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Old 07-27-2012, 06:05 PM
rbchern1 rbchern1 is offline
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Default Model 29 with no transfer bar

Any body know when the started puting transfer bars in model 29's? Or if they ever did. I just bought a SS 6" barrel with no transfer bar.
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Old 07-27-2012, 06:15 PM
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Welcome to the forum!
Smiths have always used a hammerblock rather than a transfer bar, and if your .44 is indeed stainless it would be a 629, and to the best of my knowledge they never made a 629 without a hammerblock. My guess would be that someone had the sideplate off and didn't put the hammerblock back in? If this is the case, this is something you would want to have corrected!
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Old 07-27-2012, 06:30 PM
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I don't know of ANY S&W revolver that uses a transfer bar. S&W has used
a hammer block since way back. Your 629 probably has one. If you cock
the hammer for single action you will not see the hammer block.If you
want to look at it you will have to remove the side plate to see it. You can tell if it is in the gun by just pressing forward on the hammer when
it is down and at rest.If the hammer does not move forward to let the
firing pin show in the frame window then the hammer block is there.

Last edited by JAREDSHS; 07-27-2012 at 06:38 PM.
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Old 07-27-2012, 07:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAREDSHS View Post
..... You can tell if it is in the gun by just pressing forward on the hammer when
it is down and at rest.If the hammer does not move forward to let the
firing pin show in the frame window then the hammer block is there.
Not so, because the rebound slide has a raised ledge to prevent the hammer from being able to move forward unless the trigger is pulled. Check out post #12, under "Revolver Safeties" in the FAQ: 500 Magnum Nut's FAQ's

Apparently it's common for the hammer block to be discarded by people when doing a trigger job, but having it really won't affect the trigger pull or action if everything is in spec.

HTH
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Last edited by 2hawk; 07-27-2012 at 08:01 PM. Reason: welcome!
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Old 07-27-2012, 07:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2hawk View Post

Apparently it's common for the hammer block to be discarded by people when doing a trigger job, but it really won't affect the trigger pull or action if everything is in spec.

HTH
Common, and very stupid. It is there for a reason, and if yours is missing, well, they are cheap and easy to replace. Do so ASAP.
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Old 07-27-2012, 10:02 PM
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The hammer block is a drop safety. It is there in the event the gun is dropped on the hammer spur hard enough to shear the pivot pin the hammer rides on, and this would allow the hammer to go forward and fire the gun. A transfer bar is only in the way of the hammer when the gun is being fired. The hammer block is only in the way of the hammer when the gun is at rest. When the gun is cocked, either single or double action, the hammer block drops down out of the way. Sort of the opposite of a transfer bar. It should be in there for your safety. The reason it was incorporated into the firing mechanism, is that some guns WERE dropped on the hammer and DID fire as a result of shearing the pin the hammer pivots on.
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Old 07-28-2012, 01:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Louie View Post
The hammer block is a drop safety. It is there in the event the gun is dropped on the hammer spur hard enough to shear the pivot pin the hammer rides on, and this would allow the hammer to go forward and fire the gun. * * * The reason it was incorporated into the firing mechanism, is that some guns WERE dropped on the hammer and DID fire as a result of shearing the pin the hammer pivots on.
I thought I'd read a slightly different story about the introduction of the hammer block. That it was added not because the hammer pivot pin could shear off, but because the "tip" on the hammer, which normally engages a bump on the rebound slide to prevent forward hammer movement until the trigger is pulled, could break off if the gun was dropped and landed on the hammer with enough force. See the discussion in this thread Do you need a hammer block in a modern S&W? .

The conclusion is the same, though - the hammer block was added as a backup to the hammer blocking function built into the original action design, when after 40+ years of real world experience it was shown that the original design could fail under specific circumstances. (According to the thread linked above, the failure that generated the addition of the hammer block occurred during WWII when a Navy sailor dropped a K frame Victory model revolver which landed on its hammer and discharged, killing him. At that point I believe the Hand Ejector action had been in production for over 40 years, and I think it's remarkable that there had not been enough of these failures before then to cause S&W to improve the drop safety of the guns.)
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Old 07-28-2012, 01:48 PM
shawn mccarver shawn mccarver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rbchern1 View Post
Any body know when the started puting transfer bars in model 29's? Or if they ever did. I just bought a SS 6" barrel with no transfer bar.
Stainless steel 44 Magnums are called Model 629, not Model 29. As a practical matter, it makes no difference, as the internals are the same.

S&Ws do not use a "transfer bar." A transfer bar rises up when the trigger is pulled and the hammer strikes the transfer bar, which in turn strikes the firing pin. This is not how the S&W revolver mechanism works.

S&W uses a hammer block, which prevents forward travel of the hammer unless the trigger is pulled.

