Just curious. How much better are Performance Center Smiths over regular production Smiths? Especially now that MIM is used. Are they caressed at all by PC gunsmiths or are they assembled on the production line? Thanks Guys.

The Performance Center is not a production gun with a different logo stamped on it.

The PC is it's own facility for manufacturing and assembly. The firearms are milled on the PC's own mills, With different code and often different specs and dimensions than their production brothers. The tolerances are kept tighter, tooling is replace more frequently and things are watched more closely.

Additionally PC firearms are often in configurations and may have features not available on production guns. Many PC firearms are Distributor Exclusives with very small production numbers.

These and other reasons increase production costs and therefore MSRP

Some people have a misconception that PC means hand assembled by 60 year old men wearing a magnifying glasses and holding a file, this is not true.

On the whole are PC firearms better than production firearms? Yes

Is there an occasional lemon? Of course. No matter what the price, no company can make mechanical products that are 100% perfect 100% of the time.

Are they enough better to warrant the few extra hundred dollars the cost? That is a personal decision. In my mind there is no doubt about it.

I have been buying a couple each year since day 1. I have not yet found a reason to sell one.

Your "calzarettas" 'can't be found.'

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103

Yeah, the MIM parts take getting over. And yes, they are production line guns, at least in my case (627PC .357 w/2.62").

Notice the "pencil" line on the barrel on the first image:
http://www.horizontalheavens.com/S&W...904_131507.jpg

And the mold edges on the trigger on the 2nd image:
http://www.horizontalheavens.com/S&W...904_131346.jpg

And finally on the Hammer in the 3rd image:
http://www.horizontalheavens.com/S&W...904_131440.jpg

All that being said, I was not impressed with the trigger draw... Very mechanical, you could hear the ring as the cylinder lock strikes the cylinder (at 1/3 draw) and another ring as the cylinder lock drops into the slot (at 2/3 draw).

The last third of the draw is now smoother after I did a deep lube after knocking the side plate off and removing the hammer block, main spring and stirrup. I used Jet Lube 50, a high temp moly lube. I applied the lube with a toothpick to all the contact points that I could get to without further dis-assembly. I worked the mechanism many times, to help spread the moly lube on the working contact areas.

IMO, the moly makes for a much smoother trigger pull, though I suspect that the pull is on the higher end of the scale. I do not have a means to measure the pull at this time, but can say most assuredly that my 30yr old S&W686 has a MUCH nicer/lighter/smoother trigger pull. And I admit that back in 1986-87 I did have a LGS do a trigger job on it.

All that being said, the entire innards was dry as a bone. It appeared as if the assembled gun had gone though a chemical bath/cleansing. The inside casting still had that foggy look to it, such as you get from some chemical baths.

The bottom line is that after a deep lube with the moly, it is a much better performing gun. The short 2.62" barrel, as expected, is much less accurate than my 4" 686.

I love my PC gun now. BUT, I surely did not expect to have to do my own trigger job/lube since it was coming from the Performance Center.

I only have one PC handgun, a .460 XVR but it is astounding. It has the best trigger pull of any S&W I've ever handled and I've owned and handled a lot. It is also the most accurate. Must be a fluke.

__________________
NRA Life Endowment

There was nothing that should not have been caught in the Performance Center and corrected at that time. Not sure what you mean by "a fluke"...

To me a "fluke" would be to miss a defect, or along those lines.

NOT working the trigger, NOT lubricating the gun... Failure to do one's job I do NOT consider to be a "fluke," especially in the "Performance Center" where their own advertisements brag on the "extra" care they are supposed be taking on each and every gun.

Don't get me wrong, I like my 627PC. But truth be told, my 686 no-dash is by far the better gun of the two.

The revolver pictured is manufactured in the Performance Center and not on the Production Floor.

I understand being unhappy about a out of the box trigger. Did you let the PC work on it to resolve your dissatisfaction?

My 2" 327 had a problem. Sent it in and they took care of it.

As I stated above in the second half of my post #4, I did the lube job on a dry mechanism, myself.

Not a difficult thing to do, but it should have already been done before leaving the S&W Performance Center's own production floor/bench/facility.

I really like my 4 PC autos........ mine are all from the early days 94-97 .....when I think the "old gunsmiths" were the driving force behind the PC.

Regarding HorizontalMike's photo of the barrel rib. Is it just me, or should they make the sight base almost the same width of the rib for a sleeker appearance?

Funny, that's exactly how I imagine them functioning when every single Performance Center revolver currently offered is advertised as having a "Performance Center tuned action". The promise of hands-on action work is first-and-formeost what I find compelling in a PC item.

