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  #1  
Old 07-23-2011, 08:44 PM
.50AE .50AE is offline
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Default Leaving the 15-22 cocked?

Is it ok to leave it cocked after I'm done shooting at the range?
If it isn't is there a way to uncock it?
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Old 07-23-2011, 08:46 PM
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You could leave it cocked. You could buy a snap-cap or use a fired case to drop the hammer on. I have a .22 auto pistol that I use the fired case method on.
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Old 07-23-2011, 08:55 PM
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Gun unload and chamber empty, pull back on the charge handle to move the bolt back about a quarter inch or so, then pull the trigger.
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Old 07-24-2011, 09:12 AM
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I was shooting with a friend and he noticed I leave my weapons cocked. He believes you need to uncock your weapons, relax the springs. I am 51 yrs old now and I have never worried about it. He dry fire 22 rimfire weapons, I told him that is harder on them than leaving them cocked. After the debate he is going to do his way and I am going to do it my way, It hard to teach an old dog new tricks.
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Old 07-24-2011, 11:23 AM
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I would have to agree with Bulldozer8t that keeping any weapon cocked isn't going to do any harm even over long periods of time.
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Old 07-24-2011, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChattanoogaPhil View Post
Gun unload and chamber empty, pull back on the charge handle to move the bolt back about a quarter inch or so, then pull the trigger.
+1, why dry-fire or leave cocked when you can gently release the firing pin?
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Old 07-24-2011, 12:42 PM
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Good firearms safety practice usually specifies weapons are stored unloaded and uncocked. Won't hurt the rifle or springs either way. Nor is there a convenient way of determining the M16-type (and their clones) weapons are cocked or not, the days of external hammers on rifles are long gone other than a few nostalgia lever action and pump types.

I decock all mine. But it's not about the springs.

-- Chuck
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Old 07-24-2011, 08:06 PM
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Well the easy way to tell if my 15-22 is cocked is to flip the safety, if it goes to "safe" its cocked. Same thing on some of my other rifles too, hummm.....
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Old 07-24-2011, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonrobertd View Post
Well the easy way to tell if my 15-22 is cocked is to flip the safety, if it goes to "safe" its cocked. Same thing on some of my other rifles too, hummm.....
shouldnt they be on SAFE anyway? hummmm
Uncocking ensures you have to clear the action before handling the weapon...

I was always taught 1) Guns are ALWAYS loaded; even when they are obviously NOT loaded 2) Do not EVER point a gun at anything you dont intend to KILL 3) mechanical safety devices are there for a reason--use them-- but dont RELY on them 4) the ONLY safe direction is DOWN ( either down range or down at the ground)
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Old 07-24-2011, 10:34 PM
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Mine stays cocked but once in a while I'll store it released. I just open the rifle up, pull the trigger with my finger on the hammer and just close it back up.
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Old 07-24-2011, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChattanoogaPhil View Post
Gun unload and chamber empty, pull back on the charge handle to move the bolt back about a quarter inch or so, then pull the trigger.
+1
Such an easy solution.

BTW, Redbull.. you can't put a 15-22 on safe unless it's cocked.

Hobie
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Old 07-24-2011, 11:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobie1 View Post
+1
Such an easy solution.

BTW, Redbull.. you can't put a 15-22 on safe unless it's cocked.

Hobie
mine seems to go into the SAFE position whether cocked or not...
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Old 07-24-2011, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
mine seems to go into the SAFE position whether cocked or not...
Then you have a problem.
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
mine seems to go into the SAFE position whether cocked or not...
I would fix that ASAP before someone gets hurt.
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:38 AM
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I don't believe there is any mechanical harm in leaving a weapon cocked.
That said,
I believe strongly in always putting a gun in a neutral condition (no magazine, no ammo, action closed,hammer down) before putting it away.
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Old 07-25-2011, 06:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulldozerd8t View Post
I was shooting with a friend and he noticed I leave my weapons cocked. He believes you need to uncock your weapons, relax the springs. I am 51 yrs old now and I have never worried about it. He dry fire 22 rimfire weapons, I told him that is harder on them than leaving them cocked. After the debate he is going to do his way and I am going to do it my way, It hard to teach an old dog new tricks.
Dry firing is a standard training regimen for competition shooters no matter what the caliber of the gun. And using snapcaps is a pain in the *** for those purposes. As long as the hammer in a rimfire does not hit the breechface then using snapcaps is not a real issue. Replacing a firing pin or FP spring is small price to pay for getting really good.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:13 AM
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Note the position of the selector in the Semi or Fire position is no indication if the rifle is cocked or uncocked. In the Safe position it should be an indication it's cocked. Should being the operative word.

