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  #101  
Old 07-05-2018, 11:32 AM
Paper Clip Paper Clip is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Many problems with semis in my experience are caused by user error such as limp-wristing and not inserting a mag fully, not chambering a round with enough force. A revolver's operation makes things like that much less likely. Also, I have had the grip of one of my semi's bust open during firing, never happened with one of my revolvers.
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  #102  
Old 07-05-2018, 11:57 AM
Chubbo Chubbo is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zogger52 View Post
Awhile back I did this analysis:

Revolver vs Semi-Automatic Handgun Reliability Using FMECA Approach


Summary of Results:

Modern handguns are extremely reliable. They are capable of firing many thousands of rounds with no malfunctions. In evaluating the difference in reliability between revolvers and semi-automatic handguns, the primary difference is the dependence of the gun on external factors such as user, ammo, and magazine (if a semi-automatic).
The user’s ability to properly manipulate and hold a semi-automatic is a key to semi-automatic reliability. Revolvers have less dependency upon the user than semi-automatics.

After the gun user, a gun system is most dependent upon the ammunition. Since ammunition is used once and an individual bullet can't be tested without "consuming" it, it is not possible to know with absolute certainty if a specific bullet will perform properly in a gun before using it.

Semi-automatics are more dependent than revolvers upon properly functioning ammunition since the stripping the bullet from the magazine, inserting the round into the chamber, discharge of the round, extraction of the used round, ejection of the used round, movement of the slide rearward due to ammunition discharge has significant dependences on the ammunition for properly functionality.

Semi-autos also require that magazines function properly for the gun to operate properly.

Semi-automatics have higher "first shot" reliability assuming a round has been properly inserted in the chamber.

Revolvers generally have slightly higher accuracy repeatability due to the barrel and sights being mechanically fixed.

Semi-automatics are generally less susceptible to fouling due to gun powder residue than revolvers. Hence semi-automatics generally do not need to be cleaned as often.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

System Description:
The handgun system consists of the following components:
-Gun
-Ammunition
-Magazine for semi-automatics
-User

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Assumptions:
1) The gun is being maintained properly. Proper cleaning, lubrication, tightening of screws, and replacement of parts that wear (like recoil springs) are performed at recommended intervals.
2) Proper ammunition is being used.
3) The magazines used in semi-automatics are compatible with the gun.
4) The gun has been "broken in" by firing the recommended number of rounds of the recommended type.
5) The user is familiar with the gun, ammunition, magazine, etc. and handles it per the instruction manual.
6) Revolver is being shot in Double Action mode

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
General Operation:

Revolver: The user opens the cylinder, inserts the rounds, and closes the cylinder. He then points the gun at the target and squeezes the trigger. The action of squeezing the trigger rotates the cylinder to align a round to the barrel and retracts the hammer. Once the trigger has be moved back far enough to release the hammer, the gun discharges the round.

Semi-Automatic: The user loads the magazine with the ammunition and inserts the magazine into the gun. He then cycles the slide to load a round in the chamber which cocks the hammer/firing pin/striker priming the firing mechanism. He then points the gun at the target, releases any safety mechanisms, and squeezes the trigger. The gun discharges the round and then cycles the slide to load another round into the chamber. The cycling of the slide re-cocks the hammer/firing pin/striker re-priming the firing mechanism.

Note that in a semi-automatic that as long as there was a round in the magazine to load into the chamber, the gun is ready to shoot the next round. After discharge in a revolver, the discharged round remains aligned with the barrel hence squeezing of the trigger (or cocking of the hammer in a single action revolver) is needed to move a live round into firing position.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Definition of Critically Levels:

Low: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel but the gun is capable of discharging on next trigger squeeze.

Medium: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Manual action is required to set the gun for next use.

High: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Gun system will no longer operate.

Severe: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Damage occurs to the gun system or injury to user.

Note: Normally a probability is given for each failure mode. However there are little statistics available on these failures, hence no probabilities are used in the analysis.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A High Level Listing for Credible Failure Modes for Each Component:

The high level credible failures for reach component of the gun system (gun, ammunition, magazine, and user) are detailed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gun:
The high level credible failures for revolvers and semi-automatics are detailed.

Revolver:
-Failure to properly align the cylinder to the barrel.
Results in bullet not discharging or not properly going into the barrel. Possible damage to user and gun.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if cylinder aligns properly on next trigger pull. Severe if injury to user or damage to gun.

-Failure to strike the primer with sufficient force to cause it to discharge the round.
Results in bullet not going into the barrel (light primer strikes)
Criticality: Low to High. Low if next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if gun will no longer strike primer with enough force.


Semi-Automatic:
-Failure to properly strip a round from the magazine and insert it into the chamber.
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. Severe if jam cannot be cleared.

-Failure to strike the primer with sufficient force to cause it to discharge the round
Results in a non-discharge.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can cycle the slide to eject the unfired round and insert a new round into the chamber. High if unfired round cannot be cleared and new round inserted.

-Failure to eject the discharged round properly
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if jam cannot be cleared.

-Failure to prime the firing mechanism for the next shot.
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if after user manually cycling the slide, the next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if gun will no longer strike primer with enough force (light primer strikes)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ammunition
The high level failures of ammunition and its effect on each type of gun are detailed.

