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Old 11-27-2020, 02:43 PM
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Default To oil or not to oil?

So I recently came across GunBlue on YouTube and have really enjoyed watching his stuff seems very knowledgeable and has the credentials to back it up. So I'm just asking everyone's take on the oiling guns his seems to be none other then rust protection is the way to go. I've never been much to oil guns but recently have gotten into 1911s and seems most are on the side of oil is your best friend.
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Old 11-27-2020, 02:59 PM
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Oil to reduce wear and increase function.
I don't run anything dry, not even a Glock. If I'm in a sandy/grit filled environment I use less oil and clean more often.
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Old 11-27-2020, 03:23 PM
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Gunblue is absolutely correct. Use as little oil as possible. Oil does not reduce wear. That is a myth. The forces of friction acting on steel during the guns operation are NOT nearly enough to wear down or damage hardened steel (a gun is not a combustion engine). However, sand, dirt and grime, lint and leather shavings all adhere to oil and turn into an abrasive paste that will wear on the guns steel. Ok, I exaggerate some here but the point about oiling guns is: Less is more! Gunsteel will not deteriorate because steel rubs against steel - there is not enough heat generated by the guns operation. Also, in the case of semi-auto-pistols, to much oil or grease on the sliding surfaces act like a brake. Hope this helps....
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Old 11-27-2020, 05:28 PM
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Going to disagree with blackpowder.

To a certain extend it depends on the construction of the weapon. Plastic guns have absolutely minimum metal on metal contact and need less lube. Metal frame guns can be steel slides on aluminum frames. There because of the difference in hardness of the parts lube IS required to cut down excessive wear.

Also on non-plastic guns the friction between the frame rails and slide can cause reliability issues. I've seem move then a few guns that would malfunction every couple of rounds. A quick field strip and oil and they returned to 100% reliable. These were mostly Beretta 92s, Sigs, and 1911s.
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Old 11-27-2020, 05:50 PM
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Iíve found that less is more in terms of oil on my 1911ís. A drop of sewing machine oil or other light machine oil on the frame and slide interface (one drop total) is plenty.

An additional few drops of oil on an old t shirt to wipe down the exterior after any handling is also a good idea.

A couple ounces of oil is enough for many years.
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Old 11-27-2020, 06:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpowder View Post
Gunblue is absolutely correct. Use as little oil as possible. Oil does not reduce wear. That is a myth. The forces of friction acting on steel during the guns operation are NOT nearly enough to wear down or damage hardened steel (a gun is not a combustion engine). However, sand, dirt and grime, lint and leather shavings all adhere to oil and turn into an abrasive paste that will wear on the guns steel. Ok, I exaggerate some here but the point about oiling guns is: Less is more! Gunsteel will not deteriorate because steel rubs against steel - there is not enough heat generated by the guns operation. Also, in the case of semi-auto-pistols, to much oil or grease on the sliding surfaces act like a brake. Hope this helps....
I wish I had a dollar for every AR-15 owner who said "She likes to run wet!" Not true at all, and I think the folks who say such things have a marginally functioning rifle, and they hope that slopping on the oil will fix it. It won't.
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Old 11-27-2020, 07:26 PM
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Pat Rogers did a lot of testing on ARs and saw somewhere over 500K rounds down range a year for 20+ years. What he found was that they had to be wet to run reliably under hard use. At less than 200 rounds, a dry AR would start to malfunction. I doubt I've gone more than 1500 rounds without a strip and wipe, but that's just me being anal. Pat had rifles that had a ton of rounds down range with only lube. (Filthy 14 for one had well over 40K rounds downrange without a cleaning.) He admitted that this was solely for testing and that he would have cleaned a rifle he was using for serious purposes. Note that he was not using marginal rifles - most of the ones I saw at class were Bravo Company.

Not every platform is like that. Some pistols should have very sparing amounts of lube on them.
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Old 11-27-2020, 07:31 PM
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Default Gunblue knows what he's talking about.