Also, can't we discuss the subject without calling viewpoints we disagree with "whining"?

The TK Custom defensive action tune you purchased to achieve this effect cost $150; doesn't seem to be cost prohibitive as part of a PC offering.

I see what you are saying. I agree, it would have been nice if at least the dovetailed front sight had it's dovetails "even" with the raised sight channel on top of the barrel.

As is it looks clunky, effective, but like an add-on afterthought and not integral with the barrel/gun.

Robert B

This sort of depends on your point of view. The last
3 Performance Center Smith's I have bought were not
much better feeling than their standard production
brothers. (this is as AS RECIEVED)

What I have found with the last few performance center
revolvers that I have bought is: first & foremast you
can get a slightly different gun model from the performance
center . So if the PC center offers something you want
then that is about your only easy choice.

Secondly, even though the last few performance center
revolvers that I have didn't come to me with what I would
consider a performance center action feel they were much
easier for me to get a good slick feeling trigger pull on
than standard run of the mill similar revolvers.

So bottom line here is: If you expect a (current) performance
center revolver to have a smooth as silk slick trigger feel with
no itches or glitches then you will be probably be disappointed.
On the other hand is you don't mind doing a little
hammer/trigger shimming, action work, spring tweaking
then the basic geometry & decent parts are in there so with
a little work you can have an excellent trigger & good slick action.

Even so look them over real carefully as my last performance center revolver came with a LOT of excess flashing on the barrel crown, a slightly crooked barrel shroud, & a crooked front sight (I turned it down at the shop that ordered it for me but someone else bought it the next day)

Love mine.

I have a few S&W PC guns and I just added a 642II to the stable. I looked at the standard models 642 and 442 before I decided to buy what I did . With the standard guns the trigger pull was so heavy I would have passed on those models altogether. It is going into rotation for a carry gun not just part of the collection so for me the Performance center work is the only reason that I have a current production 642. Besides in my opinion its a good looking little boomstick
DSCF9421.jpg

Ahh PC Smiths, one of these days when it's slightly overcast I need to pack them all up and bring them up to Jim's for pictures, in the meantime I'll leave you with one's I've done with my sub-par photography...

Attached Images

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	IMG_194332.jpg (127.3 KB, 1257 views)

And THAT "Performance Center work" was what I was expecting on my 627 as well. Still had to DIY.

RE your "standard production" 642 comments about trigger pull. Check out my then less than a week old 642 that I had to do a trigger job on. I had this thing locking up on me. Had to do a stone-n-lube on this as well It turned out very well in the end. While I ordered and received a spring kit for this one, I haven't found I need it at this point:

Well said:

I have bought:

Two PC 627 UDR's 2.635" Barrel
PC 627 5" Barrel
PC Talo 586 L-Comp 3"
PC 629 Hunter 7.5"
PC 1911 .45 Melonite Full Size
Standard Production 617
Standard Production 1911 Commander Gun Site Edition

The Performance Center weapons have never had to be returned for warranty work, and they have run great out of the box. They generally and faithfully reflect additional or superior action work to standard production units.

I have sent a 627 UDR and 586 L-Comp on to TK Custom for additional action work (I am qualified with the 586 with my agency). But, that does not diminish the weapon as delivered by S&W, it just recognizes you can take the gun even further if you need or want to.

These threads always remind me that when something is from the Perf Ctr., some people seem to think they are hand fitted and fussed over like for example a Wilson Combat 1911 which run $2,700 - $5,000.

For the money, S&W PC revolvers are well worth it. If you want to take them further in the hands of a master revolver smith, go for it.

Maybe I am just lucky but so far I have been very happy with all of my PC purchases. I'm sorry that yours was less than you expected, but did you try contacting the Performance center about your concerns and if so did they offer to rectify the issues? After all we payed extra for the PC work so I would personally expect them to make it right. Even if your 642 was a standard production gun I still would have contacted S&W and sent them pics of your findings.

I Myself Think Pre Lock Performance Center Guns were the Best Made Revolvers on the Planet. Period.

I think the newer lock era PC guns don't compare. IMHO.

A few of mine.

We tend to like what we have.

Agreed, and raises an important -- though perhaps confounding -- distinction: current Performance Center versus the Performance Center of 25 years ago, when it began.

I take OP's question to be about current offerings. The PCs I've handled from its early days feel like custom tuned S&Ws; the current crop, quite nice, nonetheless to my hand and eye are more Production Plus.