-Failure of the primer to discharge even when the primer is struck with sufficient force (dud)

Revolver: Same as a light primer strike.
Criticality: Low to High. Low if next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if all subsequent rounds also do not discharge.

Semi-Automatic: Same as a light primer strike.
Criticality: Medium to High. Low if after the user manually cycles the slide, the next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if all subsequent rounds also do not discharge.

-Failure of the bullet to travel fully out of the barrel due to insufficient force (squib)
Revolver: Results in cartridge discharging with bullet entering the barrel but does not exit.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round or bullet is lightly
lodged and will exit if next round pushed it through the barrel. Severe if bullet is tightly lodged and next bullet causes barrel to explode.

Semi-Automatic: Results in cartridge discharging with bullet entering the barrel but does not exit.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round or bullet is lightly lodged and will exit if next round pushed it through the barrel. Severe if bullet is tightly lodged and next bullet causes barrel to explode.

-Failure of the primer to discharge immediately (hang fire)
Revolver: Bullet still in shell casing
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round. Possible severe if user squeezes trigger for subsequent round and round discharges when cylinder is not aligned to the barrel causing injury to user or damage to gun.

Semi-Automatic: Bullet still in shell casing
Criticality: Medium if after user manually cycling the slide, the hang fire round is ejected, new round is inserted into the chamber properly, and the gun is ready for next use.

-Backing Out of Bullet from Shell Casing
Revolver: Can cause cylinder not to rotate
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if bullet back out des not interfere with cylinder rotation. Possible severe if bullet backs out far enough to stop cylinder from rotating.

Semi-Automatic: Bullet stuck in magazine
Note: All most not possible because of the way the rounds are held in the magazine.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low as long as there is not issue with feeding the backed out round. Severe if the next round cannot be fed from the magazine.

-Failure to present the round properly so it can be stripped off and inserted into the chamber.
Revolver: Not applicable
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if jam cannot be cleared.

-Not allowing the slide to lock back after the last round in the magazine has been fired.
Revolver: Not applicable
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: No Impact
Criticality: Low as user can eject magazine, insert a new one, and manually cycle the slide.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
User
The high level failures of due to the user and its effect on each type of gun are detailed.

-Not properly holding the gun so as to inhibit semi-automatic from recycling properly (limp wrist)
Revolver: No Impact
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Gun fires but does not cycle the slide properly causing a jam.
Criticality: Medium after user manually cycles the slide.

-Not properly loading rounds into a magazine
Revolver: No Impact
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if user must eject magazine, insert a new one, and manually cycle the slide.

-”Short Stroking” trigger (not pulling the trigger all the way)
Revolver: Gun does not fire but the cylinder rotates.
Criticality: Low as gun fires on next trigger pull

Semi-Automatic: Gun does not fire nor does the slide cycle.
Criticality: Low as gun fires on next trigger pull

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other Factors to Consider:

"First shot" Reliability
A semi-automatic has an advantage over a revolver when firing its first shot (or subsequent shots if the gun has cycled properly after firing a round). The advantage for the semi-automatic is that to discharge a round, only the trigger release mechanism and the round have to function properly for the gun to discharge. This is because a round is in the chamber and the firing mechanism is "primed". In a revolver, the cylinder must cycle to align a fresh round to the barrel in order for the gun to function properly. If a revolver is being fired in “single action” mode, then this factor is negated.

Accuracy Repeatability
Assuming a gun is sighted in properly and the ammunition is consistent with what was used to sight in, there can be different point of impact based on the gun design.
Revolver: In most revolvers the sights (front and back) are structurally lined to the barrel. However the cylinder chambers are moved to alight with the forcing cone and the barrel. The alignment of the cylinder chamber to barrel varies with each chamber in the cylinder. This difference in alignment can affect the accuracy.

Semi-Automatic: Except for designs that have the barrel fixed to the frame, barrels on semi-automatics move after each shot and return to position for the next shot. Since the barrel and sights are not structurally fixed together, there can be variability from shot to shot with the barrel to sight alignment. However since the bullet is inserted snugly into the chamber which is part of the barrel, the bullet to barrel alignment is consistent from shot to shot.

Effect of gun powder residue on functionality (fouling)

When the cartridge is discharged, residue from the gun powder is propelled forward and out of the shell casing. This residue adheres to various parts of the gun mechanisms. The effect of the residue is different on a revolver versus a semi-automatic. Different ammunition produces different amount of gun powder residue. So the amount and effects of residue varies considerably between different ammunition.

Revolver:
In a revolver, the bullet is housed in the cylinder where it is discharged. The bullet and any gun powder residue are propelled forward thru the front of the cylinder, across the gap between the cylinder and the forcing cone, and into the barrel. Gunpowder residue is built up in the inside of the front of the cylinder starting at the top of the shell casing, on the front of the cylinder, on the forcing cone, around the forcing cone (and frame) and in the barrel. The effect can result in the inability to eject shell casing from the cylinder, inability to insert new bullets into the cylinder, opening of the cylinder, and the cylinder not rotating properly. This effect can be observed when firing a revolver that can use both .357 Magnum and 38 Special ammunition. Since the 38 Special bullet is shorter than the .357 Magnum, if it is shot before the .357 Magnum and causes built up inside the cylinder, then issues can occur when .357 Magnum ammunition is inserted into the cylinder-it may not go all the way into the cylinder. Hence the functionality of a revolver is significantly more affected by gun powder residueand more frequent cleaning is needed.