I watched that video by gunblue and my main take away was that the main benefit of oiling your guns is rust protection. Doesn't take much. Just a very light coating rubbed off with a cloth. I believe he did say that the hardened steel moving parts of a revolver were so hard you couldn't possibly wear them out with regular cleaning. A good cleaning with Balistol is pretty much all I do. Wipe it down well, and it leaves a good thin protective coat of oil while it rests in the safe with a good drying system. All you need. Your guns will outlast you, your kids, and your grandkids.
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Old 11-27-2020, 08:42 PM
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Gunblue490 on ARs.
https://youtu.be/zPAzSVtSaDk
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Old 11-27-2020, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mscampbell2734 View Post
Going to disagree with blackpowder.

To a certain extend it depends on the construction of the weapon. Plastic guns have absolutely minimum metal on metal contact and need less lube. Metal frame guns can be steel slides on aluminum frames. There because of the difference in hardness of the parts lube IS required to cut down excessive wear.

Also on non-plastic guns the friction between the frame rails and slide can cause reliability issues. I've seem move then a few guns that would malfunction every couple of rounds. A quick field strip and oil and they returned to 100% reliable. These were mostly Beretta 92s, Sigs, and 1911s.
I agree. Metal on metal will wear, and some metals will wear faster against other metals. I'm not metallurgist, but galling can occur when metals slide against each other. I firmly believe lubrication can slow down this process.
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Old 11-27-2020, 08:59 PM
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Kroil, anyone?
It's light, it penetrates, it lubes.
And it may smell better than Hopes No. 9, depending on the user.
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Old 11-27-2020, 10:55 PM
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Everyone is wrong. Anyone that went thru any military boot camp (Navy for me) knows that a well oiled M-1 keeps your Drill Instructor happy and believe me there is nothing more important than keeping your DI happy.
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Old 11-27-2020, 11:34 PM
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I use synthetic oil sparingly. I do not recall ever having a malfunction due to lack of lubrication. Ever.
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Old 11-27-2020, 11:44 PM
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I use oil on my guns sparingly except for my Ruger Mark IVs. They get a spray of RemOil to prevent malfunctions during Steel Challenge Matches.

There is so much dust during a match it helps to keep them oiled.
'
I also use Brian Enos's Slide Glide on the internals like hammer sear engagement and inside of my revolvers. The grease stays better than oil and I haven't found it to retail dirt and grime.
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Old 11-28-2020, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diyj98 View Post
I agree. Metal on metal will wear, and some metals will wear faster against other metals. I'm not metallurgist, but galling can occur when metals slide against each other. I firmly believe lubrication can slow down this process.
I didn't say not to lube. I said to lube very sparingly. One single drop on sliding surfaces, bearing points and linkages is more than enough.
If, for example, you put your 1911 on full auto (let's say that's possible for experiments sake) and run 1000 rounds through it in long bursts, then yes, the metal will wear faster without oil. But galling and friction-wear will NOT occur during a pistols normal operation and even less on wheelguns.
I see people bathe their guns in oil all the time. That is asking for trouble (unless it's for the purpose of long term storage).
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Old 11-28-2020, 08:38 AM
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I put a drop of oil on each slide rail and spread it down the rails. A few drops on barrel and spread it around. I put a tiny bit of grease in the channel of the slide that the rails ride in and when I put the gun back together I rack the slide multiple times to spread everything around. My ARís are always well lubed.

Some would say I over oil. I donít care. Been doing it this way for nearly 30 years and never an issue. Come to think of it, I donít think Iíve had more than a dozen malfunctions on any semi auto firearm I have ever owned, and Iím talking about easily 50 different semi autos.
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Old 11-28-2020, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackpowder View Post
I didn't say not to lube. I said to lube very sparingly. One single drop on sliding surfaces, bearing points and linkages is more than enough.
If, for example, you put your 1911 on full auto (let's say that's possible for experiments sake) and run 1000 rounds through it in long bursts, then yes, the metal will wear faster without oil. But galling and friction-wear will NOT occur during a pistols normal operation and even less on wheelguns.
I see people bathe their guns in oil all the time. That is asking for trouble (unless it's for the purpose of long term storage).
Galling was a pretty well known problem amount automatic pistol manufacturers at one time. I know AMT and others experienced issues in their stainless guns in particular.

