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Old 08-10-2018, 04:26 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Default Got my new Model 69 back.....but

Checked the main issue it was sent in for....Barrel/Cylinder gap and the best they could do with a new Barrel install was .011 on the left side and .005 on the right.
Guess they have trouble getting a square cut!

Well will see how it shoots but I wouldn't purchase another new S&W for the price they ask for!
My 629-2E is a nice .006 both sides.

Price on my pair of old Smiths just went up another 200 bucks!
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:34 PM
PHS327 PHS327 is offline
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Mine is .007 on both sides, all six cylinders. I'd consider yours unacceptable and send it back - again.
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Old 08-10-2018, 04:34 PM
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TAROMAN TAROMAN is offline
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Feel your frustration.
This was my new 21-4.
Widest areas were .025"
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:14 PM
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Mine is between 0.0025 and 0.003 all five charge holes.
Perfect.

Last edited by shocker; 08-10-2018 at 05:16 PM.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:17 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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The chamber throats are a bit tighter than I like at .4295 my selection of bullets I have won't slip in like all my other .44's so I will hone them out a bit to .431 which is what my others are.

I will just shoot it after getting the throats right and see how it does.
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Old 08-10-2018, 05:19 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shocker View Post
Mine is between 0.0025 and 0.003 all five charge holes.
Perfect.
Lucky man you are! None of my revolvers are that tight.

Check those feeler gauges as sometimes the thin ones like to stick together!! j/k
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Old 08-10-2018, 06:55 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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On second thought I will call them Monday and DEMAND another new M69.
I gave them a chance to fix it correctly and why should I be without my NEW revolver for another month after forking over 700+ bucks to try again?
I want to be like you guys with a nice tight new M-69 the first time around!!

Last edited by fortyshooter; 08-10-2018 at 06:57 PM.
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:10 PM
SLT223 SLT223 is offline
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I assume the back of the forcing is still hand filed to complete the barrel to cylinder gap, no? Is this really such a challenging task?
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:52 PM
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Even sawing off the forcing cone with a band saw should be straighter than 6 thousands off on one side.
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Old 08-10-2018, 08:56 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bronco45 View Post
Even sawing off the forcing cone with a band saw should be straighter than 6 thousands off on one side.
Not if your blade is dull and or the blade guides are on the loose side.
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Old 08-10-2018, 09:05 PM
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How does it shoot?
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Old 08-10-2018, 09:17 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peak53 View Post
How does it shoot?
I fired 10 rounds through it the first time I got it and knew something was not right with cylinder gap....lots of blow by and getting peppered with residue.
It did seem to shoot where I was aiming but it was having some trigger hang ups too.

Weather is a bit iffy for weekend shooting this time but even so do I WANT a new 700 buck gun that has a big gap on one side?

If I were to sell it later would YOU buy it with a gap like that at the full resale value of a used gun?

Another thing I have noticed on this revolver the cylinder hasn't hardly settled in to lock up before the hammer falls....it is VERY close almost looking like it is still rotating as the hammer starts to fall.
My other revolvers Smith,Ruger and Charter Arms there is a definite cylinder locked in period before the hammer is released.

What happens after some wear occurs?
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Old 08-10-2018, 09:26 PM
PHS327 PHS327 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PHS327 View Post
Mine is .007 on both sides, all six cylinders. I'd consider yours unacceptable and send it back - again.
I meant 5 cylinders. All my other guns are six shooters except my single shot.
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Old 08-10-2018, 09:42 PM
riverrat38 riverrat38 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fortyshooter View Post
Checked the main issue it was sent in for....Barrel/Cylinder gap and the best they could do with a new Barrel install was .011 on the left side and .005 on the right.
Guess they have trouble getting a square cut!

Well will see how it shoots but I wouldn't purchase another new S&W for the price they ask for!
My 629-2E is a nice .006 both sides.

Price on my pair of old Smiths just went up another 200 bucks!
Brings new meaning to the term "Kit gun"!
Some assembly required.
Tools needed; Metal lathe, milling machine, drill press....
For experienced builders only.

