I've read alot on here about J-frame actions smoothing out with dry-firing. I have a 442 (w/lock) that has a great trigger, but I bought it used, and have no idea how many rds went through it before I bought it.

My lady friend bought a new 642, and while the trigger is smooth, its heavier than mine, and she has a little trouble pulling all the way through at times.

My question is- I'd like to smooth out her trigger without modifying the gun. Can I do this by dry-firing with snap caps, and can it be overdone? Is there a "magic number" of pulls that is ideal? And a number that will start to wear on the parts?

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Because of the metric system?

I'm going to make an educated guess that you will likely wear out your trigger finger before you wear out the 642.

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Back to back World War Champs.

I dry fired my 642 a whole lot when I first bought it six years ago. Really smoothed out the trigger. Last year the trigger mechanism broke. I sent it back to S&W. Took about eight months to get a new one sent to me. Was it the dry firing? Was it just bad luck? I don't know. At least they made good on it.

I have a model 49 that I have carried for over 30 years....I have dry fired that little gun thousands and thousand of times over the decades.....I also have several K frames that I have dry fired for 40 years.....tens of thousands of cycles ( an M-65 and a PPC model 10).....still quite functional. I was a Smith & Wesson armorer for over 30 years and the dry firing question was often asked during the course and recertifications.....factory says dry fire all you want with CF revolvers....some people swear by snap caps....I have never used them. You are not going to hurt your J frame dry firing it.....and there is not a "sweet spot" as far as number of dry firing and action smoothness goes.....the more the better IMO. As a veteran hand gun instructor of over 4 decades....hand strength has always been an issue with DA revolver shooting ( and pistols ) for some shooters, especially with J frames.

I don't think changing out to a lighter spring is that big of a deal, especially if you're going to keep the gun. Why not change it out. I changed mine out the minute I got my 642, and all my other j frames as well. There is nothing like instant results and gratification, which you'll get if you get a good certified gunsmith to change it out for you.

You'll wear out long before you wear out your revolver from dry firing.

Dry fire as much as you like.

Understand that dry firing is for skill development, it is not a method of tuning the trigger.

If you want a better trigger , find a good gunsmith and let him decide what to do to improve the trigger.

Then let him do it.

Trigger work is not DIYS stuff on a sd handgun.

Just my opinion, of course.

I'm a firm believer in dry fire and I usually use fired brass with the expended primer in place. However, the only firing pin I ever broke in any gun for more than 50 years was a mod. 60.At that moment I had no expended shell at hand and fired on an empty chamber.
A local gunsmith fitted a carbon steel K frame firing pin and slotted the top of the hammer and pin.[ I had previously bobbed the hammer.] I still have the gun and the firing pin with never another problem. Nick

The j triggers lighten up with use & after a while at least to me I have gotten acquainted with their pull weights & they actually feel light now. It may be just fine to have a professional lighten your pull but I don't feel the need to have it done.

To maximize the benefits of dry firing, put a Crimson Trace laser grip on the gun and practice blasting the spine of an individual book on a shelf across the room (or some other specific but small target - top of a candle, corner of a picture, a specific mullion on a window, etc.) After recovering from the (probable) initial shock of how wobbly the gun seems through the trigger cycle, it's time to focus on tightening up the grip to keep the point of aim on the desired target. And after a while, you can even switch to "engaging" multiple books in sequence.

This will give a purpose to the dry firing (improving the ablity to hold steady on the target), and the trigger will still get exercised with every "shot."

When I first got my 642 I dry fired it probably 2,000 times in the first few days. It took that and two trips to the range for it to really smoothen up.

I'd say when your tendons start feeling sore and carpal tunnel kicks in, then it's too much.

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Ephesians 6 (Armor of God)

It won't hurt it.

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"He was kinda funny lookin'"

I always use snap caps. They cost about $15. Probably unnecessary, but peace of mind. I just get paranoid that I think it's a snap cap and it turns out to be a hornday. Yikes. Boom.

