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  #1  
Old 09-09-2011, 03:50 AM
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Default Introducing GRIPP magtabs for the M&P 15-22 magazines

Hi all,

I am an industrial designer based in Bangkok and a proud owner of the M&P 15-22. I've recently designed and produced a magazine assist accessory that replaces the standard floor plate of the 15-22 long 25 round magazines. As you can see I have been inspired by MAGPUL and their great line of products.

I will be launching this accessory soon, possibly on this forum with the approval of site admins, but would like to get some feedback from fellow owners on the design. Any feedback will be appreciated!

Thanks,

Martin














Last edited by GRIPPEQUIP; 06-11-2012 at 11:23 AM. Reason: Moved picture links.
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  #2  
Old 09-09-2011, 03:54 AM
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What is the texture, material, rigidity/flexibility, durability? I would be happy to test it and provide feedback in the forum. PM me if interested.
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  #3  
Old 09-09-2011, 06:01 AM
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they look good, how durable are they?
I would like some for my mags to test them in a dynamic surrounding.

What will they cost?
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Old 09-09-2011, 06:29 AM
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Hi. I am in Bangkok. How much will it cost each? I am interested in getting some of them. They look nice.
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Old 09-09-2011, 07:08 AM
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I like! How much?
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Old 09-09-2011, 08:10 AM
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From the looks of them, getting to the release pin might be a bit tricky...please send me a couple and I'll test them and offer Youtube feedback. PM me or email tactical.in.nc@gmail.com Thanks...looks like you have something there.
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Old 09-09-2011, 09:06 AM
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They look good, Martin. Let us know where and when to ge them. I'll need 10 or so.
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Old 09-09-2011, 09:44 AM
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Very nice. I like. I want.
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Old 09-09-2011, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TacticalTom View Post
From the looks of them, getting to the release pin might be a bit tricky...please send me a couple and I'll test them and offer Youtube feedback. PM me or email tactical.in.nc@gmail.com Thanks...looks like you have something there.
I think any 90 degree allen wrech would do it...
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:33 AM
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It could be the picture...but, a lower profile would be nice.
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Old 09-09-2011, 11:34 AM
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Very cool! I like the design, however, I do agree about the lower profile^
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Old 09-09-2011, 11:43 AM
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They look great. I wish I came up with the idea first. I hope you sell a ton of them.
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Old 09-09-2011, 11:45 AM
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Very nice. I like the GRIPP as designed.
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Old 09-09-2011, 12:01 PM
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Same here, ill take 6.

Can you pm me a price with shipping to holland.
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Old 09-09-2011, 12:14 PM
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i'll take a few if the price is right.
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Old 09-09-2011, 01:32 PM
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I would like to order like 6 if the price is right!
also would they come in more colors?
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Old 09-09-2011, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
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Very nice. I like the GRIPP as designed.
I like it as is, too. It's different from the Magpul Ranger Plates.
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  #18  
Old 09-09-2011, 02:14 PM
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Gentlemen,

Keep in mind that we do not conduct business in the discussion threads.

S&W Administrator has generously allowed us to have general discussion about new product development prior to release for sale, as well as providing a 15-22 Classifieds section, but we can't start placing orders and such here. Let's not mess this up.

Tacticool22, Belt_Fed, PanterlyShotGroup, Shooboy and fmj50 have all joined the S&W Forum Vendor program and placed ads in the 15-22 Classifieds. That's where we conduct business, list prices and connect for orders via PM, e-mail and websites.

Last edited by ChattanoogaPhil; 09-09-2011 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:09 PM
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Very cool!!! i like them.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:12 PM
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Default Thank you!

Thanks to all for the responses (and orders!). I'm very pleased the design is being warmly received in the community.

Phil has kindly contacted me with regards to joining the S&W vendor program and I would like to get that processed first before entertaining any orders. As soon as I gain approval the black versions of these GRIPPS can start shipping as early as next week. Colored versions in OD, DE and FG to compliment MAGPUL accessories will follow closely. Anyway I will include more product description and pricing in the classifieds section.

But while we can continue to discuss this as a new product I would like to ask if you all would like to see a GRIPP for the short 10 round magazine? In Thailand we only have the long 25 round magazines (since there's no limitation by law) but I am interested in the short version as well since they are better with getting down low and prone. I would be happy to design and produce a GRIPP for the short magazine if there's sufficient demand for it. Can anybody shed some light on the popularity between these magazines in different US states?