Best,
Rick
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  #15  
Old 08-10-2018, 10:50 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riverrat38 View Post
Brings new meaning to the term "Kit gun"!
Some assembly required.
Tools needed; Metal lathe, milling machine, drill press....
For experienced builders only.

Best,
Rick
I was thinking the same thing and sell them at a lower price!

Also I have all the equipment you mentioned plus 40 yrs. of Tool&Die work.
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  #16  
Old 08-10-2018, 11:08 PM
kaaskop49 kaaskop49 is online now
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I understand your frustration. However, I don't know that I would DEMAND anything. People tend to tune out those who demand, no matter how correct they may be. Your B/C gap is X on one side and Y on the other and it is spitting lead. That would seem to cover it. Ask what they would recommend. Should it be returned again for service or would a new gun be indicated? Offer suggestions. YMMV

Kaaskop49
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Old 08-10-2018, 11:33 PM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaaskop49 View Post
I understand your frustration. However, I don't know that I would DEMAND anything. People tend to tune out those who demand, no matter how correct they may be. Your B/C gap is X on one side and Y on the other and it is spitting lead. That would seem to cover it. Ask what they would recommend. Should it be returned again for service or would a new gun be indicated? Offer suggestions. YMMV

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103
Thanks for that tip!

Dear Sirs...
For the money paid I will give you fine folks a 3rd chance to supply me with a replacement NEW M-69 that can meet or exceed Charter Arms Company standards of quality!
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  #18  
Old 08-11-2018, 12:14 AM
amazingflapjack amazingflapjack is offline
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Guys, the days of wine and roses are gone.
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Old 08-11-2018, 08:21 AM
smithman smithman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaaskop49 View Post
I understand your frustration. However, I don't know that I would DEMAND anything. People tend to tune out those who demand, no matter how correct they may be. Your B/C gap is X on one side and Y on the other and it is spitting lead. That would seem to cover it. Ask what they would recommend. Should it be returned again for service or would a new gun be indicated? Offer suggestions. YMMV

Kaaskop49
Shield #5103
I think I would have been out of courtesy after S&Ws second failed attempt at getting the gun right.
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  #20  
Old 08-11-2018, 08:43 AM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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Default Not beating a dead horse but looking for comparison..M-69

For those that have one...When you pull the trigger in DA mode does your cylinder lock up and settle in for a period of time with a nice click before the hammer starts to fall?

My other Smiths and brands of DA revolvers do but my M-69 is right on the ragged edge of still moving to lock up as the hammer is falling. However the chambers are lined up perfectly with hammer down.

Just looking to see what yours are like. I need to make note of this info before this gun goes back for replacement or repair.

Last edited by fortyshooter; 08-11-2018 at 08:45 AM.
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Old 08-11-2018, 09:28 AM
smithman smithman is offline
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Are you putting empty cases in the cylinder before doing this carry up test?
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Old 08-11-2018, 09:35 AM
fortyshooter fortyshooter is offline
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No and I didn't do it with the other revolvers when I was comparing. But I will try it with empties that are stuffed to same weight as loaded ammo.

Looking at the weather down at my range area which is 30 miles away and just might run down there and shoot the **** out of it...rain be damned!!

I really like the M69 size,feel and .44 Mag capability...just got to get these build quality issues straight which SHOULD be the easy part. The trigger action is really nice!

Last edited by fortyshooter; 08-11-2018 at 09:38 AM.
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  #23  
Old 08-11-2018, 11:12 AM
HamHands HamHands is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fortyshooter View Post
Checked the main issue it was sent in for....Barrel/Cylinder gap and the best they could do with a new Barrel install was .011 on the left side and .005 on the right.
Guess they have trouble getting a square cut!

Well will see how it shoots but I wouldn't purchase another new S&W for the price they ask for!
My 629-2E is a nice .006 both sides.

Price on my pair of old Smiths just went up another 200 bucks!

