Hi

I am having big property over 800 acres in Colorado area. My first carry arm is 1911 s&w. But second one I am considering to be S&w 460v.

Will that be ok? thanks

Arek

I own a 460 XVR... If you want it dead it's hard to go past... Muzzle blast is extreme and intimating at first, however it is a gentle giant to shoot (single hand 200gr pills)... Suppose it depends on what your target is... If the 460 can't do it, not too many handguns will

Whatcha raisin' down there, Dinosaurs?

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Eccentric old coot

While the 460 will take any game in North America having 2 full size carry guns on hand might be a little excessive. Have you considered carrying a nice .44 instead as it will nicely take care of all critters 4 legged or 2 should the need arise, and would save you the hassle of carrying 2 guns. On the other hand if the second gun will be riding in a truck or atv maybe a rifle or shotgun is the way to go for the second piece.

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Son of a Gun...Smith

If you are managing 800 acres you need a rifle in the truck. I'm not sure what you think you are going to run into down here but, a black bear is about as "dangerous" as it gets.

Here is my 2 cents. If I carry in the woods I usually carry a .44 magnum. BUT.....after some research I have found that the Alaska state troopers carry 10mm's. They do this because this round can take down a grizzly bear. That said I would look into the 10mm..you can cary 9 rounds in a S&W gen 3. or 15 in a piece of combat tupperware (GLOCK)

If you are currently carrying a 1911 I would say get a 10mm 1911, made by Colt or Kimber. This way you do not have to change holsters and ammo carriers...

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M.J.Hanna

Let's see here. In Colorado, rural property. If in the mountains I would carry a 629 in 44 mag. Not as much recoil and muzzle blast as 460. If you need more power than a 44 mag. get a rifle.

If on the plains, your 45 will do just fine. BUT if you want a reason to get a 460 then go get one, no one says you can't YET!

If you are in western Colorado I do know there are the occasional grizzly there, but highly unlikely you would run into one. Whatever you get be sure you can shoot it well and are not afraid of it. You are better off with a gun you can shoot than a gun you can not shot because of recoil or muzzle blast.

John

Thanks. 460v takes care of any animal but it will also be a good gun for any armed hostiles. 460 bullet might not go through a bullet proof vest but will drop down any man due to the force. I also want to arm my self well against possible human intruders. 1911 45 ACP is good but 460v goes a little further in terms of stopping power.

If you run into a griz in CO., capture it- it will be better than hitting the Lotto!
Good shooting.

"If you run into a griz in CO., capture it"

Being from back east I am curious as to how one goes about that?

Thanks

There are plenty of Bear threads around here.

I'm sure one has to cover the technique..

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Ogy

My suggestion is a chest carry for a model 29 and a Marlin 44 rifle. That combination is hard to beat and can be loaded with a number of loads that will cover the bases.

If you are worried about armed hostiles then I would definitely grab a rifle. 5.56 will defeat most soft armors but if you went with a .308 it will defeat most soft or reinforced armors as well as be an acceptable round for large or dangerous game animals.

In my opinion the 460 is not a gun that I would want for a gunfight, it is a manstopping round but its not particularly quick to get back on target, it does not reload quickly, and it only has a 5 round capacity.

If I were you I would find a .308 to keep in my truck, something magazine fed with an intermediate range scope. I'm not trying to discourage you from getting a 460 but for what you seem to be describing although it would be "enough" gun it simply is not the right gun.

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Son of a Gun...Smith

I agree with this. Carrying a rifle makes a whole lot more sense than carrying two handguns. I would feel much more comfortable with a rifle in .308 Win than ANY handgun.

