Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Ammunition-Gunsmithing > S&W-Smithing

Notices

S&W-Smithing Maintenance, Repair, and Enhancement of Smith & Wesson and Other Firearms.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-08-2017, 05:12 PM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar

I offered Small Shop Metal Prep and Rust bluing Seminar this summer 2017. When Jim Fisher decided to attend I planned to gear some of the study to S&W refinishing.

These are not factory methods but we can accomplish a quite lovely finish with hand polishing and rust bluing. The bluing is deep and dark in color and similar to a pre-war satin finish.

Jim brought a couple of no-finish1917 he wanted to do in class and we began with hand polishing. I just had two students in this group for 2017 (normally four students) and decided to run the program with me polishing and bluing a Colt SAA as it was a fulltime demonstration.

Boiling parts

Jim, Wheel carding parts

Blued Colt SAA and 1917 parts

The finished revolver had a few parts with fewer coats but they matched pretty well and Jim can continue the process when he gets it set up in his shop at home. We also did a batch of nitre blued screws seen on Jim’s revolver.


The barrel is not quite tight nor is the sideplate completely seated because the gun is not fully assembled. By Golly the bluing looks good.
Steven Dodd Hughes

Last edited by SDH; 07-08-2017 at 05:13 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-08-2017, 05:43 PM
ACORN's Avatar
ACORN ACORN is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: North Huntingdon Pa.
Posts: 4,530
Likes: 7,650
Liked 9,978 Times in 2,953 Posts
Default

I wish there was something similar around me. My Brazilian has no finish but I can only find a couple light pits under the grips. A perfect candidate.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #3  
Old 07-08-2017, 06:12 PM
DWalt's Avatar
DWalt DWalt is online now
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: South Texas & San Antonio
Posts: 33,595
Likes: 239
Liked 29,105 Times in 14,073 Posts
Default

Brownell's (and other places) supply materials needed for rust bluing, and some of the older gunsmithing books, such as those by James Howe and Roy Dunlap, provide fairly extensive information on exactly how it is done. Basically, it is controlled metal rusting, and for a long time many commercial gunmakers did all their finishing by rust bluing. It's not that difficult to do, but is fairly labor intensive, especially as it involves thorough surface preparation.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #4  
Old 07-08-2017, 06:33 PM
zipty6 zipty6 is online now
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 595
Likes: 4,510
Liked 2,074 Times in 336 Posts
Default

That looks great. How many rust cycles did you perform?

Rust Bluing is a great option for anyone willing to try it.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #5  
Old 07-08-2017, 06:51 PM
Tyrod Tyrod is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sunny Central Florida
Posts: 1,231
Likes: 334
Liked 993 Times in 378 Posts
Default

While not viable as a commercial operation, rust bluing can be done at home quite easily. With a minimal investment in chemicals & tools, bubba can easily produce quite acceptable parts. Much like other hobby endeavors, one can swap time for money. I think the key is to buy cheap guns that are finish challenged to practice on before trying it on more expensive guns.
__________________
NRA Benefactor
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #6  
Old 07-08-2017, 07:23 PM
Kenneth07ex Kenneth07ex is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: East Texas
Posts: 283
Likes: 99
Liked 164 Times in 101 Posts
Default

Nice work! I'd like to see more like this.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #7  
Old 07-08-2017, 08:11 PM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

It took me 15 years to master professional quality rust bluing, anyone can get a the metal to turn blue pretty easily. This represents 5 cycles, the minimum in my opinion. That is about the max we can do in four days in the seminar.
The some of the real tricks are in the hand polishing.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #8  
Old 07-08-2017, 08:21 PM
DWalt's Avatar
DWalt DWalt is online now
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: South Texas & San Antonio
Posts: 33,595
Likes: 239
Liked 29,105 Times in 14,073 Posts
Default

While rusting solutions are available through Brownell's, etc, the old gunsmithing books will provide various home-brew formulas that probably work as well. Some contain acids, some do not. Dunlap provides a recipe for a rusting solution made by dissolving iron in a mixture of nitric and hydrochloric acids which he claims is the best. It requires 10 to 12 rusting, boiling, and carding cycles over several days. Another solution is basically salt water. As it is slow and involves many hand operations, rust bluing is not cost-competitive with hot dip oxide (such as Brownell's) bluing which is used by nearly all high-volume gun manufacturers today. But well done by someone who knows the tricks, there is nothing better.

