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S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present All NON-PINNED Barrels, the L-Frames, and the New Era Revolvers


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  #1  
Old 08-24-2016, 11:26 PM
Jim Oliver Jim Oliver is offline
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Default Replace firing pin on MIM Smiths?

The firing pin on my new 629 Classic appears to be a bit more pointed and have a bit less protrusion than the pins on my older Smiths.

Do any of you have experience with replacing the firing pin on the MIM Smiths?

Thanks,
Jim
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Old 08-25-2016, 12:02 AM
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I'm pretty sure the engineers at S&W have some experience with them.

I'm also pretty sure that the company with a lifeline warranty is confident in them.

What makes you think that the first iteration is the better one and not the second?

Last edited by gr7070; 08-25-2016 at 12:03 AM.
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Old 08-25-2016, 12:38 AM
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If it pops the primer every time, why worry about it?
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Old 08-25-2016, 12:47 AM
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Hate to say so but you bought it knowing what you were getting.

You could have purchased a real classic: one of the originals.

I have no sympathy.
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Old 08-25-2016, 06:41 AM
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Welcome to the forum.
I have not replaced a firing pin on any of my in frame guns because they all work fine. They don't seam to break any more often than the hammer mounted ones. If its working I would leave it alone, if not, somebody in the gunsmiths section may know how to proceed.

Some people can't stand the newer guns. There are some things about the older guns to appreciated, but, that is not what is new on the shelf today. In most respects the recent guns are fine and if I really really didn't want anything at all to do with them. I wouldn't be reading in this section of the forum.

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Old 08-25-2016, 06:48 AM
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Cylinder & Slide use to make replacement firing pins for the post 2001 production revolvers. Dont know if they still do. Good luck!
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Old 08-25-2016, 07:21 AM
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Apex makes an aftermarket floating firing pins for later model S&Ws w/ different weight springs depending on the application. Also believe there's a couple other companies that make aftermarket firing pins that are a tad longer than factory to help ignition. It's pretty simple replacing the firing pin if needed and there's a you tube video if you google the subject.
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Old 08-25-2016, 08:34 AM
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If it works and not broken why replace.

Did you buy it to stare at the Firing pin or shoot it?

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Old 08-25-2016, 09:43 AM
Jim Oliver Jim Oliver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ultratec00 View Post
Apex makes an aftermarket floating firing pins for later model S&Ws w/ different weight springs depending on the application. Also believe there's a couple other companies that make aftermarket firing pins that are a tad longer than factory to help ignition. It's pretty simple replacing the firing pin if needed and there's a you tube video if you google the subject.
Thanks for the helpful reply
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Old 08-25-2016, 10:26 AM
robert1804 robert1804 is offline
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Hey, Jim. If you're comfortable with removing the side plate, the firing pin is simple to change out. It's held in by a floating pin that's captured between the side plate and the frame.
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Old 08-25-2016, 10:48 AM
cowboy4evr cowboy4evr is offline
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Let me elaborate a bit , yes it is easy to remove . all you need to remove the firing pin is a pair of tweezers and a toothpick . Remove the side plate , please use a gunsmith screwdriver and put your craftsman driver away . The 3 screws are a bit different so place them in an order on a white cloth so you will remember which screw went where . Remove the grip , lay the revolver on it's side on the palm of your hand and tap the grip frame with the handle of your screwdriver until the side plate pop out .
DO NOT PRY it off as you will bend it and it can't be straightened properly . Use the tweezers to remove the cross pin that holds the firing pin in place (it's at the top of where the side plate fits ) . Use the toothpick to remove the hair spring inside the recess for the firing pin . Now you can clean the firing pin and the recess , or change them out if you so desire . I have a 29-10 that misfired a lot , simply cleaning the firing pin and the recess cured my problem . After a while you get a buildup of crud on the firing pin and in the recess hole . I hope this helped you ,good luck

Last edited by cowboy4evr; 08-25-2016 at 10:53 AM.
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Old 08-25-2016, 04:48 PM
Jim Oliver Jim Oliver is offline
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Thanks to all who replied with positive info.
I did see the vid on Youtube--so easy even a caveman can do it

Firing pin ordered from Cylinder & Slide.