Semi-Automatic:
Since the bullet is discharged in the chamber which is part of the barrel in a semi-automatic, the majority of the gunpowder residue goes down the barrel and ejects out the gun. Some residue comes back into the slide, magazine, and frame. Some also comes out of the barrel and adheres to the front of the barrel plus the front and sides of the slide. The amount of gunpowder residue that adheres to critical parts of a semi-automatic is significantly less than in a revolver. Hence the functionality of a semi-automatic is significantly less affected and it can function reliability for more rounds before cleaning is needed.
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  #103  
Old 07-05-2018, 12:05 PM
nachogrande nachogrande is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zogger52 View Post
Awhile back I did this analysis:

Revolver vs Semi-Automatic Handgun Reliability Using FMECA Approach


Summary of Results:

Modern handguns are extremely reliable. They are capable of firing many thousands of rounds with no malfunctions. In evaluating the difference in reliability between revolvers and semi-automatic handguns, the primary difference is the dependence of the gun on external factors such as user, ammo, and magazine (if a semi-automatic).
The user’s ability to properly manipulate and hold a semi-automatic is a key to semi-automatic reliability. Revolvers have less dependency upon the user than semi-automatics.

After the gun user, a gun system is most dependent upon the ammunition. Since ammunition is used once and an individual bullet can't be tested without "consuming" it, it is not possible to know with absolute certainty if a specific bullet will perform properly in a gun before using it.

Semi-automatics are more dependent than revolvers upon properly functioning ammunition since the stripping the bullet from the magazine, inserting the round into the chamber, discharge of the round, extraction of the used round, ejection of the used round, movement of the slide rearward due to ammunition discharge has significant dependences on the ammunition for properly functionality.

Semi-autos also require that magazines function properly for the gun to operate properly.

Semi-automatics have higher "first shot" reliability assuming a round has been properly inserted in the chamber.

Revolvers generally have slightly higher accuracy repeatability due to the barrel and sights being mechanically fixed.

Semi-automatics are generally less susceptible to fouling due to gun powder residue than revolvers. Hence semi-automatics generally do not need to be cleaned as often.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

System Description:
The handgun system consists of the following components:
-Gun
-Ammunition
-Magazine for semi-automatics
-User

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Assumptions:
1) The gun is being maintained properly. Proper cleaning, lubrication, tightening of screws, and replacement of parts that wear (like recoil springs) are performed at recommended intervals.
2) Proper ammunition is being used.
3) The magazines used in semi-automatics are compatible with the gun.
4) The gun has been "broken in" by firing the recommended number of rounds of the recommended type.
5) The user is familiar with the gun, ammunition, magazine, etc. and handles it per the instruction manual.
6) Revolver is being shot in Double Action mode

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
General Operation:

Revolver: The user opens the cylinder, inserts the rounds, and closes the cylinder. He then points the gun at the target and squeezes the trigger. The action of squeezing the trigger rotates the cylinder to align a round to the barrel and retracts the hammer. Once the trigger has be moved back far enough to release the hammer, the gun discharges the round.

Semi-Automatic: The user loads the magazine with the ammunition and inserts the magazine into the gun. He then cycles the slide to load a round in the chamber which cocks the hammer/firing pin/striker priming the firing mechanism. He then points the gun at the target, releases any safety mechanisms, and squeezes the trigger. The gun discharges the round and then cycles the slide to load another round into the chamber. The cycling of the slide re-cocks the hammer/firing pin/striker re-priming the firing mechanism.

Note that in a semi-automatic that as long as there was a round in the magazine to load into the chamber, the gun is ready to shoot the next round. After discharge in a revolver, the discharged round remains aligned with the barrel hence squeezing of the trigger (or cocking of the hammer in a single action revolver) is needed to move a live round into firing position.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Definition of Critically Levels:

Low: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel but the gun is capable of discharging on next trigger squeeze.

Medium: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Manual action is required to set the gun for next use.

High: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Gun system will no longer operate.

Severe: Round does not discharge and/or exits the barrel. Damage occurs to the gun system or injury to user.

Note: Normally a probability is given for each failure mode. However there are little statistics available on these failures, hence no probabilities are used in the analysis.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A High Level Listing for Credible Failure Modes for Each Component:

The high level credible failures for reach component of the gun system (gun, ammunition, magazine, and user) are detailed.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gun:
The high level credible failures for revolvers and semi-automatics are detailed.

Revolver:
-Failure to properly align the cylinder to the barrel.
Results in bullet not discharging or not properly going into the barrel. Possible damage to user and gun.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if cylinder aligns properly on next trigger pull. Severe if injury to user or damage to gun.

-Failure to strike the primer with sufficient force to cause it to discharge the round.
Results in bullet not going into the barrel (light primer strikes)
Criticality: Low to High. Low if next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if gun will no longer strike primer with enough force.


Semi-Automatic:
-Failure to properly strip a round from the magazine and insert it into the chamber.
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. Severe if jam cannot be cleared.

-Failure to strike the primer with sufficient force to cause it to discharge the round
Results in a non-discharge.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can cycle the slide to eject the unfired round and insert a new round into the chamber. High if unfired round cannot be cleared and new round inserted.

-Failure to eject the discharged round properly
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if jam cannot be cleared.