Last edited by DWalt; 07-08-2017 at 08:26 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-08-2017, 08:26 PM
tlay's Avatar
tlay tlay is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 2,937
Likes: 1,594
Liked 1,977 Times in 732 Posts
Default

I did an LC Smith 12 ga. double barrel hammer gun with Damascus barrels with rust bluing. The barrels took 17 coats to do. All together I had 120 hours of metal work and bluing on it!!
__________________
Tom
NRA Pistol Inst
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-08-2017, 08:38 PM
tlay's Avatar
tlay tlay is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 2,937
Likes: 1,594
Liked 1,977 Times in 732 Posts
Default

I forgot that I had a few photos.
I don't know why they are upside down!!!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg LC1.JPG (125.6 KB, 98 views)
File Type: jpg LC2.JPG (84.9 KB, 99 views)
File Type: jpg LC3.JPG (112.0 KB, 81 views)
File Type: jpg LC4.JPG (87.0 KB, 90 views)
__________________
Tom
NRA Pistol Inst

Last edited by tlay; 07-08-2017 at 08:40 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Like Post:
  #11  
Old 07-08-2017, 08:52 PM
chief38's Avatar
chief38 chief38 is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 17,799
Likes: 7,843
Liked 25,702 Times in 8,685 Posts
Default

I really admire guys who can get incredible results with DIY bluing.

The only bluing I've ever attempted is Cold Bluing on small areas to specific parts (not entire guns). My results range from fair to midland but never great. I've come to NOT expect great bluing results with cold chemicals and never really cared to set up for the Hot Bluing. Again, guys who have mastered Bluing in the home shop - I take my hat off too.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #12  
Old 07-08-2017, 09:03 PM
zipty6 zipty6 is online now
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 595
Likes: 4,510
Liked 2,074 Times in 336 Posts
Default

This is 7 rust/boil/card cycles on a "worn out" 10-6:


SDH is absolutely right about the polishing. I think it would take more than 15 years experience for my work to look as good as his.

Last edited by zipty6; 07-08-2017 at 10:54 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #13  
Old 07-09-2017, 12:51 AM
bmg60's Avatar
bmg60 bmg60 is offline
SWCA Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: big sky country montana
Posts: 1,332
Likes: 720
Liked 6,411 Times in 545 Posts
Default

Hi
I have been a part time gun smith over the years and took a couple of classes in gun smithing. But I never learned the right way to do the hand finishing and polishing. The 1917 i did for the class was all hand polishing
all the lines and edges are sharp. Steves class is worth your time if you want to do it right. All the lettering was saved.
Jim Fisher LM-1491
Reply With Quote
The Following 5 Users Like Post:
  #14  
Old 07-09-2017, 06:40 PM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

Some close-up images Jim sent.


Reply With Quote
The Following 5 Users Like Post:
  #15  
Old 07-10-2017, 02:34 PM
Jebus35745's Avatar
Jebus35745 Jebus35745 is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Independence, OH, USA
Posts: 6,944
Likes: 28,935
Liked 7,229 Times in 2,599 Posts
Default

Looks like a great class to be at. I have admired Steve's work in Gun Digest for years. Glad you joined the Forum and is willing to share knowledge or help people. How do you clean the guns and with what product? Larry
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 07-12-2017, 01:17 PM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

I mostly use Hoppes #9 to clean my guns.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 07-12-2017, 03:34 PM
Jebus35745's Avatar
Jebus35745 Jebus35745 is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Independence, OH, USA
Posts: 6,944
Likes: 28,935
Liked 7,229 Times in 2,599 Posts
Default

