describing this phenomina, it would be a corporation putting their name on a reloading manual!) rather, the stories that get filtered down are all about how it could never have been a double charge, so it must have been a "detonation" (not the the OP is claiming this here).

can powder detonate?--i don't know. but i will say that if it could detonate, i would expect it to be doing so waaaaay more often than it is "reported" to.
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  #145  
Old 08-07-2011, 12:58 AM
SW357Addict SW357Addict is offline
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When powder in a cartridge burns it is a detonation of explosive and when the primer goes off the powder (an explosive) detonates. Either way you want to say it, the powder converts to gas, heat, and pressure in a matter of milliseconds.

Obviously, there was too much pressure. Excluding remote possibilities, it is an overcharge of powder. Every blown up revolver I have ever seen looks the same and in every case it is a powder over charge. Even though the reloader swears that it is not. Accept the fact that too much powder was in the case. It may not be a double charge but it was enough to rip this gun apart. This is one of the reasons I always weigh each and every reloaded round to verify the weighs are all within a few grains of each other.
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  #146  
Old 08-08-2011, 12:05 AM
number0009 number0009 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SW357Addict View Post
Obviously, there was too much pressure. Excluding remote possibilities, it is an overcharge of powder. Every blown up revolver I have ever seen looks the same and in every case it is a powder over charge. Even though the reloader swears that it is not. Accept the fact that too much powder was in the case. It may not be a double charge but it was enough to rip this gun apart. This is one of the reasons I always weigh each and every reloaded round to verify the weighs are all within a few grains of each other.
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He also told me that over his career he has been aware of hundreds of instances where a firearm of some sort came apart; he has read many of the reports associated with these accidents; and he has personally investigated a number of them. Without commenting on this specific case, due to the lack of data, he pointed out that he is aware of only one instance where a gun failed due to a mechanical or metallurgical problem; in every other case there was some human error that caused the failure.
Never a firearm metallurgical problem yet they occur in jet turbine engines costing several million dollars a copy?
Not saying so in this instance but to just pretend it doesn't happen is rather naive.

....
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  #147  
Old 08-08-2011, 11:06 AM
ExMachina1 ExMachina1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SW357Addict View Post
When powder in a cartridge burns it is a detonation of explosive...Either way you want to say it, the powder converts to gas, heat, and pressure in a matter of milliseconds.
there's a difference between "detonation" and "burning". burning is a controlled chemical reaction and is why we try to match the burn rate of a powder to a particular cartridge. powder burn rate increases with confinement and pressure, but it always burns.

a detonation happens nearly instantaneously (think of TNT) and is a chain reaction that, once it begins, is not a controlled process. detonations require no confinement in which to occur.

people have speculated that low powder volumes can cause the powder to somehow not burn but to detonate, essentially releasing all of the powder's energy in one large event. problem is that it's not a process that has ever been officially confirmed by any ammunition loading establishment.
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  #148  
Old 08-08-2011, 11:56 AM
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Not pointing any fingers - I am a big Smith fan, own several including a JM - this is the second almost identical failure I've seen in the last couple of years; the other was a 44 mag with popgun reloads. The owner is one of the really particular people and I felt an overcharge was not the issue. The pictures were almost identical. Both were late model guns, both stainless. Hmmmmm..........
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  #149  
Old 08-08-2011, 02:02 PM
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Certain double-based powders can be made to detonate with a blasting cap. Bullseye, for example, contains about 13% nitroglycerine. It is unlikely that a pistol primer has enough energy to cause detonation, but can't be ruled out. The nitrocellulose component is nitrated to a lesser degree than guncotton.

Ordinarily, smokeless powder burns from the outside in, at a speed dependent on pressure, rather slowly unless the powder is confined. Detonation progresses through the solid body at an extremely high speed (> 3000 fps), whether it is confined or not.

If detonation occured, you would probably find brass particles embedded in the steel cylinder. More likely, overpressure or a defect in the cylinder was at fault.
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  #150  
Old 08-08-2011, 07:42 PM
scooter123 scooter123 is offline
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Anything that burns can be made to detonate if the conditions are correct. All it takes is the proper heat and pressure. Fortunately, it's pretty difficult to cause detonation with modern powders for firearms, however do something foolish and it can happen.

BTW, the key difference between low explosives such as gun powder and high explosives such as nitroglycerin is that the speed of the pressure wave with a high explosive is fast enough that it will cause detonation in an unrestrained environment. Basically the pressure wave moves so rapidly that it compresses the air to a pressure high enough to trigger detonation.

Gun powders burn too slowly to create a pressure wave that can trigger detonation in open air, however fill the barrel of a black powder rifle completely, pack the powder in firmly, and then set it off and the mass of the unburnt powder in the barrel will create enough pressure to cause some of that black powder to detonate and result in an impressivly exploded gun with lethal results to whoever was foolish enough to pull the trigger. BTW, read about that back in the 70's when some idiot tried to turn a black powder gun into a Roman Candle, however Roman Candles burn from the top down, not the bottom up.
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