My primary disagreement with your comment was that gun metal against gun metal doesnít cause wear because thereís not enough heat and oil doesnít help. Wind and water can both wear metal and thatís not just a heat issue. Heat certainly speeds things up, but anytime two objects rub, there will be wear to some point from friction. Lubrication will certainly help.
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Old 11-28-2020, 10:21 AM
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From my non-technical perspective, I think the subject needs to be discussed in context with the usage of the firearm. For those who relish continuous, RAPID fire of hundreds of rounds, I would think oil is a good thing...And, for those who might be shooting in below freezing temperatures, I would think that oil is not a good thing. My personal situation has always been moderation in the amount of rounds I shoot and the speed I shoot them so my guns are cleaned after shooting and minimal oil is rubbed into metal surfaces and wiped dry (yes, I do take the revolvers apart at least twice a year to clean and lube the innards). In younger days, hunting in freezing climates, my bolt guns were treated to a wipe down inside the bolt to remove any excess oil and quick wipe and, air blast on any other parts. Keeping in mind that two shots a season, was the most action the gun saw. I have no idea how to advise those who shoot fast and hard.
IMHO as always,
J.
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Old 11-28-2020, 10:36 AM
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"To oil or not to oil? That is the question—Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the misfeeds and jams of outrageous fortune, Or to take oil against a sea of troubles."
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Old 11-29-2020, 04:19 PM
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I lube every metal to metal contact part with a moly paste or anti seeze. The run the action 50 to 100 times to burnish it into the metal pores. Wipe off the excess. Just a little of moly will do. Moly eliminates wear, reduces friction, prevents galling, doesn’t attract dirt. Now you can add one drop of oil on the rails if you want too.
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Old 11-29-2020, 04:31 PM
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I lube every metal to metal contact part with a moly paste or anti seeze. The run the action 50 to 100 times to burnish it into the metal pores. Wipe off the excess. Just a little of moly will do. Moly eliminates wear, reduces friction, prevents galling, doesnít attract dirt. Now you can add one drop of oil on the rails if you want too.
I like Moly paste. Just remember to wipe it off after you have lubed everything.
NOTE that I say "wipe" it off. The Moly will stay on the surface after wiping, just do not use any chemicals/solvents that would cut/dissolve the Moly.

EDIT: I just remembered where I originally got that advice... from BigBill himself, several years ago!

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Old 11-29-2020, 06:37 PM
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To see how moly works disassemble a 1911, run the bare slide on the frame notice how it doesn’t run smooth. Now apply moly. Run the slide by hand many times. Now wipe it dry then run it by hand. It’s very smooth.
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Old 11-29-2020, 08:31 PM
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Default Doug M hit the nail on the head

and Pat Rogers was the Real Deal & knew what he was talking about .
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Old 11-29-2020, 08:56 PM
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Quote:
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I’ve found that less is more in terms of oil on my 1911’s. A drop of sewing machine oil or other light machine oil on the frame and slide interface (one drop total) is plenty.

An additional few drops of oil on an old t shirt to wipe down the exterior after any handling is also a good idea.

A couple ounces of oil is enough for many years.
1911's like to run well lubed, so do nearly all weapons with steel or aluminum frames and steel slides.

The caveat here is that if it a part rotates it should be oiled and if a part slides against another part it should be greased.

That approach has worked well for me with various 1911s, Hi Powers, CZ-75s, M1 Carbines, M1 Garands, M1A, Mini-14s, AR-180 and AR-180B, Galil, L1A1, SKSs, AKM, AK-74 and a few others I've probably forgotten.

I treat my AR-15s a little differently - well oiled, no grease, but still run "wet".

