Mike-You need to get a macro lens for those close ups...they work miracles. I couldn't live without my 60 f2.8 Nikkor lens. I still marvel at what happened to your pistol...not good.

I certainly cant tell what caused the barrel to leave the frame's company in such a way, but I would certainly say the gun blew up for sure. While not the same as a cylinder blowing up through the topstrap, it certainly is bad enough and it sounds like the more I hear of it there might be something wrong with those lightweight J frames. Granted I own a 649 but I have been a bit skeptical of wanting a new J-frame, even though I know it could have been an off day at the factory, who knows the guy screwing in the barrel could have had a hangover, not enough coffee whatever. But I'm glad to see you are ok and the factory certainly owes you an answer.

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Vaya con Dios

I just spoke to a customer rep at S+W and they are sending me a return label.The gun will go out after that.I told the customer rep after two blown 640's I don't want it replaced with a third 640.He said under the circumstances that may be a option.Off to S+W's home page to see what I might like to have.At this point "ANYTHING BUT ANOTHER 640.....Stay tuned.....Mike

Years ago this would have been a considered a collectors idem now it's just
(will send you out a label) Do they even look at the guns before they put them in the box?

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Wow! That's pretty bad.

And Cruiser RN, your word is good enough for me.

I have dived into S+W's website and I like the Blued Model 36.It gives me a much safer feeling than the thought of another "640 Barrel Launcher" LOL.It is the same MSRP of the 640 new so that is what I will ask for as a replacement......Mike

Hope you get the M36, even a new model is a nice carry revolver.
Good Luck!

Good grief

Cruiser,
I am glad you made out with minor injuries. This is disturbing to say the least. Could have been much worse, and thankfully you will make a full recovery! Best wishes, and I look forward to the resolution from S&W

Cruiser, I am in total agreement about burns. You should not be getting burns from shooting a revolver-the odd spark possibly but not a diagnosable burn. Just my .02, ask them for a 632 Pro. Thicker barrel and probably heftier frame around barrel, six shots, and you can use .32 S&W long for range, and I doubt that round will blow anything up. And if you want a real screamer of a round use the 115 gr HPs, you are throwing an essentially .30 cal slug downrange at some pretty rapid velocities.
BTW, if either of those incidents happened to me, I would call it "blown up". Damn thing came apart under pressure, sure sounds like blown up to me.
You could also pry about a lifetime supply of .327 ammo out of them also if you were so inclined. PM me if you are interested.

Yikes! As the owner of a 442,642,632,327ng and 327pc your experience concerns me. Please let us know what Smith says. Glad you're OK and sorry about the discourteous reply you received. That's rare here.

The friggin gun blew up..Thats it. No other definitions needed. I am glad you were not seriously injured.

I will let everyone know how things turn out.A return label is in the mail and I will include a letter with my wish for a Blued Model 36 replacement gun.For the gun that replaced a gun that blew up to blow up is very scary and it will take a very long time for me to carry a S+W revolver again.BTW neither of those guns ever saw a 38+P or 357 Magnum load in thier lives which makes it even wilder......MIke

Cruiser RN is a long time friend of mine from this forum and from other firearms forums.
Your attitude about his problem is disappointing to say the least.
To treat him as a troll is out of line.
I wasn't going to comment about this because I've known about it for weeks, in fact we discussed it on the phone but after reading your comments today, I could not refrain any longer.
It is my hope that if you ever have a problem similar to Cruiser RN's with a firearm and start a thread:
A) You don't get hurt
B) You get the same treatment you have so cynically and callously imposed on him. We'll see how much you like it.

I agree with the other posters you owe Cruiser an apology.

According to the Mayo Clinic's website, 1st degree burns do not produce blisters. Blisters start to occur with 2nd degree burns.
Check it out. I don't want to put the link here because Lee really doesn't want a lot of extraneous links in the threads.

By any chance do you have or use an ultrasonic gun cleaning tank? I seem to recall some possible connection between certain cleaners (chlorinated perhaps?), ultrasonic cleaners and barrel shank fractures.

something just has me itching here.......

