Can someone explain why there is such a wide gap between the frame and the cylinder of the 351PD. I really want one but just don't get the gap. I have a 360PD with very little gap - so what's the reason? Please educate me. Thanks in advance.

Are you talking about the B/C gap? My 351PD gauges out to a snug .004, which most people would think is pretty good.

Since there is no need for the cylinder to be long, S&W made the decision to make the barrel longer instead.

You will notice that the barrel extends father into the frame window than the 360PD revolver you are looking at. The 357 Magnum cartridge is much longer than the 22 Magnum and it requires a full length cylinder

Thanks for the reply. Being a picky old man, I would have gone the other other way and either made the cylinder longer or the frame thicker to avoid the appearance of an ill-fitted firearm especially on a higher end 22 - I guess that's what other manufacturers decided to do when keeping their gaps smaller. I always wondered why some had the unsightly gap and others did not. Thanks for taking the time to reply. I still like the firearm, but I also still wish it didn't have the gap. Some annoyances you can live with over time and some you can't - the problem is not knowing in advance of the purchase. I know some complained about the rattle of the slide release on the HK P2000SK. When I read about the rattle, I thought I would be one that would be bothered by that. After I identified a solution, I purchased the firearm (HKP2K). However, I never implemented the solution because at some point I realized that I never even noticed or thought about the rattle that bothered others so much. I was having too much fun with a handgun that shot very well to get distracted by a rattle. Maybe this gap on the 351PD won't bother me as much as I think it might. Thanks again.

The J-frame is the J-frame. If they made the frame thicker, it would be some other frame.

The purpose of the shorter cylinder is to reduce the time that the projectile travels unsupported in the throat before contacting the rifling.

You want the jump from the case mouth to the rifling to be as short as possible. The projectile is wobbling until it engages the rifling and for best accuracy you want that projectile to engage the rifling as centered as possible

If you look at the Model 25s that are chambered for 45ACP (snubby in photo), they also have shorter cylinders than their 45 Long Colt counterparts
This is not about cosmetics, this is about performance.

Soor for the thread drift here . . .
I have had my P2000SK for over a decade now. I never noticed a rattle but now I have to go and pull it out just to check it I will also get it photographed while I have it out.

BTW, that is one little gun that has not right to be as accurate as it is.

I sold my HK P2KSK and regretted the sale pretty quickly and even tried to buy it back from the purchaser for a while. After no luck, I purchased an HK P30SK. Cosmetic wise, I prefer the P2KSK's front end more, due to the absence of front serrations, so less cluttered looking. I also prefer the accessory rail of the P2KSK since it's cleaner looking and I rarely used it anyway. However, I prefer the P30SK's grip and have gone the 13 round w X-Grip route with flat bottom plate, so I also enjoy the higher capacity without looking or feeling larger and bulkier. I seem to shoot the same from both of them, which is better than with anything else I have. My "perfect handgun" would be a HK something but just a tad smaller/narrower, so I could conceal it better. A man at the lane next to me today at the range, let me shoot his Springfield EMP. I thought it was a great looking gun and seemed to be the "perfect" size for concealment, long enough but thin, and I shot it reasonably well. However, after shooting it, I was done - it was like I had to really work at it. When I shoot the HK P30SK, I hate to stop shooting, because it seems effortless - not like work.

Now back to the SW, the 351PD is the result of looking for something that my grandson (11 today) can start on (handgun wise). I was working towards a revolver for the simplicity of it and towards the 351PD because I felt he could find value in it for a longer period of time than just childhood...lighter loads, but still a capable handgun with lower recoil than the bigger stuff he'll want to start shooting soon enough. I have 32 c, 380, and up pistols for him to shoot but was looking for something that would be "his first" something, and again something with some shelf life to it. I started looking for revolvers and found the 351PD. I like my 360PD, so the 351PD seemed like a good candidate.

I am naturally biased towards revolvers. But with that said, I'm still open to any suggestions you or anyone else might have for a kid's first handgun, but one with some extended shelf life for him, pistol or revolver. And thanks again for the additional information on the 351PD. Starting to understand the reason for the gap helps. And this is one area where function trumps form. I really do appreciate your taking the time to provide the additional information.

Also, I do have a little Beretta tomcat (32c) that has never been fired that might suffice for my grandson. That is, it might fit his hand better and still be a nice "first handgun" and something to value as he gets older, but I wasn't sure of the recoil of the 32 c compared to the 351PD, since I've not fired a 351PD. Is it closer to 22 LR or the 32c? The Beretta is also pretty simple to operate for a pistol.

So I guess I'm hanging between the 351PD (22), the Tomcat (32), and whatever you or someone else might suggest for my grandson's "first handgun." Maybe I'll get the 351PD and let him try it and the little tomcat and see which he takes a shine to.

Either would make a fine first handgun and I would be happy to keep the remaining one. I already have another 32 c so now I'm hoping he picks the tomcat, so I can keep the 351. I don't have any 22s and it would make a nice little brother to my 360PD.

Thanks again for the additional input about the gap.

