Triple Lock

bwade · #1 06-05-2020, 06:03 PM

Need some help. I have a Triple Lock in need of a locking bolt or a locking bolt repair. Was cracked and brazed on the shaft before I got it. I either need to repair it or replace it. Any suggestions?

Thank you,

6string · #2 06-05-2020, 07:26 PM

Personally, I would not hesitate to have the part repaired by microwelding.
It's a great way to fix and preserve original parts.

Pullman Arms in MA does great work. Their fees are very reasonable, last time I checked being $50/hr, including set up.
A simple weld for a clean break on a single part should be $100 or less.
If you instruct them, they'll weld the part and send it back. You can then clean up the weld with a fine file (not much work as the job is very precise).

Best Wishes,
Jim

Hondo44 · #3 06-05-2020, 09:48 PM

The two locking bolts in the barrel shroud (at front #1 & middle #2 lock bolt #663)?
Or bolt #3 at the rear of the cyl (#623)?

Triple Lock schematic and part names;-tl-schematic-jpg

Triple Lock schematic and part names;-tl-schematic-jpg

Photo credit: steelslayer

619A – Locking bolt cover (hole plug), retained with a cross pin (not shown)
632 - Center pin collar is a washer
637 – Stock pin listed in legend as 637 pin (640 is a duplicated # in schematic)
640* - Yoke stop detent plunger in legend & its spring (shown, but not separately numbered)
641 – Cyl stop plunger and its spring (not shown)
663** - Locking bolts front and middle retained with a cross pin (not shown), (which is a housing for #664 a plunger, spring and another cross pin also not shown)
664 – Locking bolt plunger, spring (not separately numbered), and the internal cross pin (not shown)
670 – E clip, not a washer

* – cyl hold open detent device; spring and plunger in the bottom of the yoke (used on N Frames up thru early post WWII transitional models.)

** - Locking bolts front and middle:

bwade · #4 06-06-2020, 08:42 AM

It is #663 broke at the shaft near the flat part that protrudes out of the barrel. Appears it is a very thin with a hollow shaft that has all its parts that fit in it. I don't think micro welding on its thin exterior will hold it. This part appears to be a weak point for this model, someone somewhere has had to make more of these. See the photo of part with a red line indicating the break.

Thank you Hondo44 for posting steelslayer's photo, it is very helpful.

Hondo44 · #5 06-06-2020, 09:37 AM

Blaine,

In my 50+ years of collecting and owning Smiths, this is the first I've heard about the part breaking. I'm not saying it didn't happen, just that it's clearly not a weak point.

I can visualize that the part could still function broken because of the spring tension involved. Or does it jam up?

I don't know for sure where to get one, but I got one 10 years ago from a guy that has since sold his entire S&W extensive old parts inventory to this company:

Poppert's Gun Parts: Poppert's Gun Parts Main Menu
P.O. Box 413
Glenside, PA 19038
Tel: 215-887-2391 Fax: 215-887-5816
Email: [email protected]

Other potential sources:

George Dye
"Salt Lake Collectibles Co."
P.O. Box 57433, Salt Lake City, UT, 84157
phone 205.502.2026

‘Guns & Gun Parts’ (Recommended by S&W)
(413) 732-9938
983 Westfield St
West Springfield MA 01089-3813
EMAIL: [email protected]
Guns n Parts - New and Used Guns Bought and Sold. no parts list here.

"Aonepawninc" http://stores.ebay.com/aonepawninc
has a bunch of old S&W parts for sale. They are very customer oriented and have very reasonable prices. 1/10/16

Dave Bennett: Parts and guns from 1900 up to 1970's.
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: www.22ammobox.com

Jack First: Large selection of Pre- and Post-WWII parts.
Phone: 605-343-9544
Reproduced firing pins for 22/32 Kit Gun and HFT

Gun Parts Corp: Successor to Numrich Arms; many gun parts.
226 Williams Lane, West Hurley, NY 12491
Phone: 845-679-2417
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: Gun Parts & Firearm Accessories | Numrich Gun Parts

