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03-06-2017, 11:02 PM
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Franklin BFS - My 15/22 just became my favorite gun
I've always enjoyed my 15-22, but never really loved it until I got this. I wasn't sure how it was going to work in the little AR, but figured I throw it in one of my other AR's if it didn't. I'm very happy to report, it runs like a champ. I haven't had a chance to get video yet, but will as soon as I can. It was a little late once I got it installed, so only ran subs through a can, but it was very easy to get near full auto fire out of it. Double taps were super quick and on point. I can't wait to get out to the range and blow through some ammo. If you're considering one of these, get it....now....you won't regret it.
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03-06-2017, 11:59 PM
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We all need that video! How was the install?
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03-07-2017, 12:44 AM
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Install was easy and quick, it dropped right in, no issues with fitment. I did have to grind down the safety stops so it would it would flip into binary. Real easy to do, and definitely worth it. Gives me a good reason to cerakote it at least. I have a bucket of ammo I plan on using up this weekend if the weather holds. Curious to see how it runs with hotter loads.
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03-07-2017, 11:15 AM
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Without a video it did not happen C'mon get it uploaded
I wonder how this binary fire trigger would sit within UK law?
Looking forward to seeing your vid, any chance of the internals and a shoot vid?
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03-07-2017, 11:47 AM
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Looks kinda fun from the online vids in 556,
though to be fair I can achieve approx the same rate of fire with my hiperfire 24c trigger and not risk falling foul of the kill joy restrictions of the UK gun laws.
Never say never but maybe say, not just now...
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03-07-2017, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob1
Looks kinda fun from the online vids in 556,
though to be fair I can achieve approx the same rate of fire with my hiperfire 24c trigger and not risk falling foul of the kill joy restrictions of the UK gun laws.
Never say never but maybe say, not just now...
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I agree with the speed and reset of the 24C but at the current retail price of the binary, i am saying never! i am actually considering removing the shoe from my 24C and shooting the summer comps with a flat blade,....when you have options, it's silly not to use em' I do like the shoe though.
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03-07-2017, 12:48 PM
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For that price I would rather buy another 15-22 and shoot both at the same time!!
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03-07-2017, 01:17 PM
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Wow, I thought of doing this too. Do you have the M&P 15-22 Sport or the gen 1 model?
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03-07-2017, 02:17 PM
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Yep, I need a video. Looks like a neat device, however I have a few issues with it.
Here is their advertising video.
Number one is cost, especially when a system like this for the AR-15 can be had for less then 50 bucks. Hopefully they will do one for the 15-22 soon.
Bump Fire Grip – Bump Fire Grip
Not to mention the Bump fire system can be had for 100 bucks less if you dont like the Bair arms deal.
Slide Fire Solutions 30-0100-CM S&W M&P 15-22 SBS Conversion Kit
Number two is design since this still works on the action of your finger its limited by your abilities. Also in full auto I personally would rather hold down the trigger then have to be moving it which would probably make aiming a system like this even more difficult then it already is.
My third problem is speed, here is my bump fire for comparison but mine is still a bit slow, even at a slow speed its still dumping about 10 rounds a second. Ill be hopefully finishing the build and speeding it up in the next several weeks.
Now please dont get me wrong there are some major benefits to this system.
One is the selector switch to me that harkins memories of the old military trigger group. That is cool I dont care who you are.
Two is unique, all the bump fire guys will be red with envy over your switch and ability to use no sliding add ons such as a butt stock or trigger guard attachment.
Three is rarity I think due to the cost and design not a lot of folks are gunna be running these so it will always be neat to pull out and show off.
Hope you enjoy it and understand my opinion is simply that and in no way meant to diminish your appreciation for the item welcome to the "I dump money faster then I can make it club"
Now as for that video!!!!!
Last edited by rbpwrd240; 03-07-2017 at 04:36 PM.
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03-07-2017, 07:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostMutt
Without a video it did not happen C'mon get it uploaded
I wonder how this binary fire trigger would sit within UK law?
Looking forward to seeing your vid, any chance of the internals and a shoot vid?
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Not sure on the UK thing, I am jealous of your 12" barrels though. I have a picatinny gopro mount coming in on Friday and range date on Sat. I can snap some pics of the trigger setup in the meantime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by la-li-lu-le-lo
Wow, I thought of doing this too. Do you have the M&P 15-22 Sport or the gen 1 model?
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I have a 1st gen. I was hesitant to, but it dropped right in and no issues with 200 rds I've put through it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbpwrd240
Yep, I need a video. Looks like a neat device, however I have a few issues with it.....
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No offense taken at all. I really looked into the slidefire stocks, but didn't care for the aesthetics and didn't seem like it would give you the control I wanted. Your video was bad *** though and looks like it runs like a bat outta hell.