Glad you are okay, but I had to ask that. Seen too many times that a signifigant other/ex, or others pull things, if you are an ER nurse, you know where I'm coming from, had to ask too many victims for particulars while they were in the ER getting patched up.

I won't get into the choice-of-verbage controversy but I admit I was a little confused about the details of the incident after reading the initial post. I was curious why the gun was fired after the OP had detected something about the gun (I am still not sure what) that gave him pause. But, anyway, the main thing is I'm glad to know you weren't seriously injured!

I happen to see a 640 fracture and eject a barrel just like the second gun - without apparent damage to the frame. It was about a year or so ago (I think?) and the shooter was actually unaware of the failure. We had to go out and stop him from shooting again. Don't ask me what he thought he was using for a front sight!

The question about the ultra-sonic cleaner is a good one, but it seems more likely the guns were defective in either design, manufacturing, or assembly. The gun I saw fail was a used gun that was fired a few times and traded back to the selling dealer within a couple weeks of purchase. It was being test-fired by a prospective customer when it failed. That gun probably was not one likely to have received extraordinary cleaning. S&W, to their credit, repaired the gun at no charge to the dealer.

While I agree that things happen, and sometimes it is best not to make too much of them, I certainly would ask for a different model too! Enough is enough. You know what they say about the third strike!

Ok No ultrasonic cleaner and noone has access to my guns except me.The only thing that gave me pause was that the gun was grouping slightly right to my point of aim where I was pointing dead center.@ 30 feet the Q in the FBI Q target is gone in 5 shots and there was a big group just to the right of it.The gun is out to S+W and I will be waiting for thier response.I requested a Classic Model 36 as a replacement and we will see what happens........Mike

That answers my question. I thought maybe that you were indicating you thought the gun had an alignment problem and that the bullets were striking one side of the forcing cone, or something like that. If your observation just related to a POA-POI divergence, that is not uncommon and not a reason to stop shooting - absent of any other indications of trouble.

I hope you receive a replacement Model 36 and that your trust in S&W products is restored. Lousy to have TWO of these "incidents" happen to the same guy!

I'm curious as to why you think a Model 36 will be a better replacement. If I remember correctly, the 640 is a stainless version of the Model 40. The Model 40 is pretty much the same as a 36 only it has a concealed hammer.

Or is there some other difference that I'm blanking on?

As to S&W customer service, I just received a 642-2 to replace an early production 442 that had a frame crack. Their customer service was good. They gave me the choice of a 442 in blue or a 642 in matte silver. They also gave me the option of waiting a couple of weeks for a no lock version.

Overall, I'd say that they are very customer oriented.

Gary, I'm glad they took care of you. I've found S&W and Colt's customer service to be very good.

The #1 Thing is IT IS NOT A 640.To have two of them become barrel launchers in my hand makes me become extremely concerned there will be a third time and my Guardian Angel might be off that day and someone will get seriously hurt.The Blued Model 36 is the same price point as a Model 640 and shoots the same 38 special ammo.Maybe if it behaves well I might start to be able to trust S+W revolvers again.Also the model 36 is the Classic Chief's Special with a exposed hammer.I am also hopimg it has a pinned barrel.If the 640 had a pinned barrel I dom't believe this catastrophic failure would have happened because even if overtorqued barrel the pin would have prevented it from snapping out of the frame.

What about a Mod 638, similar to the old Mod 38s and Mod 49s? Not everyone likes their humpback profile but they are also great for not snagging clothing like the old Centennials and the current Mod 640 is.

I have several Centennials and Bodyguards. I like them both, but we all have different tastes.

My instructor always said"Shoot what you carry and carry what you shoot"I fired a Airweight once and let us just say the pain doesn't lend itself to shooting it often and gaining the necessary proficency with it to be a carry gun IMHO.I have always like the look of the "Classic Chief's Special" especially with the reproduction Diamond Grips it is wearing in Blue.I can see it with a Blued Tyler T Grip giving me a warm fuzzy feeling to take it to the range and engage in some serious bonding time.It may be enough to erase the vivid memory of the "640 Barrel Launchers" and get me to trust S+W revolvers again.