Oh, and to answer some of your questions that the tab should be thinner in profile, the size of the loop is just big enough to comfortably fit a gloved finger. Any smaller I think it will defeat its purpose. I understand that the magazine is already long and an extension can sometimes get in the way, but I always rest on the advice that any magazine should not be used as a support since they can possibly lead to FTF issues. Now that's where the short magazines come in!

Thanks again!

Martin.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:18 PM
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You bet on the short 10 rounders! I used to like the full size high cap style mags, but living in a ban state it seems kind of useless to have a high capacity look with a low capacity function. I like the look of the shorties much better anyway and to have these grips on them would be awesome.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:41 PM
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I can't speak to the popularity of the short mags, but a lot of folks liked the short mag with a bit more 'flare' and 'flair' to it. A few guys were hacking up long mags to make short ones, and some of them looked pretty good. D I Y Short 5- and Medium 10-Round Magazines!!!

Last edited by ChattanoogaPhil; 09-09-2011 at 10:52 PM.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:43 PM
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I think the short 10 round mags need them.
For looks and for function.
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Old 09-09-2011, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChattanoogaPhil View Post
I can't speak to the popularity of the short mags, but a lot of folks liked the short mag with a bit more 'flare' and 'flair' to it. A few guys were hacking up long mags to make short ones, and some of them looked pretty good. D I Y Short 5- and Medium 10-Round Magazines!!!
Love the 5 & 10 round mod, but now I'm thinking.....30 round mod? Just thinkin'!
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  #25  
Old 09-09-2011, 11:06 PM
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Haha didn't know you guys liked the 10-rounders.
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  #26  
Old 09-10-2011, 01:15 AM
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I would be interested in something like the Magpul L-Plate, adding a rubber bumper to the bottom instead of the loop.

I don't think the 10-round short magazines need a loop since they're less likely to be needed from a pouch in a hurry, and also would benefit less from having a good amount of length added to them.

Although I do very much like your design. Where were you when I chopped the bottom off of one of my magazines and glued a ranger plate on there?
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  #27  
Old 09-10-2011, 03:24 AM
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The 25rnd 15-22 mags are already to long. The Magpul PMAG Ranger floorplate is one cool design. I LOVE my 10 rnd shorty, and I would put a Ranger floorplate on it too if it would fit.
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  #28  
Old 09-10-2011, 04:12 PM
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Hell Yeah!
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  #29  
Old 09-12-2011, 12:40 AM
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Default GRIPP magtabs advertised in the classifieds section

Silver Contributor status approved and GRIPPs are ready to ship!

An ad has been placed in the 15-22 specific classifieds section.

Look forward to fulfilling your orders!

Thanks again to the community and the forum.

Martin
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Old 09-12-2011, 01:08 AM
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Can't wait to see them
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Old 09-12-2011, 01:10 AM
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any idea about price?
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  #32  
Old 09-12-2011, 02:15 AM
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Default Pricing is listed in the trade section, thanks!

GRIPP magtabs | Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 long magazines

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any idea about price?
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  #33  
Old 09-12-2011, 09:10 AM
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ouch
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  #34  
Old 09-12-2011, 11:00 AM
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thanks for the link.

A friend is gonna order a set and he will include mine aswell
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Old 09-12-2011, 07:45 PM
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+20 on the 10 rounders. Do you know if and when you would be making them?

Chad
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  #36  
Old 09-12-2011, 11:18 PM
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very cool, but lil rich for my blood now.
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Old 09-13-2011, 03:13 AM
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Don't take offense to this.

Without anyone reviewing this, from the pictures they look too rigid, inflexible, and thin and they appear to make the magazine too long. The price is also a little high for being a product no one has tested and provided feedback on yet considering that Magpul Ranger Plates are $14.95 per 3pk (under $5 each) and the standard Magpuls are $9.95 per 3pk (under $3.40 each).

As cool as these look, based on my experience with the Magpul pulls and plates, doing anything that results in contact with the ground (prone, crawling, rolling, dropped mags, etc.), magazine plate accessories tend to snag on things and scoop dirt and mud. The best grip on a mag is the beer can grip. Reaching for a small tab on the base of a magazine requires fine motor skills and in a hurry (drills, competition, or emergency) I tend to grab with my entire hand.

Neat accessory though.
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  #38  
Old 09-13-2011, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by antifederalist22 View Post
Don't take offense to this.
Thanks Antifederalist22! No offence taken at all. That's exactly the kind of feedback I wanted to hear.

The choice of plastic I chose for this is ABS polymer which is popular for its high impact resistance. It needs to be rigid otherwise it can and will slip off the magazine when pulled hard enough.

