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Old 01-24-2010, 08:12 PM
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Default “D I Y” Short 5- and Medium 10-Round Magazines!!!

Ahoy to the forum from the coast of Maine. I hope you find this post interesting and informative…

Like many here, I sure was hoping to get some “true” 10-round magazines from S&W soon. When I first placed my order for 2 of them many weeks ago, that’s what I was told. It wasn’t until the evening of the very day when they had charged my c-card, that I found out there really isn’t a short 10-round mag available yet -- and that I’d be getting some “pinned” Mass-compliant mags.

When the “extra long” 10-round mags finally arrived, at first I was really disappointed... Then I got a little angry, and started thinking -- and those last two are always a deadly combination for me… So I went down into the cellar with the mags and a goal -- but without a plan -- and attempted to make my own short 5-round mag.

Well, as you can see, I finally succeeded after a little cutting and fitting so it can be cleaned like the standard magazines. Here’s a pix of my finished short 5-round magazine:

-m-p-5-rnd-mag-01-medium-jpg


Yes, I must admit the removable toe is mounted on “backwards”. It had to be done this way, and I will explain more on how & why on the next reply (to this posting). I’ll also include a step-by-step tutorial with some pictures on how I also made a 10-round medium-length magazine.

Note the blue follower on that mag… I’m guessing this must be a visual indicator to S&W that this is (was) a fixed or pinned 10-round mag built on the 25-round mag body. Who cares really, I just wish the pinned 10-round mags had the follower button to ease loading after #5.

Also note the small cotter pin added near the bottom of the slot. That was installed to remove almost all the tension from the mag spring off of the superglued baseplate (just in case) when it’s fully loaded. I used hobby-grade gel/gap-filling superglue and clamped the pieces together for an hour. (Not sure if that’s better than the thin household superglue, but I’ve always had much better luck with the gel.) I “think” the baseplate is on there for good now, but I really don’t want it popping off while I’m out squirrel hunting. Several coils of the spring are left below the cotter pin, and that puts some pressure on the locking tab to secure the removable “toe” part of the baseplate.

Below is a pix showing you the comparison to a standard 25-round mag, along with the middle piece cut from the original “pinned 10/25” mag which was sacrificed. Note the very sharp and clean cuts that were done with a “plywood” table-saw blade. (You’ll want to use a blade with many small teeth, and not a standard wood-cutting blade.) The cut on back of the middle piece, which didn’t go all the way through, was my first trial cut just to see how the plastic would handle the blade. It worked just fine.

-m-p-5-rnd-mag-02-medium-jpg

Finally, here’s a right-side view of my M&P with the new SHORT 5-round mag inserted. I’m really happy with the way it looks AND performs, as I range tested it this afternoon and it worked like a champ! Awesome -- no FTEs or FTFs at all!

By the way, the small tactical scope is an NC Star 1.25 - 4X x 30mm with red/green illuminated reticle. The size is just right to me. The low 1.25 power works great for plinking with a view just like iron sights, except for with a crosshair. With the red or green reticle “On” at low power you get the quick-pointing capability of a red-dot, in my opinion. But best of all, you also get the option to dial up to 3X or 4X power for longer-range or smaller, more challenging targets like squirrels -- which I plan to do soon, now that I don’t have a long 25-round “assault magazine” hanging out of the bottom of my M&P.

-m-p-5-rnd-mag-medium-jpg

Stay tuned for a follow-up reply with even more details and pix…

Tight groups!

Old No7
Attached Images
File Type: jpg M&P 5-rnd Mag 01 (Medium).jpg (91.8 KB, 10962 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 5-rnd Mag 02 (Medium).jpg (100.9 KB, 10971 views)
File Type: jpg M&P with 5-rnd Mag (Medium).jpg (80.0 KB, 10920 views)
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:15 PM
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good job, im sure many will follow
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:21 PM
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Default Part 2 of “D I Y” Short 5- and Medium 10-Round Mags

Here we go again…

In this post, I’ll include pictures and commentary for “how I did it”. There may be some other or even better ways to do this, so new ideas and methods are encouraged. Just understand that since I can’t control what happens in your workroom, if you do decide to cut into your own mags, I can’t be held responsible for the results.

The first pix below shows the mag setup on my table saw, which has the fine-toothed “plywood” blade installed. My plan is to cut just inside the masking tape. Note the use of a wooden block on my saw guide to help stabilize the mag as it’s cut. Wood smiths use extensions or blocks like this quite often, and it’s a helpful tip. I don’t have a fancy angle guide on my saw, but you can see the surface is ribbed. I just aligned the top and bottom of each cut parallel with a rib, then tightened the block to the saw guide.