The latest to this story.The 640 went back to S+W on Monday.No one called so I called S+W today.Was told by a customer service person that it immeadiately went to warranty repair,they placed on a new barrel,and it is on the way back to me.I was reassured that it was extensively test fired and everything was fine.It was fortunate I am off today because there was ZERO communication on the part of S+W in this matter.I sure do hope that this gun will function in the manner it was designed.Here is hoping.BTW to all those who supported me in this thread I would like to say a heart felt thank you and to ALK 8944 I hope you never have a experience like I did and if you do may everyone give you kindness and support,may you not be hurt,and hopefully you learn not everyone is a liar and a perp. ...Mike

I hope it works out for you, Cruiser. You deserve a break.

While I didn't read every post thoroughly, I have to ask what you polished the gun with?
Some cleaners have ammonia or other chemicals that can be corrosive or change the integrity of the metal. Perhaps something leached between the barrel and frame to cause the failure.

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Memory of Randy Freas-Rimfired

Mother's Mag Polish applied with finger pressure only and buffing with a clean cloth and a application of Rennisanse Wax.I do not use any ammonia based cleaners.I am awaiting someone from Smith to tell me what caused the failure.The consensus here believes the barrel was overtourqued @ the factory upon initial assembly.The customer service rep tried to blame the ammo when he never saw the pristine nature of the ejected barrel.I told him S+B is factory 158 grain 38 Special Ammo.That being said if the round was higher than SAMMI standards the gun is a 357 Magnum which generates higher pressures and higher muzzle velocities routinely and this gun never saw a 357 round in its 800 round or so lifetime.I bought a 357 Mag in the event I ever got a out of spec 38 special round.We shall wait and see.....Mike

Mike, the ammo-blaming is almost certainly a cheap shot. It doesn't make sense. But there is no sense arguing with them. I believe if I was concerned, as well you might be, I would get the repaired gun back and trade it on something you have more confidence in, whether another S&W or something else. After two of these go-arounds, S&W should have done more to get you back into their camp.

I may be the odd man out here but I have re-read Alk8944's post a couple times. He is a very knowledgeable gunsmith with years of experience with S&W revolvers. Given that background, I took his questions as being more investigative, rather than intending to be insulting to you. Your initial post confused me a bit, too.

Anyway, let us know how this episode is resolved. I can't blame you for not being enthusiastic about S&W's response.

WoW, what a story my friend. I can't believe that happened with a S&W revolver. The burns are one thing, but what about losing an eye, or the lead leaving that gun at such a speed it takes you out. I owned a S&W model 686 4 inch for years and never had any problems with it. But that is years ago now. I bought the gun in 1983. Maybe the craftmanship was differant 30 years ago. This could verywell be a defect in this model. Still that gun should not have let go like that. A very dangerous situation for the shooter and for everyone standing next to you on the line. The same model gun explodes twice in your hands, its time S&W investigate this before someone gets serious hurt or killed.

John

The first 640 was called"Catastrophic Metal Failure" because the barrel took off and the frame cracked.This critter seems to be that the barrel was overtorqued when assembled @ the factory.I will be totally honest, it will be a cold day in HELL before I count on any S+W Revolver to potentially save my life.We shall see if third time is a charm or curse.....Stay Tuned

I don't plan on buying a 640 but you can bet if I ever have a similar problem as Mike with any other model and a barrel goes sailing downrange it won't be posted here after seeing how he's been given the third degree about it-good grief! It's like he's guilty until proven innocent.

That absolutly SUCKS! Twice a same make and model 640 blows up and with TWO different brands of ammunition!
I've read stories of some of the newer Smith revolvers tossing their barrels due to the two-piece design, and quite frankly I'm a bit leery of buying anything new from them!
I'm about to take possession of a new 642 and will ring the heck out of it! I'll be watching it closely!
Crusier RN; glad your ok, that would have really shook me up! And as for those members that seem to want to play the "prove it" game. Every company at one time or another has put out ****! Recently S&W has hit the wall in QC what with mim parts and new designs of already proven guns! And can well remember the days of LS when some 629s had .41 magnum cylinders and barrels on them!
I could list other reputable manufactures as well. Thing is I don't drink Kool-Aid and until the weapon I purchase has at least 200 rounds thru it I DON'T TRUST IT! Dale

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"Long live the S&W 3rd. Gen.!"

