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Old 09-28-2018, 09:03 PM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Default Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on

I am far from a gunsmith, but am pretty comfortable disassembling 1st thru 3rd generation Smith semi-autos.

I recently acquired a 469 cheap ($130) whose action was sort of sticky. After disassembly, I noticed that the ejector seemed to be sticking up higher than normal from the frame...didn't seem to go as far down as it should when you applied finger pressure to it. Sort of the same for the decocking pawl (?) and safety pawl (?) - I think that's what they are called.

After disassembling and cleaning everything up, I reassembled it, and it seemed much better (ejector and pawls) and the gun went back together a lot easier.

I started doing a function check and everything seemed really good. Until I put on the safety - actually more when I took off the safety. When I put on the safety, it behaves as expected. When I take off the safety...no change it still acts as if the safety is on.

If I rack the slide, it works as normal again. Magazine safety works as expected.

Any thoughts about what I might have done wrong?

Many thanks
Jim
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Old 09-28-2018, 09:36 PM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Take a look at what the drawbar is doing when you move the safety lever down, and move the lever up. With an empty magazine in the gun, the drawbar should move down when the lever moves down....and move back up when the lever is raised. Sounds like the drawbar may be rubbing on the frame, or on the magazine.
There may also be a rub mark or marks on the magazine at the location(s) where the incidental contact occurs.

Also, check the levers for damage. Make sure they are "flat", with no burrs on them. One or more of the levers may be bent, or improperly fit, and being trapped down in the lever slot, even when the safety lever is "up" (off). Check for the presence lever springs, there should be two of them. One under the ejector/ mag. dep. lever and one under the combined sear release/firing pin safety levers.

Check for free movement of the disconnector up and down. With the slide removed, make sure the disconnector is moving freely up and down, and that the drawbar is pushed down by the disconnector, and follows the disconnector back up.

Many other possibilities, but these are a few of the things that come to mind.
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Last edited by armorer951; 09-28-2018 at 09:49 PM.
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Old 09-29-2018, 06:42 AM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Thanks for all of this input. I will check these things and let y'all know what I find.
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Old 09-29-2018, 09:05 AM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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I had a 669 with a similar problem. 469s and 669s have a recall for the safety. I donít recall the particulars but the info is on this site. Search for 469 669 recall.

There is one part of the reassembly that is tricky and damage can result if not done correctly. Itís noted in the manual. I bet a prior owner missed that step. That was the case with my inherited 669. Anyway- my 669 was out of the serial number range for the recall, but I contacted S&W service by email describing the problem, giving them the SN and asking if it was possible that my pistol could be affected by the recall issue even though out of the SN range. The rep responded with a shipping tag at their expense, said theyíd have to inspect. If I sent it in, at their expense, they would look at it and let me know if they could fix it and if it would be recall or not. The tech also said he used to build 669s when 669s were in production. I sent it in and if I recall correctly he replaced the sear and one other part. No charge and my pistol was back in two weeks. Iíll see if I can find the note as to what was replaced. Iíve traded the 669 off for other, personal, reasons. Nothing to do with the function of the pistol after it came back.

My brother had purchased the pistol new so I wasnít the original owner. He apparently messed up reassembly at some point. But S&W stood behind their out of production product and took care of me. Iíd send S&W service an email.
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Old 09-29-2018, 09:17 AM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Here is the recall ref the safety/decock/sear/hammer (half cock notch) system:



SMITH & WESSON
MODEL 439, 459, 469, 539, 559, 639, 659 & 669,
9MM CALIBER, PISTOLS

RECALL: This warning is issued for Smith & Wesson 9mm Semiautomatic Pistols which were shipped from the factory between May 1, 1983 and February 26, 1986. Included are Models 439, 459, 469, 539, 559, 639, 659 and 669 but only with serial numbers in the following ranges:

A745000-A865000 and TAA0001-TAL9999

The pistols within the serial number ranges listed above must be inspected for function from the half-cock notch. The safety mechanism will function in a perfectly satisfactory manner in many of these pistols, as well as in all pistols with serial numbers outside these ranges and in all pistols shipped from the factory after February 26, 1986.

Every one of these models bearing a serial number within the ranges listed above should be carefully inspected by the owner for this special condition. To determine if your pistol has this condition, do the following:

Point the muzzle in a safe direction.
Completely unload the pistol. Check both the magazine and chamber to assure they are empty of live rounds.
With your finger off the trigger, operate the manual safety with the unloaded pistol fully cocked and fully uncocked so that you can recognize how the manual safety looks and feels when it is fully in the safe position. The hammer will fall from the fully cocked position into the "at rest" position when the manual safety is moved down toward a safe position. When you are thoroughly familiar with placing the manual safety fully in the safe position, place it up in the fire position.
With the manual safety in the fire position, place the hammer in the half-cock notch:

For the Model 439, 459, 539, 559, 639 and 659, put the hammer of your pistol in the half-cock notch by pulling the hammer to the rear slowly until you hear the first click and then releasing the hammer so that it catches between the full cock and the "at rest" position.

For the Model 469 and 669, put the hammer of your pistol in the half-cock notch by inserting an empty magazine and slowly pulling the trigger until you hear the first click and then releasing the trigger so that the hammer catches between the full cock and the "at rest" position.

With the hammer in the half-cock notch, push the manual safety down toward the safe position. If you can push the manual safety fully into the safe position and the hammer falls into the "at rest" position, your pistol does not require modification. If you cannot push the manual safety fully into the safe position or the hammer does not fall into the "at rest" position, your pistol is being recalled for modification free of charge.

Recalled pistols should be sent promptly to a Smith & Wesson Warranty Service Center for modification. Call 800-331-0852 for the name and location of the one nearest you or for answers to nay questions you may have. Law enforcement departments who have pistols, which exhibit this condition, should contact the Smith & Wesson Service Department to arrange for modifying the pistols.
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Old 09-29-2018, 10:55 AM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Thank you gents for this information. Mine is a serial number in the TAU range. Additionally, mine is a spur-less hammer...and I cannot feel ANY half-cock at all. No matter how slow and steady I pull the trigger, there is not even a hint of a half-cock.

Everything seems to work (including de-cocking). I will be working on it this morning, and see what I can find out.

Jim

Follow-up - in case this is a clue as well. When you take the slide off, normally the hammer comes forward. On this one, it remains in the cocked position.
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Old 09-29-2018, 12:14 PM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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Your follow up is an indication that the sear release lever is worn or improperly fit. New levers are available if this is the problem. A new sear release lever will need fitting. Look for excessive wear on the top of the sear r. lever, or on the angled interface on the bottom of the lever where the angled portion of the lever interacts with the sear.

In addition, excessive gauge between the slide and the frame, or stated another way, excessive wear on the slide rails, particularly at the rear of the frame, can cause the safety/decock lever to malfunction. (hammer does not drop, or drops late when the decocking lever is lowered)
You may see the slide rise up, or move up, away from the frame as the decocking/safety lever in lowered.
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Last edited by armorer951; 09-29-2018 at 08:10 PM.
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Old 09-29-2018, 08:03 PM
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Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on Model 469 - when I take off safety, still acts is if it is on  
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The parts (sear release lever and firing pin release lever) both look more worn than on any of my other S&W semi-autos. I am ordering new ones along with springs from Numrich as they are cheap...and it gives me a "project". Thanks for the advice.
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