Model 25-2 Vs Model 25-5. Which of these is more versatile? Prefered? I have a 25-5 that I truly enjoy. I have an original Colt Series 70 National Match that is a joy to shoot. Just wondering what the board members think of the 25-2's.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

I see the main advantage of the 25-2 is the wider availability and lower cost (sometimes) of factory .45 ACP. If you reload the .45 Colt sounds like a lot of fun too.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

What are you going to do with it? The 25-2 is great on paper, tin cans and various targets of opportunity. The 25-5 (with more barrel length options) will do the same and can also be used for hunting.

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S&W factory revolver armorer

I reload for both. I have a Colt Model 1909 U.S.Army that i reload to the original specification load that is a hoot to shoot.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

I do not hunt anymore. So mainly it would just be paper. My 25-5 is a 6 inch.

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USMC 69-93 Combat Pistol Inst.

Which is the most versitile depends on if you are a hand loader or not

To a hand loader there is not much of a difference

Since the -2 engineering revision is chambered for the 45 ACP cartridge which is primarily for auto loading pistols, the power range of Factory ammunition must be limited to what will cause the pistol to cycle.

If you are a hand loader, that is not an issue for the -2. You can load the cartridge very soft or on the hot side. Just remember not to use these custom loads in your auto loading pistol. You can load using 45 Auto Rim cases to prevent the ammunition from ever being confused with hand loads for the auto pistol.

Now, since the -5 engineering revision is chambered for the 45 Long Colt cartridge, it would be the most versitile to someone that is not a hand loader.

Factory Ammunition is available from soft shooting Cowboy loads to powerful hunting ammunition

Hand loaded ammunition can be wherever you want it to be power wise .

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"Acta non verba"

Really, they are two entirely different revolvers, in my mind. I think of the 25-2 as a paper-puncher. In the field, you can do the same things easier with your 1911 - less weight and bulk. At the target range, the 25-2 puts its empty brass in your hands. Whether you are satisfied with its accuracy is up to you. My own opinion is that even a good one won’t outshoot a well-tuned 1911. In formal target shooting, in rapid-fire they're a big nuisance, and they’re also a nuisance also if you practice with lead. “JMHO”

The 25-5 is like the 29. Sure, you can use it for casual target shooting, but I think of it as a mid-range .45 Colt field gun. You won’t load it up like a Ruger or TC, but you can do a little better than a 250 at 850 and still be reasonably safe. Maybe a 250-270 at 950-1000, if you need it? Some might push it a little harder. Either way, a good .45-caliber 250 LSWC at 1000 FPS is nothing to sneeze at. The bigger issue with the 25-5, and the 25-2 suffers from the same, is exit bore size. Some of these guns, in both models, have exit bores of 0.455” to 0.456”, maybe even a shade bigger, which really complicates things. The 25-9 version fixed that problem, as did some of the later 25-5s, but if you have one of the older guns, the exit bore size is a limiting factor. I am not a fan of the earlier guns. They were pretty, but that’s about all, unless you could find or make the correct bullets to make them click. Nowadays, it is much easier to order custom molds, so getting over-size .45 bullets is a minor problem compared to, say, thirty-years ago. More “JMHO.”

I bought a 25-2 to use on revolver days in bowling pin matches. Uses same ammo as 1911 so only one reloader. With moon clips it’s the fastest revolver reload on the planet. The 6inch N frame is a hoot to shoot. I had my trigger narrowed and polished and chambers chamfered.

The 25-2 is a target gun. It does very well in that capacity. I have one and its only used for target shooting. It very rarely gets shot with anything other than 200gr SWC target loads.
The 25-5 is an all purpose gun. Good for punching paper, self defense or hunting. The .45 Colt is an extremely versatile cartridge, especially if you reload. I like it!

The bottom right gun is my 25-2. All the rest are in .45 Colt.

The comment on the 25-7 is spot on. Smith and Wesson really hit the nail on the head with that one. Once I found out about them I had to have one. Got tired of buying model 29s and having .431-.432" bullets fall through the cylinder. I have a really early 629 with the same problem.

Not everyone may agree but I have a -5 that's cut for moon clips. Seems to work well.

My 25-2 (45acp) came with an extra cylinder chambered in 45LC. The 45LC rounds come close to the end of the cylinder, but most ammo functions fine. Without extensive, controlled testing, it seems to be equally accurate with either set-up and offers the best of both worlds.

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Free advice is worth the price

Although this is not .45 LC vs.45ACP, I sort of had the same dilemma long ago. 30 years ago I was on the fence about a .44 mag or a .45 ACP revolver. Since I would have shot 99% light Specials anyway, and I was also already set up for .45ACP progressive loading AND bullet casting, I went with the .45 ACP.

