So I went through an orientation this past weekend to a local range that is just about the only one in our area that has a rifle range over 200 yards. What is really cool is that at special times, you can get on steel at 600 yards.

As it was described to me, they stated "we are a muzzle down club". Ok, so don't walk around the range with your rifle pointed up in the air.

Now, they had us go through a test firing and reloading of any weapon we wanted to bring, to show our safe handling skills. I brought my stalwart DAO model 15. I was the only revolver there, go figure. When I laid it on the bench, I was asked how I was going to reload that and as I described the proper way to, while using speed loaders, to reload a revolver - they reminded me about the muzzle down rule.

Go ahead, search the web, there is not one tactical guru or guide book that prescribes and/or recommends a muzzle down tactical clearing of a double action revolver!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think it's a bit much.

Your thoughts?

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DAO Hunter, SWCA #2955

Their range, their rules.

Guess it's not a tactical practice range.

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Slava Ukraini!

You're the new guy; they don't know you..................Their range, their rules

Right there...but maybe they forgot to add "range" after "muzzle down"....

R

You don't have to do "tactical" reloads at a range , pretend you are a NRA Bullseye Match shooter and do a non tactical reload .
After your probationary time , the rule maker's might be open to letting go tactical on the reloads .
I shot Bullseye Match for about 20 years and got by fine with no speed loaders and no tactical reloads....just do it for a while , maybe you can educate the rule makers about the ways of revolvers .
For now ...just stick to the rules .
Gary

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Certified Cajun
NRA Member

I would be willing to bet, that if you are on the range and look up at the overhead, you will see bullet strikes everywhere. There's a reason they have instituted the muzzle down rule and enforce it.
The Fish & Game club range that I use, has power lines that cross overhead between the bench area and the target line. Everyone one of the power lines has been spliced multiple times, WTH. Couple years ago the club invested in putting nice covers over the shooting positions and it didn't take long before holes started being shot in the new covers.

Gonna be a pain at ejecting your shells out of the revolver if you keep the muzzle down....

Gonna be tough to shoot your muzzle loading rifle.

Loading a revolver muzzle down is no problem, but ejecting fired cases should really be done muzzle up. It prevents unburned powder/debris from getting under the extractor and allows the cases to drop free. To comply with their rules, partially extract fired case just enough to get get hold of one or two, then allow the extractor to reseat before pulling them out.

Once you've been a member for a while, talk to the powers that be and ask how they handle revolvers.

Their policy makes me wonder how the club deals with traditional muzzleloaders. Anti-gravity black powder is hard to find!

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"I also cook."

Some folks are just plain ignorant of firearms. They understand the one in their hand, but have no understanding or tolerance for those that shoot something different from "what they think they know".

^^^^ THIS!


Besides the shooters next to you on the line will be appreciative.

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

Sorry, gotta rant.I'm working on a pistol range on the land I have now and I couldn't be happier. Theres very few clubs up here but tons of fed land. The problem is we seem to have some exceptionally bored forest rangers since they came to my house to inquire about the "trash I'd been dumping" his words. He was referring to the trash can I had chained to a tree by the shooting spot with a note in a zip loc that had my name on it explaining it was for garbage left from shooters and that I'd been emptying it periodically. I told myself then no more shooting on property didn't own.

You might succeed if you motion to demonstrate that the during the revolver reload process , cylinder open, muzzle up cylinder clearing is safe and practical. Open minds may well allow this exception to the muzzle up rule.
Good luck
Jim

Easy. Put cap(s) on with muzzle down.

Years ago I belonged to a metro Atlanta gun range. Somebody instituted a policy that all shooters step away from the tables when people needed to go down range. Not a bad policy for TAB’s (temporarily able-bodied shooters) but there were nearly a dozen handicapped members in wheelchairs or electric scooters who had difficulty repositioning themselves. The Board insisted there would be no changes. An attorney with a copy of the ADA straightened The Board out real fast.

I believe the muzzle down thing is based on the idea that an AD going up into the air goes who knows where, and if one goes into the berm or even ground, at least that's that.

Back when I tried IPSC I used to get yelled at a lot. As a shotgunner first and foremost, I had hammered it in my head that up was safe. When there was a problem or concern, I instinctively pointed up! Couldn't untrain myself!

I suppose I could go along with this with one proviso.

If any of these "handicapped shooters" so much as touched a gun while I was downrange, they would be immediately ejected from the range and told to never come back. (Needless to say, I don't have much trust in folks that consider themselves "experts" when it comes to gun safety)

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

Ejection, yes. But kind of hard to reload a revolver muzzle up......

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

Obviously you need to start collecting break-tops!

My reference was obviously muzzle up ejection.
Cant imagine taking it any other way. Of course charging is muzzle down. Hard to believe you thought that. DUH!
Jim

I believe you misunderstood the issue. The handicapped shooters had great difficulty getting set up properly; it was an unnecessarily cruel requirement from a club that willingly took membership fees from these folks.