The mag must be held very tight and carefully to the block, don’t let it lift up or shift left or right on you, or you won’t get a clean cut at all. Luckily, the plastic cut easily and it put very little pressure on the blade, so once it was started right, it tracked straight and finished with a nice clean cut.

-m-p-10-mod-01-medium-jpg

Here’s a close-up of how the tab on the follower (held in place by elastic, so it won’t slide down and engage the blade!) and the curved edge of the magazine align on the wooden block to stabilize the mag for cutting. It can “rock” some if you allow it to, so you have to ensure those 2 points are fully pressed against the block on the saw guide.

-m-p-10-mod-02-medium-jpg

OK, the cuts are done. Here’s a view of the clean cuts for the middle piece which is removed, and the bottom baseplate which is salvaged to work on the new shorter mag.

Just a note that I did not have to cut the original spring from this mag, as I just used the leftover piece from the spring which was cut to make the 5-round mag. I guess having an extra 25-round magazine spring won’t be such a bad thing to have around.

-m-p-10-mod-03-medium-jpg


OK, here is where it gets interesting… The pix below shows the now cut-off baseplate mounted on the mag where it will be glued. For this 10-round mag, the baseplate will sit correctly front to back, with the removable “toe” where it should be. The red circle on the left shows an area where some plastic must be removed in order to remove the spring through the baseplate for cleaning. I used a sharp Xacto knife, followed up by a file.

The red arrow on the right shows a solid plastic wall which runs the entire length of the mag body. That wall was one of the challenges I had fitting the baseplate onto the 5-round mag, and why I ended up reversing the baseplate. For the 5-round mag, it was just easier to cut out the extra plastic from the reversed baseplate so the spring could be removed. I don’t think the baseplate would have mounted correctly on the small 5-round magazine, as think of this -- when viewed from the right side of the rifle, the bullets start out at the top left of the magazine, but then they end up at the bottom right. So... When you put the cutoff baseplate onto the very short mag body of a 5-rounder, the slots for the spring won’t line up at all. Reversing the baseplate made it work though, as that was a much better/closer fit.

-m-p-10-mod-04-medium-jpg

Next is a view of the baseplate for the 10-round mag with some plastic already removed from the inside top left corner, so you can see what needs to be cut out. The bottom inside left corner must also be trimmed to match so there’s room for the spring to be removed later. Note the wedge-shape of the original slot on the right side, if you cut your baseplate and mag body to make a short 5-round mag, you’ll need to cut out all the plastic on that side too.

The crude drawing and dimensions in the background were leftover from my first effort to make the 5-round mag. My original plan was not to use the factory baseplate at all, but to try to replicate the grooves and cuts to hold on the removable toe of the baseplate. That was going to take way too much filing or Dremeling, and it turns out the glued-on baseplate (as supported by the cotter pin) works just fine.

-m-p-10-mod-05-medium-jpg

Stay tuned for Part 3 -- as I can't add 2 more pix you will want to see...

Tight groups!

Old No7
Attached Images
File Type: jpg M&P 10 Mod 01 (Medium).jpg (67.5 KB, 10786 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 10 Mod 02 (Medium).jpg (72.9 KB, 10777 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 10 Mod 03 (Medium).jpg (54.6 KB, 10769 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 10 Mod 04 (Medium).jpg (46.2 KB, 10725 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 10 Mod 05 (Medium).jpg (46.9 KB, 10696 views)
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:28 PM
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Default Part 3 - “D I Y” Short 5- and Medium 10-Round Mags

OK, the end is near...

So let's start right off with a right-side view of my M&P with the new MEDIUM 10-round mag inserted. I range tested this today, and it too was flawless!

-m-p-10-rnd-mag-medium-jpg

Well, if you’ve read along this far, thanks, I sure hope it’s been helpful to you. This is my way of thanking the forum and other posters for all the pictures, “how to” and other ideas they’ve all shared -- even though some of those end up costing me money!

If you follow my lead to do this, it will cost you a couple of the long magazines as the raw materials and some time & effort, but if you’re tired of waiting on S&W and/or you really enjoy the challenge of doing-it-yourself, then good luck! Just be sure to “Measure twice, and cut once” as my late father always used to always tell me. (I think he was looking over me as I did these mod’s, and that he’d approve...)