Jim
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Old 08-25-2016, 05:53 PM
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Some think a longer frame mounted firing pin can improve ignition when lighter springs are used in the gun. I bought a J-frame reduced power spring kit once and it came with a new longer firing pin.
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Old 08-25-2016, 05:54 PM
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Smith & Wesson had a problem with under length firing pins a few years ago. I had to replace the one on my new Model 67-6 immediately after I purchased it. This was a common and known problem at the time. I used a Power Custom replacement firing pin to replace the factory version. The Power Custom firing pin was the proper length, as opposed to the factory firing pin which was too short by about three or four thousandths. All Smith & Wesson revolvers use the same firing pin in these models with the frame mounted pin, and Smith & Wesson got a bad batch from wherever they get them (either made themselves or by jobber). Since replacing the original firing pin, I've not had any problems, firing many thousands of rounds through the Model 67. To clarify, I was having light primer strikes when the gun was new, but none since I replaced the firing pins.........

Last edited by L Pete; 08-25-2016 at 05:56 PM.
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Old 08-26-2016, 12:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Oliver View Post
The firing pin on my new 629 Classic appears to be a bit more pointed and have a bit less protrusion than the pins on my older Smiths.
My new 625PC's firing pin was more pointed than the older ones too. I had bought an Apex firing pin several years ago expecting I'd need it for one of my Night Guards (stories of light strikes) but never needed it.

Since the Apex had the more rounded nose I installed it in the 625PC, while I had the side plate off to add a lighter rebound spring, just for the heck of it. The factory was .490" long & the Apex measured .500" long. That rounded nose firing pin really puts a wide crater in the primers (factory mainspring). Needless to say, I've had no issues igniting primers with it.

I ordered a replacement firing pin from Apex to have on hand, just in case. Wouldn't you know it, the new one (.496" long) I received has the pointed nose, like the factory.

Hopefully the C&S firing pin you get will be rounded.

Welcome to the forum.

.
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Old 08-26-2016, 05:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
Hate to say so but you bought it knowing what you were getting.

You could have purchased a real classic: one of the originals.

I have no sympathy.
Hmmm, you have nearly 2,000 posts and one would expect you've had years of experience with Smiths. The OP is on his
fourth post and probably doesn't know a lot of Smith history.
And his question doesn't indicate a lot of knowledge about what makes a Smith go bang.

You sure told him!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 08-26-2016, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
Hate to say so but you bought it knowing what you were getting.

You could have purchased a real classic: one of the originals.

I have no sympathy.
He asked about experience, not conjecture.
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Old 09-29-2016, 03:38 AM
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Default APEX and C&S firing pins

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUEDOT37 View Post
I ordered a replacement firing pin from Apex to have on hand, just in case. Wouldn't you know it, the new one (.496" long) I received has the pointed nose, like the factory.

Hopefully the C&S firing pin you get will be rounded.
Follow-up: I emailed Apex twice trying to find out why the change, or if I got the wrong part. Never got an answer for it.

Since I posted this I've bought a 325 Thunder Ranch, & a 327TRR8, & found they both had light strikes/FTF with their .486" firing pins. Put the new pointed Apex F/P in the 325TR & it worked but with some very light strikes, no FTF. Put the older round nose Apex F/P in it & it worked great consistently with broad deep impacts.

Just received the C&S extra length firing pins (CS0188) I ordered from MidwayUSA (since Apex wasn't helpful) & they are .510" OAL & have the broad rounded nose. I also bought a factory S&W F/P from them, just for grins, & it measures .497" OAL with a broad round nose.

Sure wish S&W would go thru their parts bin & throw out all the .486" F/Ps & stop installing them in new guns.

.



.
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Old 09-29-2016, 04:37 AM
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My gun smith tells me the "updated" firing pins are slightly longer on both sides than are the original stock pins due to inconsistent ignition with some guns some times. Mine so far has given me zero problem so I have no plans to replace it.
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Old 09-29-2016, 06:13 AM
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interesting subject. Even though I have had a S&W model 10 for about 30 years, I have only recently starting to learn more about revolvers. I have been thinking of picking up a less expensive k or L frame and attempt to to smooth and lighten the trigger pull to about 9 lbs. Mostly as a learning experience. I will pay close attention to the firing pin when I do so, and replace if needed. I am concerned if I lighten the pull, I my have problems. Good information here, thanks everyone!
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Old 09-29-2016, 07:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
Hate to say so but you bought it knowing what you were getting.

You could have purchased a real classic: one of the originals.

I have no sympathy.
Why do you feel the need to be an a**hole? He asked a legitimate question and your opinion about what you think about MIM parts was not asked for. If you don't like modern S&W's don't buy them and shut up when others mention them. I own 9 S&W revovlers and 7 are newer MIM parts and I shoot the hell out of them and there is nothing wrong with them. If you have nothing of value to add don't post when someone asks a legitimate question.

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Last edited by S&W1006; 09-29-2016 at 08:02 AM.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:07 AM
S&W1006 S&W1006 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Oliver View Post
The firing pin on my new 629 Classic appears to be a bit more pointed and have a bit less protrusion than the pins on my older Smiths.

