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Old 07-15-2018, 10:42 AM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Question Funny soot staining - barrel cant?

Picked up a great looking used 686-6+, but I don't think I did a good enough job giving it the once over (excitement got the best of me). When I got it out on the range I had a few light-strikes and a barely-breathe-on-it single action; those I should be able to fix by tightening up the tension on the hammer spring. However - I noticed that I had very uneven staining around the outside of the cylinder - although the soot on either side of the cone seemed pretty even. It's all on the left side just outside the cone and on the outside of the yoke, and I just noticed that the barrel is a little canted. (See pics linked below). Is the timing off, or is the cant responsible? It seemed to shoot very well otherwise. (These pics taken after 40 rounds through it)

This is my first "big" revolver - my little 642 was bought new and behaves very differently, obviously.

Any advice? Thanks in advance!

Pic1-Left Angle: LeftAngle.JPG - Google Drive

Pic2-Left Side: LeftSide.JPG - Google Drive

Pic3-Right Side: RightSide.JPG - Google Drive

Pic4-Cone: Cone.JPG - Google Drive

Pic5-Top: TopShot.JPG - Google Drive

Last edited by dhandler; 07-15-2018 at 10:43 AM.
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:07 AM
Toolguy Toolguy is offline
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Barrel cant wouldn't normally make any difference. It could be that the cylinder gap is wider on the left side due to the back of the barrel being at an angle. I have yet to see one that is perfectly square from the factory, although some are better than others. Sometimes it seems like they set the gap with a hand file.
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:15 AM
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Alk8944 Alk8944 is offline
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Sometimes it seems like they set the gap with a hand file.

It "seems" like that because that is exactly the way it is done! Maybe not two-piece barrels, but always one-piece ones! Some fitters are more skilled with hand tools than others!
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Old 07-15-2018, 12:18 PM
OldChief OldChief is online now
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Originally Posted by Alk8944 View Post
It "seems" like that because that is exactly the way it is done! Maybe not two-piece barrels, but always one-piece ones! Some fitters are more skilled with hand tools than others!
That's correct, at the S&W Revolver Armour Course we were taught to use a file when fitting the cylinder to get the correct gap between it and the forcing cone.
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Old 07-15-2018, 05:17 PM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toolguy View Post
Barrel cant wouldn't normally make any difference. It could be that the cylinder gap is wider on the left side due to the back of the barrel being at an angle. I have yet to see one that is perfectly square from the factory, although some are better than others. Sometimes it seems like they set the gap with a hand file.
Thanks for the info... I didn't think the cant would impact that, either, but I decided to ask. Perhaps the gaps are like you say, but still within spec and I am just being overly particular - especially since it is pre-owned.
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Old 07-15-2018, 08:35 PM
SLT223 SLT223 is online now
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Advice for what exactly? How does it shoot?
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Old 07-15-2018, 08:52 PM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Advice for what exactly? How does it shoot?
I am worried that the odd staining is possibly a symptom or a warning sign of a mis-aligned barrel or cylinder, or something else that actually makes the firearm dangerous to be used. It seemed to shoot fine, but it was my first time out on the range with it, so I don't have any history to judge. If somebody said, "Yes - I had the same problem and sent it in for repairs, now it's better", or "nope - that's typical, don't worry," at least I'd have some direction.

I do realize that it's really hard to make such a judgement with only a short description and some pics, but I am hoping that the huge collective experience of the forum might be able to help. If not, on my next opportunity, I'll just take it down to the shop and see if the armorer can look at it.

Thanks!
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Old 07-15-2018, 09:04 PM
OKFC05 OKFC05 is online now
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Unless it has been shot a HUGE amount, the only thing I would worry about on a clean used 686 is how much "Bubba improved it!"
I have shot them with lead loads on a long weekend shoot until they were more black than silver, and they cleaned right up, ready for next time. Soot pattern, flame cutting, drag line, stain on front of cylinder? Just clean normally, lube and shoot. Repeat PRN
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Old 07-15-2018, 09:25 PM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Unless it has been shot a HUGE amount, the only thing I would worry about on a clean used 686 is how much "Bubba improved it!"
I have shot them with lead loads on a long weekend shoot until they were more black than silver, and they cleaned right up, ready for next time. Soot pattern, flame cutting, drag line, stain on front of cylinder? Just clean normally, lube and shoot. Repeat PRN
LOL! Thanks for the guidance, and your service! :-)
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:03 PM
Execpro Execpro is offline
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That’s NOT normal!!