No worries. Fire away . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

Two alternative suggestions - have her look at a 642 Lady Smith (which will have a slightly lighter pull from the factory), or have 'her' do the few thousand action cycles. I would bet she will have no problems with the pull after that, either from the action or her hand strength improving .

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

When I do my dry fire practice, I use a shooting hold and "aim" at stuff around the room. My 442 has a Laserlyte side mounted laser, I'll put the red dot on something and try to keep it there through the trigger stroke.
Don't just sit there pulling the trigger over and over, use that time to practice trigger control.
After the onset of my neuropathy, I had to do something to lighten the trigger pull. I installed an 11 pound Wolff rebound spring and an 8 pound Wolff main spring. I can still shoot my snubby and I haven't had any misfires or light primer strikes.

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Keep on Chooglin'

I put over 2,000 dry fires on a J-frame for a friend who wondered why my gun was so much easier to shoot than hers. No damage of any kind.
Anything mechanical can wear out, but this won't, not in our lifetimes.

Pulling the trigger is good. Pulling it with a laser sight is better.

Thank you for all of the replies. I've cycled it a good bit, and am going to have her take over with the daily practice. It is the CT model, so there's the added benefit of visual stimulation.

Her Glock has made her "trigger-lazy."

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Because of the metric system?

On new guns l like to dry fire at least 1,000 times. In my experience it does help to smooth and lighten the trigger pull. I did this on a Ruger Single-Six recently (a single action, of course) and the results were day-and-night. It went from heavy and creepy, to light and smooth. On the Single-Six it's easy to remove the cylinder, which I did, so as to not put any wear-and-tear on the cylinder, stop stud, or hand.

I have found the benefit with S&W revolvers is not as spectacular, since it's a smother action to begin with. But it does help. I used this technique recently on two NIB J-frames (a M638 and a M63) and I can feel an improvement.

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~ S&W aficionado in training ~

Guess I'm just strange, but I don't ever dry fire anything. If the trigger is too hard to pull, I would either get another gun or modify the one I have. I don't want to be responsible for causing my Grand father to roll over in his grave. Or my Dad. I wonder, if in a critical defense situation, if I would ever notice the stiff trigger pull on my 37? I doubt it.
peace,
gordon

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better have that checked

Try putting some moly paste on the trigger sear. Use the paste or anti Swede moly it has more moly in it. A higher (%) percentage of moly in it.
The gray engine assembly pre-lube or camshaft assembly lube has moly in it.

Moly will smooth out the roughness in the action.

Moly will lessen the trigger pull by up to 50% right away and more as it works into the pores of the metal.

I lube everything were there is metal to metal contact. I lube the star on the cylinder, the indexing lever, cylinder stud. Assemble the revolver install the snap caps and dry fire it 50 to 100 times.

While no two brand new guns can be the same action wise my new m58 and m57 had different feeling actions. One was a tad rougher over the other. I lubed the rougher one with moly and both actions are equal now.
Moly makes every gun feel the same action wise and the sear let off feels the same too. This really matters when switching between guns. Even though the calibers can vary they handle and shoot the same action wise.
I don't having to readjust to a totally different feeling action.

You need to try the moly paste or anti-seeze

Molly will oxidize over time and disappear so it has to be renewed.

No dry fire, and no grease on any of my guns, thank you. Lube per manufacturer's instructions.

Sure, go ahead and dry fire all you want! You will know how many times was too much when something breaks! The parts most susceptible to damage from dry firing are hammer noses and rivets, frame mounted firing pins and their springs, hammer studs and trigger studs. Yes, there is plenty of anecdotal evidence that it does no harm, simply because the poster has never had an issue themself, good for them! Call S&W and they will tell you go ahead and dry fire, they sell parts and repairs!!! Simply read the revolver posts in the various sub-forums and you will find numerous posts about broken parts. For some reason most seem to think that normal firing is what causes breakage necause that is when it is noticed. But how many dry-fire cycles has the gun been through before the breakage occurs?