If the plastic M&P15-22 selector been forced onto Safe with the rifle not cocked it may become possible to fire the rifle in the Safe position. These are steel in the 5.56mm versions and won't do this, but the plastic M&P15-22 version can wear enough to allow enough trigger movement when cocked to release the hammer.

-- Chuck
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
mine seems to go into the SAFE position whether cocked or not...
You've forced the selector to SAFE while uncocked too many times, and you need to get it fixed.
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Old 07-25-2011, 10:35 AM
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I keep all my AR style rifles cocked in the safe.

If the SHTF I just slap in a mag and drop the bolt and I'm ready to rock n' roll.

-Masta
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Old 07-25-2011, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
mine seems to go into the SAFE position whether cocked or not...
S&W will send you a new safety selector. The old one can't be fixed.

E-mail or call Kelley Rathman at S&W:

Smith & Wesson
Customer Service
Returns/Exchanges
Retail Export Support
Admin.
800-331-0852 X 3766

[email protected]

Tell her your what your safety does, you will have a replacement in short order.

Last edited by CPTBeaker; 07-25-2011 at 10:46 AM.
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon88 View Post
You've forced the selector to SAFE while uncocked too many times, and you need to get it fixed.
I have never FORCED anything on ANY firearm and insulting my intelligence is not appreciated--i bought the gun used from a local dealer--meaning the moron who owned it before me probably forced the safety
And the earlier post "before somebody gets hurt"--if you follow Cooper's Range rules then nobody should be in the position for it to be an issue; those four rules back eachother up and should always be practiced

I will be having my Dad look at the lower this week--does anybody know if the steel components in the m&P 15 5.56 trigger assembly will work in ours>?
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
does anybody know if the steel components in the m&P 15 5.56 trigger assembly will work in ours>?
Any small pin FCG made for an AR will work on the 15-22, however, safeties made for an M&P 15 or any other AR will not work on the 15-22. The 15-22 lower receiver is wider than a standard AR lower, therefore the safety selector for a standard AR is not wide enough. The fire 'flat' on the safety, and the detent locations will not line up, therefore will not function, if installed in a 15-22.

Currently there are no after market AR safeties that work on the 15-22.

Last edited by CPTBeaker; 07-25-2011 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CPTBeaker View Post
S&W will send you a new safety selector. The old one can't be fixed.

E-mail or call Kelley Rathman at S&W:

Smith & Wesson
Customer Service
Returns/Exchanges
Retail Export Support
Admin.
800-331-0852 X 3766

[email protected]

Tell her your what your safety does, you will have a replacement in short order.
thanks--i emailed this morning straight away and my dad is expecting the lower and the parts when they arrive


I will also be having a chat with my local dealer when i stop in today to grab pistol ammo--the rifle has been in this state from day 1 and they need to be aware they sold me a rifle that should have been more thoroughly checked--no harm done but if S&W sends me a bill you can bet the dealer will be footing it
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Old 07-25-2011, 12:25 PM
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but if S&W sends me a bill you can bet the dealer will be footing it
There will be no charge. I've requested a new safety and several other parts and have not been charged for any.
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Old 07-25-2011, 01:09 PM
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I have an early 15-22 and I have just been discovering some of the issues some of the other owners have had with the 15-22. If Im done at the range, and I remove the magazine and the weapon is empty. I press the trigger to fire and the weapon is uncocked, I am NOT suppose to be able to move the fire selection switch to safe? It has been this way since the day I brought it home.
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Old 07-25-2011, 01:21 PM
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I just got done checking my rifle. My safety selector switch is definately worn down. I am embarrassed that I didn't recognize/know this. I apologize for being a novice AR owner.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:14 PM
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Default Wear on safety

You folks haven't used the allen screw pre-travel trick have you? If you have, you can bugger your safety doing that. If you haven't, then just don't try to safety the un-cocked gun....but you know this.

Hobie
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
I will also be having a chat with my local dealer when i stop in today to grab pistol ammo--the rifle has been in this state from day 1 and they need to be aware they sold me a rifle that should have been more thoroughly checked--no harm done but if S&W sends me a bill you can bet the dealer will be footing it
That's your responsibility as well. A simple function check of the gun would have revealed the problem the first time you cleaned or inspected it.
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon88 View Post
That's your responsibility as well. A simple function check of the gun would have revealed the problem the first time you cleaned or inspected it.
It's the buyer's responsibility to verify all operations... especially when looking at a used firearm.