-Failure to prime the firing mechanism for the next shot.
Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if after user manually cycling the slide, the next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if gun will no longer strike primer with enough force (light primer strikes)

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ammunition
The high level failures of ammunition and its effect on each type of gun are detailed.

-Failure of the primer to discharge even when the primer is struck with sufficient force (dud)

Revolver: Same as a light primer strike.
Criticality: Low to High. Low if next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if all subsequent rounds also do not discharge.

Semi-Automatic: Same as a light primer strike.
Criticality: Medium to High. Low if after the user manually cycles the slide, the next rounds discharges when user squeezes the trigger to fire the next round. High if all subsequent rounds also do not discharge.

-Failure of the bullet to travel fully out of the barrel due to insufficient force (squib)
Revolver: Results in cartridge discharging with bullet entering the barrel but does not exit.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round or bullet is lightly
lodged and will exit if next round pushed it through the barrel. Severe if bullet is tightly lodged and next bullet causes barrel to explode.

Semi-Automatic: Results in cartridge discharging with bullet entering the barrel but does not exit.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round or bullet is lightly lodged and will exit if next round pushed it through the barrel. Severe if bullet is tightly lodged and next bullet causes barrel to explode.

-Failure of the primer to discharge immediately (hang fire)
Revolver: Bullet still in shell casing
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if user does not fire next round. Possible severe if user squeezes trigger for subsequent round and round discharges when cylinder is not aligned to the barrel causing injury to user or damage to gun.

Semi-Automatic: Bullet still in shell casing
Criticality: Medium if after user manually cycling the slide, the hang fire round is ejected, new round is inserted into the chamber properly, and the gun is ready for next use.

-Backing Out of Bullet from Shell Casing
Revolver: Can cause cylinder not to rotate
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low if bullet back out des not interfere with cylinder rotation. Possible severe if bullet backs out far enough to stop cylinder from rotating.

Semi-Automatic: Bullet stuck in magazine
Note: All most not possible because of the way the rounds are held in the magazine.
Criticality: Low to Severe. Low as long as there is not issue with feeding the backed out round. Severe if the next round cannot be fed from the magazine.

-Failure to present the round properly so it can be stripped off and inserted into the chamber.
Revolver: Not applicable
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if jam cannot be cleared.

-Not allowing the slide to lock back after the last round in the magazine has been fired.
Revolver: Not applicable
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: No Impact
Criticality: Low as user can eject magazine, insert a new one, and manually cycle the slide.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
User
The high level failures of due to the user and its effect on each type of gun are detailed.

-Not properly holding the gun so as to inhibit semi-automatic from recycling properly (limp wrist)
Revolver: No Impact
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Gun fires but does not cycle the slide properly causing a jam.
Criticality: Medium after user manually cycles the slide.

-Not properly loading rounds into a magazine
Revolver: No Impact
Criticality: None

Semi-Automatic: Results in a jam.
Criticality: Medium to High. Medium if user can clear the jam and another round can be inserted into the chamber. High if user must eject magazine, insert a new one, and manually cycle the slide.

-”Short Stroking” trigger (not pulling the trigger all the way)
Revolver: Gun does not fire but the cylinder rotates.
Criticality: Low as gun fires on next trigger pull

Semi-Automatic: Gun does not fire nor does the slide cycle.
Criticality: Low as gun fires on next trigger pull

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Other Factors to Consider:

"First shot" Reliability
A semi-automatic has an advantage over a revolver when firing its first shot (or subsequent shots if the gun has cycled properly after firing a round). The advantage for the semi-automatic is that to discharge a round, only the trigger release mechanism and the round have to function properly for the gun to discharge. This is because a round is in the chamber and the firing mechanism is "primed". In a revolver, the cylinder must cycle to align a fresh round to the barrel in order for the gun to function properly. If a revolver is being fired in “single action” mode, then this factor is negated.

Accuracy Repeatability
Assuming a gun is sighted in properly and the ammunition is consistent with what was used to sight in, there can be different point of impact based on the gun design.
Revolver: In most revolvers the sights (front and back) are structurally lined to the barrel. However the cylinder chambers are moved to alight with the forcing cone and the barrel. The alignment of the cylinder chamber to barrel varies with each chamber in the cylinder. This difference in alignment can affect the accuracy.

Semi-Automatic: Except for designs that have the barrel fixed to the frame, barrels on semi-automatics move after each shot and return to position for the next shot. Since the barrel and sights are not structurally fixed together, there can be variability from shot to shot with the barrel to sight alignment. However since the bullet is inserted snugly into the chamber which is part of the barrel, the bullet to barrel alignment is consistent from shot to shot.

Effect of gun powder residue on functionality (fouling)

When the cartridge is discharged, residue from the gun powder is propelled forward and out of the shell casing. This residue adheres to various parts of the gun mechanisms. The effect of the residue is different on a revolver versus a semi-automatic. Different ammunition produces different amount of gun powder residue. So the amount and effects of residue varies considerably between different ammunition.