Someone mentioned 10mm/40S&W for an Alaskan outdoors gun? I just can't believe that would be an effective caliber for a hungry grizzly. 44 Mag has been the handgun answer since it came out. Maybe a hole magazine worth of 40S&W. If that's the case then, having to dish out multiple hits, then you're dealing with a VERY stressful situation. You want a 1 hit wonder up there. I've been to Alaska a few times and the preferred load then (2004) was the 44 mag being most common, 454 Casull, and the S&W500 was newer but very prevalent up there. Last time up my uncle was carrying a 629 Power Port with a 300gr load. That was his everyday outdoors gun. For him it went everywhere. He also carried a 1911 and said he'd put his life on that. You really appreciate that firepower when you're trying to fly-fish a couple hundred feet from grizzly. From what I've heard, read & seen on TV the new wild frontier guns are the 500 and 460 but the 44 is still the most common. I know if I had to go trekking where that nut case Timothy Tredwell and his girlfriend were killed... I'd be doing it with a 460S&W with a few boxes of ammo... maybe a 629 for an ankle gun LoL

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Insured by S&W since 2000 :)

Whatever you decide will be OK with me, Just thought I'd let you know.

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C & L

You capture it! Not me! In 1983 a guide in SW Colo. was attacked by a griz. I have seen griz tracks myself in NW Colo. No mistake on that.
There is "offical" evidence of griz in Colo. I live in MT now and deal with griz when they aren't hibernating! No I will not try to capture you one, but you can come and get one anytime you want!

Back to the OP---Get a AR-10, I think it will work the best for you, like others have said.

John

A rifle should always be the main weapon when trouble is expected.

What he said. And besides, you can drive around with a rifle in the back window of your truck and no one would think a thing about it.

A 460 strapped to your hip will draw more attention than you can imagine. Especially in rural Colorado. No one thinks of guns other than tools out there.

Was born, raised and still live in Colorado. My .357 Blackhawk will do anything I need to do except hunt elk and it would do in a pinch. my .308 Marlin XS7 is all the rifle I need but I travel with a beat up old 30-30 Win.

If I had to manage 800 acres of land, my jeep/truck would be carrying a walkie talkie, lots of water, gas, beef jerky, a Ruger Mini-14, Maverick 88 pump and a good flashlight.

The carry weapon would be a chest carried S&W 629 44 magnum. Out in the boonies is not a good place for a FtE

Probably have a 640 tucked in somewhere too.

The 460V would be laying in my safe, highly polished and wearing a tiara.

Cant go wrong with a .308 but if your spending any amount of time in the field and dont want to carry two different kinds of ammo my two favorites are the Ruger .44 Magnum Carbine and .44 Mountain gun combination.

Check out the Springfield SOCOM in 308. That is one fine weapon.

Somewhere out West there is a tombstone with this inscription:

Here lies Sam Jones. Bet his pistol against a rifle at 100 yards

In that part of the country, expertise with a rifle is a life saver.

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Take your time..quickly.

I would carry one 4" Model 29. Seemed to work well for Elmer. Rifles are great but they never seem to be around when you need them.

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Centennial Every Day

Depends on what you are doing when you "carry". Weight won't be an issue riding in or on a vehicle (or horse; I guess they don't complain ).

If you'll be walking, however, an 8 3/8" 460 is over 6 pounds unloaded, plus ammo and holster. Add that to the 1911, holster, magazines/carrier and ammo, and that is a lot of weight. Sounds like a good situation for a .308 Scout-type rifle as cornfed83 suggested.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

Does the 460 come with wheels?

I'm with the rifle guys. Just about anything .223/5.56 or bigger will do for bad guys, but 6.8/7.62 will handle bigger stuff and longer ranges. The Ruger Mini-14 in 6.8 SPC makes a compact, lightweight package that should handle just about anything you'll run across that needs shooting.

ECS

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CPT, Armor (Ret)
Luke 22:36

I suggest a s&w model 686 .357 magnum revolver with a 4 inch barrel. This particular gun is small enough that it can be carried but yet if you have to shoot it the recoil won't hurt to much.

Thanks for good suggestions folks. I am new to managing large areas of open space in the wilderness of Colorado.

Springfield SOCOM in 308 looks like a rifle that could take out a bear at even 500 meters. What caliber is it? I need something powerful on the level of 1911 45 acp.

