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  #51  
Old 02-25-2011, 11:14 PM
billdeserthills billdeserthills is offline
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Originally Posted by Josh M. View Post
I bet they sell plenty of J frames at their current pricing - esp the no-lock models.
Sure, last year when the first 642 no locks appearred I sold 10 in a month
now forget it, people want Ruger LCR. Even the S&W Bodyguard 38 Sp. gets few to no looks, the .380's will go once in awhile
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  #52  
Old 02-25-2011, 11:16 PM
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Most weapons will outlast us and we will leave them behind for someone else to enjoy. Last year I found two model 19-3's one 6 inch and one 2 1/2 inch.This week I just found a 3 inch RB 547. Most unusual gun and a shooter as well. They only made them a short time so there are no "new" ones. Well made revolvers will always have a market.
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  #53  
Old 02-25-2011, 11:50 PM
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I'm a semi-newbie. I had a couple of Ruger Security Six models many years ago. Last month, I bought an S&W 442 no lock from Bud's for $361. I'm extremely happy with the trigger, etc. I'm contemplating a 642 purchase as well to carry both. As an aside, I have a good friend who told his 18 year old son that he would not allow him in the house if he bought a Smith because of the Clinton agreement.
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  #54  
Old 02-25-2011, 11:59 PM
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I'm a complete newb when it comes to revolvers to be honest i never thought that i would WANT to own one but with smith and wesson coming out with the governor it' s one i plan on buying and who know's i may find myself digging around for some of the older stuff!
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  #55  
Old 02-26-2011, 12:17 AM
weyerbacher weyerbacher is offline
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I like the feel of the recent 686 without the full underlug barrel. If they make it w/o the lock, I'll buy one. The last new S&W I bought was one of the 642 no-locks a few years back.
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  #56  
Old 02-26-2011, 11:31 AM
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I have purchased two new S&W revolvers in the past three years. A nickel Model 36 and a Model 64. Both have the IL and MIM parts but they're definitely old school hand guns.
My wife bought a new automatic (M&P 9C) last year.

I wonder how many people outside of this forum of hard-core collectors have even heard of "IL and "MIM"? Not too many, I'll bet. The general populace certainly doesn't and I'll further wager that whether the new models have or don't have these particular features amounts to "a mote in God's eye" in overall sales.

Come Sancho, time to saddle up Rocinante ...

Last edited by blujax01; 02-26-2011 at 11:53 AM. Reason: Added paragraph
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  #57  
Old 02-26-2011, 12:01 PM
Geronimo Jim Geronimo Jim is offline
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Put me down on the no IL and no mim parts. Anything I want in a revolver, I can find without those two items. Also, I just got a thing about useless **** in a product like the IL. It is just a matter of principle with me not to buy them. Only been collecting Smith's for 40 years so what do I know? Oh........there are hundreds of documented failures of the lock.
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  #58  
Old 02-26-2011, 12:45 PM
clayflingythingy clayflingythingy is offline
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http://www.atf.gov/statistics/downlo...ort-report.pdf
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  #59  
Old 02-26-2011, 02:22 PM
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I bought one late last year, only because they came out with the no IL M&P 340. Its the only new S&W revolver I've bought in probably 5+ years. The last one prior to that was a no IL 340SC. I MAY buy one of the new 3" 63 .22LR's, just because it would be strictly a training/plinking gun and never carried for self defense so the IL is a non issue ('specially cause I don't think .22 recoil is going to affect it).
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  #60  
Old 02-26-2011, 03:43 PM
Brian41 Brian41 is offline
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In recent years I've bought 3 new S&Ws and many more older ones. One was a no lock model 37 and the others a 325PD and 357PD as they were both discounted in price after being in the case too long.
I'm not faulting the new guns and hope they sell lots but olde P&R revolvers are mainly what I'm interested in and buy.
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  #61  
Old 02-26-2011, 04:34 PM
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Well i own two S&W's with the loc and i hope to purchase more new ones. I just lubed them with moly and there ready to play with. I better make sure the loc area on the side of the side of the trigger is lubed too. Bill
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  #62  
Old 02-26-2011, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by BigBill View Post
Well i own two S&W's with the loc and i hope to purchase more new ones. Bill
Ditto.

The used ones are commanding way, way too much money for them. I'd rather pay a few bucks more and get new.

