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S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present All NON-PINNED Barrels, the L-Frames, and the New Era Revolvers


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Old 01-02-2014, 07:14 PM
cometpx4 cometpx4 is offline
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Default Smith Brings back the Model 66!!!

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Before you start reading this thread or post in this thread, READ this Post- Smith Brings back the Model 66!!!

Lee Jarrett
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Its for real. The 66 4 inch is back. i will also be picking up the PC 686 with unfluted cylinder and 2.5 inch barrel

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Old 01-02-2014, 08:27 PM
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Here is a link from the inter-www-net-web-thingy :

Return of the Smith & Wesson Model 66 Combat Magnum

And after the factory stated they would never make a K frame .357 again - anyone with the flying pig graphic to post?
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Old 01-02-2014, 08:55 PM
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Wow, does that mean the "few" I have now are obsolete? ;-)
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:02 PM
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IL or no IL, setting aside THAT can of beans for a moment.. I'm darned glad they are bringing back the K-Frame magnum!

I have been puzzled as to why you can get a J-frame 357 but no offerings in K-Frame... One wonders if the reintroduction of the 66 is successful enough, will we see the m19 make a comeback in the "Classics" line??
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:04 PM
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I hope they do a 2.5 inch version, then I'm in.
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphydog View Post
Here is a link from the inter-www-net-web-thingy :

Return of the Smith & Wesson Model 66 Combat Magnum

And after the factory stated they would never make a K frame .357 again - anyone with the flying pig graphic to post?
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:20 PM
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I have a 4" 629 with a lock. Said I'd never get one. Glad I did. Is it a little different from my older 629 or 29-2? Yes but it works and is accurate.

Perhaps, just perhaps now that they have a "K" frame we might see 22's and or other items. Maybe a 5 shot 44 Special?

It will not hurt the value of the older ones. It will allow those who can't find an original to buy one.
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:25 PM
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Interesting. Maybe my 500 mag plan just got put off a bit? You never know how long these will be in production for. I don't recognize the source for this. Can anyone vouche for the website?
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Old 01-02-2014, 09:27 PM
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Interesting. Maybe my 500 mag plan just got put off a bit? You never know how long these will be in production for. I don't recognize the source for this. Can anyone vouche for the website?
I wondered about the website as well. I hope it's true.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by model70hunter View Post
I have a 4" 629 with a lock. Said I'd never get one. Glad I did. Is it a little different from my older 629 or 29-2? Yes but it works and is accurate.

Perhaps, just perhaps now that they have a "K" frame we might see 22's and or other items. Maybe a 5 shot 44 Special?

It will not hurt the value of the older ones. It will allow those who can't find an original to buy one.
Check out the rest of the 2014 guns. There is a model 69, a five shot L frame 44 magnum.
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Old 01-03-2014, 04:13 AM
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Geewiz MrTrolleyguy, That was nice of you to post the pictures ...that rates a like!

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Old 01-03-2014, 05:19 AM
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I like. Hopefully it will be around long enough for me to save my pennies after my S&W 500 purchase. What's the deal with the black cylinder release? Is this something s&w will be going on all their revolvers?
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Old 01-03-2014, 08:03 AM
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You guy are hard on S&W. Guys have been asking SW to bring back the 66 and some other guns. They did it for us. I'm not saying they built them better then the older ones. We now have more guns to pick from. I been e-mailing SW to make a 9 mm rev. and now i see two new one.
We all know things today are not built like the old day.. Lets see what Ruger builds for there customers. Give S&W thumbs up !!!
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:43 AM
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Based on the pictures, have they recut the frame around the hammer to more closely match the original, pre-lock lines?
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:47 AM
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Based on the pictures, have they recut the frame around the hammer to more closely match the original, pre-lock lines?
Nope. Look at the photo of a 66-2 in another thread.

recently purchased a used .357 66-2
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:05 AM
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3."

Needs 3."
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:13 AM
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Well yeah!!

But I think what some of us who are happy to see the return of the 66 are not trying to say new is better than old, or vice verce.. Just nice to see Smith is listening..at least to a point...

I prefer the old, but still like the new. It's nice to know they are listening is all...
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Old 01-03-2014, 12:21 PM
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I like the model 66; but S&W production is not keeping up with demand for current models. It has taken almost two years for shields to show up in numbers in local gun shops that did not require a special "back order". I like the idea of the "66" release but I doubt I see one in person unless I happen to see the initial "1" that shows up at my Stocking Dealer.
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Old 01-03-2014, 12:21 PM
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Change, for better or worse, is one of the few constants in the world. While I love the old Smiths, they're gone forever. Despite the MIM and IL, I'd wager this this new M66 will be a nice gun. Hopefully, they'll be enough interest in the gun that they'll bring out a 3" model. That's what I'd be interested in.


