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S&W Revolvers: 1980 to the Present All NON-PINNED Barrels, the L-Frames, and the New Era Revolvers


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  #1  
Old 12-23-2019, 09:19 PM
AlwaysArmed AlwaysArmed is offline
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An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old  
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Old 12-23-2019, 11:49 PM
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Great video
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Old 12-24-2019, 01:43 AM
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Good video but he does kinda make it sound like older Smiths were as fragile as a handful of autumn leaves!
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Old 12-24-2019, 07:51 AM
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Interesting video- thanks for posting this up OP.
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Old 12-24-2019, 08:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jframejoey View Post
Good video but he does kinda make it sound like older Smiths were as fragile as a handful of autumn leaves!
Yeah, I don't buy his "new stuff is great, vintage stuff is cheap junk" attitude and statements at all. Something is very screwy about him. He sounds more like an S&W salesman than an S&W armorer.

Nothing wrong with praising the new stuff if that is your taste, but bashing the vintage guns like that just doesn't make sense.
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Old 12-24-2019, 08:53 AM
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It's less about "bashing the
vintage guns" than pointing
out what were the problems
often encountered in servicing
them.

I'd say that the changes he points
out for the new guns are valid
points to praise in comparison with
maintenance or building the older
ones.

Some of the hand fitting needed for
the older models also opened the
door/doors to more mistakes that
the craftsmen of old might and did
make on a given gun.
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Old 12-24-2019, 11:16 AM
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He lost me when he assured us “it’s nothing that can go wrong. It’s nothing that can accidentally turn” when speaking of the lock.
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Old 12-24-2019, 12:38 PM
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Feathers ruffled, love it.

Merry Christmas y’all
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Old 12-24-2019, 02:57 PM
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I attended the same armorers school in the last class John Contro taught and when he was mentoring the new instructor, Don Dion. The behind the scenes comments from these guys came to recall as I watched the video. I agree that real craftsmen made the early guns but there are so many things that need to mesh together to enable a proper working order that something had to change. Many of the new changes omitted time consuming adjustments that would make hand fitting cost prohibitive now. Thankfully I can diagnose issues and make repairs on mine and friends older guns at least until parts become harder to get. I still don’t care for the IL and the 2 piece barrel but I do see improvements.
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Old 12-24-2019, 04:14 PM
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A similar discussion is taking place on the older forum. Gunblue490 is no “salesman” for S&W. In fact, after following his channel for years, I believe that he prefers Rugers.
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Old 12-24-2019, 04:35 PM
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I liked the video, heck of a salesman! I love the fact that if you want,you can still buy a new S&W revolver or an old P&R....will I buy a new one to go with my old ones, not likely,but maybe....My old 1971 vette is a far cry from the new mid-engine,but they're both Corvettes, and both fun, just like the two revolvers!
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Old 12-24-2019, 05:23 PM
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Older S&Ws are the triumph of craftsmanship over engineering, new S&Ws are the other way round. I prefer craftsmanship, but appreciate engineering also.
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Old 12-24-2019, 05:32 PM
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Change is hard to accept. I brought a S&W Model 64 pinned barrel a couple of months ago and am as proud as a Daddy with newborn baby. I will choose a old pinned barrel S&W over a modern ones almost all of the time.

However my wife choose the M&P 1.0 9mm a couple of years ago that she really likes and I gave a Shield 9mm this year as a gift. We shot the Shield Sunday and it is a really comfortable gun to shoot. Now I am too stubborn to own one for myself but that doesn’t mean I will not shoot hers.
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Old 12-24-2019, 06:35 PM
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I own 2 newer guns and they shoot and handle like a dream, but.....there is just that history of the old guns that draws me like a magnet and I guess they always will.
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Old 12-24-2019, 10:10 PM
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An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old An old S&W armorer talks new vs. old  
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Back in "the day" labor was cheap and technology was expensive. In the 21st Century technology is cheap and labor is expensive. Especially in the USA. I've spent a lot of the day today watching this man's videos. As a 40+ year industrial technician I must say I agree with a lot of what he says. Just finishing up watching his video on cleaning and lubricating the AR-15. I just ordered a three pack of that lube from Sportsman Guide.
AA
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Old 12-25-2019, 12:13 AM
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Seems to me that in the video he is looking at the new design from his prospective as an armorer. The guns he serviced were tools and in that role many issues he feels were addressed. Many of his issues with the old designs just fade away for me because my revolvers are always clean never banged around and I can in the first place purchase my guns that are without many of the wear and abuse signs and symptoms. He was also an armorer working on model number guns during a time that as soon as Bangor Punta took over had made cost saving changes and shortcuts that allowed the product quality to suffer as he notes on the internals. If I were to buy a gun that I was going to use daily as a tool I would heed his warnings.
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Old 12-25-2019, 06:23 PM
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Amen to this video.

Nostalgia is always more glorious than reality.

I spent 40 years in the motorcycle business and went from the era where anything that turned or slid had to have is bushing reamed or its bearing surface fitted, to that wonderful time when materials and molding and machining centers became so consistent that factory parts just fell together.

And they ran, handled, and stopped much better than the oldies.

The same thing with today's cars.

But even with the oil spots on the floor, the anemic brakes, the short travel, "wobbly" suspensions, the narrow tires, the "lottery" electrics, and the adventure of wondering if you would make it home, it was always fun listening to the old guys fondly and proudly "mis-remembering" how great the old stuff was.

These are the "good old days".

John
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Old 12-25-2019, 07:20 PM
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As a person who has done hand fitting and file work, there's nothing exciting about it. Much prefer if the parts were dimensionally correct in the first place. It's OK to be a humble "assembler".
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Old 12-25-2019, 07:57 PM
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i happen to agree with this guy. if you watch his other vids you will see he is most definitely a fan of classic firearms. He has no commercial interest in his opinion. His opinion seems to be purely a technical perspective from someone who knows the work and issues.

I also think the new model 19 is the nicest looking new revolver currently available.
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Old 12-25-2019, 08:06 PM
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i happen to agree with this guy. if you watch his other vids you will see he is most definitely a fan of classic firearms. He has no commercial interest in his opinion. His opinion seems to be purely a technical perspective from someone who knows the work and issues.

I also think the new model 19 is the nicest looking new revolver currently available.
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Old 12-26-2019, 11:18 PM
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I finally watched the whole video. It was an interesting video and I agree that there appear to be some design improvements.

The problem is that I walked into B & H Police Supply today. They had one of the new model 66 revolvers. It initially looked nice. I asked to see it and things went downhill quickly. The action was terrible even for a brand new gun not broken in. The star (or whatever) had sharp raised burs on it. The ball of the ball detent replacing the old ejector rod lock didn't really engage anything and was just kind of suspended in air in the detent. The barrel shroud was canted left. The milled slot for the rear sight was milled off center right. What a tu**. Well it did look nice until you looked a little closer.

On the other hand, they also had a new 629. It also looked nice (other than that darn IL). Now it doesn't have the new lock up or the 2 piece barrel which I think could be improvements, but everything looked straight on it and it did have a very decent action for a new gun. I'm kinda liking it as my old 629 has seen some miles.

By the way, I thought all of the new 629s had the full lug barrel, which I hate. This one didn't have the lug and aside from the IL sure looked like my old gun. It was wearing rubber and I guess it's a RB under the rubber but oh well.
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