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Old 01-27-2020, 03:48 PM
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I have a 1953 5 screw pre 18 coming in a couple days. It has some surface rust that should clean up, but one spot on the bbl that will have pitting for sure. So after I soak this in Kroil, and use bronse wool, and a pure copper penny on the light stuff, is drawfiling a part of the bbl acceptable to lessen the pitting? I am talking about smoothing the rough area to a degree, and not going after depth to remove it all, just make it more presentable. The project in and of itself is somewhat of a rescue mission to make a decent shooter.

Your thoughts?
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Old 01-27-2020, 04:57 PM
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Pete truthfully I wouldn't do that the file marks will be hard to remove.
A good wire brushing would probably be better. If you a Dremel with a small brush that will work.
Once you get into filing your looking at a full restore and reblue.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:02 PM
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Pete truthfully I wouldn't do that the file marks will be hard to remove.
A good wire brushing would probably be better. If you a Dremel with a small brush that will work.
Once you get into filing your looking at a full restore and reblue.
I understand. I am talking about super fine jeweler's files, and then a stone dressing, but maybe not a great idea
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:17 PM
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I understand. I am talking about super fine jeweler's files, and then a stone dressing, but maybe not a great idea
I understand, I have several jewelers files and they are pretty fine cutting. Even being fine cutting and a stone follow up you'll still change the contour of the barrel. If your just looking for a not to bad looking shooter just wire brush the pitting, clean it up and touch it up with a little cold blue. The old K-22 combat masterpiece has earned it's scares.
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Old 01-27-2020, 05:21 PM
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I might try some abrasive paper, fine grit.
Cut a narrow strip about 1 inch strip.
Lightly back and forth over the rusty area.
Then Cold Blue.
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Old 01-28-2020, 07:34 AM
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Draw filling usually doesn't leave much in the way of file marks if your technique is good and with a fine file, should work if the pitting is that deep. Practice on a round bar to see how to keep file marks to a minimum if you are not all that experienced draw filling.

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Old 01-28-2020, 11:07 AM
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You can also wrap fine grit sandpaper around a flat file and use that instead of the bare file. I have done that many times.
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Old 01-28-2020, 11:41 AM
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If you file keep the file clean with a file card ,use plenty of chalk on the file to keep it from clogging with the fines.Then fine sand paper on a block
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Old 01-28-2020, 01:09 PM
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There are so many grits of wet dry paper why use a file??
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Old 01-28-2020, 02:30 PM
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Draw filing will work just fine. The final cleanup will involve many grits of fine sandpaper with water. Realize that you are removing the surrounding area of metal uniformly and not just around the rust pit. Good advice above in that you should practice the draw filing technique first. Use brand new files, card the file often and use lots of file chalk. A lot of work for a "shooter".

I too echo the advice to just clean up the handgun, fine tune the action and have it Cerakoted. BTW, originally the only way to cut the 'flats' for a hexagonal or octagonal barrel was to draw file them.
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Old 01-28-2020, 02:40 PM
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I have a 1953 5 screw pre 18 coming in a couple days. It has some surface rust that should clean up, but one spot on the bbl that will have pitting for sure.

Your thoughts?
All speculation until you see it in person.

I have a gun or two with pitting. If I started chasing them in "depth" I'd be putting a lot of work into a gun that worked just fine before I started.

If you want a gun without pitting, buy one without pitting.
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Old 01-28-2020, 03:06 PM
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I'd be reluctant to try that for fear of flat spotting a mostly round barrel.
If you must, try starting with a fine grit ~600 wet and dry paper with a wetting agent - I like WD40 - and see how that does on your rust spots. Take the grit rougher (work down to 220 in steps) or finer (up to 2000) from there depending on what remains of the offending spots.
Start easy and work up. Draw filing is a good technique for flats, but in my mind, is pretty drastic to start right off with on a non-flat blued surface.

Last edited by ameridaddy; 01-28-2020 at 03:07 PM.
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Old 01-28-2020, 04:55 PM
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I had a gunsmith draw file some rust off the end of a LC Smith side by side. I'd challenge anyone to find where. Obviously, the skill of the filer comes into play.
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Old 01-28-2020, 05:25 PM
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Back in the day gunsmiths would change the profile of military barrels when they customized hunting rifles by drawfilling them. I don't see the technique as effective on a portion of a 4" barrel. I think that your rescue plan is a good one up to that point. Don't be like me, post photos.
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Old 01-29-2020, 02:29 PM
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Back in the day gunsmiths would change the profile of military barrels when they customized hunting rifles by drawfilling them. I don't see the technique as effective on a portion of a 4" barrel. I think that your rescue plan is a good one up to that point. Don't be like me, post photos.
Don't have the gun yet
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Old 01-29-2020, 02:38 PM
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Well, hurry Pete! its cold and a little boring today down here!
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Old 01-29-2020, 03:03 PM
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Draw filing is fine if:
You have the right tools.
You have the right skills.
Something tells me you have both!
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Old 01-30-2020, 01:04 AM
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If you have a pitted area and the plan is to remove it to clean steel, then files are OK, They just remove metal fasted than abrasive papers.. Same idea as rough cut files remove fasted than fine cut files.

You don't really need to 'draw file' the area.
You need to file it carefully from different directions in order to avoid a depression that is easily seen when you are done and the pits are gone.
You have to blend the are in with the surrounding area of undisturbed metal/finish.
Once you are done with files, you move to abrasive papers or cloth.
Start with something like 180 and go up to whatever you need to bring the polish to match the orig surrounding finish.
Polish at opposing angles to the grit you just polished. That will allow you to see the coarser grit (lines) being cut away. Don't worry about the final direction of the grit lines till you reach the final grit. They will take care of themselves at that point if you have removed all the coarser lines up to that point.
If not, those older, coarser lines will be staring at you like someone just keyed your car door.