I sort of would reason this out the same way.

Then again, as I got older and wiser, I realized the the REAL answer was to have both, so now I do!!

How hard would it be to find a 45LC cylinder for the 25-2 & where would be the best places to look for it?

Probably pretty scarce. You could always buy a .44 Magnum cylinder and have it shortened, reamed, and fit.

foxy320: The .45 Colt cylinder is longer by about 0.14 " meaning you would have to shorten the barrel stub to make it fit. This would also mean that you can't go back to the .45acp cylinder because it would now be too short.
If you go back and look at my picture, you'll notice the custom snubby .45 Colt. That was originally a 6" Model 25-2 barrel. I had to cut both ends to get what I wanted.

The 25-2 that Tony2much mentioned was a special limited factory run and now very hard to find. Yes, most .45 Colts will fit, but the cylinder is the same length as the .45acp. You have to be careful of overall cartridge length. Some heavy bullets are too long and stick out the front of the cylinder preventing it from rotating.
I suppose you could shorten and ream a .44 Magum cylinder as suggested, but then you're back to the OAL problem.

The change you're asking about would be expensive and impractical. You'd be better off just finding a used 25-5.

l acp guns and several collt guns. More is better!

I’m with Jack the Toad, I’d have your cylinder on your 25-5 cut for moon clips. I used Pinnacle High Performance in Pa. TK Custom also cuts cylinders. That said you can’t own too many 25s, grab a -2

Thanks guys. Really like convertible revolvers but can see this would not be practical

I think you have an excellent combo already!

My choice for .45 ACP revolvers are the shorter barreled 625s. Generally fired DA.
My 25-5s are more accurate than any of my blued .45ACP S&W revolvers, but none is a 25-2. M1917s and a very nice 1955. All of which have ludicrous 0.457-0.458" cylinder throats.
Even the "big throated" early 25-5s aren't that loosey-goosey!

With proper handloads the 25-2 will handle almost any hunting challenge the 25-5 will.

In the S&W N-frame, .45 Colt loses a lot of its advantage since it can't be loaded as hot as in a Ruger.

I bought a Model 25-5 4" gun in the early 1980's when S&W reintroduced them. It was a beautiful gun and in the presentation case. My intention was to shoot the heck out of it with cast bullets at moderate velocities.

It was also one of the guns that had ridiculously large cylinder throats, something like .457". It leaded badly. S&W should have been ashamed of themselves for allowing guns like that to get off the assembly line. I ended up selling it at a loss.

I would take a set of pin gauges with me if i were ever to consider another one. I seem to recall that a few years after that debacle S&W would replace the cylinder with one of more proper dimensions if the customer complained and I would have taken them up on it but it was too late.

Interestingly enough, I also have a Model 25-2 in .45 ACP. It has .455" throats and is very accurate with hardball. I understand that they also can be made to shoot accurately with really hard cast round nose bullets but haven't tried anything but factory 230 gr. ball ammo in it.

My very first new S&W was an "N" prefix 25-5 which had the big throats. But at the time Winchester sold ammo and lead bullets which had 0.456" bullets, so after a little bit of "hard knocks" education, no worries! By the time Winchester quit selling those big old 255gr "oversized" hollow based bullets I had figured out other options. With either size throat, they can be made to shoot. I still have a few boxes of those Winchester projectiles, mostly due to those other options!

( don't think S&W was thinking they were "wrong" to put the "old spec." dimensions in the new .45 Colts, it was just that folk were gravitating towards a uniform .45 bullet size that favored, logically, the .45 ACP.

On the other hand, I've yet to encounter definitive history on the rationale behind the dimenioning of the old .45 ACP revolvers. One theory was that it kept pressures down on the non heat treated cylinders as commonly used in WWI. Otherwise,???

The pre-model number 1950 Target and 1955 Target were designed and built for Bullseye match use. These older ones have tight match chambers and good throats, generally .453" +/- .001". Cast lead works great. Since there is no taper from chamber to throat, your ammo needs to be perfect, at least if using sharp shouldered bullets seated out of the case mouth.
The reward is excellent accuracy.
I like using a 45 Long Colt resizing die. Very gentle on your brass, and sizes enough for lead bullet use.

Personally, I suspect that the rationale for oversized throats was due to issues people were having using improperly loaded ammo. In such instances, cartridges may not fully chamber or may back out against the recoil shield, causing binding.

