Howdy,

Posted a thread a couple of days ago about the center pin on my 19-3's extractor rod being VERY difficult to depress. So difficult that I can't close the cylinder.

Need help with 19-3: Extractor Star Issue

Received my gunsmith screwdriver set today and successfully removed the cylinder and then removed the extractor rod.

A couple of questions:

1) Should I be able to push the Center Pin into the Extractor Rod at all? It is very tight and doesn't move. There's a spring there, so I assume it should move.

2) How do I remove the Center Pin from the Extractor Rod? Is it threaded or just a press fit?

(This is my first time ... so please be gentle.)

Thanks to OldChief for supplying the diagram.

The center pin is supposed to be a very free slip fit in the extractor rod. There is old oil or rust binding it up. I would soak the assembly in penetrating oil for a day or 2, then put the extractor rod in a vise and knock out the center pin with a pin punch. Once you get the parts separated, you can clean them up. Going back together will be way easier.

Thanks, Toolguy! I really appreciate the response and the info.

I just plunged it into a bowl of Kroil. Will stick it out on the back porch for a few days and let the Kroil "creep".

No vise, though. Any other suggestions for getting the pin out in a few days after it's done soaking?

Thanks again.

How did you get the rod out of the cylinder? As said soak in penetrating oil. Then work the pin from the rod by hand.
It's hard to see from the picture but it sure looks like there is some hard looking crud on that pin, spring and rod.

The knurl on the extractor rod is lookin' rough.. did you protect it from damage from the tool you used to loosen it.

If you are unable to pull the center pin out there is a chance that the front end of the center pin is peened slightly, causing it to stick inside the cavity of the extractor rod. Peening on the end of the pin creates a small "mushroomed" area at the end, and is caused by recoil battering between the end of the pin and the front locking bolt.
You can confirm this damage by pushing the pin fully forward and looking at the fit/flat end of the pin with a magnifier. (soaking in penetrant will not help free the pin if this condition exists)

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Ret. LE, FA Instr, S&W Armorer

Would this be the result of a many 357 magnum loads in a K frame or not?

That would be a cause.. Recoil battering occurs as the power factor is increased.

Could be. I've seen it happen more often in the large caliber N frames like the model 29, than in the K series magnums though.

This may not be the problem he's having, but it's a possibility.

Just a theory, but I think this may result from the way the factory fits the center pin's overall length. They taught us to grind the pin to the correct length using a bench grinder.....which we all know if not used correctly can cause damaging heat build-up at the point of contact. I personally think this occasional "heavy handed" grinding by fitters may actually inadvertently cause the pin to be "soft" at the end, where it enteracts with the front locking bolt.

__________________
Ret. LE, FA Instr, S&W Armorer

I did. Used a piece of an old leather belt. It looks a lot "rougher" in the photo than it does in real life.

Thanks. Will let it soak in Kroil until Friday and hope that's the fix. If not, will follow your suggestion. (Though, right now I can't make the center pin move in either direction.)

If it is peened, what's the fix ... just file off the offended "mushroom" ... or is it gunsmith time?

If it's peened on the end you will likely have to drive it out of the extractor rod cavity front to back. I use an old center pin to do this, after securing the rod in a padded vise.
The damage on the end can then be carefully removed using a stone or a small file. Be sure to only remove the material around the edge that has been displaced outside the normal diameter of the pin......you don't want to change the diameter of the pin itself.

If the gun will be used frequently or carried, I would suggest installing/fitting a new center pin.

__________________
Ret. LE, FA Instr, S&W Armorer

Good luck with it and hopefully its just crud. But if you plan on taking extractor rods out of cylinders much I really suggest you get one of the tools designed for it. I know there will be many who have used whatever with no issues.
I don't have the pleasure of being anywhere close to a S&W gunsmith and it takes months to send a revolver to one. I'm no gunsmith but I am a mechanic (that could be dangerous) and if I'm going to do it then I better have the right knowledge and tools or let someone who does do it.
The one I got wasn't that expensive and works like a hot damn.

One tip about re-assembling the extractor to the extractor star. The thread used are an Extra Extra Fine Pitch thread and it is VERY easy to cross thread it, so NEVER EVER force it hoping it will "find" the thread. Until you get to the point of it being fully tightened you sould be able to spin the rod in with just a thumb and forefinger.