Revolver:
In a revolver, the bullet is housed in the cylinder where it is discharged. The bullet and any gun powder residue are propelled forward thru the front of the cylinder, across the gap between the cylinder and the forcing cone, and into the barrel. Gunpowder residue is built up in the inside of the front of the cylinder starting at the top of the shell casing, on the front of the cylinder, on the forcing cone, around the forcing cone (and frame) and in the barrel. The effect can result in the inability to eject shell casing from the cylinder, inability to insert new bullets into the cylinder, opening of the cylinder, and the cylinder not rotating properly. This effect can be observed when firing a revolver that can use both .357 Magnum and 38 Special ammunition. Since the 38 Special bullet is shorter than the .357 Magnum, if it is shot before the .357 Magnum and causes built up inside the cylinder, then issues can occur when .357 Magnum ammunition is inserted into the cylinder-it may not go all the way into the cylinder. Hence the functionality of a revolver is significantly more affected by gun powder residueand more frequent cleaning is needed.

Semi-Automatic:
Since the bullet is discharged in the chamber which is part of the barrel in a semi-automatic, the majority of the gunpowder residue goes down the barrel and ejects out the gun. Some residue comes back into the slide, magazine, and frame. Some also comes out of the barrel and adheres to the front of the barrel plus the front and sides of the slide. The amount of gunpowder residue that adheres to critical parts of a semi-automatic is significantly less than in a revolver. Hence the functionality of a semi-automatic is significantly less affected and it can function reliability for more rounds before cleaning is needed.
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  #104  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:38 PM
texmex texmex is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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A revolver will handle light loads or heavy loads without any change or trouble.
There is no safety to work and you don’t have to worry about whether a round is in the chamber or not.
A revolver doesn’t depend on a box magazine. Most magazines are flimsy sheet metal and easily damaged.
The revolver will fire if pressed hard against an adversary. Many autos will be pushed out of battery from such pressure and will not fire.
An auto can have the safety accidentally disengaged or have the magazine accidentally released. This makes it more likely to fire when you don’t want it to or not fire when you want it to.
A dud cartridge in an auto means you have to eject that cartridge and chamber another round. On a revolver, you just pull the trigger again.
Revolvers handle cartridges from 22 short to 500 magnum.


AUTOS ARE A PASSING FAD.

Last edited by texmex; 07-05-2018 at 02:05 PM.
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  #105  
Old 07-05-2018, 01:43 PM
Paper Clip Paper Clip is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texmex View Post
A REVOLVER WILL HANDLE LIGHT LOADS OR HEAVY LOADS WITHOUT ANY CHANGE OR TROUBLE.
THERE IS NO SAFETY TO WORK AND YOU DON’T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT WHETHER A ROUND IS IN THE CHAMBER OR NOT.
A REVOLVER DOESN’T DEPEND ON A BOX MAGAZINE. MOST MAGAZINES ARE FLIMSY SHEET METAL AND EASILY DAMAGED.
THE REVOLVER WILL FIRE IF PRESSED HARD AGAINST AN ADVERSARY. MANY AUTOS WILL BE PUSHED OUT OF BATTERY FROM SUCH PRESSURE AND WILL NOT FIRE.
AN AUTO CAN HAVE THE SAFETY ACCIDENTALLY DISENGAGED OR HAVE THE MAGAZINE ACCIDENTALLY RELEASED. THIS MAKES IT MORE LIKELY TO FIRE WHEN YOU DON’T WANT IT TO OR NOT FIRE WHEN YOU WANT IT TO.
A DUD CARTRIDGE IN AN AUTO MEANS YOU HAVE TO EJECT THAT CARTRIDGE AND CHAMBER ANOTHER ROUND. ON A REVOLVER, YOU JUST PULL THE TRIGGER AGAIN.
REVOLVERS HANDLE CARTRIDGES FROM 22 SHORT TO 500 MAGNUM.

Autos are a passing fad.
Don't know if it was intended this way or not, but I read the entire post in an angry, screaming voice.
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  #106  
Old 07-05-2018, 03:35 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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All I would say is that I believe that if you compared a mixture of 100 revolvers each from Ruger and S&W with 100 semi autos each from those same manufacturers, my bet would be on the revolvers, particularly if you factored in the issue (however that could be done) of defensive uses where nerves could likely induce limp wristing in a semi with nothing comparable from the revolver.

Revolvers require little if any break in, unlike semis. I don't think knowledgeable shooters would use a semi for CCW unless it had 100-200 flawless rounds through it.

A revolver should be "good to go" if it has a flawless cylinder full through it. Don
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Old 07-05-2018, 04:04 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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The automatics get an alibi for poor function when "limp-wristing" is inserted in a forum discussion. How well will an alibi stop an assault? Do we want to rely on handguns that have the capability of failure due to limp-wristing?
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Old 07-05-2018, 05:20 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Depends on the revolver. I have a Ruger Single Six I bought new in 1975 and has 10's upon 10's of thousands of rounds fired and never a malfunction. I have never seen a semi do that but several revolvers.
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Old 07-05-2018, 05:24 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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I am going to discuss this with the Mechanical guys at work that calculate our MTBF for some of our products. One of them is a gun guy.

