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Old 08-25-2013, 03:03 PM
viceunit viceunit is offline
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Default Sticky extraction m36

I have a nickel model 36 no dash. Factory nickel, purchased 33+ years ago for my dad. He hardly ever shot it, but when we did I noticed it was hard to extract empties. I thought it just needed cleaning. Sat in a drawer for over 30 years until he gave it to me a few years ago. I hope I can explain the malfunction accurately.

Experimenting with it with empty cases, I found that one chamber in particular would hang up. If I load only one case into that chamber the extractor star binds on the case. No evidence of any bend in the extractor shaft. When I let the extractor down and turn the gun over, gravity will allow the empty case to fall out. Cylinders are clean. The gun looks new.

At the advice of some local knowledgeable people, I tried polishing the part of the extractor where it contact the case. I treaded carefully here with a fine sandpaper drum about the size of a .38 special case chucked in a cordless drill on low rpm. The idea was just to clean off any burrs not visible to my eye.

After that the extraction seemed a little better, but mixing various empty cases and loading all five chambers I was back to square one - hard extraction. The star will lift the cases about 3/8 inch and I cannot lift them any higher with the extractor. However, I can pick 4 of the cases easily out of their chambers with my fingers. That fifth one was holding up the works. If I load 4 into all chambers except the problem chamber, I can extract all 4 without issue.

I know that during shooting you turn the gun with barrel up and give a firm pump on the extractor. When I do that gravity will let 4 fall out, the fifth one is bound up. It does not happen every time, and that is what is puzzling me.

Sometimes it works best with all five empties because I think that helps keep the star concentrically aligned. So, for about every ten tries, it works as it is supposed to 2 times. 20% is not good enough.

Of note, when I load the gun with live ammo, the extractor removes them easily. The spent cases I was using to test the gun were fired in other guns. But, recently firing this gun gave the same results as my mixed empties. So, thinking that bad chamber #5 was causing the case to expand more than others is not the cause, I think, because I get the same results from empties I fished out of a coffee can.

I am thinking of sending this gun to S&W, but wanted to post here in the event someone has had a similar malfunction. Thanks for any help.
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Last edited by viceunit; 08-25-2013 at 03:18 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 08-25-2013, 04:50 PM
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First, forget how the gun extracts with fired cases which were fired in another gun, this means nothing. The only test that indicates anything at all is how cases from ammunition just fired in your gun extract. Do not even try extracting them and re-inserting into the cylinder, only how they extract immediately after firing means a thing. All charge holes are not identical even in the same cylinder. (Note: Revolvers have only one cylinder, but multiple charge holes [chambers]).

When you shoot the gun pay attention to which charge hole is giving extraction problems, and if it is always the same one. Since this is a factory Nickled gun there would be a N stamped on the cylinder as a reference point.

If, as you say, the case extracts about 1/4" and then hangs up it is a problem with the chamber, not the extractor! Plating tends to build up on sharp corners causing what amounts to a burr. DO NOT use a Dremel to remove this! Instead, first disassemble the cylinder, then, using a round "Crock Stick" (ceramic sharpening stone) or fine Aluminum oxide polishing paper wrapped on a dowel, polish the edge of the chambers under the extractor just enough to remove the sharpness on the corner. (You can use a very fine Cratex polishing tip in a Dremel tool, but very carefully. All you are doing is removing a fine burr!)

Unless the one chamber is jugged from a very heavy load I can guarantee this will fix it. I have worked on both new and factory re-Nickeled guns that have had extraction problems and, so far, deburring the chamber has always worked. I have always used a ceramic rod.
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Old 08-25-2013, 08:28 PM
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Thank you for the reply. Using the N stamped on the cylinder, it is the charge hole (chamber?) directly to the right of the N. This is the same charge hole that gives immediate extraction problems when live firing. It is the same charge hole that gives extraction problems with my mixed test empty cases.

I understand what you are saying. What is confounding me is that I can easily pick out the empty brass from this charge hole with my fingernails. But, when I try to push it out with the extractor, it hangs up. That is what seems counter-intuitive to me. It is as though the extractor is not pushing the case out exactly parallel to the bore of the charge hole. Like it is binding up somehow.

I will try your suggestion and let you know if there is any improvement.

Thanks
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Old 09-02-2013, 12:23 PM
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Default extractor problem

Have you checked under the extractor to see if both of the alignment pins are in place? If they are, check to see that they are straight, and they are not binding when the cylinder is fully loaded with empty casings. Sometimes using a broach to very lightly touch up the alignment holes in the extractor body itself will help with the problem you are describing.
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Old 09-04-2013, 01:19 AM
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The extractor shaft might not be bent but it have minor damage or a scratch to it inside the housing that you can not see, unless you pull the whole member out and examine it.

You might make sure the springs are 100% also , while you have the weapon broke down. A broken spring is a long shot
but you never know.

Good luck finding what is "Binding up" on case extraction.
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Old 09-05-2013, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by armorer951 View Post
Have you checked under the extractor to see if both of the alignment pins are in place? If they are, check to see that they are straight, and they are not binding when the cylinder is fully loaded with empty casings. Sometimes using a broach to very lightly touch up the alignment holes in the extractor body itself will help with the problem you are describing.
Thanks. Yes I did check that. When cycled empty the extractor star cleanly aligns with the pins. I can load 4 empties in the non-problem charge holes and they eject without difficulty. If I add one in the fifth hole, it binds up the whole works.

I have not yet had an opportunity to attempt some of the suggestions. I will update the post to report a resolution to the problem.
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Old 09-06-2013, 08:34 AM
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Another crazy idea......put Dykem or magic marker on the sides of a casing and push it into the offending cyl hole....then push it out with the extractor. Pehaps that will show where the contact point is, or some burr or other "artifact" that needs to be removed.
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