The 351PD is LOUD and has fairly stout recoil because it is so lightweight. The ammo is expensive and often hard to find. The DA trigger is very heavy. In such a lightweight handgun, this makes it tough to get good accuracy. It's really an expert's gun, not a good choice for a boy's first handgun.

Reed001, Lobster Picnic is right about recoli of 351 PD. Although I have a 351C, I doubt if there's much difference. Mine even came with a hi viz front sight. You mentioned you didn't have any 22s, so unless the 43C is just to light for him, I will say it's a fun revolver to shoot. i sure liked anything in a 22 when I was young. Heck, I like 'em now too.

There are nice 22LR/22WM convertibles with close cylinder/frame gaps in the SAA form factor. Uberti

Any suggestions?

Yes. The appropriate cartridge for a first gun is .22LR. Although there are some nice .22LR autoloaders around, the best first gun is really a revolver. While a K-frame revolver (or D-frame in a Colt) is best for an adult, it may be a little large for an 11-year-old boy, possibly even heavy. A Model 34 is possibly best - the stock grips (some would say stock stocks) with a Tyler grip adapter would be fine now. Later, as he grows (actually, as his hand grows, but I'm hoping that he will grow along with his hand, or vice versa), he can substitute a Pachmayr Presentation grip or an S&W "Target" grip, which will fit his larger hand better.

By the time he is proficient with his Model 34 (or 63), he will have his own opinions on what is the best next gun, and he will stand a good chance of being right. Meanwhile, the 34 or 63 will still be a pretty nice gun to hold on to.

I would look hard at a H&R 999 new enough to have a transfer bar. Many of them are more accurate than a S&W and the 6" barrel is a plus. Reloads are a breeze. Keep the rear sight screws tight.

I'm with the "start him with a .22LR" crowd. That's plenty enough gun for an 11-year-old new shooter.

You don't mention anything about hand strength in this young fellow, so if you intend to go the revolver route and want him to have a positive experience, especially in DA, I suggest that whatever you decide to buy for him, you arrange to have a gunsmith tinker with a spring kit that will be just right for him.

My own suggestion would be the S&W Model 317 AirLight in 3" barrel. It is lightweight, the barrel is long enough that it will be easy for him to shoot accurately, and it's a fine "kit gun" for general purposes. You can buy these new, with a Hi-Vis Front Sight and Adjustable Rear Sight, or you could find one from earlier years with just the V-notch and fixed blade front sight. Only knock I've heard on these is that they have a relatively heavy DA pull, but that's something that can be addressed with a spring kit, and rimfires do typically have heavier trigger pulls to help ensure igniting of the cartridge.

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Ukraine -- now more than ever

I appreciate the information and I agree with the shift from 22 mag to 22r - the 22 mag ammo is extremely high priced - it's been a long time since I priced any 22 ammo, and I was shocked. Even 22 lr is up there.

And I am also starting to realize that the revolver criteria may be too heavily influenced by my personal bias...since my first two were revolvers 40-50 years ago. I do believe that he would pick a pistol over a revolver with all other thing being even.

That got me looking more at 22 pistols. And the question this raised was, why do some manufacturers have you sweep the safety down and others have you sweep the safety up, even within the same manufacturer?

I'm from the sweep-it-down school because that's how a hand moves more naturally as it closes in on the grip. Although in the interest of full disclosure, I carry and prefer DAO and no safety. But does anyone here know why the lack of consistency, and more specifically - why ever sweep it up- that seems so unnatural to me?

And last does the possibility of including pistols - not just revolvers - generate any additional recommendations?

Some of the ones that come to my mind are: Ruger SR22, SW22 compact, Walther P22, and Sig mosquito. I have no experience with any of these, but if you happen to know if one is more suited to a smaller hand or if some are more trouble free - that would be a great help to me.

Trouble free and a good warranty are at the top of the list. My experience w SW and SIG warranty has always been good, but I don't have much experience w anyone else's warranty. Thanks again for the feedback and I promise I'll quit pestering you about this here soon.

I have watched too many new shooters hit that trigger multiple times before they could get their finger off that trigger and out of the trigger guard. The more the gun bucked, the harder they gripped that gun and trigger.

I have always recommended a single shot for a youth's first gun. Get control and safety down pat.
Young kids are just what they are; young kids. If a kid swings his firearm after shooting a single shot, we are all still alive. It takes multiple bad experiences for most of us to discover the reason "don't touch the stove".

Single shots are many times more safe than any semi-auto.

As far as safeties go, I do not believe in them, up or down. I think more people have been shot with the gun that the guy swore was on safe than any other way. The word seems to imply, you can do stupid stuff now.

It sounds like you are more interested in what gun you would like, than what fits the situation. I would err on the side of safety.


Prescut

As others have said, the .22 is a far better choice than the .22 Magnum, for all of the reasons listed. Go to a range and rent a couple revolvers of different sizes. I like the K frames as a rule, but his hand size may make that a no-go. A J frame kit gun (34/63) might be the right size, but it is harder to get a decent trigger on the J frame.

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NHI, 10-8.

Autoloaders can be very good target pistols, and possibly everyone should have one, but they are generally not the way to start out. Simplicity of concept and operation are more important than other considerations, which may indicate a revolver, anyway.