The only thing the used guns provide that I value is they cost less, but not enough less to justify no lifetime warranty and more use.
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  #63  
Old 02-26-2011, 07:46 PM
RetLawman590 RetLawman590 is offline
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Originally Posted by gr7070 View Post
Ditto.

The used ones are commanding way, way too much money for them. I'd rather pay a few bucks more and get new.

The only thing the used guns provide that I value is they cost less, but not enough less to justify no lifetime warranty and more use.
I believe any S&W manufactured after 1989 will be covered by the lifetime warranty no matter who owns it. Prior to that, you are on your own.
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  #64  
Old 02-26-2011, 08:48 PM
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With so many quality S&W's out there for relatively modest prices, does S&W sell many new revolvers?

For example, if you can get a nice 27-2 for between $550 and $650, who needs a new N-Frame?
This reasoning sounds backwards. Why would you pay $550-$650 for something used when you can have a brand new one, fresh in the box for $699?

If I am going to settle for something used, that has no warranty, I would want to save at least 25% on the price.
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  #65  
Old 02-26-2011, 11:24 PM
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This reasoning sounds backwards. Why would you pay $550-$650 for something used when you can have a brand new one, fresh in the box for $699?

If I am going to settle for something used, that has no warranty, I would want to save at least 25% on the price.
Couldn't agree more.
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  #66  
Old 02-26-2011, 11:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colt_saa View Post
This reasoning sounds backwards. Why would you pay $550-$650 for something used when you can have a brand new one, fresh in the box for $699?

If I am going to settle for something used, that has no warranty, I would want to save at least 25% on the price.
But when you are set on a used gun ( with no lock or MIM) then you have to charge new gun prices. More dealers every day are starting to put the new gun price on guns that are 97% or +, and knocking off 10 to 15% for a 93% + gun. Some ask for it and they also pay for it .
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  #67  
Old 02-26-2011, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by colt_saa View Post
This reasoning sounds backwards. Why would you pay $550-$650 for something used when you can have a brand new one, fresh in the box for $699?

If I am going to settle for something used, that has no warranty, I would want to save at least 25% on the price.
I couldn't agree less. As far as I can tell (other than the no-lock models) SAW doesn't make a single revolver that I would buy today. So when you ask why would somebody buy a used revolver for 5-20% less than a new one costs. It's because some of us look at it as a BETTER revolver that costs 5-20% less. Who wouldn't want a BETTER gun that costs LESS?

If Smith hadn't screwed up all their guns 10 years ago (IMHO) the used ones wouldn't have anywhere near the resale value that they have today, and then we'd be looking at used guns that cost 20-50% less than new ones.

BTW - all recent models have the lifetime warranty, for the first owner, or the tenth. If you but something pre-lifetime warranty - Smiths repair price rates are VERY reasonable. - JM.
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  #68  
Old 02-26-2011, 11:48 PM
rslscobra rslscobra is offline
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I believe they do!