I dont understand why folk dont find 460v appropriate EDC? It can be concealed carried under arm just like 1911 45 acp. It can be accurately fired even by average build person. But most importantly it will stop safely full grown black beer or 2 within one magazine load.

Arek

If you plan on carrying that .460 with the 1911 you might want to get some suspenders. Personally, if you are in heavy timber where there is not alot of range I would consider a 20-inch barreled 12 gauge pump, slugs will take care of bear, and buckshot anything else. You could get a Marlin 336 in .30-30 (.35 Remington would be better) or maybe a Guide Gun in .45-70 if you anticipate big things. As far as a handgun, a .357 with stout cast bullets will get along just fine or maybe a .41 Magnum or .44 Magnum revolver. I would either get a decent Smith or Ruger Blackhawk or Super Blackhawk with 4 5/8 inch barrel. Any more than that and you might as well get some field artillery.

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Vaya con Dios

Arek,

The Springfield SOCOM is a variant of the M1A Service rifle chambered in .308 Winchester/7.62x51 NATO. It is a highly reliable and battle proven design capable of making accurate shots out to 800 meters while still being an effective platform for CQB (close quarters battle). When loaded with any practical ammunition that I can think of it will is more capable of stopping power than a 1911 in .45 ACP.

The reason that many of us have suggested a rifle as opposed to the 460 is because a rifle is much more capable of being used at distance and when you are in a SHTF situation you will be glad to have a rifle in your hands! The increased capacity and handling/accuracy will make a difference. I'm not experienced hunting black bear but I would imagine that a .308 will suffice, but you also mentioned worrying about hostiles wearing body armor. I know from personal experience that when working on a two way firing range that capacity makes a huge difference as does reload speed. With the 460 although it is accurate and capable of defeating armor the capacity and speed of reloading makes it impractical for use as a main arm against a potentially armored bad guy. The M1A as with most battle styled .308 rifles have a standard magazine capacity of 20 rounds and being magazine fed allows you to reload relatively quickly. If you do chose to go with a rifle styled like this there are several offerings available from approximately $600 and up.

The other option that I'm not sure has been mentioned yet is rechambering your 1911 to .460 Rowland. The .460 Rowland is comparable to the .44 Magnum round and your 1911 is easily converted with a new barrel and recoil spring while still using the same magazines and other parts.

The other thing that is most essential is no matter which firearm you decide to use for protection and daily carry is that you practice and become intimately familiar with every function of your firearm so that you can use it simply by muscle memory. This is extremely important for any situation that your life may depend on. I believe the old saying is "luck is a combination of preparation and opportunity."

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Son of a Gun...Smith

Arek,

You postings give me pause to ask a few questions.
Why do you think you will need to be armed against human threat in "a wilderness situation in CO?

You state "Springfield SOCOM in 308 looks like a rifle that could take out a bear at even 500 meters. What caliber is it? I need something powerful on the level of 1911 45 acp."

A 308 is a lot more powerful than a 45 acp. Why with your limited knowledge of firearms do you think a 460 S&W is the answer?

I do not intend to cause you any strif, but this all seems a little strange to me.

John

BUT.....after some research I have found that the Alaska state troopers carry 10mm's. They do this because this round can take down a grizzly bear.

Not recommended. If you must shoot a griz with a hand gun save at least one round. You will know what to do with it when the time comes. Jim

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That's just somebody talkin.

Just what I was thinking.
.308 FMJ can defeat any body that can be obtained by most people with no plate insert.
Maybe pot growers out there have such armor......

[QUOTE=LostintheOzone;136522104]BUT.....after some research I have found that the Alaska state troopers carry 10mm's. They do this because this round can take down a grizzly bear.

REALLY???? Are you willing to bet your life on that? I'm not.

John

NO WAY.

Rifle 6.8 and .308.

.44 magnum to carry. No less than 4" mountain gun. Definitely not over 6" because its too much to carry. Larger calibers than .44 I have only shot in black powder rifles.