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Old 01-03-2014, 01:20 PM
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I have a friend who recently showed me his S&W model 66 revolver collection and since that visit with that friend i have had a very wet appetite for a S&W model 66 with a 4 inch barrel.

Now that S&W has reintroduced that model i think i am going to buy one as soon as i can get the money saved up.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:22 PM
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My first Smith&Wesson was a Model 19 4" in 1970, a Bangor Punta abortion. Tried to carry it as a duty weapon but 5 rounds of W-W 357s and the gun would bind as one side of the cylinder was .005 wider than the other. Forcing cone was undersized and the hot lead and powder particles and lock up was soon to occur.

Gun was screwed up like Hogan's goat. Took a professional gunsmith and a lot of machine work to get it tuned and operating reliably, also a years time. That year included a trip to the Mothership who advised that I was shooting too hot of ammo in it. That was their fix.

When I started looking for alternative Smiths to carry, it was basically a sellers market. You could buy 6" Model 10s all day from Smith but the idea of a Model 66 wasn't reality then.

I've been shooting Smiths predominately for 48 years, it's nice to see them bring back the 66 such a nice carrying weapon in a very adequate caliber. Thanks S&W for jumping back into K frames, magnum style.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:40 PM
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Good news for the folks who like their guns in the white. NOW if they brought back the Model 19 they'd have my attention.
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x10x10 View Post
Does this mean I will have to start screwing the ejector rod back in every 3-4 cylinders that I shoot it or it will lock up
My first Model 19, a Bangor Punta model purchased in 1980, did that all the time. The threads were reversed, I think, from the cylinder spin, and recoil caused them to "unwind" and jam up. At least I THINK that's why. But, regardless, Loctite cured that! The gun was great otherwise, until I blew it up with unknown ammunition (discussed elsewhere on this Forum).

***GRJ***
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:51 PM
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Good news for the folks who like their guns in the white. NOW if they brought back the Model 19 they'd have my attention.
I prefer blue myself but even with the MIM parts and IL I'd own one and be happy with it. Those locks do not bother me - I'm old fashioned but not THAT old fashioned and hung up on the issue. I don't actually need one of these but it would fit into my collection and a K-frame .357 is nice to have. So we'll see.

And it does have the lock, as the picture shows it very clearly.

***GRJ***
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Old 01-03-2014, 02:56 PM
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It IS on the S&W website:

Search Results - Smith & Wesson

MSRP is $849.00

***GRJ***
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:09 PM
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Folks, if you truly don't like new guns-don't buy them! Yes it would be grand indeed to see a forged frame, forged internals recessed cylinder, pinned barrel, squared butt M 66 with hammer mounted firing pin coming out of Springfield or Houlton.
Would ANYBODY be able to afford the cost of a production gun requiring that much hands on work?? Look at the cost of the current production Colt New Frontier $2000 and up.

Hopefully S&W will make enough of the newly introduced revolvers to actually get some in dealer display cases. Then the "I gotta have the newest" crowd will then trade-in their classic 'OLD' guns on the new ones! My LGS took in a pair of 686's on an R-8 and a shield a couple weeks back, proof some people just don't want an older gun.
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Old 01-03-2014, 04:00 PM
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So...it's a 686 without the full underlug then? I don't see the fuss :-)
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Old 01-03-2014, 04:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bronco45 View Post
My first Smith&Wesson was a Model 19 4" in 1970, a Bangor Punta abortion. Tried to carry it as a duty weapon but 5 rounds of W-W 357s and the gun would bind as one side of the cylinder was .005 wider than the other. Forcing cone was undersized and the hot lead and powder particles and lock up was soon to occur.

Gun was screwed up like Hogan's goat. Took a professional gunsmith and a lot of machine work to get it tuned and operating reliably, also a years time. That year included a trip to the Mothership who advised that I was shooting too hot of ammo in it. That was their fix.

When I started looking for alternative Smiths to carry, it was basically a sellers market. You could buy 6" Model 10s all day from Smith but the idea of a Model 66 wasn't reality then.