Do any of you have experience with replacing the firing pin on the MIM Smiths?

Thanks,
Jim
Welcome to the forum. I see your question was answered please don't let the turds who think they need to bash the newer S&W's scare you away. Most of the people here are very helpful but unfortunately some feel they need to bash others who own the newer Smiths.

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Old 09-29-2016, 12:41 PM
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Smith stopped pinning barrels for a reason, Smith went to mim parts for a reason and Smith uses personnel agencies rather than direct hires for the same reason-its less expensive to conduct business this way this cannot be disputed.
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Old 09-29-2016, 12:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rpg View Post
Hate to say so but you bought it knowing what you were getting.

You could have purchased a real classic: one of the originals.

I have no sympathy.
You sir, are an A**hole. If you did not have an answer to the question asked, why reply at all !
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Old 09-29-2016, 05:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsn View Post
Smith stopped pinning barrels for a reason, Smith went to mim parts for a reason and Smith uses personnel agencies rather than direct hires for the same reason-its less expensive to conduct business this way this cannot be disputed.
Who would dispute it? What does this have to do with firing pins?
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Old 09-29-2016, 06:55 PM
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I AM ACTUALLY EMBARRASSED THAT WE HAVE MEMBERS OF THIS FORUM, THAT WOULD REPLY WITH DISPARAGING REMARKS, TO THE LEGITIMATE REQUEST FOR HELP WITH A PROBLEM, POSTED BY A RELATIVELY NEW SHOOTER......

WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU GUYS ? ? ? THERE WAS A TIME WHEN WE WOULD GREET NEW MEMBERS, AND ENCOURAGE THEM TO ASK ANY QUESTION THEY WANTED---EVEN IF THEY THOUGHT THAT IT WAS "STUPID". WE WOULD TRY OUR BEST TO HELP THEM OUT. MEANWHILE, THE OP'S QUESTION WAS NOT STUPID AT ALL......

NONE OF THE POSTS CRITICAL OF HIM HELPED HIM ONE BIT ! ! ! I PREFER NOT TO GO BACK THROUGH THE THREAD TO CALL OUT THE OFFENSIVE MEMBERS, BUT YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE. THE CLASSY THING TO DO WOULD BE TO APOLOGIZE TO THE OP, FOR YOUR RUDE REMARKS. OF COURSE, IF YOU WERE CLASSY GUYS, YOU WOULD NOT HAVE MADE THOSE REMARKS IN THE FIRST PLACE.....

KUDOS TO OUR STAND UP MEMBERS, THAT RIGHTFULLY IDENTIFIED THOSE OFFENSIVE POSTERS BY VERY UNFLATTERING TERMS. I FEEL THAT YOU SPEAK FOR THE VAST MAJORITY OF US....
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:47 PM
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The subject of best practices for frame mounted firing pins comes up pretty frequently on this forum. I find there is enough information spread across many threads that is it is difficult to find concise and accurate information. Also, the best practices change periodically as pins from S&W and from aftermarket vendors get updated.

Post #2 in the thread below has information that I believe is accurate and up to date.

Firing pin replacement.

There are also other useful posts farther down in the thread.

The only thing I would add is that many people think the .495 S&W factory titanium pins are nearly ideal. As far as I know these pins all have hemispherical tips. If I received factory pins that were .497 long with hemispherical tips, I would definitely use them.
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Old 09-29-2016, 08:47 PM
Jim Oliver Jim Oliver is offline
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Again, thanks to those with positive, helpful comments.

Although I am new to the forum, I have several older S&W revolvers and have owned several several S&W semi autos. My purpose in buying one of the new revolvers is to gain first hand experience with what is required to achieve reliable ~6 pound DA trigger pulls with the new guns. I am making progress. So far two 629-6 with 6 to 6.5# DA and one 686-6 with 6# DA, all reliable with Federal primers (only). Other brands require ~7.5#.

Also have an older 617 with 6.5# DA--great fun gun

Oh, and I do know how to use the "ignore" button.........

Jim
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Old 09-30-2016, 06:08 AM
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rb, th op seems to be questioning the -design- of the gun my reply is intended to convey that both Smith the Company and what is being produced is quite different from when I was there-and this phenomena is not particular to Smith and Wesson.

I believe its fair to say that there really are NOT any machinists anymore but only machine operators/programmers. How this impacts overall quality I cannot say but I often hear this: 'any idiot can assemble an auto'-this comment is not intended to impugn anyone.

With regard to manufacturing in the US, as everything else that which was is long gone and is never coming back.