Sorry, I meant how is the gun cleaned before bluing. What product is used to make it clean to let the blue process work on the metal. I have a couple to re-blue and don't want to buy tanks and salts, rust blue seems to look good when done right. Larry
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 07-12-2017, 05:27 PM
DWalt's Avatar
DWalt DWalt is online now
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: South Texas & San Antonio
Posts: 33,595
Likes: 239
Liked 29,105 Times in 14,073 Posts
Default

The main purpose of cleaning is to remove all grease and oil prior to bluing. Wiping with MEK (from one of the big box stores) works very well. Much better than boiling parts in a silicated detergent solution. Work outdoors.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #19  
Old 07-13-2017, 09:28 AM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

To degrease, we began with an water soluble solution called Oil Eater. The entire gun is cleaned inside and out. The parts are dried the the polishing begins. After polishing, just before the first coat the parts are wiped down very thoroughly with denatured alcohol.
Often oil leaches out from the nooks and crannies during the first boiling so the water is usually change before the second boiling.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #20  
Old 08-21-2017, 09:57 AM
dwade7551 dwade7551 is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Interest in Rust Bluing Seminar

Steve,
I would in interested in attending your rust bluing seminar next summer. I attended the one week in course at Trinidad State Jr College this year and enjoyed. I have rust blued a 1917 Colt, Hi-Power and an FN SA22 semi auto rifle. I will post pictures of them. I am always looking to learn more.

Dale Wade
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 08-23-2017, 09:11 AM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

I'll do my best to make an announcement on the forum when I begin organizing Seminars for next year. I also offer a Stockmaking Seminar for rifles.
You can contact me via email in my profile to get on the list for next year.
Best, SDH
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 08-27-2017, 05:08 PM
djoch djoch is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Montana
Posts: 5
Likes: 1
Liked 2 Times in 1 Post
Default

Maybe a dumb question here...what is the protocol for the interior of the frame? Do you leave it as is, or is it stripped and then cold blued as well? If cold blued how do you effectively card all the tiny studs, nooks and crannies?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 08-27-2017, 06:15 PM
SDH SDH is offline
Banned
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Montana
Posts: 2,142
Likes: 2,064
Liked 3,137 Times in 644 Posts
Default

I usually apply a couple of oats on the inner surfaces that show leaving unseen areas as they are.
Carding of tight spaces and the inside of the trigger guard bow are done with 0000 steel wool. Note that with hand polishing we can leave the external studs on the left side flat of the frame.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 08-27-2017, 06:37 PM
ditto1958 ditto1958 is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 306
Likes: 147
Liked 191 Times in 87 Posts
Default

Is the satin finish the result of how the gun is polished before its re-blued? What would you need to do differently if you wanted a deep glossy look?
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 08-27-2017, 06:46 PM
Zoner Zoner is offline
Member
Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar Metal Polish - Rust Bluing Seminar  
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: San Diego
Posts: 356
Likes: 48
Liked 260 Times in 116 Posts
Default

i rust blued the slide and controls on this RIA. The frame was left parked. Used acetone in a spray bottle, Brownells rust bluing, a stainless pot i got at the swap meet to boil water. Used the kitchen stove to boil water. And yes, my wife was out of town when i did it
Attached Images
File Type: jpg rust blue.JPG (122.1 KB, 51 views)

Last edited by Zoner; 08-27-2017 at 06:48 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
rust bluing Nickjc S&W-Smithing 13 09-08-2016 12:11 AM
Rust Bluing tlay S&W-Smithing 6 04-17-2015 09:07 AM
More on Rust Bluing dangt S&W-Smithing 13 12-07-2014 07:34 PM
So I tried my hand at rust bluing... John Frederick Bell The Lounge 4 02-27-2013 11:18 PM
MAAS metal polish zellerSC S&W-Smithing 1 05-15-2011 09:42 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:35 AM.


Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)