Jim Horvath: Many parts for all S&W's (large and small) from 1860 up;
can reproduce parts.
e-Mail: [email protected]

Jeff Lee: Lee's Gun Parts (an extensive supply of gun parts, including S&W)Mike who works for Lee has 45 M25 barrels.
(Open to the public on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays).
3401 W. Pioneer, Suite 2, Irving, TX 75061
Phone: 972-790-0773
http://www.leesgunparts.com/

Jan Matlega: Parts for Pre-WWII S&W hand-ejectors.
Mail Address: 528 Eddy Glover
New Britain, CT 06053
Phone: 860-229-6872

Charlie Pate: Provides screws (original & reproduction) for S&W Tip-ups and Top-breaks; author of books and articles on S&W guns.
Phone: 703-533-8057
e-Mail: [email protected]

Phil Saccacio: Phone: 540-456-6405
e-Mail: [email protected]

Dave Szilagy: Manufactures parts for older S&W's.
Mail Address: 3107 Electric, Lincoln Park, MI 48146
e-Mail: [email protected]

Mike Veilleux: Guns and Gun Parts
All Parts inc. for Pre- and Post-WWII S&W's.
Phone: 413-732-9938
e-Mail: [email protected]
Web Site: www.gunsnparts.com

S&W Parts; antique and new
[email protected]
Ph: 352 394-7412

"Schludershots"
https://www.schludershots.com/gun-pa...gun-parts.html

Everygunpart.com - Parts Kits
https://everygunpart.com/

Good luck and please let us know how you make out,

bwade · #6 06-06-2020, 01:19 PM

Jim, when the part comes apart, the lock stays pushed forward because of the internal spring. The cylinder cannot be opened when this failure occurs. Most of the time when this occurs on newer Smiths is when the extractor rod comes loose, but when a Triple Lock does it, it can be the broken locking bolt. The only way to open the cylinder when this failure occurs is to take out the pins holding the bolt to remove spring tension from the long spring inside the locking bolt. After the tension is removed, you point the barrel down, the lock goes forward and the cylinder then opens.

Someone had previously brazed the part in my gun and it has failed again at that braze. I will check your parts vendor suggestions to see if I can find one.

Thank you,

Hondo44 · #7 06-06-2020, 06:56 PM

Blaine,

Got'cha, I see what you mean now. You'd have to leave the broken lock bolt out and install a standard front locking bolt and spring (no machining to the gun needed), to shoot the gun until you find the replacement bolt part. You're right the triple lock cyl will still open if the extractor rod unscrews. Unless it moves so far forward that it jams on the shroud.

There's just so little surface to braze I can see why that didn't hold. Tig welding would work if you can't find one. Another specialist for gun welding:

Micro-welding - Wicked Welding
5703 Webster St suite j, Dayton, OH 45414
Phone: (937) 454-9023

It would be prohibitively expensive to make a new one but that is a last resort option.

Well I truly hope you find a new part. I'll be looking for you too.

bwade · #8 06-22-2020, 09:54 PM

Well, it is repaired with a replacement locking bolt!

This could not have been accomplished without this forum and without the help of Jim (Hondo44) for connecting me with Steven (stbryson) who very generously sent me the nickel barrel with a locking bolt! I don't know how I can ever repay you guys, but you have credit in my bank!

As you can see, this is a fairly high condition Triple Lock that has new life given to it thanks to these two gentlemen. If everyone in our society had the qualities of these two guys... Guess I would not have had my career.

I will post better pictures of it later, this picture is just the fresh repair. Notice the broken part in the picture. I pieced it back together for a mold and measurement in case I had to manufacture another.

crsides · #9 06-22-2020, 10:33 PM

nice looking TL

Hondo44 · #10 06-23-2020, 09:47 AM

Blaine,

That's a beautiful TL you've rescued! Congrats.

Any of the membership here would have done the same, given the opportunity to help you out. I'm as pleased as you that it came together.

bwade · #11 06-23-2020, 07:55 PM

Here it is cleaned up!