---

My revolvers are just lightly oiled. Basically oil it and then wipe off any excess, so the part still has a shine but no visible oil. That works as it leaves sufficient oil in the recesses to lubricate the rotating parts, and there are for all practical purposes no sliding parts, where the parts are under pressure.
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Old 11-29-2020, 09:02 PM
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I think oil is good if you put just a little in the right places.
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Old 11-30-2020, 02:43 AM
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If you pay attention to GunBlue's video, you will see how to properly oil revolvers (a bit long winded but very instructional).
Semi-automatic pistols are treated differently only in respect to the sliding surfaces - all else is the same. Personally, I put one drop of machine oil on all the rails and surfaces that friction acts on. If you use grease, make sure you remove ALL old grease thoroughly before applying new grease. Brake-free works well for this purpose because most of it evaporates and the remainder is blown out with compressed air. That way you start with a clean gun before applying anything.
Just my two cents on what worked for me the past 40 years.
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Old 11-30-2020, 02:53 AM
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Iíve owned two Ed Brown pistols. I wonít make any claims regarding how good an Ed Brown 1911 may or may not be. And I wonít make any claims as to what level an authority Ed Brown may be, if any level whatsoever.

I will say that the ownerís manual shipped with each pistol, Ed uses his own words to say that he wants the pistol lubed sufficiently. And then he says that naturally, you might ask how you know when you have done so. And he goes on to say that if, during the course of fire, the pistol flings lube on to your hand or arm, you have thusly lubed it sufficiently.

I am not kidding. Itís been years since Iíve had either of these two (a Special Forces and a Kobra) and I wish I had proof of what was written. Sorry, I do not.
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Old 11-30-2020, 04:19 AM
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I have watched the video that is being discussed here and disagree with Gunblue to some extent. IMHO, oil absolutely does decrease friction, lessens wear and helps the semi-auto mechanism operated more reliably. I guess that is just his opinion however I've yet to see a manufacturers instruction manual that says operate the gun almost dry! I would also think that he formed this opinion from years of seeing LEO's handguns dripping with way too much oil and/or grease, but IMO he has gone too far the other way! I do agree with him in the respect that a little goes a long way!

If you look at the inside of any semi-auto there are always wear marks on the slide, rails, barrel and all moving parts. Oil helps the metal slide and move with less friction, minimizing further wear.

What I do agree with is that many people who oil their guns put way too much oil on! All you need is a thin film to reduce the friction, decrease wear and keep metal from rusting when it becomes bare. Oil should not be pooling, dripping, or obvious when you handle the gun. When too much is applied, you are actually creating problems such as being a dust and grit collector, getting all over your holster, clothing and wherever to lay the gun down, and could also get on your ammunition which could actually disable the primers and does nothing more than a thin film will do better.

I have personally seen and handled guns that were cleaned and oiled then loaded and put back in holsters of some owners I know. I have tried to calmly and politely let that those persons know that while oiling is proper, more is not better here. Sometimes they listen and sometimes they don't.

So while I absolutely do think oil is proper, slathering a gun with way too much is worse.

Gunblue is entitled to his opinions but I do believe I've seen a few of his videos that are (IMHO) giving out some shaded information - especially to novices who might misunderstand his message. Hey, that's is his personal opinion - no matter what his position was, and there are also Doctors, Auto Mechanics, Accountants etc. etc. that have opinions that buck conventional wisdom and just because they have a piece of paper with a title does not automatically make them correct about everything!

In any field there are accepted industry standards that most agree with and there are always a few renegades that lean one way or the other. Once again, how many firearms owner's manuals have you seen that advocate running and operating the gun almost dry?! I've seen exactly zero! So while he does mention a drop her and a drop there, I am sort of between him and over oiling.

PS: My long time favorite lubricant I've used has been Rig #2 Oil. The reason is that the carrier evaporates quickly leaving lubrication and protection from rust behind. While it's almost invisible, protection and lubrication need not be dripping. Sadly, Rig #2 has been discontinued for now by the Company that purchased Birchwood Casey, but I've got a supply that will last me years. For slides and rails I like Breakfree CLP. I do agree with Gunblue in that almost any major brand of oil thats been around for a long time will work fine and I've yet to find a "wonder-lube!.