I just purchased a S&W 642 "Talo" Edition for a excellent price. Out the door new under $500
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  #69  
Old 02-27-2011, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Josh M. View Post
If Smith hadn't screwed up all their guns 10 years ago (IMHO) the used ones wouldn't have anywhere near the resale value that they have today, and then we'd be looking at used guns that cost 20-50% less than new ones. - JM.
I'm not so sure about that. So many, many used guns regardless of lock and regardless of current lock or no lock productions are sold for very high price percentages of new guns. People are just willing to pay a lot for high quality used guns regardless of lock.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh M. View Post
BTW - all recent models have the lifetime warranty, for the first owner, or the tenth. If you but something pre-lifetime warranty - Smiths repair price rates are VERY reasonable. - JM.
Wrong. You obviously haven't read the warranty or the lifetime service policy. They are clearly stated to apply to the original owner. While S&W chooses to honor these for subsequent owners they do not have to. RTM.
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  #70  
Old 02-27-2011, 12:11 AM
Josh M. Josh M. is offline
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My bad, in practice it seems to apply to one and all, but apparently, all rights are reserved to the original purchase in theory. And you are correct, I've never read it, but I have used it.
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  #71  
Old 02-27-2011, 12:15 AM
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I haven't used it yet, but they did send me a new part the other day that *I* screwed up. They did so free of charge. Gotta like that, lock or no.
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  #72  
Old 02-27-2011, 12:32 AM
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There's no question that Smith has made some beautiful guns over the years that still hold up today as the standard in gun manufacturing. But just look at how far they've come with today's guns. Do you think that Elmer Keith could have ever imagined a revolver like the 500 X frame in his era? Think back 30 years or so. What do you think your gun buddies would have said if you showed up at the range with a 357 magnum J frame that only weighed 10 oz. built from scandium and titanium? Lots of people turn their nose up at MIM parts but I don't think they realize what a huge advancement in gun making the use of this technology is. The lock is what it is, a solution to a non existent problem but for those who are obsessing about it, I think it's time to get over it. Even with the lock, the modern revolver is as reliable today as it ever was (Except in the mind of some pundit gun writers and their minions.). The bottom line is that Smith is turning out some of the best revolvers that they ever have, now.
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  #73  
Old 02-27-2011, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by cmj8591 View Post
There's no question that Smith has made some beautiful guns over the years that still hold up today as the standard in gun manufacturing. But just look at how far they've come with today's guns. Do you think that Elmer Keith could have ever imagined a revolver like the 500 X frame in his era? Think back 30 years or so. What do you think your gun buddies would have said if you showed up at the range with a 357 magnum J frame that only weighed 10 oz. built from scandium and titanium? Lots of people turn their nose up at MIM parts but I don't think they realize what a huge advancement in gun making the use of this technology is. The lock is what it is, a solution to a non existent problem but for those who are obsessing about it, I think it's time to get over it. Even with the lock, the modern revolver is as reliable today as it ever was (Except in the mind of some pundit gun writers and their minions.). The bottom line is that Smith is turning out some of the best revolvers that they ever have, now.
Plus 1,2,3,4,..... my feeling exactly, I just didn't think I could say it nicely. It's just a shame to see a poster pass on false info like it's a fact... The newbie gets a false impression and he inturn passes it along like it is fact..
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  #74  
Old 02-27-2011, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by bushmaster1313 View Post
...does S&W sell many new revolvers?
Is there a website showing S&W and other manufacturers' sales by model?
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  #75  
Old 02-27-2011, 01:05 PM
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This past year I have purchased a few new model S&Ws. New in box 25 Classic, .45 colt, 6" Nickel finish and 617 4" .22. I also purchased used, lnib a 24-13 4" .45 Colt and a 620, 4" .357. All work well. Very accurate and seem to be reliable. No lock issues.

I also have a few from the '70s and 80's.
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  #76  
Old 02-27-2011, 01:50 PM
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Like many here, I have no issues purchasing a new S&W with the lock. I also own a few pre lock revolvers.

When at the range I really don't notice any differences between the two.

Also remember, no new sales, no S&W in the future.
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  #77  
Old 02-27-2011, 01:55 PM
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I tried to purchase a new .22 caliber M617, but the cost was too high for me. I couldn't do it for $700.00, not for a .22 handgun.
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  #78  
Old 02-27-2011, 06:31 PM
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Robctwo, check pages 5, 6 or 7 the ATF data for 2009 is listed.
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  #79  
Old 02-27-2011, 07:25 PM
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About 1 year ago I purchased a new 642 no lock and in fact I think it is a great little carry gun. However since then I also bought 2 used S&W revolvers that I had always longed for but only recently could afford. I still look at the new models and am attracted to several but there are still a number of the old ones I covet. It could be a disease!
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  #80  
Old 02-27-2011, 11:16 PM
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I like S&W Wheelguns. Purchased three new over the past 14 months. A Model 686, 7 shot, 6" barrel .357; a Model 351 PD, .22 mag; and a Model 63, 8 shot, .22 LR, j-frame with a 5" barrel. The latter two are my wife's. All see frequent use at the range. Never had any problems. The 686 is very accurate and minimum recoil with .38 rounds. My wife picked up rosewood grips for her Model 63. A very pretty gun (which she likes), she can also shoot pretty good groups with it.
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  #81  
Old 02-28-2011, 12:31 AM
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Who is buying revolvers these days? Certainly not PDs or SOs, and they were the bread and butter for both S&W and Colt in times past. With record CCWs and concerns about public safety I;d think those would exemplify many buyers of both revolvers and semi autos, and collectors (you guys with a dozen J-frames in the safe crack me up---but in a good way!) I'm not sure how many revolvers competitve shooters or hunters buy---certainly the big S&Ws are superb for hunting but I don't know many handgun hunters (certainly not as many as back in the '70s) nor do I know many serious competitors---in my area Silhouettes, bullseye and PPC are nearly extinct and what matches there are comprise of SASS and IPSC, niether of which have a strong showing of modern DA revolvers.
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  #82  
Old 02-28-2011, 01:31 PM
Habbyguy Habbyguy is offline
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Originally Posted by Hovnnes View Post
Who is buying revolvers these days?
I bought my 19-6 for home defense (nothing to jam/go wrong if things get strange). I find it easier to acquire a sight picture than most large automatics (especially since I "improved" the sights with neon green and red markings).