Think about this. As reported in some posts S&W has taken the position, at least sometimes, that parts breakage is not a warrantee issue but normal wear and tear. Older guns will not be repaired by S&W if parts are not available. Finally, based on posts from this forum parts breakage of Aluminum framed models seem to be more frequent than for steel framed guns, but breakage occurs with both steel and airweight models.

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Gunsmithing since 1961

Before I load a new gun I dry fire 2000 times cleanig and lube every 500 times. After that it goes to the Range. At home I will do dry fire practice. Empty gun check twice. Start from holster draw shoot at safe target/backstop. If the gun can’t take it, I don’t want it. I’ve done this for the last 40 years with every Revolver I owned. Of corse the Carry Revolvers get dry fired the most.

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Two Handguns every day

Well as expected, opinions are all over the place, here’s mine:

I dry fire a new gun sparingly using snap caps. I probably pull the trigger 50 or so times max. I do this to get the feel of the trigger prior to actual firing. After that, I shoot the gun with real ammo and that’s it, no more dry firing. I look at dry firing like sitting in your driveway revving up your engine to 5k rpm for hours on end.

The opinions are always all over the place on the do's and don'ts of dry firing. Why not just buy some snap caps for a few bucks, and use them for their intended purpose and not worry if what you ( indefinite ) are doing is OK?

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Pete
I ain't no fortunate son

Well, I'll qualify it by saying most of my guns are about 100 years old or more, but even with my newer guns, I don't dry fire. I'll cycle the action with my thumb on the hammer so it doesn't snap down.

Range ammo is generally cheap enough that I'll just it shoot a lot.

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SWCA #3356, SWHF#611

I dry fire all of my centerfire guns.

I do have to admit, my last range session I had a round fail to ignite. I don't THINK it was from dry firing and the round could be the blame. I will have to keep an eye on it. Obvously if it keeps happening then I have an issue. This was the first time.

But that's one of the upsides to a revolver. Just keep pulling the trigger if that happens.

Only other thing I did was put a little CLP down the little hole of the trigger on the backside where it meets the frame. I think that helped smooth it some too. I don't think CLP in there will hurt things or gum up too much. But I could be wrong.....

Here is the definitive answer: When something breaks, that was too much!

As others have indicated, you ain't gonna break it.

I never dry fire any of my guns. I'm always amused when I see where
someone says that no wear is put on the gun by cycling the action if no
round is fired. When I read the posts about dry firing a revolver thousands
of times I get a mental image of some guy on his couch snapping his gun
at the bad guys on TV and yelling BANG! Boys with toys

If you don't want your gun to break, just softly place it in the sock drawer and never take it out. Problem solved!

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Centennial Every Day

Dry firing reminds me of another human activity. What's that called again ???

You should see how many times they get dry fired during the assembly process . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

How about you swap her the 442 with the already nice trigger, at least until you clean-up the 642.....

The J-frame revolvers feature a coil main spring. In my experience many of these are quite heavy and you can benefit greatly by changing over to a Wolff spring kit. Takes about 10 minutes to change out the rebound spring and main spring. Anyone with a good working knowledge of the S&W revolvers can do it without any damage to the revolver. A gun smith probably has a minimum shop charge, but it shouldn't be prohibitive for such a simple chore.

Only thing I would add to the discussion is a warning against dry firing any rimfire firearm (there are plenty of J-frame .22's out there). Repeatedly driving the firing pin into the chamber rim will eventually damage one or the other, or both.

Thanks a lot. I just put 5 holes in my kitchen floor.