Well there you have it…

This just may be the first ever complete set of fully functioning 25-round LONG, 10-round MEDIUM and 5-round SHORT M&P15-22 magazines in the country -- for a little while that is! Knowing some of the guys on this forum, it won’t be long until mine have some good company…

-m-p-25-10-5-rnd-mags-medium-jpg

That’s all folks! Enjoy!

Tight groups!

Old No7
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File Type: jpg M&P with 10-rnd Mag (Medium).jpg (55.1 KB, 10636 views)
File Type: jpg M&P 25 - 10 - 5-rnd Mags (Medium).jpg (97.9 KB, 10621 views)
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:29 PM
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It's not so much the length of the mag that bothers me, but the lack of a load assist button.
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:35 PM
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really nice work!

i'll wait for smith or blackdog to come out with a 10 rounder before i ruin one of my 25 rounders. i'm a measure twice, cut once, swear profusely, remeasure and cut again kind of guy. it's not pretty.
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Old 01-24-2010, 08:45 PM
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^likes this.

Last edited by chickenADOBO; 01-24-2010 at 09:08 PM.
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Old 01-24-2010, 09:05 PM
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Thanks #7 I knew you would come through for us. It's funny you did what S&W said they couldn't or wouldn't do or maybe will do or whatever other answer they give on any given day.

Last edited by Skidder; 01-24-2010 at 09:12 PM.
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Old 01-24-2010, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Temporaryscars View Post
It's not so much the length of the mag that bothers me, but the lack of a load assist button.
LOL, I knew it.
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Old 01-24-2010, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
"i'm a measure twice, cut once, swear profusely, remeasure and cut again kind of guy. it's not pretty."
LOL!!! That sounds like my identical twin brother!

Luckily, my side of the egg got some skills which helped me in this task. He got skills that... ...I probably shouldn't mention in pubic, I mean, public.

But seriously, thanks for the comments.

Old No7
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Old 01-24-2010, 10:27 PM
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Hey OLD No7 you did a very good job on them mags. I will probably do the same with one of mine. But I have a question where did you get your NC star scope from and how much did you pay for it? I'm looking to get a 3-9x42.
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Old 01-24-2010, 11:51 PM
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Damn fine work Old No.7. Now, will you get to work on that blown extractor problem !!!!
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Old 01-25-2010, 02:52 AM
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Your an artist
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Old 01-26-2010, 07:17 AM
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#7 do you know how long or how many coils you cut the spring for the ten rounder?

Last edited by Skidder; 01-26-2010 at 01:39 PM.
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Old 01-26-2010, 10:31 PM
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Quote:
"Where did you get your NC star scope from and how much did you pay for it? I'm looking to get a 3-9x42."
Zunkted: I paid $120 at a local shop, cause they had several and that's what I wanted "right then and there". But a buddy over on LeverGuns just told me to check out AMAZON.com for optics -- and wow! Some great prices and selection there, lowest-priced Nikon Monarchs I have ever seen, who woulda thought to shop there???

Quote:
"#7 do you know how long or how many coils you cut the spring for the ten rounder?"
Skidder: The 5-round spring is just about 3.5", which makes the 10-round one 8" -- I just checked my extra 25-round spring and it's 11.5" long. Good luck if you make one!

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Old 01-27-2010, 07:42 AM
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Also was there a reason for not using the assist button on the ten rounder?
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Old 01-27-2010, 03:44 PM
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Quote:
"Also was there a reason for not using the assist button on the ten rounder?"
Why yes there is! And a very good one at that...

(a) I cut below the pin which S&W molds into the mag body and (b) I didn't have an extra one anyway, as their pinned 10/25 mag comes without one.

But you're right -- without that, I use a key or screwdriver blade or something like that to assist after round #6.

Good luck!

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Old 01-27-2010, 05:38 PM
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As soon as I find another mag I'll get started. Up here in mass. we can't get 25 rounders and there are no 10's for sale yet.
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Old 01-27-2010, 09:45 PM
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Wholesale AR15 Magazines at 44MAG.com has had a good supply, from what I have seen and heard. If your not concerned about the length of the mag, buy one of their repair kits for the 15-22. It looks as though they can ship that to every State. Ask them about the limiter plug, or go to eBay or Tactical Defense Solutions LLC - Specializing in high quality supplies for the critical shooter
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Old 02-28-2010, 10:17 AM
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this thread should become a "sticky" at the top of our forum.
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Old 02-28-2010, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
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Ahoy to the forum from the coast of Maine. I hope you find this post interesting and informative…

I found it informative enough to sticky.