I also plan to carry it when hunting (again, it's simple so there's nothing to do but pull the trigger, and it's powerful enough with a .357 magnum hunting round to stop nearly anything that I might need to stop). And given the nasty things that can happen to a holstered gun during a hunt, I think the simplicity and reliability of a wheel gun makes sense.

YMMV, of course...
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  #83  
Old 02-28-2011, 02:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Hovnnes View Post
Who is buying revolvers these days? ... I'm not sure how many revolvers competitve shooters...
I shoot revolver competitively - IDPA. Few shoot revolver. At the 2010 Nationals 8% shot revolvers, which seems high I suspect because it's nationals there might have been a greater percentage of wheel gunners than is representative, but that's a guess.

I know of very few who shoot revolver in the handful of clubs near me; far less than 8%. I know some larger sanctioned matches that get half the percentages that nationals did.

Personally, I had no interest in revolvers until just a year ago. Many years after I had started buying my own guns. Auto was the way to go.

I bought just to have and decided to play with it I IDPA. Which has become my regular gun now, but I never expected that to happen.

Revolvers aren't dead, but they appear to be an afterthought compared to autos.
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  #84  
Old 02-28-2011, 03:58 PM
rz625-8 rz625-8 is offline
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Revolvers have been making a small comeback into the market arena for law-abiding citizens and old school peoples like us. the new pistols are ok to a point but,when you grew up on 1911s and revolvers,there is nothing better in my own opinion to revolvers is mainly what I own now. You do not have to look around,bendover to pickup spent brass.
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  #85  
Old 02-28-2011, 04:15 PM
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Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers?  
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does this count, just picked it up about 2 hours ago....

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  #86  
Old 02-28-2011, 04:56 PM
smith35 smith35 is offline
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Wink Super interesting thread!!

Personally, I wish everyone would quit buying any and all nasty, old, garbage pre-lock S&W revolvers. I'll gladly buy them all at scrap price!

IMHO, the best post yet was the "if only one child is saved....".
Heck, "if only one child can be saved" then we should let O chop up and melt down every single privately held firearm in America.
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  #87  
Old 02-28-2011, 06:54 PM
Geronimo Jim Geronimo Jim is offline
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Turbo.........what in the world is that? Can you buy accesorys like wheels?
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  #88  
Old 02-28-2011, 06:59 PM
corgiS&W corgiS&W is offline
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Originally Posted by skeete View Post
I ... would not buy a new S&W until the do away with the lock and the MIM parts.
Why the negatives on the MIM parts? Which parts are most objectionable?
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  #89  
Old 02-28-2011, 09:17 PM
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turbo38gn turbo38gn is offline
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Originally Posted by corgiS&W View Post
Why the negatives on the MIM parts? Which parts are most objectionable?
Forgive him my son, for he know not what he said... or why...
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  #90  
Old 02-28-2011, 09:25 PM
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turbo38gn turbo38gn is offline
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Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers? Are many people buying new S&W revolvers?  
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Originally Posted by Geronimo Jim View Post
Turbo.........what in the world is that? Can you buy accesorys like wheels?
That's my new SW500 Bone Collector Limited Edition.

10.5" barrel, 50 caliber... not sure what I'm going to do with it yet, wanna shoot it, but the firearms instructor at S&W said I had to lock it away in the safe... what ya guys think..
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  #91  
Old 02-28-2011, 09:33 PM
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Originally Posted by bmcgilvray View Post
Due to several features, Smith & Wesson does not currently make a revolver product that I am interested in acquiring.

I maintain a large interest in revolver models formerly made by the company.
My sentiments eactly.