I bet it is a near perfect .006 on the 629-2E... That Revo was made during a time when there was much more focus on craftsmanship and hand fitting and tolerances. Comparing that baby to a 629-6 or so... well... I won't do it because it isn't really fair to the finer points the art of gun-making.

I'm keeping my current Smiths because I have fixed/modified them to be 100% but I won't be buying anything else unless it's vintage early 80's and earlier Smiths and Colts.

I have a current production M625 and a M629. Both are lacking in the fit and finish and QA/QC department when compared to my Lew Horton Special M29 and 70's production "J" frames. Both the M625 and the M629 had nearly every screw back out of them before the first 200 factory loaded rounds; i.e. the cylinder release screws, yoke, side-plate, & strain screws backed out considerably under recoil of factory loaded ammo.

The cylinder release and strain screws backed out enough in both to cause cylinder release malfunctions and light strikes. Both were easily remedied (by me) with a thorough disassembly & cleaning of the revo's themselves &
every screw mentioned, their respective holes/threads and then reinstalled with the proper drivers and 2 dabs of Purple Loc-Tite; then torqued down to two hairs past snug. None of the aforementioned screws have ever backed out since even with Buffalo Bore 255 grain .45Supers and 300 grain Hard Cast Underwood's... and a couple thousand, (non-boutique), full house factory loads thru each Revo.


The screw back outs is something that has never happened in my 70's and 80's made Smiths and Colt Agent. Light strikes could happen at the worst time. It's not something you expect to happen in an $800+ revolver. So with new Smith's, if you are going to put more than 500 rounds thru them and not leave em' stuffed in a sock drawer... then we need to be proactive and able to maintain them.

This has been my experience with current production Smith Revo's and of course YMMV...
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Old 08-11-2018, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fortyshooter View Post
For those that have one...When you pull the trigger in DA mode does your cylinder lock up and settle in for a period of time with a nice click before the hammer starts to fall?

My other Smiths and brands of DA revolvers do but my M-69 is right on the ragged edge of still moving to lock up as the hammer is falling. However the chambers are lined up perfectly with hammer down.

Just looking to see what yours are like. I need to make note of this info before this gun goes back for replacement or repair.
Mine seems OK in that respect. I'd do a video but I don't really have a place to upload it to or the bandwidth for practical video uploads. Comparing it to my 629-4, the hammer on the 629 travels a good deal farther back after cylinder lock-up before hammer drop as compared to my 69. They are very different guns though so I doubt that's a valid comparison.

Last edited by oink; 08-11-2018 at 12:48 PM. Reason: Typo
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  #25  
Old 08-11-2018, 01:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fortyshooter View Post
For those that have one...When you pull the trigger in DA mode does your cylinder lock up and settle in for a period of time with a nice click before the hammer starts to fall?
Answer: No

I don't have an N-frame but I checked my J-frame 8 shot. Cylinder lock up occurs while the hammer is still moving to full cock. With five charge holes the cylinder has to spin 72 degrees vs. 60 for a six shot. Perhaps all the 5 shot Smiths are like the 69.
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Old 08-11-2018, 02:06 PM
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Well, comparing to my model 60 no dash, the 60 seems in
between the 69 and the 629. I'm thinking the only valid comparison is with another model 69.
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Old 08-11-2018, 03:40 PM
Brad Cayton Brad Cayton is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fortyshooter View Post
For those that have one...When you pull the trigger in DA mode does your cylinder lock up and settle in for a period of time with a nice click before the hammer starts to fall?

My other Smiths and brands of DA revolvers do but my M-69 is right on the ragged edge of still moving to lock up as the hammer is falling. However the chambers are lined up perfectly with hammer down.

Just looking to see what yours are like. I need to make note of this info before this gun goes back for replacement or repair.
I just tried my 69 as you asked but with an empty cylinder. It does look up just before the hammer falls. My 5 shot 642 cylinder locks up a little quicker than the 69. Those are the only 5 shot Smiths I have
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