With all the **** I have taken all I can say is "It is what it is" and I thank those who have supported me.As to what happened all you need to do is look @ the pictures and "the thing speaks for itself".It is my humble opinion that the moderators should take a good long look @ this thread to see how this forum is degenerating.This used to be a place where people are always welcome and if disagreements took place they were respectfully discussed.Now flame throwing is done by senior forum members,tolerated by the moderators,and nothing is said or done.This is very very sad.JMHO .......Mike

Here is the way I look @ it.I don't really care what this Alk is.He wasn't being "investigative" he was being accusitory.He was not there to see the burns on my hands which I prevented from being second degree by my emergency treatment.Furthermore to question my honesty that I didn't shoot the gun much because it was polished like all my guns and that there was a issue in taking off the grips so people could see the frame was unnecessary @ best.JMHO This is the last I have to say about ALK's post.

The saga continues.NO gun today on the 22nd so I called S+W.I was told that a supervisor stopped the shipment of the 640 and it is on its way back to S+W.It seems like they are going to give me a replacement Model 36 which is far more acceptable to me.Just maybe after expressing my displeasure last Friday and requesting supervisory intervention it actually accomplished something.....Stay tuned

Sounds like the best possible outcome. A Model 36 is what you really want at this point clearly. Hopefully they (should) will ablige.

Cruiser, I am glad you are getting a new gun...I think S&W should have done that after the first failure...Atleast they are making it right good for you and S&W for doing the right thing...

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M.J.Hanna

Sucks that happened to you CruiserRN. Glad you were not injured worse than you were.

I hope you get that 36 from them. Seems the very LEAST they could do! Good luck! Regards 18DAI

Scooter,

You were doing fine until you ventured into medicine, but I have to disagree with you and your opinion. The medical profession classifies burns into three successively worse "degrees" with 1st being the least severe and defined as up to and including reddening of the skin and some edema (swelling.) If there is blistering, this indicates deeper damage and is categorized as a 2nd degree burn. This is not opinion, it's what I taught in basic Red Cross First Aid (before I started teaching Basic Human Anatomy to student nurses.) +1 to Malysh for the following, "According to the Mayo Clinic's website, 1st degree burns do not produce blisters. Blisters start to occur with 2nd degree burns."

CruiserRN, having had a couple of guns come unglued in my hands over the years, I sympathize and join our fellow forum members in congratulating you on your good luck that the injuries to you involved only first degree burns. Another testimony to the importance of wearing protective glasses etc when shooting. When my 38 wad gun (on a Colt Gov't Model) let go, I got a nice splinter of brass right in the middle of my right protective lens!

Froggie

Here is the latest.The 640 got back to them and I am getting a Blued Classic Model 36 as a replacement.They said it may take some time as they do not make many of them but I could care lees how long it takes.I could never put a 640 on my hip and feel comfortable it would be able to function if called upon.I am happy S+W finally listened to me and what I wanted.Let's just say that I lost my patience yesterday and said if pushed farther I would foward the pics of both barrel launchers to every law enforcement agency and say "This could happen to you if you have a 640 BUG." Do you think that might affect your LEO sales?? That statement DEFINATELY got thier attention and it came to good resolution today.Stay Tuned......Mike

When you bust a cap and major parts of a gun like the barrel leave the frame, I got no problem with the term "blew up".
That happening twice to you is almost incomprehensible. I'm glad you weren't seriously injured and I certainly understand your chagrin. I've been around shooting and shooters more than 4 decades and I've never known of another person who had the same catastrophic failure TWICE with the same model of gun!
To sum up, we're good up to here- two guns blew up, you got burned, and I don't blame you for being disappointed, angry, and less than confident in S&W's. NO problem.