The only new gun I have is a model 610. Only reason I bought it is because I couldn't find the older 610's at the time.

augy
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  #92  
Old 02-28-2011, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by olin View Post
I don't know if many of you are involved in the stock market but a few analysts are saying now is the time to buy when swhc is just coming off its bottom. Predictions are that stock has the possibility of a huge increase through 4th quarter of 2012. After that they don't know. When they see shootings like in arizona a month or so again all gun stocks spike because more people buy in fear of laws changing. With current pontiff that is a possibility at all times. After 2012 and the chance for a changing of the guard to a more gun orientated regime that would spell trouble for stock growth. Less people would buy if they felt safe in leaderships direction regarding the laws of the land. - Heres the full take - 3 Gun Stocks: Buy, Sell or Hold? - Stockpickr! Your Source for Stock Ideas
IMHO,
I kinda feel that gun stocks are like airplane stocks.

In the past I have bought airplane stock, and loss my butt big time when there was a plane crash. Personally, I don't think I would speculate on gun stocks.
Of course who knows the future?
augy
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  #93  
Old 02-28-2011, 09:56 PM
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Originally Posted by turbo38gn View Post
does this count, just picked it up about 2 hours ago....


They make a IWB for that?
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  #94  
Old 02-28-2011, 10:59 PM
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Marshwheeling Marshwheeling is offline
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My first, and so far only Smith is my 5" Model 60. It has the IL; I didn't know any better at the time, and it still doesn't bother me, but it led me to this forum, which I have found enormously educational as well as entertaining.

This forum has given me an appreciation for the older Smiths, but more importantly, buying the new Smith a a couple of years ago revived my interest in shooting and gun ownership in general. I have bought other guns since, and I will probably buy another SW. Because of this forum, that purchase will be better-informed than the last one.
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  #95  
Old 02-28-2011, 11:06 PM
brucev brucev is offline
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Recently bought a 21-4 NIB. Excellent outstanding revolver! When I can afford it, I'll probably look to see what I can't live without... and then take steps to see to it that I keep living!
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  #96  
Old 02-28-2011, 11:13 PM
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turbo38gn turbo38gn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marshwheeling View Post
My first, and so far only Smith is my 5" Model 60. It has the IL; I didn't know any better at the time, and it still doesn't bother me, but it led me to this forum, which I have found enormously educational as well as entertaining.

This forum has given me an appreciation for the older Smiths, but more importantly, buying the new Smith a a couple of years ago revived my interest in shooting and gun ownership in general. I have bought other guns since, and I will probably buy another SW. Because of this forum, that purchase will be better-informed than the last one.
I don't understand your statement about the IL, "didn't know any better".. can you explain. Did you have some kind of problem related to the IL?
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  #97  
Old 03-01-2011, 06:19 AM
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Marshwheeling Marshwheeling is offline
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I don't understand your statement about the IL, "didn't know any better".. can you explain. Did you have some kind of problem related to the IL?
That was a semi-facetious comment. I have had no problem with the IL. I just had no idea it was so widely despised.
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  #98  
Old 03-01-2011, 06:37 AM
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M2MikeGolf M2MikeGolf is offline
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Default New S&Ws

I've been out of the revolver market for some years (while I was active duty, a limited budget and locations of duty stations, I kept to service style autos to stay "in practice". I'm retired now and can do what I want!). I recently purchased a Model 619 (although it appears S&W doesn't make them any more, it was new, from a dealer), my first new S&W since the IL, two-peice barrel. I have previously owned some 1930's era small frames, an 80s era Model 27 and a variety of Rugers and some others. The IL doesn't bother me in the least, and I like this 619 more than any other revolver than I have ever owned (with the possible exception of a 547 that I still possess). Not sure what the fuss is about the new models exactly, other than the purists that one always encounters. If I have a lock failure or barrel separation, I'll let the "old timers" know right away, but I'm not really expecting any big news alerts anytime soon. If I had to do it over again, there would be no hesitation in regards to this 619, new ones or old ones are all fine by me!
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  #99  
Old 03-01-2011, 07:43 AM
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turbo38gn turbo38gn is offline
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Originally Posted by Marshwheeling View Post
That was a semi-facetious comment. I have had no problem with the IL. I just had no idea it was so widely despised.
Thanks and yes, baffeling to me too. It's just sad to see it said so frequently in threads that it has no bearing. It scares away a newby gun person from the best guns S&W has made, yet there is no problem with the IL.. I'm a newbie and at first I had my doubts until I investigated
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  #100  
Old 03-01-2011, 09:25 AM
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They make a IWB for that?
That would be obscene! But whata' way to pick up chicks!

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