I don't think he will think I am killing a sacred cow as he is shotgun guy first.
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Old 07-05-2018, 05:32 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Here is a quote from Hilton Yam. "You really need to shoot the gun for 1000-1500 rounds, to include about 500 or more rounds with duty ammunition to have a good feel for what the gun is doing. Do not just put "200 flawless rounds" through the gun and declare that it is "completely reliable." That is not a statistically significant cycle of service."
The platform in this instance was the 1911. When you think about auto pistols in general, there is some concern about it being reliable with different brands or types of ammunition. It may work fine with some brands or styles of hollow point ammo but not another. They are obviously sensitive to different power levels of ammo (hardball vs. wadcutters or other target loads). Revolvers are not sensitive to bullet shape. Ball, wadcutter, semi-wadcutter or hollow point, if it goes into the chambers and the cylinder will turn when you close it, it will probably work. One of the few concerns would be bullets jumping the crimp when fired in lighter weight revolvers such as a 357 model 340 or 44 Magnum model 329. Also, anything interfering with slide movement (such as a barricade) may cause a malfunction. Autos probably are not reliable when fired from inside a coat pocket. Revolvers usually work fine but it is pretty hard on the coat.
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Old 07-05-2018, 05:37 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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What gun and what ammo?
Oops, sorry I never answered until now, but I'm not getting my notifications lately. The revolver is a 2.625" 627 PC. I seem to have trouble with the Hornady XTP's pulling crimp, but never my cast bullet loads. It happened (for the third time) a couple weeks ago and I just pressed down on the bullet nose with my thumb and it eased back down into the case enough to allow the cylinder to rotate. It only happens with the short barreled 627...yet I don't think I am "limp wristing" it. I think it is just a case of a short, sharp recoil impulse causing bullets to pull crimp. The same bullets work fine in my 4" barrel 586. It is only a problem because I concealed carry the 627 fairly often. The fix is to stick with my cast bullet loads...they work flawlessly. I suppose I could work on getting a better crimp on my handloads, but TBH after 3 lockups I just don't trust JHP's.

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Old 07-06-2018, 10:41 AM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Revolvers

Don't forget that if you HAD to you can discharge that centennial or bodyguard J frame from inside your pocket or thru the side of a purse for the ladies that carry. Without showing what's coming and without snagging. Give that a whirl with a semi and you'll probably wind up with a tangled up mess by the time the slide snags something and binds up.
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:25 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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I believe



This thread would have gone in a completely different direction...



In the Taurus forum
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Old 07-06-2018, 06:34 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by JDinAZ View Post
Revolvers

Don't forget that if you HAD to you can discharge that centennial or bodyguard J frame from inside your pocket or thru the side of a purse for the ladies that carry. .
EXACTLY. Your sick children/wife/mother will ONLY ask for cough medicine at 3Am and the ONLY pharmacy open is that one across the train tracks with multiple thugs hanging around the entrance.
Either flash the grip from the 1911 in your waistband
or walk to the door with your hands in your sweatshirt pockets .
I always keep a "RESOLVER" in the carry rotation
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Old 07-09-2018, 10:25 PM
Beemer-mark Beemer-mark is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Back on track as to reliability - I think we can agree it's the ammo that isn't reliable. I reload and don't really shoot much factory ammo but in a revolver there are numerous issues with ammo that can cause a the cylinder to bind. A lot of older hand guns (Colt SAA) have chambers that don't meet SAMMI specs. So rounds don't always chamber. An ever so slight high primer will bind the gun. One of the worse is insufficient crimp causing one of the unfired the bullets to jump out slightly binding the cylinder. Most of these issues are found when attempting to load. Once in a great while, for reasons unknown, a cartridge will not go BANG when the hammer hits the primer. Doesn't disable the gun and usually goes BANG on the next go around.

Same ammo issues in a semi will usually ties the gun up until you drop the mag, pull the slide and clear the bullet. You also have issues with failure to feed if the round is slightly out of spec. For carry guns I test every single round. Factory or not. Put it in the gun. In a revolver make sure the cylinder turns freely. Inspect the crimp. In my 1911 I load the magazine and pull the slide repeatably until all the rounds have cycled thru and then put them back in the magazine.

Guns are pretty reliable. People and ammo isn't.

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Old 07-10-2018, 10:53 AM
Ziggy2525 Ziggy2525 is online now
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by Practical View Post
I am going to discuss this with the Mechanical guys at work that calculate our MTBF for some of our products. One of them is a gun guy.

I don't think he will think I am killing a sacred cow as he is shotgun guy first.
I don't think the approach you're considering will work like you're expecting. Even through pistols are simple machines, reliability calculations would be different for a pistol than something that's in continuous use like an air conditioner or a pump motor.

I think you'd be looking at the number of cycles (shots) between failures and the mean time to return the pistol to service (MTTR). Plus you'd need to consider the duty cycle of the pistol. e.g. how close together the shots are together - the effects of expansion/contraction due to heating and cooling could impact wear and tear (and reliability). e.g. shooting 1,000 rounds, one round a month will probably create less wear and tear than shooting 100 rounds in 15 minutes, each day for 10 days.

Too many variables. I suspect pistol manufacturers have a small number of different usage profiles set up they test against when they design a pistol. Maybe one for casual use, one for competitive use, one for military/police use. They have some proprietary algorithm they use to evaluate the failures in each of those categories, then modify those calcs with empirical data from repair returns.

Since as consumers we don't have access to any of that info, about all we can do is look at ad hoc info from users. Certain pistols and revolvers have a reputation for exceptional reliability. Others don't. No guarantee for a specific pistol/revolver though.
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Old 07-10-2018, 10:56 AM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Old 07-10-2018, 02:11 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by Practical View Post
I am going to discuss this with the Mechanical guys at work that calculate our MTBF for some of our products. One of them is a gun guy.