Here is where our viewpoints diverge seriously:
Now THAT is exageration.
I saw this thread on the 2nd or 3rd day, so Alk's post had been more than adequately handled in the first 24 hours in my opinion. After almost a month, he has not replied or even tried to defend his statement.
scooter's 'opinion' of burns was simply ignored by most of us, since almost all living people have had a burn that didn't blister.
So, I disagree with your assessment. This board is moderated much tighter than most big gun boards. Opinions differ and eloquence, directness, and terminology varies from individual to individual. This is a very different board from what it was years ago. Removing every dissenting opinion from a discussion board doesn't leave much discussion.
You painted with way too broad a brush there.

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Regards,
Lee Jarrett

I can't resist. What are the lessons we've learned from reading Cruiser's post? 1) what should a shooter look for as warning signs - POI vs. aim point; 2) many recommendations and questions on the care and feeding of your revolver; 3) what else??
Cruiser I hope that you have been well taken care of and that you have run through your personal string of bad luck. Decades ago I was an EMT and we used to joke that bad luck came in 3's.
Personally, I prefer big heavy metal on my hip. Carry choice is 1911 government, but alot depends on your body size and fortunately I can handle one of these in a IWB holster.
Can't beat a good revolver for fun though!
Wishing you good fortune in the future.

You are right I did paint too broad a brush in that post.It was difficult to feel like I was being attacked for just posting what happened and when I saw it was a senior member who was doing it and it being allowed to stand without any comment by you I equated the inaction on your part to be acceptance of the behavior displayed.It took me stating this to get your input.Heck I was reprimanded for putting a link up one time not knowing it wasn't allowed.If that happened I was thinking how in Hades is this being allowed to happen without comment.JMHO......Mike

Mike ... It would be interesting to hear if S&W offers an explanation for what occurred. Not an excuse ... but an honest explanation. From everything that has been written thus far, I'm erring on the side of a metallurgy problem. Everything else seems to be too coincidental. Keep us posted on the new pistol.

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I'm with the banned ...

Makes me wonder about the quality of the newer Smith & Wessons!

Not me, I have confidence as I believe in looking at the big picture. We tend to put S&W under a microscope when it comes to anything built the last 20 years, but tend to hide our head in the sand when it comes to previous models from S&W. This situation, in this thread is probably 1 in a million. It's unfortunate, but no real damage occurred. I'm glad Cruiser is ok, I'm thinking I'll start wearing my shooting gloves more often..

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Jack C

I don't have any firm opinions judging current S&Ws more closely than I do older ones.
I buy nothing newer than mid 1960s S&Ws because I like the looks and finish of older guns more. Especially flat latches and diamond center gripped guns. It's common with folks like me who are getting older to look backwards with nostalgia. The older guns remind us of younger times, or historical times before ours. The only modern feature I have a real negative opinion about is the safety lock. If they had to install one I would have preferred it be more unobtrusive.

As for ignoring any problems of the past that is not the story for all of us. I have a lot of Airweights. The newest is 1962. There's been a lot of posts about cracked frames from barrel over torquing. Then there's the concern about cracked forcing cones on M-19s and M-66s when shooting a lot of lighter 357 magnum loads. It seems like there's a lot of concern about a few issues of the older models. It doesn't matter what side the members take about problems with earlier S&Ws, just the threads and the posts within clearly show it's not ignored and that negative focus is not soley about the newer products. There's plenty of posts to substantiate this. I don't see S&W people hiding their heads in the sand when it comes to asking questions or venting frustration when an older S&W has malfunctioned, broke, or giving them problems.

Guys it is simple STUFF HAPPENS plain and simple.I am probably that 1 in a million case where it happens with the same Model Twice.In the first case it was termed "Catastrophic Metal Failure".In the second we will never know.They attempted to send me the SAME # Frame with a new barrel and NO EXPLANATION.This caused me to go balistic and I said I had a montage of picks of both guns with the email list of every law enforcement agency I could think of and that I was going to send it with the message of How can you allow your officers to carry a S+W 640 as a BUG or Off Duty when this happened to me TWICE? Think long and hard before you trust your officer's lives with guns that do this.This might just put a kink in your LE Sales Don't you think? After this they became much more ammicable to my suggested solution and in the next day I was told the 640 got back to them and I would get my Blued Model 36 on the next production run...