What drew me to this was the selector (it does feel good to switch it to "binary" mode) and the double tapabilty (they're spot on and very quick) and there's no learning curve to it. Based on the 200 rds I put through it, I don't think I can get quite as fast as the slidefire, but I'm not far off. I've only ran subs through it so far, I'll push some HV through it this weekend. With the 22 having so much less bolt travel than a .223, I was able to get quite a bit faster ROF than the video, you'd be surprised how quick it'll dump a mag.
No offense taken it all, the slide fires are awesome, this was just more my cup of tea. Both are a ton of fun in this rifle
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03-07-2017, 08:01 PM
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You should look into walking a paintball trigger and see if you can accomplish the same thing. I bet it would make that thing fly....
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03-07-2017, 08:41 PM
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Pics as promised, it's kind of hard to get a good shot in there.
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03-11-2017, 10:04 PM
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Last edited by Teebsa; 03-13-2017 at 09:37 PM.
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03-11-2017, 10:17 PM
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Ok, I need embedding lessons. I'm using [youtube ] .....[/youtube ]. It's worked for me on other forums.
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03-12-2017, 03:51 AM
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Looks like you posted the four clips just fine. As for the trigger, seems to work just fine too.
Nice one.
Rob
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03-12-2017, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob1
Looks like you posted the four clips just fine. As for the trigger, seems to work just fine too.
Nice one.
Rob
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It's supposed to be 2, not sure why it duplicated them. It ran good, put about 1500 rds through it yesterday, and other than pulling the bolt to clean it a couple of times, that's it.
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04-06-2017, 05:26 PM
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Hi Teebsa..
Thanks for starting this thread.
I've ordered a BFS III now that they're available from various distributors for around $387 with free shipping.
Could you comment on which springs you're using on your installation and any thoughts regarding the installation, which looks easier than my HT 24C BTW.
TIA.
:harry
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05-02-2017, 07:01 AM
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Sorry for the late reply, you probably have it installed already, but if anyone else is curious. I used the standard weight spring that was on it. Install is very simple, the trigger itself drops right in, just a matter of pulling the old one out, aligning and sliding the pins in. You will need to grind down the safety stops to allow the selector to move to the binary mode. That was probably the "hardest" part.
I did pick up one of the slide fire recoil enhancers and the gun is running better. I noticed it ran through better through the can, but didn't want to $7/box subsonic ammo through it all day. I still want to polish the guide rails on it and I sent it off to be cerakoted last week. I'll update once it's back, but I've ran about 4k round through it since the trigger and it's still just as much fun.
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08-01-2018, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teebsa
Sorry for the late reply, you probably have it installed already, but if anyone else is curious. I used the standard weight spring that was on it. Install is very simple, the trigger itself drops right in, just a matter of pulling the old one out, aligning and sliding the pins in. You will need to grind down the safety stops to allow the selector to move to the binary mode. That was probably the "hardest" part.
I did pick up one of the slide fire recoil enhancers and the gun is running better. I noticed it ran through better through the can, but didn't want to $7/box subsonic ammo through it all day. I still want to polish the guide rails on it and I sent it off to be cerakoted last week. I'll update once it's back, but I've ran about 4k round through it since the trigger and it's still just as much fun.
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Hey Teebsa, how's this trigger working out for you? Looking into their installation option they offer, but wanted to get an updated opinion about this trigger? Your thoughts, suggestions, etc.
I'm looking at putting it in my Springfield Saint Pistol 556.
Thanks in advance
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08-09-2018, 10:02 PM
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I hate it......cleaning it afterwards that is. Install is pretty simple, didn't take more than 30 mins or so and that was being extra careful and taking my time.
It's a blast to shoot, every once in awhile I'll over run the trigger, but not often and it's more of a "me" issue than the triggers. There is a cadence to it and it's not real hard to get down.
I did move it to my 300BO and played around with it for a bit, ammo just got too expensive, so it's back on my .22. I have no regrets with it and the minute the CZ Scorpion version is released, I'm getting it too.
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08-13-2018, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teebsa
I hate it......cleaning it afterwards that is. Install is pretty simple, didn't take more than 30 mins or so and that was being extra careful and taking my time.
It's a blast to shoot, every once in awhile I'll over run the trigger, but not often and it's more of a "me" issue than the triggers. There is a cadence to it and it's not real hard to get down.
I did move it to my 300BO and played around with it for a bit, ammo just got too expensive, so it's back on my .22. I have no regrets with it and the minute the CZ Scorpion version is released, I'm getting it too.
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Thank's for the feedback, I'm going with Fostech Binary for the reason you mentioned about over running it. The Gen II Fostech can run with a stock M-16 bolt carrier now and gets rave reviews. Got it on order and just hoping the ATF grandfathers it in when they ban devices that increase the rate of fire, it seems it's just a matter of time at this point.
Here's what I'm putting it in, Springfield Armory AR Pistol 556, 7.5" barrel. Shot it this past weekend and it's about the most fun you can have legally without going to Tajuana.