I wouldn't think it would be the 10,000 or more times I've seen
some posters on here claim. I saw one post about having to
replace snap caps after 25,000 impacts. Some posters brag about
thousands of dry fires and seem to think this makes them the
authority on SD shooting. I really doubt there is much
correlation between snapping a revolver at the TV, lamps etc in
a home and defending yourself at arms length against a deadly
assault in a mall parking lot at night.

When asked by students for my suggestion for a concealed carry gun
I always suggested S&W 642. I would also suggest at least 1,000
practice draws along with dry fire. Of course not all at once, and also
of course after being absolutely, positively, 100% certain the gun was
not loaded. My old 642-1 has been dry fired thousands of times, and
it is very smooth.

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In Omnia Paratus

Squirt some gunslick in the action and shoot/dry fire it..........It will improve!

I dry fired my 642 over 3,000 times. It significantly improved the trigger pull.

I dry fired with both left and right hands. Dry firing not only improves the trigger, it improves your trigger finger.

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I've still got it made.

One way to save on the snap caps for the reloaders is run the case through the resizing die and fill the primer area with a small piece of pencil eraser. It works good.

This is too much

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I don't dry fire, maybe because it seems like a dull exercise, but I'll not criticize someone that has found dry firing to be beneficial. How does one measure the advantage of a much dry fired gun over one that has not been dry fired? I assume some here may be speaking of a benefit other than a smooth trigger or maybe reduced trigger pull weight, but I really don't know.

I seldom modify any gun, other than maybe adding a scope to a rifle. If a gun doesn't shoot well straight out of the box, I generally don't keep it long. I've had very good luck with Colts and Smith & Wessons (mostly revolvers), but I enjoy J-frames because they are quite challenging. I shoot often, almost exclusively with my own cast bullet loads, and usually single-action Bullseye style at 25 yards, but I'm certainly not an excellent shooter. Many of my S&Ws were purchased new more than thirty years ago. I think they're all pretty smooth from honest use, but I don't recall any of them having unacceptable triggers when I bought them. I'm not gadget-oriented so don't use things like laser sights.

Just a different perspective on the subject, certainly not something worthy of argument...

We have entered a time when dry firing sounds like something fun to do.

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I've still got it made.

I think the latter is a big part in making the trigger feel better.

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“Look life in its iron face”

Dry firing significantly improved my shooting, although in a way I don't think has been mentioned in this thread.

I have a Ruger Redhawk .44 mag from 2000. This gun is...not good. I mean it's not bad, but I find Rugers can have good triggers from the factory. This is not one of them. It's heavy as heck (both the trigger, and the gun) and just unpleasant to shoot in double action.

So I started dry firing it. If I sat down for a movie I would just dry fire it, holding it out straight, until I couldn't feel my arm. Then I would switch to the other hand. I did this any time I watched television for any reason, until I just couldn't physically pull the trigger any more.

After doing that for a couple months my shooting improved dramatically, especially with my J-Frame (I carry a model 60 with a bobbed hammer).

I've dry fired that old Ruger thousands upon thousands of times at this point, and that trigger is still not as good as my other Redhawk. I don't think I will ever make it good just through dry firing.

Anyway. I think that Dry Firing as exercise, especially with a heavy revolver, that has a heavy trigger, is a rather good way to make time in front of a screen a hell of a lot more productive.

Broke this firing pin dry firing my 60-7. No big deal, I replaced it but currently use a bobbed hammer on this revolver.

Things can break. Doesn't mean that dry firing is a bad idea.

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Purchased my no-lock 340PD about 4 yrs ago and it had the heaviest trigger I’ve ever experienced in a J frame. After several hundred rounds, and even more dry firing, it’s a lot smoother but still over 12 lbs on my scale.

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Old Cop
LEO (Ret.)

Usually smooth everything inside, change to lighter Wolf springs and lubricate. Then range shooting and dry fire.

I fired a j frame air weight from 1999 probably 1500 to 2000 rounds 38 special then dry fired 6000 to 8000 times my j frame broke too. s&w fixed it.