If you don't know what to look for, then contact a good gunsmith or buy new.

What's the saying... let the buyer beware....
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Old 07-25-2011, 07:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crazykg85 View Post
I have an early 15-22 and I have just been discovering some of the issues some of the other owners have had with the 15-22. If Im done at the range, and I remove the magazine and the weapon is empty. I press the trigger to fire and the weapon is uncocked, I am NOT suppose to be able to move the fire selection switch to safe? It has been this way since the day I brought it home.
This below was sent out by S&W. It is located in the Notable Thread Index here at the top of the Forum page of threads.

------------------------------

Date: March 18, 2010

IMPORTANT NOTICE TO OWNERS OF SMITH & WESSON M&P15-22 RIFLES AND M&P15 CENTERFIRE RIFLES

It has come to our attention that certain operating procedures detailed in the Safety & Instruction Manuals of our M&P15-22 Rifle (prior to revision date 03-22-10) and M&P15 Centerfire Rifle (prior to revision date 03-22-10) are inaccurate which could lead to damage to and/or improper functioning of your rifle. When operating your M&P15-22 or M&P15 Centerfire rifle, if the Safety & Instruction Manual calls for the placement of the safety selector into the “SAFE” position, and the safety selector does not easily rotate into the “SAFE” position, DO NOT attempt to force it into “SAFE.” Instead, while keeping the muzzle pointed in a safe direction and your finger outside of the trigger guard and off of the trigger: (1) remove the magazine; (2) lock the bolt open; and (3) then rotate the safety selector into the “SAFE” position before proceeding. Going forward, for proper operating procedures, please refer to the sections on “INSPECTING YOUR RIFLE,” “LOADING,” “CLEARING MISFIRES,” “UNLOADING,” and “DISASSEMBLY – FIELD STRIPPING” in the revised Safety & Instruction Manual for your particular rifle. These revisions can be accessed by clicking on the appropriate link below.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore...fle_Manual.pdf
http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore...fle_Manual.pdf

If you have any questions regarding any operational aspects of your Smith & Wesson firearm, please contact Smith & Wesson at 1-800-331-0852 ext. 2905 before proceeding with its operation.

Thank you for your cooperation in this matter.

--------------------------------------------------------

Here is a link to it and the Owners Manuals, as well as commmentray by our Forum members M&P15/M&P15-22 Rifle Important Safety Notice
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Old 07-25-2011, 08:10 PM
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Manual? Who reads the manual?

-- Chuck
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Old 07-25-2011, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon88 View Post
That's your responsibility as well. A simple function check of the gun would have revealed the problem the first time you cleaned or inspected it.
when i bought the rifle and inquired about it i was assured it had been thoroughly examined by the gunsmith on staff--and I did check the BASIC functions of the rifle...however since i had not yet read the owners manual how exactly could i have known about this particular issue>? And as outlined by our chief of intelligence Mr Chatanooga_phil at the bottom of this posting i read the manual and thought it was normal behavior of the rifle...

Thanks yet again to this group of helpful gents i can correct the issue when the UPS dude brings the replacement parts
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Old 07-25-2011, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
shouldnt they be on SAFE anyway? hummmm
Hummm...not necessarily.

Many of us with military experience "grew up" (at least in terms of ARs) inspecting the chamber and dropping the hammer (preferably with the muzzle in a clearing barrel) before turning our rifle in to the arms room.

The only time my ARs are on "safe" is when there's a round in the chamber.

I don't happen to think that leaving a weapon cocked does it any appreciable harm, but old habits die hard.
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Old 07-25-2011, 09:03 PM
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Many of us with military experience "grew up" (at least in terms of ARs) inspecting the chamber and dropping the hammer (preferably with the muzzle in a clearing barrel) before turning our rifle in to the arms room.
Exactly. This procedure or a variation of it was used in every unit I was in.

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Old 07-25-2011, 09:04 PM
Dragon88 Dragon88 is offline
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Originally Posted by Frailer View Post
Many of us with military experience "grew up" (at least in terms of ARs) inspecting the chamber and dropping the hammer (preferably with the muzzle in a clearing barrel) before turning our rifle in to the arms room.

The only time my ARs are on "safe" is when there's a round in the chamber.