I have wrapped my magazine up in cloth, exposing only the GRIPP end, and thrown it across the street numerous times. Rough and dirty testing but it survived despite scratches. I feel confident that a typical drop from chest height should not be a concern.

Handling wise I agree that the beer can grip is the best. I've seen the Magpul videos and agree that bobbling can occur if handled just on the end while inserting into the mag well. However I personally feel that this is good accessory to have, especially with deep pouches and gloves, for when you need to pull them out before the beer can grip. Yes it's longer, but 15mm added length in exchange for added function is okay to me.

Point taken on pricing. I haven't mentioned that 25 round magazines here cost $120 a pop! Crazy but true. So for me to have a loop/butt plate at less than 10% the cost of a magazine is justifable. In the US I imagine 25 round mags are between $15-$20?

My investment in tooling has been expensive and, amortized by a small volume of first production batch of 4 colors, cost still remains high. I am a one man effort unlike Magpul who will have production runs into 10s or 100s of thousand units. Piece costs naturally diminish quite quickly when you're looking at larger volumes (not to mention the demand and brand presence extending beyond real firearms into the airsoft market - since they fit both). My GRIPPS is exclusive to just the 15-22 and I'm still in the unknown about the real production quantities out there. Any ideas?

My pricing strategy is the more you buy the cheaper it gets. It's currently down to $6 per pack of 12. At what cost are you happy to pay for? How many mags does the average US owner have?

By the way I'm interested in designing a 10 round version for this but short mags are just not available here. I realize there's a legal restriction in sending mags outside the US but if there's anyone with perhaps a broken 10 rounder who is willing to sell me one (if that makes it legal) I'll be happy to hear from you.

Thanks,

Martin.
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  #39  
Old 09-13-2011, 08:28 AM
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personally i have about 7 mags, and the pricing of the ranger plate seems to be more than fair @ about $5 each. i would sell them in qtys of 3+ and not waste time on selling them 1 at a time.

i understand you aren't magpul, but you also have to understand we tend to pay extra for that name and the fact that they are made in the US.

i by no means am trying to be disrespectful, but the immediate thought was "wow who is this guy, and what makes this product worth double" and didn't rush to place an order.
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Old 09-13-2011, 12:39 PM
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i'll check if its legal here to export a mag.

(as far as the price goes, the US-dollar is worth a lot less then the Euro, so it's fine by me )
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Old 09-13-2011, 08:07 PM
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I like the looks of these... I don't really use my 15-22 for drills, just a fun gun to shoot all day for very little money, so for me these would just be "aesthetics enhancements". I'm also very glad to see more 15-22 accessories like this being made, either by large companies or small.. and I don't really mind paying a bit more to encourage start-ups. Smaller production runs simply mean higher per-piece fabrication runs. I'll be placing my order on payday
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Old 09-14-2011, 03:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRIPPEQUIP View Post

Point taken on pricing. I haven't mentioned that 25 round magazines here cost $120 a pop! Crazy but true. So for me to have a loop/butt plate at less than 10% the cost of a magazine is justifable. In the US I imagine 25 round mags are between $15-$20?
Mostly right on magazine price, but some deals can be had if buying more than one and depending on where you buy them. I can get them at a gun show for $14-$16 depending on how many I buy--getting a few more in October. I think two things will drive your sales for this particular accessory. First, price is going to drive customers away if they stop and think about a comparable accessory on a 5.56NATO platform. Second, people who own the Magpul Ranger Plates on their 5.56NATO platforms probably bought them thinking they were a "must have", but actually never use them, making them purely an aesthetic item. Some people might buy a few and realize it was not worth it and may not outfit all 100+ mags they own, but as a businessman you will make your money and I wish you the best of luck.

Quote:
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My investment in tooling has been expensive and, amortized by a small volume of first production batch of 4 colors, cost still remains high. I am a one man effort unlike Magpul who will have production runs into 10s or 100s of thousand units. Piece costs naturally diminish quite quickly when you're looking at larger volumes (not to mention the demand and brand presence extending beyond real firearms into the airsoft market - since they fit both). My GRIPPS is exclusive to just the 15-22 and I'm still in the unknown about the real production quantities out there. Any ideas?
I understand economics, but I also understand what works for me, which also doesn't translate into "works for everyone else". Your product looks good, but I still think you are going to have a tough sell at the prices I saw in the advertising post. You are taking a risk, and with risk comes reward and that is what business is all about. On quantities you could hope to sell, I really couldn't begin to estimate. One major factor here, aside from quality and price, is the transaction. People in the USA typically do not like doing business overseas, do not like waiting long for shipping or paying a lot for shipping, and one bad shipping experience can result in a bad review which will drive customers away. Make sure the way you get the product to the customer is as seamless and reliable as possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GRIPPEQUIP View Post
My pricing strategy is the more you buy the cheaper it gets. It's currently down to $6 per pack of 12. At what cost are you happy to pay for? How many mags does the average US owner have?
I have a total of 15 magazines (10 - 25rd, and 5 - 10rd) and I will be buying more. We buy magazines in the US when they are cheap and we have the money. Sometimes, you might need replacements, whole mags or just parts, and there is no telling what that availability is, so I like to prepare in advance.