I've been shooting Smiths predominately for 48 years, it's nice to see them bring back the 66 such a nice carrying weapon in a very adequate caliber. Thanks S&W for jumping back into K frames, magnum style.
That can't possibly be, I heard on the internet that every pre lock gun was perfect.
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Old 01-03-2014, 04:49 PM
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Quote:
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It IS on the S&W website:

Search Results - Smith & Wesson

MSRP is $849.00

***GRJ***
The website has it listed under N frames
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Old 01-03-2014, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphydog View Post
Here is a link from the inter-www-net-web-thingy :

Return of the Smith & Wesson Model 66 Combat Magnum

And after the factory stated they would never make a K frame .357 again - anyone with the flying pig graphic to post?
In the words of Tobias Fornell, "Well tie me up and call me Loretta."

I have been on a rant lately about the ridiculous announcements out of the Performance Center for 2014. I still think those new PC guns are "just not right," but at least someone at S&W is thinking that us old timers might still be interested.

I am willing to remove the lock, if necessary, and I am willing to give them a break about the tiny percentage of canted barrels (most don't show pictures and when they do, I can not ever really make out that it is clearly canted), and so I will give S&W the benefit of the doubt.

I will remind everyone that the most coveted revolvers in the 60s and 70s for defense work were the ONI Model 19s with 4 inch barrels and round butts that were given over to the FBI. The only way that gun could have been better was if it had been in stainless steel. This, quite frankly, for this cranky old *** is the best news I have heard all day. A newly available 4 inch round butt Model 66 Combat Magnum.

Good show and congrats to S&W for getting it right, if not yet in the execution, at least in the idea/thought to bring back this desirable revolver. Those grips, however, will have to go.

As to the pigs flying thing, I think S&W has considered that the majority will be shot mostly with 38 Special or the newer, kinder gentler .357 factory loads, and I think the two-piece barrel takes away some of the issues with the 6 o'clock position on the barrel shank which was a problem "back in the day" with the one-piece barrel. The two-piece barrel will also eliminate any canted barrel issues. The pictures look like a two-piece barrel, but this is speculation.

It looks like that the sideplate screws and the thumb piece are to be in contrasting blue. It gives it a nice look without being too gaudy. Good show!

Brilliant!



PS - did anyone notice the Model 69, the new L frame 5 shot 44 Magnum, 4 inch stainless, round butt?

EDIT: After reading Lee's post 117 in this thread, I went back and looked. The video, at about 0:29, does show the lengthwise flat on the top of the barrel and on the sloped forward part of the frame between the front of the rear sight assembly and the frame-end of the barrel. It does not appear to be serrated when I do a "pause" at that point in the video, but it does appear that something has been done to make it non-reflective. Whether that is an optical illusion, bad video or what, I cannot say. For what it is worth, I cannot discern the lengthwise serrations in the rear sight leaf either, but that may also be just poor stop video quality. Lee also pointed out that the new 2014 4.25 inch Model 66 may have a one-piece barrel. I don't know what will end up in final production, but here are comparison pictures of a Model 67 two-piece barrel with a similar picture of the 2014 Model 66. Please note also the lack of the cross pin and its corresponding hole for the front locking bolt, indicating that those parts are missing on at least the 2014 Model 66 appearing in the video. That would seem to point to a ball detent lock-up, assuming the revolver in the video accurately depicts the final product.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg S&W Mod 67 barrel - 2 pc.jpg (36.8 KB, 47 views)
File Type: jpg S&W Mod 66 barrel - 2014.jpg (56.8 KB, 48 views)

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Old 01-03-2014, 05:09 PM
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I think it's wrong to assign the model number of 66 to a gun that differs in so many ways from the original. I would like it better if they gave it its own number - 68 or maybe 666?

THESE will always be Model 66s in the eyes of anyone old enough to remember them.



And not just for the forged parts, no lock and reshaped frame reasons. Target triggers, target hammers, trigger stops, square butts on the longer ones and attractive stocks on all of them are features no longer offered that anyone with an admiration for firearm beauty can appreciate.

Ed
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Old 01-03-2014, 05:18 PM
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I think it's wrong to assign the model number of 66 to a gun that differs in so many ways from the original. I would like it better if they gave it its own number - 68 or maybe 666?
Model 68 already used. Model 666, really?
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Old 01-03-2014, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by steamloco76 View Post
Folks, if you truly don't like new guns-don't buy them!

bingo!

And guess what? Keep boycotting, and they'll just not make any.

I don't keep up with latest & greatest, but I haven't seen any new "classics " in a while. On the other hand, S&W seems to keep pumping out guns for USPSA, ICORE and IDPA.