I don't think he will think I am killing a sacred cow as he is shotgun guy first.
I will be interested to see what they have to say about my very long post on reliability. I used to do those things for a living.
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Old 07-10-2018, 02:28 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Personally, I have never had any issues with my revolvers. My semi-autos on the other hand, I've had to perform many immediate action drills, thankfully at the range. I am also a stickler on keeping my weapons clean. Maybe it's the magazines, the ammo or what not, but at the end of the day, I feel more comfortable with a revolver, even if it's a slower reload for me
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Old 07-10-2018, 02:44 PM
uncleted327 uncleted327 is offline
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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By their very operation revolvers will ALWAYS be more reliable than a semiautomatic, given we are talking about quality firearms on both sides. The ammo in a semi needs to have a good magazine, seated properly, a flawless transfer from the mag to the chamber, fire and propel the bullet, move the slide to reset the trigger and load the next round, eject cleanly despite any issues with the gun itself or the shooters grip and actions and then do that every time you pull the trigger. The ammo in the revolver needs to fire and propel the bullet...and that's it. Only then can we start talking about possible issues with the mechanical parts of the guns themselves...
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Old 07-10-2018, 02:54 PM
Ziggy2525 Ziggy2525 is online now
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zogger52 View Post
I will be interested to see what they have to say about my very long post on reliability. I used to do those things for a living.
Back in the old days, when I was working as a dishwasher at the local diner, I used to moonlight in the evenings at the local nuclear power plant doing some equipment reliability calcs and FMEA analysis do determine the probability of equipment failure if a loss of coolant accident occurred. Back in those days it wasn't very highly thought of work so was mostly limited to the unemployables.

The one thing I'd say about your post based on my limited experience is no matter how well you try to conceptualize the various modes of failure, without some basis to quantify the actual failure rates of the various components, the assessment will be off. But then again, I was just washing dishes for a living.
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Old 07-10-2018, 04:58 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by uncleted327 View Post
By their very operation revolvers will ALWAYS be more reliable than a semiautomatic, given we are talking about quality firearms on both sides. The ammo in a semi needs to have a good magazine, seated properly, a flawless transfer from the mag to the chamber, fire and propel the bullet, move the slide to reset the trigger and load the next round, eject cleanly despite any issues with the gun itself or the shooters grip and actions and then do that every time you pull the trigger. The ammo in the revolver needs to fire and propel the bullet...and that's it. Only then can we start talking about possible issues with the mechanical parts of the guns themselves...


After seeing other posts from the OP, it’s obvious he’s not interested in a real discussion and is just trolling to get a rise out of revolver shooters.

He’s not getting any more of my bandwidth.
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Old 07-10-2018, 05:49 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by jtcarm View Post
After seeing other posts from the OP, it’s obvious he’s not interested in a real discussion and is just trolling to get a rise out of revolver shooters.

He’s not getting any more of my bandwidth.
I have to agree with you, jtcarn. Just trolling the revolver forums to get a rise out of the revolver shooters.

I have revolvers (quite a few) and semi auto handguns in metal frame and also polymer plastic fantastics. I have had mechanical malfunctions with both, but there is just more to malfunction with a semi auto, in my opinion. To each their own. If you like the plastic bottom feeders then good for you. I happen to like something more substantial in hand, but that is what I feel best with. The added weight mitigates recoil and lets me get back on target a bit quicker, but that is my experience. But I don't go into the bottom feeder forums and troll them with statements about my revolvers being more reliable than their bottom feeders.
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Old 07-10-2018, 07:04 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Well my only two plastic fantastic semi-autos would laugh and run circles around my new Model 69 Combat Magnum 4 shooter right now!
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Old 07-10-2018, 07:30 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Practical View Post
I like revolver's. I enjoy shooting the and just looking at them, however, I no longer believe they are as reliable as a well designed Law Enforcement Semi-Auto.

I KNOW this is an opinion. I would like to back it up with facts but without an employee leaking information or a analysis of a revolver or long term tests we can't prove it.

It's not the lock in Smith & Wesson or the changing of manufacturing processes to MIM with all major manufacturers.

I still think they better serve a gun owning population that need a gun to stored in a home and ready for use but used seldom and given little attention.

However, I think the reliability of carried often and shot often Semi-Auto design used for LEO use is more reliable for a more active an well trained user.

The issue is basically the engineering and manufacturing processes used in today's semi-autos and their widespread use ensure manufacturers compete to win these markets and put their best products forward.

In contrast, Revolvers aside for security use in some cities in the US are consumer grade products. The LOCK demonstrates this. Even on competition models like the Competitor or Performance Center guns.

What pushed me to this post was watching a youtube video of a 7 Shot GP100 which could not close it's cylinder because some brass specs were a little too large. Maybe the rims expanded or were out of spec, but when a revolver can't be closed because of it's design when loaded the manufacturer has reached a new low. Unfortunately this is not new, I had a new Colt double action revolver fail to function with almost all brands of ammo 20+ years ago. It only held 6 rounds. Just before they stopped making revolvers. I can see why they stopped. Why ruin your reputation.

I no longer believe in revolvers...
The problems with opinions is that they are just that, opinions, and many, such as this one, have no basis in fact. And, no matter how much you want such an opinion to be true, it just isn't.