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Last edited by 03hemi; 08-13-2018 at 04:14 PM.
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08-15-2018, 06:11 AM
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Just my experience here and others experience may vary.
I have 2 Fostech gen 2 echo triggers and 2 franklin armory bfs triggers.
The bfs triggers have been FAR more reliable than the fostech triggers in my AR's. I finally just gave up on getting the fostech echo triggers to work reliably. I contacted Fostech several times about the echo 2 issues and they offered no interest in fixing them.
The Franklin Armory BFS triggers have worked exceptionally well in my MP 15-22. Out of thousands of rounds fired in binary mode I might have had maybe 3 trigger overruns. Statistically such a small number I dont even think about it.
If I had to do it all over again I would have just gotten the Franklin Armory BFS trigger and been happy.
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08-15-2018, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackBelt
Just my experience here and others experience may vary.
I have 2 Fostech gen 2 echo triggers and 2 franklin armory bfs triggers.
The bfs triggers have been FAR more reliable than the fostech triggers in my AR's. I finally just gave up on getting the fostech echo triggers to work reliably. I contacted Fostech several times about the echo 2 issues and they offered no interest in fixing them.
The Franklin Armory BFS triggers have worked exceptionally well in my MP 15-22. Out of thousands of rounds fired in binary mode I might have had maybe 3 trigger overruns. Statistically such a small number I dont even think about it.
If I had to do it all over again I would have just gotten the Franklin Armory BFS trigger and been happy.
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Specifically what issues were you having with the Gen II? Thank's for your feedback.
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08-15-2018, 09:53 AM
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The problems with my Echo gen2 triggers were function related. About half the time I would pull the trigger the first function (pull) shot would fire but the second (release) shot would not. I would have to flip the select lever and clear the weapon, then drop the bolt home on a new round and repeat the process.
I made a couple of videos and sent them to fostech but they just said I was pulling the trigger wrong. I made more videos showing closeup on the trigger and that I was using the proper approved technique of pulling the trigger all the way to the rear before release but still experienced failure after failure.
I googled the issue and only a few things popped up. Months later as I visited various internet AR boards I found out that a substantial number of people were having the same issue.
I had much better success with the Franklin Armory triggers though. They have run like a top with very few problems at all.
I believe that their BFS is a simpler design trigger and that has increased its reliability over the Fostech Echo.
Like I said though, these were just my experiences. Im sure there are lots of folks out there who have no problems with their Echo triggers. Mine just didnt work well at all.
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08-15-2018, 10:06 AM
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Yes, there is a trigger spring out now to replace the little spring under the lever that's supposed to reduce the pull weight down significantly. I'm going to order one and replace mine before I install the trigger, thank you for getting back.
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08-18-2018, 02:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostMutt
I wonder how this binary fire trigger would sit within UK law?
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I would not be the one to test the waters on that one. This is about the same firing rate as a fully automatic. I don't think UK laws are going to let you delve into the semantics of the modification differences like US laws.
Just my 2 cents
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05-02-2019, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teebsa
I hate it......cleaning it afterwards that is. Install is pretty simple, didn't take more than 30 mins or so and that was being extra careful and taking my time.
It's a blast to shoot, every once in awhile I'll over run the trigger, but not often and it's more of a "me" issue than the triggers. There is a cadence to it and it's not real hard to get down.
I did move it to my 300BO and played around with it for a bit, ammo just got too expensive, so it's back on my .22. I have no regrets with it and the minute the CZ Scorpion version is released, I'm getting it too.
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I see Franklin has a couple of binary triggers for the ar platform. Which one are you using?
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07-15-2019, 09:08 AM
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Ok, guys, need some enlightenment here.
Got the BFS3 for my 15-22 and installed it (not sure if it matters but I have KNS Anti-walk pins installed).
Got thru the safety checks up to section 9-J (binary function test) and my trigger fails to fire upon trigger release but instead resets on the seer like it would in semi mode.
It also feels to require a **** ton of pressure when the trigger is being held to get the hammer to reset.
In my quest to make this trigger work, I have done the following:
1) changed Hammer Spring
2) changed hammer itself from the one in the kit with a Giessele ACT group I was using previously
3) Took trigger apart and changed IDS spring with the spare in the kit. Both IDS springs were undamaged, same length, and are in the correct orientation.
No change, Hammer resets on seer every time upon trigger release.
What I haven't done, but seen online that may help:
1) change hammer (I have the stock hammer from my 15-22 may try that but I doubt I would have two out of spec hammers...)
2) Change trigger spring
3) take trigger apart again and polish the surfaces of the sliding components with 1200 grit sandpaper, oil and reassemble.
Does anyone have any suggestions that I can try?
At this point, I'm quite close to taking it and listing it on eBay to dump it since I can't get it to work.
Super frustrating!
Last edited by i4dat; 07-15-2019 at 04:52 PM.
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07-15-2019, 10:09 PM
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I would try changing that trigger spring first
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