IMO, the difference is competitive shooters don't turn up their noses because the guns aren't forged/P&R and actually BUY them knowing they perform as well or better.

Personally, I hate recessed chambers and functionally, I see no difference between forged and MIM parts.
Yes, the MIM parts are butt-ugly. So is my colon, but so long as it's out of sight and functions properly, I don't care (the MIM parts are far more reliable than the other thing)
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  #34  
Old 01-03-2014, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by shocker View Post
Looked at the SW website. 66 was there yesterday, not today. Hmmm.

Didn't realize that gun weighs 36 oz. Makes me think about my 25 oz. Glock 29, more firepower in a small package that is still accurate and reasonably comfortable to shoot. Technology advances, like it or not.
Why would a revolver make you think about a Glock? One isn't meant to be the other...don't overlap in any way except "BANG"!
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Old 01-03-2014, 06:28 PM
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Not sure, but I think the weight is too little for it to be an L frame, even with a half underlug. My guess is that some guy with ME behind his name figured out how to put 125 grain HPs through a K frame without cracking it. If so I hope he gets a nice bonus for his trouble.

Do have to wonder if this barrel would fit an old school 19 or 66 in need of a transplant. Bet there are a few of those in sock drawers across the country.
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Old 01-03-2014, 06:48 PM
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Based on the current 686's and 629's I see in my dealers case, I hope S&W at least gets the barrel crown on these correctly machined and cleanly cut without burrs. I doubt I'm interested.
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Old 01-03-2014, 06:50 PM
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OK, I hate to sound ignorant, but why would anyone want a new Mdl 66? Isn't the 686 also a medium frame and designed to be stronger?

Or, as Wildenout says, is it a 6-shot 686 with a shorter underlug? Can someone explain?
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Old 01-03-2014, 07:07 PM
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Originally Posted by WaMike View Post
OK, I hate to sound ignorant, but why would anyone want a new Mdl 66? Isn't the 686 also a medium frame and designed to be stronger?

Or, as Wildenout says, is it a 6-shot 686 with a shorter underlug? Can someone explain?
686 L frame (larger than 66 K frame.)
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Old 01-03-2014, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by WaMike View Post
OK, I hate to sound ignorant, but why would anyone want a new Mdl 66? Isn't the 686 also a medium frame and designed to be stronger?

Or, as Wildenout says, is it a 6-shot 686 with a shorter underlug? Can someone explain?
Let's use this analogy: The K Frame is the 1500 series truck, capable of hauling 3/4's of a ton, but not all day every day. Suits many as we don't use the heavy loads often. The L frame is the 2500 series. Built to handle that 3/4 ton all day every day, and just a bit heavier. The 3500 series would be the N and X frame guns-big, heavy and can handle any sane load.
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Old 01-03-2014, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WaMike View Post
OK, I hate to sound ignorant, but why would anyone want a new Mdl 66? Isn't the 686 also a medium frame and designed to be stronger?

Or, as Wildenout says, is it a 6-shot 686 with a shorter underlug? Can someone explain?
They are two different frames. The 686 is actually a larger frame (L frame). The 66 is a K frame. It's lighter, has a more level point of aim, and with proper care can handle any steady diet of magnum rounds (though probably 90% of people who own either will practice with .38 Spl. Some will even carry with .38+P). The problems in the past with forcing cone issues I'm sure would be fixed by now with these new model 66's. As mentioned, they've got J frame's in .357 mag these days and those guns have very thin forcing cones.

Since S&W has dropped from production most of their best known K frames (10, 15, 19, 66, 67), there are a lot of shooters today who don't know the joy of how one handles. The original K frame 357's from pre 1980s had a lot of details that never made it to the L frame (686) like pinned barrels, recessed cylinders, ribbed triggers, ribbed backstraps, half lug barrels, checkered magna grips, butter actions ... all reasons why a lot of shooters prefer finding them and paying less for what a new Smith without these features cost.

I like the 686, own one myself. But I think it represents a different era in S&W revolvers when cost cutting measures started to take place. By today's standards the L frame is considered one of the best. But compared to an old 19/66 and the K frame is in a league of it's own.
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:05 PM
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My first center-fire revolver was a Model 66-1 with six-inch barrel, target trigger, hammer and grips. I ordered from a LGS 04/07/79 and received it 10/22/80. In those days law enforcement was purchasing 4 inch Model 66’s in volume. Delivery time for the new release will probably be similar.