Now the tip, which is how to properly start a fine pitch thread like this. What you do is press against the spring pressure until the rod is fully seated against the extractor star and then rotate the extractor rod in the LOOSEN direction slowly. If you pay very close attention you will feel a very light "click" as the starting points of the male and female threads pass each other. As soon as you feel that "click" then reverse the direction and spin the extractor rod home. BTW, if you don't feel any click then press the two parts together a bit more firmly and concentrate on keeping them engaged 100% of the time that you are turning the rod in the reverse direction. It may take a while to develop a "feel" for this but once you have developed this skill you will find it's the only way to get these threads started correctly the first time and every time you have to do it. BTW, never use Loctite on these threads, it's not necessary and the residue will make it much more difficult to feel that "click".

Now for tightening the Extractor Rod so it won't work loose. This is another matter of developing a "feel" for getting it just right. What I do is hold the cylinder in my left hand and use how hard I squeeze the cylinder to act as a "slip clutch". If I find the Extractor Rod shoots loose then I squeeze a bit harder when I re-tighten it. To grip the extractor rod to tighten it I fold a bit of 1/16 leather over the knurling and use slip joint pliers to hold the leather on the tip of the rod and allow me to get enough torque to tighten it properly.

For years I have used an old wooden clothes pin to tighten the knurl nut . Works great , no damage to the knurling . Hope this helps .

It looks like you have just about every suggestion anyone can come up with. The center pin should have easily separated from the extractor rod. My guess is crud or maybe even rust on the pin and/or interior of the extractor rod. Hopefully the soaking will release it and then a good cleaning and lube to keep it loose. We're all making educated guesses, it's hard to diagnose the problem without having the parts in hand.

Well, my plan was to let it soak in Kroil until tomorrow (Friday), but I had to go out on the back porch just now to get the recycle bins, so I gave the ol' Cylinder Pin/Extractor Rod assembly a pull ... and sure enough ... they slid apart!

Many thanks for all the replies and suggestions.

One last question ... I plunked the separated pieces back in the Kroil. Is that the best stuff to de-gunk the interior of the Extractor Rod or should I now plunk them in something else?

Again, a big THANK YOU!

Take a brush and go over all that you can while its soaking. Not sure what you have but try something inside the rod or use the pin back and forth in the rod while in the Kroil.

I have done this before. Use your own judgement. You will need to remove as much oil as possible first. Hold the extractor rod by the threaded end wearing a welders glove. Apply a small amount of heat (enough to expand extractor rod without heating up center pin) Takes more time than heat usually . Do not change color of extractor rod watch the color, don’t worry about smoke or soot, it will slightly. I have used a propane torch. Heat the knurled end of extractor rod evenly. 300 to 400 degrees +/-. Set down torch and put on another glove and pull the extractor rod away from center pin. It is trial and error for the first timer. Always let the assembly cool back to room temperature before giving another try. Good luck.

When your done with all that, buy new part's and re-assemble

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Stang1911

Try a pipe cleaner for getting inside the extractor rod. If you don't have any, you can pick them up at any hobby type store. I think that you're pretty much home free now but don't forget to clean the collar and spring real good. A few more things like this and you'll be able to call yourself a gun plumber!

Found some pipe cleaners at the local hardware store.

All back together and functioning like a champ.

Thanks again very much for the assistance!

After reading this thread... I second this suggestion!

Awesome, nothing like doing it yourself and making it work. By the way this is the tool I use to remove rod. There are others that may be better but this is the one I saw first. Also a really nice guy to talk to.

ViseSmith™ - a unique extractor rod tool for - S&W(R), Taurus(R), and Ruger(R) Speed Six Revolvers | Welcome to Gunsmither™ Tools | Myself

In addition, Loctite can "leak" down the center rod and glue the shoulder on it to the inside of the extractor rod, with unfortunate quincequonces

I found out the hard way recently because my extractor rod seemed to want to work itself loose slightly from time to time, which made it impossible to swing out the cylinder. The result of what I thought was a very careful and precise application of removable Loctite was that the next day the cylinder release latch couldn't push the center rod forward and I had the same problem, only different! Fortunately I was able to get the cylinder out and the judicious application of heat softened the Loctite so I could get everything apart, cleaned out and back together. (How annoying that no number drill is exactly the same diameter as the shoulder of the center rod, which would have made cleaning the Loctite off the extractor rod wall somewhat easier.)

As regards the fine threads on the extractor rod, I don't have the appropriate tool but I do have a pair of Wilton aluminum "over"-jaws with a longitudinal v-groove for my bench vise which allows me to hold the extractor rod firmly and safely while threading and un-threading it from the cylinder. But you do have to be very gentle. The threads are something like 10-46 LH; I doubt anyone other than S&W has taps & dies for that.