I don't happen to think that leaving a weapon cocked does it any appreciable harm, but old habits die hard.
Yup. Sometimes while scratching my head at issues people have with their ARs, I have to remind myself that a lot of these people don't have military experience. They never learned the right way. Then it makes sense.

My 15-22 stays cleared, cocked and on safe after the range. I have no doubt the hammer spring will outlive me and everyone I know being left like that. Since real ARs can be dry-fired, I leave those with the hammer dropped and on fire just like being turned into an arms room. No issues with that either.
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Old 07-25-2011, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Dragon88 View Post
Yup. Sometimes while scratching my head at issues people have with their ARs, I have to remind myself that a lot of these people don't have military experience. They never learned the right way. Then it makes sense.

My 15-22 stays cleared, cocked and on safe after the range. I have no doubt the hammer spring will outlive me and everyone I know being left like that. Since real ARs can be dry-fired, I leave those with the hammer dropped and on fire just like being turned into an arms room. No issues with that either.
That is one of the things that is tough about those of us who are not Veterans. Growing up I was always told/taught that weapons, loaded or not, are suppose to be on safe unless you plan to fire. Having a bolt action rifle or a .243 Rossi single shot is definitely different than having an AR in .22lr or .223.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by crazykg85 View Post
That is one of the things that is tough about those of us who are not Veterans. Growing up I was always told/taught that weapons, loaded or not, are suppose to be on safe unless you plan to fire. Having a bolt action rifle or a .243 Rossi single shot is definitely different than having an AR in .22lr or .223.
this is also my exact same school of thought...All the bolt-actions ( 17HMR/ Remington .22/ Mosin Nagant/ 8mm Mauser) all stay on the shelves with the bolts open and magazines empty or removed where applicable...guess Dads rules will always trump most advice in my mind
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Old 07-26-2011, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragon88 View Post
Yup. Sometimes while scratching my head at issues people have with their ARs, I have to remind myself that a lot of these people don't have military experience. They never learned the right way. Then it makes sense.

My 15-22 stays cleared, cocked and on safe after the range. I have no doubt the hammer spring will outlive me and everyone I know being left like that. Since real ARs can be dry-fired, I leave those with the hammer dropped and on fire just like being turned into an arms room. No issues with that either.
So, to be consistent with your ARs, you don't do this to drop the hammer on your 15-22?

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Originally Posted by ChattanoogaPhil View Post
Gun unload and chamber empty, pull back on the charge handle to move the bolt back about a quarter inch or so, then pull the trigger.
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Old 07-27-2011, 09:23 AM
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Just to be very, very clear to some posters on this thread. NEVER drop the hammer (dry fire) this weapon. If you feel the need to drop the hammer use some method other than pulling the trigger on an empty chamber. You can get into an argument about the merits/drawbacks of dry firing centerfire firearms without snapcaps but with RIMFIRE (22 LR) never do this. It will eventually cause you grief. There have been two methods described in this very thread (pulling back the bolt on an empty gun and pulling trigger and physically lowering the hammer with the action open) both work if you are so inclined. I get the impression that some guys are still thinking dry fire of a .22LR is OK, it is absolutely NOT OK. Good luck, enjoy.

Pete
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Old 07-27-2011, 11:09 AM
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I stored this Mini MkX for 10 years cocked. When firing Israeli M855, it would not hit the hard primers with sufficient force to ignite(fires Fed,Rem,Win no problem). Unlike the Mini14 or AR's. Lesson learned. I still need to change the spring. The "easy" bolt dis assembly instructions ain't so easy. Drop the hammer. Joe
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Old 07-27-2011, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pedropcola View Post
Just to be very, very clear to some posters on this thread. NEVER drop the hammer (dry fire) this weapon. If you feel the need to drop the hammer use some method other than pulling the trigger on an empty chamber. You can get into an argument about the merits/drawbacks of dry firing centerfire firearms without snapcaps but with RIMFIRE (22 LR) never do this. It will eventually cause you grief. There have been two methods described in this very thread (pulling back the bolt on an empty gun and pulling trigger and physically lowering the hammer with the action open) both work if you are so inclined. I get the impression that some guys are still thinking dry fire of a .22LR is OK, it is absolutely NOT OK. Good luck, enjoy.