Shot all bullet weights in 357 and one day it lost the timing. I sent it back to the factory for repair. It got a new non-recessed cylinder as one of the chambers was swelled. I believe some change/replacement of the forcing cone due to the cylinder dimensions. It cost one-half or better of the purchase price for the repair. It’s a nice gun and I guess I just enjoyed it too much.

Got a 686 and considered that a solution to the short comings of the Model 66. Got a second 686 and put a scope on it. I retired the Model 66 and haven’t shot it in 20 years.

When I think about another Model 66 it reminds me of the movie “The Outlaw Josey Wales”. Chief Dan George comments . . . “All I have is a piece of hard rock candy. But it's not for eating. It's just for looking through.”
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:45 PM
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Smith and Wesson is in it to make money. They think the new 66 will sell. It is in 4.25 inch barrel so it can be exported to more country's. I'm sure it will do good. Not grate but good. When they are out for a while and I can find a good used one at a good price I'll get one.

Last edited by jrs70; 01-03-2014 at 09:55 PM.
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  #43  
Old 01-03-2014, 09:48 PM
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There are just so many things "wrong" with it; but I want one!
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:48 PM
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Thanks for the answers. I own a 586 and holsters, grips and lots of innards interchange with my Mdl 10 and 15 (and 18!), but other than the extended underlug, I've been unable to see the difference. Guess I need to drag out the calipers and check.

Thanks to Steamloco for the pickup comparison. I presume S&W are the Chevys of RevolverLand!?

No....this isn't a hi-jack!
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:51 PM
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I had a sort-of similar experience to WI357SIG's with my first Smith & Wesson, a Model 19 I bought new in the mid-1970s with "all the options" - target hammer, trigger and stocks plus colored sights. I ran a lot of ammo through that gun, most of it 148-grain wadcutter target loads but a fair amount of too-hot (I guess) magnum fodder. Fired case extraction became harder and harder to the point where even one that had contained 3.2 grains of Bullseye required a punch and mallet to remove.

I sent it to S&W and received it back a few weeks later with a new cylinder. The accompanying letter stated that the original cylinder's chambers were out of round. A few years later, the same thing started happening and I returned it again. This time the accompanying letter advised me that this was the last cylinder replacement that would be performed under warranty. I foolishly replaced the gun with a Python.

The old K-frames could be delicate in some ways and I now treat those three K-frames in the photo a few posts back with respect and feed them only target loads.

Ed
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Old 01-03-2014, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 357-RevolverGuy View Post
It's lighter, has a more level point of aim, and with proper care can handle any steady diet of magnum rounds (though probably 90% of people who own either will practice with .38 Spl. Some will even carry with .38+P). The problems in the past with forcing cone issues I'm sure would be fixed by now with these new model 66's. As mentioned, they've got J frame's in .357 mag these days and those guns have very thin forcing cones.
.
Yup. With LE switching to autos, very few .357s ever get shot with enough mags to be an issue. Plus the problem was with shorter bullets, 125 & lighter. Think of it as a +P .38 special with the option to shoot magnums.

As for who, I might well buy one. I've bought 2 M-66s in the past year, one with the dreaded lock/MIM (gasp!) What may motivate me is the 2-piece barrel, which is proven to give better accuracy. I just wish they'd do packs like Dan Wesson, and allow us to set the BC gap. That would be awesome, an M-66 with 2 3/4, 4, & 6" barrels (though I'd like a 5" and 3")

It looks pretty much like the 66-7 that was discontinued in 2005.

I like the looks of the 689. I'm still think they could build a 6-shot 40 S&W/10mm convertible on the L-frame.
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shawn mccarver View Post
Model 68 already used. Model 666, really?
And it appears that Model 69 is now taken: Model 69 L-Frame .44 Magnum

Now that's an interesting development....
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  #48  
Old 01-03-2014, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by 18DAI View Post
That new revolver being called a model 66, with the two piece barrel....
Woo! Where does it mention a two piece barrel? I must have been napping.
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  #49  
Old 01-03-2014, 11:25 PM
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Pictured before I added a red dot sight is my 2005 era, bought new old stock in 2010 model 67-6. Dreaded internal lock, MIM, and two piece barrel. Guess what? It is one of the smooooothest K frame actions I've ever felt and is my most accurate 4 inch revolver. Looks a lot like the new 66.
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Old 01-03-2014, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkitch View Post
No thanks. I will find a vintage Model 19 with case hardened hammer and trigger and a firing pin on the hammer where it belongs...
Why would you prefer the firing pin to be mounted on the hammer instead of the frame?
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