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Old 11-30-2020, 10:17 AM
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In South Louisiana , the land of heat , humidity and mold , if you don't wipe everything down with an oily rag , sooner or later it will rust or mold will grow on it .
The wife even wipes the babies butts down with a mineral oil based product ... Johnson's Baby Oil ... we don't want any rusty or moldy kids running around !
The stuff would probably work on firearms in a pinch !

My advice ... wipe them down with something !
Gary
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Old 11-30-2020, 03:34 PM
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Rust protection on the finish and bores oil or G96. I wiped everything down with G96. I haven’t opened the safe in over a decade. No rust at all. They look like the day I wiped them down. I did notice what revolvers I didn’t moly the action. I just can’t live with that roughness in the action.

On metal to metal contact either sliding or rotating moly paste or antiseeze.

Try a dab of moly on your revolvers cylinder on the rear lock pin and cam. Put a tad on the pin and burnish some moly on the cam. Now open and close the cylinder.
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Old 11-30-2020, 04:31 PM
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FWIW, I've run gas operated semi-auto's, in lots of conditions for 40+ years..too much oil can create a need to clean more often condition..Rem 1100 needs oil the least in my opinion, and Winchesters (SX 1,2&3) the most....all need wipe down after use!
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Old 11-30-2020, 05:59 PM
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An interesting video on the myth of over oiling was done by Larry Vickers .
He takes an AR and a Beretta 92 and submerges them in a tub of motor oil . He then pulls them out and immediately shoots a magazine out of them .
Oil flies everywhere but they run just fine .
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Old 11-30-2020, 06:03 PM
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Over time I seen oil dried a red color like freckling. I purchased three k series below average cost because the PO thought it was rust or light freckling. I scored on this purchase there 99% condition. G96 on the outside.
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Old 11-30-2020, 06:06 PM
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Everyone is wrong. Anyone that went thru any military boot camp (Navy for me) knows that a well oiled M-1 keeps your Drill Instructor happy and believe me there is nothing more important than keeping your DI happy.
If you talk to a couple military armorers, the ones that build and maintain rifles for the shooting teams, they want to see a bit of oil on the moving parts of a clean gun. S&W has instructions for lubing their guns. So does Ruger.
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Old 12-01-2020, 01:23 AM
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Iíve owned two Ed Brown pistols. I wonít make any claims regarding how good an Ed Brown 1911 may or may not be. And I wonít make any claims as to what level an authority Ed Brown may be, if any level whatsoever.

I will say that the ownerís manual shipped with each pistol, Ed uses his own words to say that he wants the pistol lubed sufficiently. And then he says that naturally, you might ask how you know when you have done so. And he goes on to say that if, during the course of fire, the pistol flings lube on to your hand or arm, you have thusly lubed it sufficiently.

I am not kidding. Itís been years since Iíve had either of these two (a Special Forces and a Kobra) and I wish I had proof of what was written. Sorry, I do not.
That's been pretty common advice for 1911s over the last three or four decades that I've been shooting them - and it works for 1911s and Hi Powers.

However, that's also what got me started using a light weight gun grease (like Rig, or Tetra gun grease) on the slide rails. If lubricates the rails sufficiently, while throwing a lot less of it at you.
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Old 12-01-2020, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by gwpercle View Post
In South Louisiana , the land of heat , humidity and mold , if you don't wipe everything down with an oily rag , sooner or later it will rust or mold will grow on it .
The wife even wipes the babies butts down with a mineral oil based product ... Johnson's Baby Oil ... we don't want any rusty or moldy kids running around !
The stuff would probably work on firearms in a pinch !

My advice ... wipe them down with something !
Gary
I conceal carry every day, and my oiling and cleaning habits had to change. Here in NC, where it's hot and humid in the summer and warm and humid most of the "winter". When you are covered in sweat before you get to the bottom of the front porch steps, oil for rust prevention becomes a much bigger deal than it was in western SD, where 40% humidity was a "humid" day.

The major threat in SD was oil and grease congealing in the gun in -20 or -30 degree F weather.