And, the example you cite as pushing you to this post is not a failure of the revolver in question but the ammunition. If you had ammunition that one would use in an auto that suffered from the same issue would not chamber properly in an auto nor allow the slide to close.

Good luck in your quest to prove your opinion but I'm afraid it's doomed to failure.
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Old 07-11-2018, 12:36 PM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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[QUOTE=Kiwi cop;140088721
Revolvers are good for those who shoot and train little, provided they are properly maintained.

Semi autos are good for those who shoot and train a lot, given the more varied ways they can malfunction.

[/QUOTE]

But what about the revolver shooter that trains alot? I carried a 357 mag for decades on duty and shot on the pistol team. Now that I am retired I still carry a 357 mag and shoot competitively.

What you mean is more training is required to run a semi well.
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Old 07-12-2018, 06:31 AM
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I have one of the new 7 shot GP100's with 2.5" barrel and have ran across only one brand of ammo thats "tight" when loaded with 7, 6 is fine in it, the ammo is cheap WWB target rounds, all of my defense loads from multiple brands work fine.
IMO really ain't any different than a Semi that won't feed certain brands or hollow points and then you also have the magazine problems to deal with like the Shield that double over own themselves and quit working, I own a 9mm Shield and like it though, or like the Sig P365 that seems to have multiple issues.
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Old 07-12-2018, 08:54 AM
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Further testing is required. Only way to be absolutely sure is to buy as many S&W revolvers possible and see if they all shoot. Can’t be too careful when scientifically testing theories.
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Old 07-14-2018, 02:52 AM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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Originally Posted by clang444 View Post
I never saw a revolver fail to fire due to limp wristing.
I have had my 629 fatally jam due to limp wristing by a friend, it was cheap factory reload ammo, and the bullet slid forward in it's case and jammed the revolver to the point it would not fire, would not rotate at all, could not open cylinder, had to push the bullet into the case for it to rotate, complete catastrophic failure to function.

This type of failure turned the revolver into a club.

I love revolvers, but prefer to carry autos, for more capacity, and for the ease of correcting malfunctions, just replace mag and rack.
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Old 07-14-2018, 03:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Practical View Post
I like revolver's. I enjoy shooting the and just looking at them, however, I no longer believe they are as reliable as a well designed Law Enforcement Semi-Auto.

I KNOW this is an opinion. I would like to back it up with facts but without an employee leaking information or a analysis of a revolver or long term tests we can't prove it.

It's not the lock in Smith & Wesson or the changing of manufacturing processes to MIM with all major manufacturers.

I still think they better serve a gun owning population that need a gun to stored in a home and ready for use but used seldom and given little attention.

However, I think the reliability of carried often and shot often Semi-Auto design used for LEO use is more reliable for a more active an well trained user.

The issue is basically the engineering and manufacturing processes used in today's semi-autos and their widespread use ensure manufacturers compete to win these markets and put their best products forward.

In contrast, Revolvers aside for security use in some cities in the US are consumer grade products. The LOCK demonstrates this. Even on competition models like the Competitor or Performance Center guns.

What pushed me to this post was watching a youtube video of a 7 Shot GP100 which could not close it's cylinder because some brass specs were a little too large. Maybe the rims expanded or were out of spec, but when a revolver can't be closed because of it's design when loaded the manufacturer has reached a new low. Unfortunately this is not new, I had a new Colt double action revolver fail to function with almost all brands of ammo 20+ years ago. It only held 6 rounds. Just before they stopped making revolvers. I can see why they stopped. Why ruin your reputation.

I no longer believe in revolvers...
Poppycock.

I've had out-of-specification brass keep my Glock slide from going into battery.

You think that's only a revolver problem? It's not, period. And malf you can name with a revolver can be had with an auto. The reverse is NOT true.

Revolvers are more reliable. They are more durable and dependable, they are not outdated. The men that shoot them, true shootists that grew up in times when men were men, know how to shoot more than most of today's pray and sprays with their bucket of bullets under the gun blasting.

A fightsman so armed with a wheelgun of his chosing is today no less a foe than when Sammy Colt whipped up the first one in his shop over a century ago. I'd take one in a gun fight ANY DAY over the new jamomatic tupperware. WOOD AND STEEL rule the day. Plastic don't belong in no guns no how that's what ma daddy taught me.
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Old 07-14-2018, 08:33 AM
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Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos Can we show Revolver's are not as reliable as today's Semi-Autos  
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The revolver is not at fault for a crimp jump stoppage, that is an ammunition issue.

I reload and take great care in my process which results in better quality control than factory ammo. I feel that is a big part of the reliability of my Sigs and CZs. The only stopages I have had were due to poor quality factory ammo.

I have had crimp jump in a revolver. That was part of the learning process as a new reloader. That was an ammo issue.
If your revolver stops due to crud, that is a maintenance issue. If it crud’s up after only a small number of rounds, that is an ammo issue.

I have had only one firearm actually break, that was a revolver. The hand that turns the cyl broke inside the gun during normal operation. I can only assume that was a bad part.

My gut tells me that the revolver is more reliable, but there is a lot required to prove such a point. A point that no one will spend the time and money required to prove scientifically.

I carry both, and trust both equally.

If the OP is indeed a troll, then wow, that was quite a post just to get rise out of some old bones.
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