Been shooting revolvers for over 50 years and never saw anything like that on my many guns or anyone else’s. I owned a 686 and over 50 officers carried and shot them at State and Fed requalifications with only powder burn on the end of the cylinder which is normal for the number of rounds fired.
The picture of the cone does not look right.
I would not clean it up and call S&W and see what they say. If you send it in,it needs to be just like the pictures show. JMO!

There are a number of issues that come to mind but I will not speculate.

I would call S&W before shooting it anymore and if they won’t help you find a qualified gunsmith.

Good find and should be an easy fix.

Be SAFE and shoot often but not with that gun until it is looked at!

Last edited by Execpro; 07-15-2018 at 11:11 PM.
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Old 07-15-2018, 11:44 PM
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I see what Exactpro is saying. The powder marks on the yoke are unlike any I’ve ever seen.

If if were me, I’d call S&W tomorrow and send the photo to someone real-time via email so they can look at it. Then you’ll know whether or not to send it back.

If you DO send it back, I would not clean it either so they can see exactly what the issue is.

Best of luck, and better safe than sorry.
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Old 07-16-2018, 07:06 AM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Ok, the "nopes" have it! This is just what I was looking for - I'll be contacting S&W as soon as I can and getting their input on it.

Thanks!
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Old 07-16-2018, 10:15 AM
jnichols2 jnichols2 is offline
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Just a note: I don't think your barrel is canted. I think the front part on your rear sight mount is canted to the right (as you hold the gun). I used a 3x5 card on my screen, and can also see the screw is off center).

I'll leave the staining to the experts.
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Old 07-16-2018, 10:52 AM
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JAREDSHS JAREDSHS is offline
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How did the gun shoot—did it shoot to poa? Did it shoot nice small groups? After that many rounds you should have some ideas on whether or not it shoots well ?
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Old 07-16-2018, 01:27 PM
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bigggbbruce bigggbbruce is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jnichols2 View Post
Just a note: I don't think your barrel is canted. I think the front part on your rear sight mount is canted to the right (as you hold the gun). I used a 3x5 card on my screen, and can also see the screw is off center).

I'll leave the staining to the experts.
Look again.. barrel is canted and the rear sight is fine.
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Old 07-16-2018, 04:32 PM
Execpro Execpro is offline
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Default NOT SAFE TO SHOOT!

Upon further review of the pictures, if the cylinder is in the closed position and the cylinder is locked,then the cylinder is NOT in alignment with the barrel!
I see burn marks on the left side of the frame. This is caused by Fire (extream heat) NOT powder residue (There is a lot of that also over the entire gun).
It looks like a timing issue to me,but could also be caused by other issues as well.

Again I would tell you NOT to shoot this gun again!

Good news is that it can probably be repaired if no physical damage has been done to the frame.

Last edited by Execpro; 07-16-2018 at 04:36 PM.
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Old 07-16-2018, 04:57 PM
twodog max twodog max is offline
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The light strikes and the barely breath on it single action trigger tell me that Bubba has been at work again. That implies that no telling what else Bubba fixed. Needs expert attention.
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Old 07-16-2018, 06:08 PM
dhandler dhandler is offline
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Yup - I am going to send it in. I tried calling into S&W Customer Service a few minutes ago. I got into the queue at 5 minutes before 6 PM EST, waited on hold about 10 minutes, and then at 6:05, they just dropped my call. Now the phone says they are closed for the evening. :-( I'll try again tomorrow.

Thanks to everybody for the diagnosis assistance! You are all an awesome help!

Last edited by dhandler; 07-16-2018 at 06:10 PM.
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Old 07-19-2018, 11:44 AM
Execpro Execpro is offline
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Please let us know what the outcome is. Thanks
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