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Old 12-01-2020, 04:04 AM
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When talking to other people with many years of experience handling, shooting and maintaining all types of firearms, the general consensus on the issue of oiling ist this: Oil is good when used sparingly. What constitutes "sparingly" is relative and very subjective. IMO, one needs not to make a rocket-science out of oiling a gun. It is a simple thing. Extremes such as running a gun dry or oiling until it oozes and drips from the weapon should be avoided.

As a side note: It helps to keep in mind that both, the gun and oil industry, will always lean towards "more is better" rather than "less is sufficient" in their recommendations and user informations (many gun manufacturers also market their own brand of oils and lubes). They have a vested interest in the generous use of their products. The makers of WD-40, for instance, would have you believe that their product is good for everything save ingestion by humans.
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Old 12-01-2020, 06:49 AM
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FWIW I have also seen a Gunblue video where he constantly (purposely) drops the slide of his 1911 (without retarding it) on an empty chamber and empty magazine, then states repeatedly that this will not due any harm to a pistol while continuing to drop the slide over and over and over.

IMHO doing this repeatedly with no loaded magazine or chamber (even snap caps would be OK) is letting metal slam on metal with no cushion or resistance to slow it down. This has to accelerate metal wear and fatigue in my opinion, but not according to him. Again, doing this once or twice is not what he is claiming - but over & over & over. So while that may be his opinion I certainly differ with that opinion! I'd also want to believe that most here familiar with 1911's would back me up here.

The reason I point this out os to show that just because someone has a piece of paper in a certain area does not make them "smart" 100% of the time!
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Old 12-01-2020, 10:35 AM
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FWIW I have also seen a Gunblue video where he constantly (purposely) drops the slide of his 1911 (without retarding it) on an empty chamber and empty magazine, then states repeatedly that this will not due any harm to a pistol while continuing to drop the slide over and over and over.

IMHO doing this repeatedly with no loaded magazine or chamber (even snap caps would be OK) is letting metal slam on metal with no cushion or resistance to slow it down. This has to accelerate metal wear and fatigue in my opinion, but not according to him. Again, doing this once or twice is not what he is claiming - but over & over & over. So while that may be his opinion I certainly differ with that opinion! I'd also want to believe that most here familiar with 1911's would back me up here. .../
/...
His argument about dropping the slide and pulling the trigger for inspection on guard mount is that the 1911 "was made to withstand that over and over again."

He also implies that JMB used that criteria as one of the primary design goals for the 1911. I really doubt that. It certainly wasn't one of the test criteria the military used in accepting it for service.

In practice, 1911s in military service received ample armorer attention and were rebuilt as needed. Any wear and design issues are addressed in that process, so his logic is at best flawed.

A major point to consider is that fire control parts are face hardened so that they have a very hard and wear resistant outer service, while the still inside the part is still very strong and tough.

The problem is that over time, impacts on those parts will cause the grain structure of the part to change. In simple terms, the grain structure that creates that hard - but brittle - outer surface starts to migrate deeper into the part. Eventually the part loses too much of that tough and strong inner grain structure and the part breaks.

The Walther PP series pistols are a well known example of this. The PP (1929) and PPK (1931) were very innovative pistols incorporating and introducing the double action/single action trigger in combination with a decocking lever. However, over the course of as many as 90 years of even infrequent use, the number of times a PP or PPK has been decocked starts to add up and those parts can and do become very brittle. I'm a PP series fan and own a few of them, as well as a few more of the FEG AP and APK series clones. In light of how that change in the grain structure occurs, and the history of parts breakage in the PP series pistols, I've developed the habit of lowering the hammer when I operate the decocking lever to avoid the impacts on the hammer and the decocking block.

Now...someone might argue the PP was never designed to be a service pistol.

Ok, so let's look at one that was. The Beretta M1923 evolved into the M1951 (which also incorporated the locking system from the Walther P.38 service pistol), which eventually became the Model 92 which was initially marketed as a civilian pistol.

However, the Model 92 was subsequently modified for Italian police and military service (as well as other countries) as the 92S. The 92S was further refined as the 92S-1 (Model 92SB) for USAF service, and as the Model 92F (Model 92SB-F) for US federal government service with drop in part interchangeability and a squared off trigger guard. The 92F was then modified slightly with an enlarged hammer pin to keep a broken slide from coming off the pistol as the Model 92FS, which became the M9.