You specifically said muzzle up reload...... (Say what you mean.....)

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

I think I understood the issue quite clearly. The whole object of showing safe and moving behind the red line (or whatever color your club uses) is to remove the temptation of someone fiddling with their gun while someone is downrange. The last club I belonged to wouldn't even allow unpacking a firearm while there was a cease fire in effect.

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

I eject empties muzzle up, down, and horizontal, depending on the situation and my whims.
Always reload with muzzle generally down.

Some more rigid people follow the text of the rule and not the spirit of the rule. Its hard to ND into the air with the cylinder physically out of the firearm.

Or maybe even your toe, foot or leg! That’s that too. And I bet one would never have another negligent discharge after that!

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Possum—The other white meat!

In the last ten years before I retired a large part of my work was as an expert witness investigating and testifying as to the causes of transportation related accidents. Yes, there were a fair number of blockheads who were accidents waiting to happen. But the majority were people who were well trained, knew the safety rules and yet one time cut a corner, or forgot to look first, or was too busy thinking about something and forgot to set a parking brake and they, or somebody near them got injured or killed. The take away is that far too many times people are injured or killed in the workplace because they didn’t do something by the book.

The reason for strictly enforcing safety rules is that when people make exceptions, someone invariably gets injured.

Now to the issue at hand. When you take the NRA RSO class they teach fundamentals like muzzle and trigger discipline and explain what constitutes good practice. After that they teach one rule; the job of the RSO is to ensure all of the people on the range adhere to the rules established by the range. They also teach that the RSO can not change the rules on an ad hoc basis. The rule is the rule, and if someone is not observing the rules, explain it and suggest the shooter change. If there is no change forthcoming, then follow the established procedure for rule breakers.

The OP broke the established rules. There’s no discussion, there’s no dispensation because it’s the wrong time and place. As others have said, if you don’t like a specific rule, open a discussion with the powers that be at an appropriate time when rule changes are being discussed. Or the alternative, find someplace else to shoot their revolver.

Here’s something to consider, why would a range have such a rule? How about the possibility that prior to the rule a round got off the property and put a hole in a neighbor’s window? Interestingly enough I spent the early part of this evening at my club helping to present to the membership the plans our architect has come up with to implement no blue sky features on our rifle range. Guess what? we are going to have no muzzle up rules as well. Our black powder shooters will have their own stations where the ceiling above their stations will have steel plating.



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Hopefully, if you ever wind up in a wheelchair, various people will be considerate of your needs and go a bit out of their way to accommodate you.

Maybe I am dense, but that doesn't sound safe to me. If one goes off, it bounces back to anyone under that shelter. That seems far more dangerous than an errant round going straight up.

Rosewood

As I stated earlier, if I am ever in such a position and am left sitting on the line during a cease-fire and I start fiddling with my gun, I hope they kick me out.

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Dean
SWCA #680 SWHF #446

There was no handling of firearms by the disabled shooters during ceasefire at any time. It was blatant discrimination.

The roof is angled and is actually a sandwich of 2” wood ceiling and steel plate under the actual roof structure. It’s based on a DOE no blue sky design. We’re also talking structural steel, not AR500, with the idea to not necessarily contain the round, just slow it down sufficiently to make it non lethal. Since the down range direction abuts a wooded wildlife management area we don’t have to worry about a round going into a residence.


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Hank—I am curious, what thickness of steel plate are you using?

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Possum—The other white meat!

There is a range near me that runs steel challenge and they have the same no muzzle up rule. However, the couple of times I’ve shot with a revolver, I ask the RSO about it and he gives permission to eject with muzzle up, With the clear direction to “open the cylinder first”. I’ve also seen others granted the same permission, provided they ask.

Yeah, I bet that would work - you just need to let them know that you know what you are doing AND remind them that with an open cylinder you're as safe as safe can be.

I don't argue with the "their range/their rules" concept but something as silly as causing you to not be able to dump empties from a double action revolver cylinder is just that - silly.

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Come and take it!!

I don’t know. We’ve only seen the architects renderings. The construction drawings are in process. My understanding it will dimensional, so greater then gauge thickness.


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More like a silly misinterpretation, (deliberate) by you.
Being a little pragmatic lately?
I edited my original post so even you can understand.
Jim

How close are they to occupied buildings? Direction of firing line? One club I belonged to for a short time had no particular rule, and a careless round from an 8mm Mauser was launched at enough of an angle that it penetrated a house wall 1 1/2 miles away and lodged in the floor of a little girls bedroom. Within 30 days the club was limited to handguns and .22 rifles, the membership dropped so much it couldn't be maintained and it was closed down. Rules are made for reasons.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244