I know a X AK trooper who has taken down 2 or 3 bears with a .45 ACP.
Not that he had a choice, but bullet placement is more importent then calaber most of the time...

I would carry two firearms, one would be a 44MAG handgun and the other would be a 44MAG lever gun. Why carry two different cartridges? Also I chose the lever gun due to speed and it holding more rounds than that of a bolt action.

James

460 cartridge is way more powerful than any other gun. It even has more power than s&w 500. Thus when and if 44 is not enough there is power at hand as a back up.

As the golden saying says "Better to have and not need than need and not have".

Thrifty: you've bought into the hype without doing any homework. The bigger the flash, the bigger the recoil, the bigger the pricetag and the shinier the gun under the lights DOES NOT make it more effective at killing something no matter what the Terminator is saying in Hollywood.

What makes a firearm effective is your ability to put the bullets on target, at a variety of ranges, in a variety of lighting conditions, under a variety of stress levels (yours).

If you can snap up a gun and hit a pie plate reliably in three seconds... you're starting to get somewhere. I can do it with my .44 magnum at close range, my .38 spl a little farther out, my 12 gauge easily (even if the plate is flying through the air or rolling on the ground) and my .303 British, .308 Win or .338 win mag. a couple hundred yards out. With more time, my effective range increases.

Can you hit small targets reliably with a .22 long rifle?
How about your .45 acp?

There is a reason the U.S. Army uses the 5.56 mm & 7.62 mm Nato rounds (also known as the .223 Rem. & .308 Win.) for most rifles. Most people can hit and kill reliably with them, with open sights out to 300 meters. I hit 37 out of 40 pop up human sized targets over a variety of ranges (25 m headshots to 300 m whole torso) when I qualified with my M16-A2 (5.56) at Ft. Benning,GA. I could not have done that with a 460 handgun.

Get past the blast and start shooting some grapefruit. Start hunting small game. Start hunting large game. Learn the woods, how to sneak and maybe take a defensive course on how to move under fire, use cover effectively and return fire.

Or just buy into the hype, buy the big shiny gun, squeeze the trigger as fast as you can and play it like a musical instrument. Might work. C.B.

Well said C.B.

John

When I'm out a bustin' doggies on my horse, ole' flapjack, I carry a little piece made by Dillon Aero. Not sure what caliber it is - in fact I don't care. It's one of them ole' gatlin guns - 'cept with a motor attached. I just slap 'er in the scabbard where I used to carry the Winchester and then slide the battery and 1300 round ammo can in the saddlebags with the coffee pot, cast iron skillet, etc...

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But then, what do I know?

Wouldn't it be simplier to just move to the city and reside in a high rise condo?

A .44 magnum is easy to carry in the 4" or under variety. It can be concealed under a light cover garment, especially if it has a round butt or boot grip. It will stop any soft target, and is better than a sharp stick against an angry bear. It takes practice to deal a fast second shot (or more), but definitely possible.

Marlin .44 magnum carbines have a 1:18 twist and an oversized bore. You will get keyholes unless you slug the barrel and size accordingly. I would pick a Marlin 45-70 Scout over the .44 in a heartbeat. It's a 6# rifle with real thump, and up to 7+1 rounds to go (5+1 is typical).

The SOCOM 16 is a shortened M1a (37.5") weighing just under 9# dry. It's a bit much to carry unless you use a sling, weak side, muzzle down, with one of those funny balloons over the muzzle to exclude mud and junk. The penetration of 7.62x51 is legendary, and the SOCOM is good to 300 yards or better. Mine will hold a 1" group at 100 yards without trying hard. The compensator is very effective - you could put out 5 semi-aimed shots in 2 seconds. The 1:11" twist works best with 162 to 168 grain BTHPs.

For varmints wearing armor, an M25, a white feather (and a posse) would seem about right.

Well, gee, my Marlin 44 mags don't know that they are supoose to keyhole----all the holes touch with my two 44 mags. SHHuuuussshhh! Don't tell them. LOL

A 45-70 is a better cart., no doubt about it.

John