Last edited by gsn; 09-30-2016 at 06:10 AM.
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Old 09-30-2016, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsn View Post
rb, th op seems to be questioning the -design- of the gun my reply is intended to convey that both Smith the Company and what is being produced is quite different from when I was there-and this phenomena is not particular to Smith and Wesson.

I believe its fair to say that there really are NOT any machinists anymore but only machine operators/programmers. How this impacts overall quality I cannot say but I often hear this: 'any idiot can assemble an auto'-this comment is not intended to impugn anyone.

...
It is true that modern machining technology uses computer-controlled machining rather than machining via human skill. Whether we like it or not, this is a good thing from the standpoint of the product that it produces. The "holy grail" of manufacturing for over a hundred years was to be able to produce devices, e.g. guns, that did not require hand-fitted parts but instead used standard parts. This sounds easy but in practice was very difficult. At first this was an unattainable dream, then a distant prospect, and now reality. The result is better guns at a lower price. While this may offend traditionalists who believe that a hand-fitted, craftsman-made gun was "better", in fact you have to realize that guns were hand-fitted and assembled simply because the state-of-the-art did not allow for modern methods. The new S&Ws are superb guns, regardless of what the traditionalists think, although they are certainly entitled to their opinions.
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Old 09-30-2016, 07:53 PM
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Guess my problem is that I compare everything to the mdl 64 that I received as a gift in '75-never fired it would always qualify with the issued Colts. The trigger puts anything new to shame ditto the fit/finish, then again sentiment can cloud reality.
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Old 10-01-2016, 04:43 AM
VanMan1961 VanMan1961 is offline
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I did some testing on my 929 with the standard Performance Center firing pin (left) compared to the C&S extended firing pin (right). I actually found the stock Performance Center firing pin to work better. I think because the "pointy" profile takes less force to crush the primer against the anvil.



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Old 10-01-2016, 08:50 AM
Jim Oliver Jim Oliver is offline
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I found the same thing with my C&S pin. The C&S pin worked great after a "nose job"
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Old 10-02-2016, 02:47 AM
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BLUEDOT37 BLUEDOT37 is offline
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That's interesting. I hope to get to the range in a few days to try the C&S F/Ps. All the broad nose F/Ps have worked good for me so far.

I pulled the sideplate off of several of my other S&W revolvers the other day (adding reduced power rebound slide springs) & checked their F/Ps while in there. A couple had .486", .489" long F/Ps. Those guns have over a thousand rounds thru each & never had a misfire, or light strike, in them.

I guess small differences in the gross headspace (between the cylinder face & breach plate) has something to do with it. However, when I was trying to figure out why the one Apex F/P worked in my 625PC, but not the 325TR, I measure the gross headspace & there was only .002" difference (same for my 627PC & 327TRR8), which didn't seem enough to make a difference.

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VanMan1961: How did you get those reading on crushing the primers? Roughly 1/2 lb. more force

.
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Old 10-02-2016, 03:10 AM
VanMan1961 VanMan1961 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLUEDOT37 View Post
That's interesting. I hope to get to the range in a few days to try the C&S F/Ps. All the broad nose F/Ps have worked good for me so far.

I pulled the sideplate off of several of my other S&W revolvers the other day (adding reduced power rebound slide springs) & checked their F/Ps while in there. A couple had .486", .489" long F/Ps. Those guns have over a thousand rounds thru each & never had a misfire, or light strike, in them.

I guess small differences in the gross headspace (between the cylinder face & breach plate) has something to do with it. However, when I was trying to figure out why the one Apex F/P worked in my 625PC, but not the 325TR, I measure the gross headspace & there was only .002" difference (same for my 627PC & 327TRR8), which didn't seem enough to make a difference.

.

VanMan1961: How did you get those reading on crushing the primers? Roughly 1/2 lb. more force

.
I was testing sized and primed cases with no powder or bullets. I had the strain screw backed off a bit and would turn it in slightly until I could get 2 full moonclips to fire off ok in DA. Then I'd measure the trigger with my Lyman electronic trigger pull scale.
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  #36  
Old 10-02-2016, 03:47 AM
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My guess would for why they changed the shape of the firing pin would be this..

In recent years we've been hearing about quite a few different ammo types with " hard primers ". If the firing pin has a more conical shape, the same amount of pressure will result in a deeper indent due to not having as much surface area at initial contact.

A rough comparison. Take a 4x4 and hit a piece of sheet steel with 10 pounds of force. Now do it again with the round end of a ball peen hammer. Which makes a sharper dent?

To the OP..... as long as the gun goes boom every time you pull the trigger I wouldn't be too worried about it. If it is ftf'ing, then clean and try that. THEN replace the firing pin if nothing else works.
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