Well done.
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Old 02-28-2010, 03:10 PM
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I did this to one of my mags and it looks great and runs flawless.
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Old 02-28-2010, 04:39 PM
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GREAT JOB Skidder!!! Looks super!!!

And THANKS to Smith 357 for making this a sticky.

Good luck to others who "make the cut"!!!

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Old 02-28-2010, 04:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skidder View Post
As soon as I find another mag I'll get started. Up here in mass. we can't get 25 rounders and there are no 10's for sale yet.
hey skidder, not to hijack this thread, but i live in thompson, CT. always looking for more shooting pals, where ya at?
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Old 02-28-2010, 05:11 PM
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Ya know,..THIS is what I love, .....ingenuity is the mother of invention!! how great is this!? we all have the same ideas, but it's the ones who throw caution into the wind and say " "F"-it", and go ahead and "TRY" something that we don't have the time/confidence to do....and we ALL benefit from this. I really don't know what/how I could find this "mad scientist" work-up on my gun without all of you. I Thank ya all!! To me, this is what it's all about. Together, we make all the rest better. great post!! there should be more in this spirit!!!!
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Old 03-01-2010, 12:35 AM
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Quote:
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Ya know,..THIS is what I love, .....ingenuity is the mother of invention!! how great is this!? we all have the same ideas, but it's the ones who throw caution into the wind and say " "F"-it", and go ahead and "TRY" something that we don't have the time/confidence to do....and we ALL benefit from this. I really don't know what/how I could find this "mad scientist" work-up on my gun without all of you. I Thank ya all!! To me, this is what it's all about. Together, we make all the rest better. great post!! there should be more in this spirit!!!!
Amen to that!!! Couldn't of said it any better myself. On a side note, I made a 10 rounder today and got it all cut up and epoxy'd the base plate to the other half and let it sit for 3 hours to dry. Then I went to check up on it and it looked good and everything, then I noticed something was wrong........ i forgot to put the follower in it before I glued it, LOL. So I broke it back apart before the epoxy really dried then put the follower back in and re glued it. Total time it took me to make was like 30min.
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Old 03-01-2010, 07:20 AM
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Yup that Old #7 is a genius and was nice enough to share with us all.
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Old 03-02-2010, 06:12 PM
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Anyone think about taking 2 and making one long 30-35 rounder?
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Old 03-02-2010, 08:22 PM
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Anyone think about taking 2 and making one long 30-35 rounder?
Or like a 40-45, LOL that would be huge, smart thinking Rip3000. You would somehow have to join the 2 springs together also. Say I won't
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Old 03-24-2010, 11:59 PM
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I did this to one of my mags and it looks great and runs flawless.
Did you cut your spring and if so to what length? And what adhesive did you use? Oh and by the way that looks great. Thanks in advance.
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Old 03-25-2010, 06:34 AM
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I think I just cut it in half. Old #7's was a bit longer. I used a two part epoxy.
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Old 04-02-2010, 05:01 AM
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Thanks for putting this info out. I am going to try this with one of my mags for my AK47 22. They just put pins in like S&W for the different capacity mags. The GSG AK 22 mags are built different and will require some tinkering to get it right. Thanks again.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:18 PM
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You're welcome. Good luck!!!

Hope you "make the cut"!

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Old 04-10-2010, 11:15 PM
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Wow! What and absolutely extroidenary thread!! Thanks so much for documenting this, it is something I will definitely be doing.

I have a couple of questions if you wouldnt mind answering.

First, You mention using a cotter pin to releave tension on the spring. Can you describe this and its instalation a little more for us? And is it possible to provide more/better pics of this step?

Second, Can you describe how and what you used for glueing the two pieces back together? If its possible to provide more pics of this as well, that would be fantastic.

Lastly, when cutting the very bottom, did you just cut it right above the bottom "groove" right under the S&W emblem?

Thanks again for such a great thread.
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Old 04-11-2010, 11:50 AM
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I was also wondering if you have tried to make a 20 round clip, or if you had any advice on those?

Thanks
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
"I was also wondering if you have tried to make a 20 round clip, or if you had any advice on those?"
Nope, I've not tried that, but if I ever wanted a "20", I would not bother cutting down the magazine at all. There's a "10 round follower" for 25-round mags listed on eBay, and I'd just cut down that longer follower instead, so it allowed only the 20 rounds, not 10 (or 25).

Good luck with that, if you try it.

Old No7
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Old 04-11-2010, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
"First, You mention using a cotter pin to releave tension on the spring. Can you describe this and its instalation a little more for us? And is it possible to provide more/better pics of this step?