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Originally Posted by GRIPPEQUIP View Post
By the way I'm interested in designing a 10 round version for this but short mags are just not available here. I realize there's a legal restriction in sending mags outside the US but if there's anyone with perhaps a broken 10 rounder who is willing to sell me one (if that makes it legal) I'll be happy to hear from you.
Sorry, I can't help you here. Seriously, I do wish you luck on this endeavor.
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Old 09-14-2011, 08:39 AM
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I buy some Chinese products (especially flashlights Fenix, Olight, Solarforce, etc) but I always buy thru a US distributor.

I want to be able to get the item quick (shipping from China can be a long wait depending upond the Chinese holiday schedule/shutdowns, etc.

Contrary to what some may say, and although there is a lot of junk made in China, there are some really well made items. Going thru an American distributor minimized that risk in my opinion.

If these items were sold thru an American distributor, I'd buy some. Otherwise no.
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Old 09-14-2011, 09:16 AM
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Default It fits!

Went out to the local gun store where I bought my 15-22 and to my surprise they carry the short mags in stock! They were just as happy to see my GRIPPs as I was happy to see their short mags. We had a long conversation but struck a quick deal. I also asked to be waitlisted for the M&P9 (but that's another story).

Fumbled with it all the way back home and I am delighted to find that it fits! There needs to be another hole for the short mag locking pin and that's easy to do without any tear up. I'm considering another filler piece that fits in between the gap though.

So one part fits both! But aesthetics? Well, you be the judge of it!

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Old 09-14-2011, 09:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRIPPEQUIP View Post
Went out to the local gun store where I bought my 15-22 and to my surprise they carry the short mags in stock! They were just as happy to see my GRIPPs as I was happy to see their short mags. We had a long conversation but struck a quick deal. I also asked to be waitlisted for the M&P9 (but that's another story).

Fumbled with it all the way back home and I am delighted to find that it fits! There needs to be another hole for the short mag locking pin and that's easy to do without any tear up. I'm considering another filler piece that fits in between the gap though.

So one part fits both! But aesthetics? Well, you be the judge of it!
I think it looks fine. It doesn't hurt in any way.
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Old 09-14-2011, 11:38 AM
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It looks better than I thought it would.
Depending on where the gate is. It should be a fairly easy mold mod to have an insert put in to make the filler piece with a nice fillet. Then you would have a twofer mold.
Oh yeah. I usually ship the day of the order or the next. Hint hint.
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  #47  
Old 09-14-2011, 11:40 AM
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Default Thanks Arther!

Thanks for being the first customer Arther! Permission to post your pics. Enjoy GRIPPing!







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  #48  
Old 09-14-2011, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
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It looks better than I thought it would.
Depending on where the gate is. It should be a fairly easy mold mod to have an insert put in to make the filler piece with a nice fillet. Then you would have a twofer mold.
Oh yeah. I usually ship the day of the order or the next. Hint hint.
Exactly! I'm going to have a chat with the toolmaker tomorrow morning to see what's possible. But in the meantime if most people don't mind the appearance of the offset tab using the old hole I may just leave it as is. Thoughts?

Don't worry tacticool22, I have you lined up as my first US dealer as soon as I have everything sorted!

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Old 09-14-2011, 01:04 PM
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dont like them on the short ones, looks not finished.

I think a new mold would be nicer (more costly tho).

The first picture but with a more shallow slope to it would be great
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Old 09-14-2011, 01:22 PM
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Sweeeet.
New hole (left pic) with a large fillet blend to make it look finished.
Cover the grooves on the "T" completely
A new mold to match the angle of the shorter mag and a different pull tab angle would be the "best" way. But a mold mod will work great.
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Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 Thread, Introducing GRIPP magtabs for the M&P 15-22 magazines in Smith & Wesson Rifles and Shotguns; Hi all, I am an industrial designer based in Bangkok and a proud owner of the M&P 15-22. I've recently ...
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