You need to bring the filed/polished area out of the immediate pitted area and taper it into the metal that has no blemishes in it.
The more you taper and blend the repair into the surrounding area, the less the repair will be noticable.
The downside is that you will be removing perfectly good finish as you bring that gentle taper outward from the divot you created by removing the pitting.

Once blended in to your satisfaction, now you have to polish the 'in the white' are you have created to match the polish that is UNDER the bluing on the rest of the metal.
Look closely at the orig finish. Not finger smears of oil but the orig polishing grit lines. Follow those grit lines off of the orig surface and on to your in the white newly polished surface. Bring up the brilliance of the polish on your new surface to match the orig.

Now reblue the new surface.
Chemical cold blues can work pretty good. But results are usually lacking in the end.
The spot that is prepared will show and the more you work it over, the worse it'll look generally.
Rustblue can blend quite well.
Quick (Express) Rust works very well in touching up spots like this. Slow rust can be used but you have to watch for the soln etching and leaving an matted finish in that area. It takes some experience and technique.
A Hot Salt dunk will usually match quite well.
But that would require the bbl being removed & re-installed.

Lots of options.
Another is to clear the gun of oil.
Boil the bbl portion of the assembled (bbl & frame) in plain water. That'll turn any rust to blue/black oxide just as if rust bluing.
The fine dusty stuff will card right off with steel wool (de-oiled). It will NOT remove pitting but will kill the rust and turn existing rust blu/black and leave a better looking finish than any rust on the surface.

I have a Win21 here now that has a few light patches of pitting and most of the blue gone on the bottom of the frame . The top of the frame & top lever was pitted.
I polished the bottom of the frame out, left the sides untouched except for a light 1200grit hand polish.
Then filed the top of the frame and the edges of the standing breechs, Then polished them back down to 1000 grit.

I will rust blue the entire action and parts to blend the old orig blue and polish on the sides in to the new polish on the top and bottom.

Kind of the same idea on a larger scale. Trying to save the orig polish and finish where I can. My idea of restoration.
Not the easiest or quickest,,but restoration as I see it.
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Old 01-30-2020, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Carey View Post
Draw filing is fine if:
You have the right tools.
You have the right skills.
Something tells me you have both!
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2152hq View Post
If you have a pitted area and the plan is to remove it to clean steel, then files are OK, They just remove metal fasted than abrasive papers.. Same idea as rough cut files remove fasted than fine cut files.

You don't really need to 'draw file' the area.
You need to file it carefully from different directions in order to avoid a depression that is easily seen when you are done and the pits are gone.
You have to blend the are in with the surrounding area of undisturbed metal/finish.
Once you are done with files, you move to abrasive papers or cloth.
Start with something like 180 and go up to whatever you need to bring the polish to match the orig surrounding finish.
Polish at opposing angles to the grit you just polished. That will allow you to see the coarser grit (lines) being cut away. Don't worry about the final direction of the grit lines till you reach the final grit. They will take care of themselves at that point if you have removed all the coarser lines up to that point.
If not, those older, coarser lines will be staring at you like someone just keyed your car door.

You need to bring the filed/polished area out of the immediate pitted area and taper it into the metal that has no blemishes in it.
The more you taper and blend the repair into the surrounding area, the less the repair will be noticable.
The downside is that you will be removing perfectly good finish as you bring that gentle taper outward from the divot you created by removing the pitting.

Once blended in to your satisfaction, now you have to polish the 'in the white' are you have created to match the polish that is UNDER the bluing on the rest of the metal.
Look closely at the orig finish. Not finger smears of oil but the orig polishing grit lines. Follow those grit lines off of the orig surface and on to your in the white newly polished surface. Bring up the brilliance of the polish on your new surface to match the orig.

Now reblue the new surface.
Chemical cold blues can work pretty good. But results are usually lacking in the end.
The spot that is prepared will show and the more you work it over, the worse it'll look generally.
Rustblue can blend quite well.
Quick (Express) Rust works very well in touching up spots like this. Slow rust can be used but you have to watch for the soln etching and leaving an matted finish in that area. It takes some experience and technique.
A Hot Salt dunk will usually match quite well.
But that would require the bbl being removed & re-installed.

Lots of options.
Another is to clear the gun of oil.
Boil the bbl portion of the assembled (bbl & frame) in plain water. That'll turn any rust to blue/black oxide just as if rust bluing.
The fine dusty stuff will card right off with steel wool (de-oiled). It will NOT remove pitting but will kill the rust and turn existing rust blu/black and leave a better looking finish than any rust on the surface.

I have a Win21 here now that has a few light patches of pitting and most of the blue gone on the bottom of the frame . The top of the frame & top lever was pitted.
I polished the bottom of the frame out, left the sides untouched except for a light 1200grit hand polish.
Then filed the top of the frame and the edges of the standing breechs, Then polished them back down to 1000 grit.

I will rust blue the entire action and parts to blend the old orig blue and polish on the sides in to the new polish on the top and bottom.

Kind of the same idea on a larger scale. Trying to save the orig polish and finish where I can. My idea of restoration.
Not the easiest or quickest,,but restoration as I see it.
As an update, I received the gun, but decided to return it. Not for the finish issues but for other undisclosed mechanical/safety issues.

Thank you so much to all for your input!!!!
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