In other words the M9 is a highly refined descendent of a military service pistol (M1951) going through several iterations to work out various bugs and perceived deficiencies to make it what most considered to be eminently suitable for military service.

Fast forward about 20 years. A friend of mine, who spent his career in the US Army and then in the National Guard was asked to look into the high rate of fire control parts breakage in US Army and National Guard M9s. The concern was that these pistols had comparatively low round counts and it was felt they should not be breaking fire control parts at this rate.

My friend, knowing metallurgy, gun history, and how the military works and uses pistols, looked at a few of the broken parts to confirm they were embrittled. He then didn't bother with looking at how the parts had been manufactured (which was where the US Army was wanting to place the fault), but rather started by looking at how the broken pistols were actually used by the US Army. He recognized that round count was a poor measure for this kind of embrittlement failure and he suspected it was frequency of function checks causing the problem.

Where he could establish usage patterns for M9s he found a much higher incidence of parts breakage in M9s that were function checked on a frequent basis. For example, M9s used by MPs, on guard duty, and in front line service were subjected to a function check every time one of them was checked out of the unit armory to be carried. In some units the pistols were function checked again when they were returned. Pistols issued on a daily basis were not surprisingly function checked more often and were more likely to suffer breakage of a fire control part.

The highest failure rates were in pistols used in training where function checks were done multiple times per day as troops learned how to do function checks.

Either way, each function check involved multiple drops of the hammer and or decocking lever, and over the course of daily checks and sometimes multiple checks per day over a period of years, embrittlement of the fire control parts was inevitable.

Ultimately, his response to the inquiry was a much longer and slightly more tactful version of:

"Well no ____, it's not about round count. Given all the function checks, of course the fire control parts are breaking. You are either going to have to accept the breakage, do a better job of managing and rotating M9s between units with different missions to spread those repetitive function checks across more pistols, or modify your function check procedures to reduce impacts."

-----

As an aside, I googled his other videos and found the lubrication video, 1:00:25 long (!) as well as one on cleaning and lubricating the AR-15, an 1:22:01 long (!!). I can't image watching that.
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Old 12-01-2020, 11:24 AM
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I agree with one thing he said. I've used a silicone cloth for decades and under normal circumstances it keeps rust off of blued firearms. For a blued firearm that is carried daily in a damp environment, by a sweaty person, nothing will keep rust off a blued firearm. In that case, plating, coating or stainless steel is the best option. It is imperative that lube be kept from under the extractor star of double action revolvers. Revolvers need extremely little lubrication in the right places.
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Old 12-01-2020, 11:50 AM
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So I recently came across GunBlue on YouTube and have really enjoyed watching his stuff seems very knowledgeable and has the credentials to back it up. So I'm just asking everyone's take on the oiling guns his seems to be none other then rust protection is the way to go. I've never been much to oil guns but recently have gotten into 1911s and seems most are on the side of oil is your best friend.
Always oil your gun.
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Old 12-01-2020, 12:10 PM
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.... It is imperative that lube be kept from under the extractor star of double action revolvers. Revolvers need extremely little lubrication in the right places.
In my recollection of the video, that is exactly the point GunBlue was making.

Anyway, I think some of you are too hard on GunBlue. I haven't seen all his videos but regarding S&W revolvers - or any revolvers for that matter - he is right on the money. Judging by his background, he seems to be a revolver guy while semi-autos may not be his game.
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Old 12-01-2020, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by BB57 View Post

"Well no ____, it's not about round count. Given all the function checks, of course the fire control parts are breaking. You are either going to have to accept the breakage, do a better job of managing and rotating M9s between units with different missions to spread those repetitive function checks across more pistols, or modify your function check procedures to reduce impacts."
The price of getting nuke tipped cruise missles into Italy was adopting the Beretta. Cruise missles were withdrawn in a few years but we were stuck with the Beretta.
Too bad Austria wasn't in NATO, could have had Glocks.
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