The later non-pinned 25-5s in 45 Colt are very nice, too. And, you can have lots of fun shooting black powder out of them. No kidding! It's easy to replicate the 1909 45 Colt DA load. Clean up is not a problem. (The old corrosive primers were the big problem). Anyhow, it adds a whole dimension of fun to your S&W big bore revolver experience.
Neither the ACP or "Long Colt" versions are magnums. Velocity and pressure limits must be kept down. But, either will punch big holes, shoot accurately (if you find the right ones) and offer "enough" (?) power by virtue of big, heavy chunks of lead.

Jim

For comparison, here are the throat measurements other S&W .45 ACP revolvers in my collection:

Model 1917 from October 1918: .453"
Model 1950 Army Pre-Model 22 from June 1952: .455"
.45 Cal. Model 1950 Pre-Model 26 from April 1956 : .455"

Considering that the Model 1917 was expected to be used in trench warfare conditions, you would think that one has the most generous chambers. It does have a 0.010" barrel cylinder gap which seems logical.

In the immediate years following WWII, a lot of new Bullseye shooters used surplus 1917s to shoot the 45 stage of the 2700 match. It was a long time, and a lot of gunsmith experimentation later, before guys were able to shoot 50 yard slow fire scores using a 1911 that compared to what could be done with a stock 1917.
Obviously, that was the real reason behind the early "pre-model number" 1950 and 1955 Targets.
Another winner to come out during the Carl Hellstrom era.

Jim

I have both a -2 and a -5. Both have comparable barrel lengths. The one I enjoy shooting the most is the -2. I guess I prefer the ACP cartridge over the long Colt cartridge. Both can achieve the same ballistics in the N frame.

Kevin

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Unshared knowledge is wasted.

If you're looking at a .45 Colt S&W you need to do the "plunk" test. Take a standard lead .452 .45 caliber bullet and simply drop it through the chambers. If it hangs up slightly, the throats are good. If it drops straight through, they're over sized. Quick and simple.
Generally speaking, S&W got the throats right at about the same time they did away with pinned barrels. Usually non-pinned guns will have proper throats. However, as with all things S&W, this is not always true. Some pinned barrel guns are good while some non-pinned guns are over sized. Thus the plunk test.
BTW: every one of the 125th Anniversary guns that I've ever seen had badly over sized throats. They may be pretty, but they don't shoot worth a hoot.

Have you ever found a S&W Model 25-2 45 Colt?
I may be able to help with that piece in barrel length of 8 3/8".

M25-2's that were chambered for .45C had a cylinder the same length (1.67") as the ones in the M25-5/7/9 etc. The M25-3 and -4 are "short cylinder" .45C and have cylinders the same length (1.53") as the .45 Auto versions. So, if you find a .45C short cylinder, you'd be good to go, there may be a few thousandths difference in the B-C gap between them but still be within spec. If you found a long .45C cylinder, you'd have to have the forcing cone rebated to fit, and then the .45 Auto cylinder would no longer work.

I've never really cared for the idea of a rimless cartridge designed for a semiauto in a revolver. I do love my M25-5 though, and it is a frequent range attendee. My hands are on the small size of average, I put a set of magnas on it and took the targets off. Recoil is mild enough not to matter.

Look on eBay, try Numrich Gun Parts, or gun shows, or put a WTB ad on the forums.

Attached Images

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Interesting thread. Hair Trigger gets it right. There was never a 45 long colt cartridge. It is a 45 Colt

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Pete
I ain't no fortunate son

A few Police Departments authorized the 25-2 and 25-5 as duty revolvers before the 9mm became the rage. The advantage of the 25-2 with moon clips you can carry twice as much ammunition. With the 25-5 you have a speedloader pouch that can hold two speedloaders (12 rounds) but with the 25-2 you can put two loaded moonclips in the space of one speedloader. (24 rounds)

I prefer the 25-2 for reloading. Light SWC for hole punching and I also load the 45 Auto Rim.

The only problem with that fable is the cylinders on ALL S&W Model 1917 revolvers were heat treated by the specifications set down by the Army.

Kevin

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Unshared knowledge is wasted.

It's just what I've read. IIRC, most other S&W cylinders weren't heat treated until later, guessing it started with the .357? The M1917s even had "non standard" S&W rifling to meet military specifications. There must have been some logic to the throat size. Certainly not accidental.

BTW, here's a link to SAAMI's history. Not sure what their predecessor (SAMSAA) had to do with setting the sizes of throats and such in regards to the .45 ACP revolvers.

History - SAAMI

The Model 1917 was designed prior to the involvement of the United States in WW I. The Army had the Model 1911 but Colt was unable to produce them fast enough. The Army ad already done the ground work when they came up with the specifications for the 1911. S&W adapted them to the revolver but ALL 1917s had heat treated cylinders. Other models followed suit when the war ended.

Kevin

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Unshared knowledge is wasted.