Extractor rod button bushing questions

delcrossv · #1 02-17-2020, 02:03 PM

I have a couple of guns where this bushing is worn on one side. I'd like to remove it, spin it 180 degrees and reinstall as then the oval side will be toward the frame (opposite the opening side).

See here- this one is fine:

What's involved?

armorer951 · #2 02-17-2020, 02:18 PM

If you're concerned about wear and tear on the edge of the bushing cavity caused by the center pin, I think this would be entirely cosmetic, unless the hole is worn to the point of causing misalignment of the cylinder itself.

I'm sure a competant gunsmith could replace the bushing. The biggest problem would be sourcing the bushing itself. You might have to make one, or have one made.

delcrossv · #3 02-17-2020, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by armorer951

If you're concerned about wear and tear on the edge of the bushing cavity caused by the center pin, I think this would be entirely cosmetic, unless the hole is worn to the point of causing misalignment of the cylinder itself.

I'm sure a competant gunsmith could replace the bushing. The biggest problem would be sourcing the bushing itself. You might have to make one, or have one made.

Yes, there's lateral movement. More than I'd like.

As I'd have to make one, I'd like to just flip the one that's presently in the gun. The yoke will stop movement more inward and I'll be good.

Question is, how are they put in? Is it just a cylinder shape?
I've already has this one out for service once, and the smith didn't want to mess with it. So next is DIY.

armorer951 · #4 02-17-2020, 02:35 PM

I've not had to remove one, but I would assume they are simply pressed into the breechface. The biggest concern I have is the proximity of the hand window to the cutout for the bushing. Wow, that is a very thin wall between those two cavities.

I'm wondering if that bushing is already installed before the hand window is cut in the frame??

delcrossv · #5 02-17-2020, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by armorer951

I've not had to remove one, but I would assume they are simply pressed into the breechface. The biggest concern I have is the proximity of the hand window to the cutout for the bushing. Wow, that is a very thin wall between those two cavities.

I'm wondering if that bushing is already installed before the hand window is cut in the frame??

Good question. I was thinking of freezing it with ether to shrink it before trying to push it out .

armorer951 · #6 02-17-2020, 03:08 PM

Perhaps you could install a smaller hardened collar inside the existing bushing after drilling out the existing center pin hole?? (instead or removing the existing bushing)

Kind of a "bushing inside a bushing" so to speak. Maybe something that wouldn't wear as readily....titanium??

Also, are you sure some of the side to side gauge you are feeling and attributing to the frame hole for the center pin is not in fact in the extractor cavity provided for the center pin?? Maybe a slightly larger diameter center pin would solve the gauge issue without having to modify the frame??

KAC · #7 02-17-2020, 03:16 PM

The bushing is staked in position. The staking tool goes down the barrel and creates the ring around the bushing. The staking tool is very hard, if not impossible to find. You should see if you can find someone who does or used to do S&W warranty repair, they may have that tool.

armorer951 · #8 02-17-2020, 03:20 PM

He's not referring to the hammer nose bushing.....he's talking about the bushing around the center pin hole. (see arrow in post #1)

delcrossv · #9 02-17-2020, 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by armorer951

He's not referring to the hammer nose bushing.....he's talking about the bushing around the center pin hole. (see arrow in post #1)

Correct. FWIW, I've seen a number of guns with the bushing re-staked with a pin punch. So I have that covered.

KAC · #10 02-17-2020, 03:53 PM

My mistake.

delcrossv · #11 02-17-2020, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by armorer951

Perhaps you could install a smaller hardened collar inside the existing bushing after drilling out the existing center pin hole?? (instead or removing the existing bushing)

Kind of a "bushing inside a bushing" so to speak. Maybe something that wouldn't wear as readily....titanium??

Also, are you sure some of the side to side gauge you are feeling and attributing to the frame hole for the center pin is not in fact in the extractor cavity provided for the center pin?? Maybe a slightly larger diameter center pin would solve the gauge issue without having to modify the frame??

The bushing is quite oval on the "worn" guns. The cylinder/extractor side seems fine (no slop). It looks like the bushing takes wear from opening and closing the cylinder. If I used a larger pin, I'd have to drill the bushing.

I'd like to avoid having to make something. And if something has to wear, I'd rather have it be a bushing than the rod end.

Hondo44 · #12 02-17-2020, 05:04 PM

The "wear" I see is actually a sign of a nice snug fit and normal. This would not affect lateral (side to side) play. I can't think of any hand ejectors I own that don't have the blue worn like yours from the extractor star riding up the cam surface of the recoil shield as designed. And in fact yours shows a nice even wear mark transitioning from the cam onto the bushing.

The locking bolt/ctr pin lockup hole shows virtually no wear which if worn might cause lateral play.

If you have fore and aft play, a shim washer in the cyl axis hole for the yoke quill is the fix for that.

The bushing is crimped in place around the perimeter as posted above. Recrimping by staking looks messy w/o the right tool.

It can be driven out from the rear or better, pulled out with a small screw inserted thru the lock bolt hole from the rear, a washer with a larger hole than the bushing placed on the recoil shield, and a nut with small washer on the screw that's tightened and works like a gear puller to pull the bushing forward and out.

But in my opinion I see nothing that needs fixing.

delcrossv · #13 02-17-2020, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondo44

The "wear" I see is actually a sign of a nice snug fit and normal. This would not affect lateral (side to side) play. I can't think of any hand ejectors I own that don't have the blue worn like yours from the extractor star riding up the cam surface of the recoil shield as designed. And in fact yours shows a nice even wear mark transitioning from the cam onto the bushing.

The locking bolt/ctr pin lockup hole shows virtually no wear which if worn might cause lateral play.

If you have fore and aft play, a shim washer in the cyl axis hole for the yoke quill is the fix for that.

The bushing is crimped in place around the perimeter as posted above. Recrimping by staking looks messy w/o the right tool.

It can be driven out from the rear or better, pulled out with a small screw inserted thru the lock bolt hole from the rear, a washer with a larger hole than the bushing placed on the recoil shield, and a nut with small washer on the screw that's tightened and works like a gear puller to pull the bushing forward and out.

But in my opinion I see nothing that needs fixing.

Hi Jim, sorry if I wasn't clear in the first post. The photo isn't of my gun, but just to identify the part.

The pictured bushing, I agree is fine. (Just didn't have a photo of a worn one)

Hondo44 · #14 02-17-2020, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by delcrossv

Hi Jim, sorry if I wasn't clear in the first post. The photo isn't of my gun, but just to identify the part.

The pictured bushing, I agree is fine. (Just didn't have a photo of a worn one)

Oh, ok. Yeah good idea to just turn it around. I would not try to re-stake it. Just drive it back in with flat punch or brass rod down the barrel. It will stay in place with the constant slamming back of the case head whn each shot is fired, plus the crimp circle will still be tight.