Pete
Dry firing some .22LR rifles is ok, my Ruger 10/22 manual even recommends dry-firing. In other words, check the manual..
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Old 07-27-2011, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zamboni_driver View Post
Dry firing some .22LR rifles is ok, my Ruger 10/22 manual even recommends dry-firing. In other words, check the manual..
That is a correct statement.

On page 14 and Page 19 of the 10/22 Ruger manual (B 10/10 R 20) the dry firing is encouraged to get the feel of the trigger and to decock the rifle.
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Old 07-27-2011, 04:21 PM
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I have a 10/22 but I got it probably 25 years ago. The manual never said to dry fire it. The current manual does, you are correct. They don't mention using snap caps either. Ruger stands behind their product but I still stand behind my statement. Running a firing pin directly into the steel of the receiver doesn't seem particularly smart, especially using the logic of doing it to get "used to the feel of the trigger". Caveat emptor or some other Latin phrase that is appropriate but this doesn't pass the "makes sense" test. Yes, Ruger engineers do this for a living but so do SW and Savage (last two .22LR that I have bought recently) and neither of them recommend this practice. Does the Ruger have some mechanical reason why this practice is OK? I certainly don't know but until someone can provide a reasonable explanation I will NOT dry fire a rimfire without snap caps. To each their own. Good luck.

Pete

Did some more research. The Ruger may have a firing pin stop that doesn't allow the pin to hit anything. Maybe that is why they allow it. Whatever. I still won't dry fire MY 10/22 but I guess it is ok to do yours.

Last edited by pedropcola; 07-27-2011 at 04:33 PM.
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Old 07-27-2011, 10:42 PM
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i think i am just going to break down and buy some snap-caps in various flavors for all my firearms

dry-firing is a no-no for me also but each their own
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Old 07-27-2011, 11:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redbulladdikt View Post
i think i am just going to break down and buy some snap-caps in various flavors for all my firearms

dry-firing is a no-no for me also but each their own
Unlike the snapcaps I use for my centerfire firearms, most rimfire snapcaps mention that they can only take a very limited number of firings. Look closely at the various rimfire snapcaps before you purchase.
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Old 07-28-2011, 12:08 AM
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thanks for the advice! this will be my first voyage into the world of snapcaps
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Old 07-28-2011, 03:00 AM
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Wonder if Tipton makes any for .22lr. I can't remember.
Very satisfied with my 9mm ones from them. Still on my first and it's doing well
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Old 07-28-2011, 09:41 AM
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Wonder if Tipton makes any for .22lr. I can't remember.
Very satisfied with my 9mm ones from them. Still on my first and it's doing well
thanks for the lead! I will ask when i am at my local Scheels today to see if they do--post my findings
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:21 AM
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I own a S&W 15-22 that was manufactured on 4/29/2011.

I have disassembled and inspected the workings of the bolt and found that the firing pin DOES indeed have a perpendicular roll pin that stops it just short of hitting the breach face. (This is the same method used in my Ruger Mk II and Mk III pistols and my 10-22 Ruger rifle.)

While I admit that S&W says not to dry fire their .22s, I did a test using some very thin metallic tape on the breach face that, if the firing pin were to hit it, there would be a mark left on it - there was none. (I also own a model 34 S&W revolver and did a similar test on it too and the cylinder chamber faces remained unstruck).

I still seldom dry fire these guns, but I have determined to my own personal satisfaction that if/when I do, it won't harm the gun (unless the shock against the firing pin stop would eventually wear it out).

I just thought this discussion warranted adding these observations and tests that I have made. Has anyone else done this here?

RonJon
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Last edited by RonJon; 07-28-2011 at 10:23 AM.
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Old 07-28-2011, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonJon View Post
I own a S&W 15-22 that was manufactured on 4/29/2011.

I have disassembled and inspected the workings of the bolt and found that the firing pin DOES indeed have a perpendicular roll pin that stops it just short of hitting the breach face. (This is the same method used in my Ruger Mk II and Mk III pistols and my 10-22 Ruger rifle.)

While I admit that S&W says not to dry fire their .22s, I did a test using some very thin metallic tape on the breach face that, if the firing pin were to hit it, there would be a mark left on it - there was none. (I also own a model 34 S&W revolver and did a similar test on it too and the cylinder chamber faces remained unstruck).

I still seldom dry fire these guns, but I have determined to my own personal satisfaction that if/when I do, it won't harm the gun (unless the shock against the firing pin stop would eventually wear it out).

I just thought this discussion warranted adding these observations and tests that I have made. Has anyone else done this here?

RonJon
Good info. Thanks
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