Second, Can you describe how and what you used for glueing the two pieces back together? If its possible to provide more pics of this as well, that would be fantastic.

Lastly, when cutting the very bottom, did you just cut it right above the bottom "groove" right under the S&W emblem?"
I've got another mag to cut down... Give me a couple of weeks if you can -- LOTS going on at work right now -- and I'll make a note to snag a few pix of those steps.

If I can get to it any sooner, I will do so. Thanks.

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Old 04-11-2010, 10:33 PM
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Thanks Old No 7! This is really a great thread.

I was hoping to do one this week and was just looking for a little more instruction before doing so. If not no worries

Thanks so much
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Old 04-16-2010, 12:32 PM
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Thank you old no.7

Just did myself... a 15 rounder magazine
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Old 04-16-2010, 12:52 PM
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Thank you old no.7

Just did myself... a 15 rounder magazine

Hey that looks really good. What dimensions do you have on that and what did you cut the spring down to. I would love to make one that size.

Thanks
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Old 04-16-2010, 01:54 PM
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To make a 15 rounds mag, my measurement are taken from bottom edge of the S&W circular logo as a reference line.

1.5" on the front and 1.5" on the back.


I used a small hand saw 6" to cut the bottom first


Then the top edge (where I used a masking tape to mark the edge)


I used a clear epoxy glue to glue the bottom to the mag body (light sanding both surfaces to be glued first to ensure smooth and even contact surfaces)
Just 10 min. into drying I used a sharp knife to remove excess glue that oozed out.
Noted that I reassembled the mag follower and already cut the spring about 6 notches.


Hope this help explain it.
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Old 04-16-2010, 01:57 PM
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Thanks for the info. I made a 10 rounder on Monday, and it came out great! I would just like something with a little larger capacity. I live in a restricted city, so I have to make something with fewer rounds.

Thanks
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Old 04-16-2010, 03:45 PM
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Default New M&P 15-22

Just picked up my new CA model (10 shot limit mag), took it home, cleaned, slight oil and hauled off to the range. I took 6 different ammo brands that included 30 yr. old Federal Classic, new Federal bulk pack, Winchester, PMC and two brands of cheap Philippine ****. Also included were two kinds of hollow points.
In short, this fantastic gun ate them all without a burp in over 300 rounds. Medium rate fire and rapid fire showed no difference.
This gun has the blue spring with serial DTX 50xx. I am extremely pleased. Very easy to shoot. S&W told me they are working on an actual 10 shot mag. rather than the blocked 20 they now supply in the Democaratic Peoples Republic of California. I put in a back order for a few.
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Old 04-27-2010, 11:18 PM
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I finished the short 10rd mag last Friday and ran about 700 rounds through it on Sunday. Only a few FTF... I adjust the spring at the range (cut 3 more) and it worked flawless! Going to cut my other 3 this week!

Take it apart


Tape it up


Make the cut - Cut 8 levels of the spring


Don't let your dogs eat the shavings while you go to the bathroom!


2 Ton Epoxy! Vised up and stuck for 8hrs


Sand down the sides and polish it up

Last edited by RazorClose; 05-03-2010 at 03:58 PM.
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Old 05-12-2010, 06:18 PM
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Did you cut 3 more levels of the spring after the 8 you already cut? How many total did you have to cut?
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Old 06-24-2010, 09:38 PM
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I had a 10rd mag that came with my gun but I can have 25rd here in CT. I wasn't going to use the 10 so I made a 5 out of it.



here's the molded in pin that makes a 25 a 10



finished product





I haven't shot from it yet. I didn't notice a post on how many spring coils others used, I used 10 for starters, feels pretty good.

thanks for the inspiration Old No7
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Old 06-27-2010, 09:22 AM
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I see S&W is advertising a true 10round clip for us now. Great for those of us with no creative ability to diy.

Product: M&P15-.22 10 RD Magazine

Anyone know if they are actually in production or have received one though?
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Old 07-09-2010, 12:24 PM
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:update:
I ordered the 10 rd. from S&W and got it in a little over a week, so they are available.
Wish I had the skills to make my own but for those of us that don't these are great.



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Old 07-09-2010, 06:41 PM
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I wish the magazines could be clip fed. It would make re-loading go much faster.
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Old 10-04-2010, 09:45 PM
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For those of you that have completed this 25 round to 10 round (or less) conversion, do any of you have the orange followers or load assist pins available? I'm looking for 3 of them and willing to buy or otherwise compensate you.

Thanks;

John
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