You can clearly see if it is in the revolver by simply starting the hammer back and watch for it to drop out of its upper position.

If it is really not in the revolver, then I suspect that some unqualified person removed the side plate and carelessly allowed it to fall out, and either did not realize it or did not know what to do with it. A very small number of gunsmiths have been known to remove the hammer block in the erroneous belief that it makes a smoother or lighter trigger pull on double action. A competent gunsmith can smooth out the action just fine without removing such an essential safety component.

If any part is missing, there is no telling what other dangerous or unsafe operations have been done to your revolver. You should send it back to the factory to have it properly repaired. You should not sell it without an essential safety-related part. That is both irresponsible and dangerous, and could be grounds for liability.

If any gunsmith or other person tells you that removal of the hammer block is not dangerous because of the hump on the rebound slide, you must immediately place all advice from such a person into "File 13," or "Category B," as all advice from such a person should be considered suspect.

The hammer block is essential to the safe operation of the S&W revolver in the sense that the revolver WILL discharge if it receives a sufficient blow to the hammer, whether that blow is from someone hitting the back of the hammer with a hammer or whether the blow is from being dropped. It is unsafe to be on the shooting line with a person with an S&W revolver modified by removal of the hammer block as it is impossible to predict the direction the bullet will travel if the revolver should discharge under such circumstances, and as much as these wags will insist that no competent shooter will ever drop a firearm, it does, and has, happened.

GET IT FIXED. WITHOUT DELAY.

Last edited by shawn mccarver; 07-28-2012 at 01:52 PM.
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  #9  
Old 06-13-2018, 05:51 PM
6 Cylinder 6 Cylinder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2hawk View Post
Not so, because the rebound slide has a raised ledge to prevent the hammer from being able to move forward unless the trigger is pulled. Check out post #12, under "Revolver Safeties" in the FAQ: 500 Magnum Nut's FAQ's

Apparently it's common for the hammer block to be discarded by people when doing a trigger job, but having it really won't affect the trigger pull or action if everything is in spec.

HTH
I have a 629-6 2 5/8" out of the performance shop. bought it new. shot about 4 boxes of shells through it with the last 2 on a ransom rest. I have 2 issues with the gun. I though I had one issue corrected. It was the trigger not making full return at times and all the time if I pointed it up while dry firing. Took it apart and had some glue looking junk on the trigger slide. cleaned and slicked up and much better but still not returning at times when pointed up. I took the hammer block ? out and it works perfect every time. I suspected it before but I'm big on safety so I lean that way. Considering leaving it out. I would hate to be in a scenario where I have to shoot with the gun pointed up and the trigger does not return. The second issue I will detail in a separate post but want to mention because it is the same gun. The cylinder pops open when fired from a ransom rest. Every thing appears to be in proper working order otherwise.
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Old 06-13-2018, 06:48 PM
Pisgah Pisgah is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6 Cylinder View Post
I have a 629-6 2 5/8" out of the performance shop. bought it new. shot about 4 boxes of shells through it with the last 2 on a ransom rest. I have 2 issues with the gun. I though I had one issue corrected. It was the trigger not making full return at times and all the time if I pointed it up while dry firing. Took it apart and had some glue looking junk on the trigger slide. cleaned and slicked up and much better but still not returning at times when pointed up. I took the hammer block ? out and it works perfect every time. I suspected it before but I'm big on safety so I lean that way. Considering leaving it out. I would hate to be in a scenario where I have to shoot with the gun pointed up and the trigger does not return. The second issue I will detail in a separate post but want to mention because it is the same gun. The cylinder pops open when fired from a ransom rest. Every thing appears to be in proper working order otherwise.
Is there some reason why this revolver isn't already on its way back to S&W? Had I paid Performance Shop prices, I'd have shipped it back pronto...
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Old 06-13-2018, 09:49 PM
6 Cylinder 6 Cylinder is offline
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Thanks. Just got back out of town yesterday but definitely plan on shipping to S & W. Already talked to customer service. The cylinder never came open when hand held and fired. I learned more about the function of the hammer block and also found some sharp edges on it that were dragging on the trigger block. Smoothed all that and it helped some but when the gun is pointed upright and the trigger pulled still it fails to fully return unless the hammer is nudged. Since the hammer block seems to rely a bit on gravity the only option I presently see for full reliability in all positions and safety is to carry on an empty chamber. Otherwise leave hammer block in, carry 6 and remember to manipulate hammer if shooting repeatedly with gun pointed up. I'll see what S&W can do for me but unless they test fire on a Ransom Rest they may not be able to duplicate the cylinder popping open. I understood the customer service gentleman to say they did not test on one, did not have any stiffer springs for the detent, or other options.

Last edited by 6 Cylinder; 06-13-2018 at 09:53 PM.
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