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  #1  
Old 03-20-2011, 11:52 AM
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Default S&W M&P .40 Compact

I will be picking up my first S&W M&P .40 Compact with 24/7 night sights in about a week. I have heard that people install the APEX M&P Duty/Carry Action Enhancement Kit (DCAEK) to make the trigger 4-5.5lbs and a fast reset. Would this be something that I should look into. I had a S&W Sigma .40VE and the trigger was terrible. I mostly own Glocks and a Springfield Micro Compact 1911, and 1 Sig P239 SA/DA.
Also would you put Crimson Trace laser grips on it or go with a Viridian C5L Light/green Laser. Or nothing at all.
Thanks for any comments.
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Old 03-20-2011, 01:05 PM
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Default SW MP 40c

I owned a 40c and traded it, but I still have and shoot a 9c. I had just the sear from APEX installed and it is very nice, smooooth. Then I did the same on my 45FS MP. Very nice also. The other APEX items,I don't know about. Good luck with the 40c. I liked mine, but got rid of it to get
MP45c.
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Old 03-30-2011, 04:55 PM
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The M&P .40c is a perfect fit for me. Haven't experienced laser sights with this gun yet, but the old eyes are kinda suggesting that I seek a little help. Had CT grips on my J-frame but sold it. They did help me quite alot so I feel comfortable in recommending them.
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Old 04-01-2011, 05:34 AM
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Jaybird:

I've got the Apex kits in three M&P's here.... The overall result is a trigger quite similar in feel to my ancient S&W revolvers in SA mode (a Model 10 and a Model 15, both circa 1968).

The M&P may shoot in (expect it to be a little ragged) to almost this point eventually, but if you can do the work yourself, it's a quick DIY fix that really does the job, IMHO....

DO read up on the "dead trigger" issue, though - it seems that the DCAEK kit will increase your chances of having the problem, although (just IMHO again), you probably will have it eventually anyway. Tolerance issues, I think.... My 40C failed immediately after adding the kit. The other two - a 9C and 40FS haven't yet been modified - they've been fine.

Apex has a fix for the dead trigger should you need it - you can send them just the sear block and they'll update it. SOME M&P's made after October 2010 already have the upgraded sear block, but the DCAEK kit still includes a new spring for them.

(The sear itself, and the drop safety plunger in the slide, are the real keys, along with a couple springs that improve things in general. The drop safety plunger is just plain wrong as you receive the gun, although it will work in a bit. Apex changes some of the sear configuration to improve that, too. You can find Apex's videos around, with some details, and there's an article around someplace by Dan Burwell, who does the same sort of thing as custom smithing. VERY good choice, but expensive, and he's awful busy.)

Enjoy!
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Old 04-01-2011, 07:24 AM
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Stu,

Can you explain to me exactly what happens when the dead trigger kicks in after installing the Apex kit. I always thought it happened when I installed one of the new Apex sears and the trigger pulled all the way back without releasing the firing pin. I adjusted the trigger bar tab that contacts the bottom of the sear and all was fine since...
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Old 04-01-2011, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaybird13 View Post
Also would you put Crimson Trace laser grips on it or go with a Viridian C5L Light/green Laser. Or nothing at all.
Here's my 40c with CTC grip. Once you get used to them, they work just fine. What is also nice about them is that they're always powered "on".
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Old 04-01-2011, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo38gn View Post
Stu,

Can you explain to me exactly what happens when the dead trigger kicks in after installing the Apex kit. I always thought it happened when I installed one of the new Apex sears and the trigger pulled all the way back without releasing the firing pin. I adjusted the trigger bar tab that contacts the bottom of the sear and all was fine since...
Jack:

The dreaded "Dead Trigger" we're talking about is where the sear refuses to reset, so it can't grab the striker. Squeezing the trigger then results in nothing happening....

The sear can fail to contact the striker during recoil, which then results in the gun not being cocked.... It apparently bounces around a bit.... Meantime, the shape of the sear and the sear block (the latter being that hunk of MIM that holds all the fun parts) is a little sloppy, and may or may not make this situation more likely. Putting a larger plunger and stiffer spring under the sear seems to fix this. (Randy knows where I live so I have to add that it's the sear block that's sloppy ....)

Your "dead trigger" is more likely from a slightly out-of-spec trigger bar that no longer hits the sear where it's supposed to. The fix - bending the trigger bar just a little - seems to be more than enough, and is pretty cheap, too .... (Now you know why that thing has the little loop in it. Besides contacting the drop safety plunger, it can be adjusted without much effort, and without hurting - if you're careful - the drop safety action.)

The DCAEK kit may affect the latter 'cause the new sear has a slightly different shape. The whole design resembles trying to put your car key on a 10' pole and operate a door lock with it.... (OK, it's a little more reliable .)

Regards,
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Old 04-01-2011, 10:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SMMAssociates View Post
Jack:


Your "dead trigger" is more likely from a slightly out-of-spec trigger bar that no longer hits the sear where it's supposed to. The fix - bending the trigger bar just a little - seems to be more than enough, and is pretty cheap, too .... (Now you know why that thing has the little loop in it. Besides contacting the drop safety plunger, it can be adjusted without much effort, and without hurting - if you're careful - the drop safety action.)

The DCAEK kit may affect the latter 'cause the new sear has a slightly different shape. The whole design resembles trying to put your car key on a 10' pole and operate a door lock with it.... (OK, it's a little more reliable .)

Regards,
Can you be a bit more specific about bending the trigger bar tab? I am looking at it and wondering how what you are bending works for the Dead trigger. The trigger bar tab doesn't touch the the sear until you are back at least half way through the travel, but the Dead trigger would be happening when the trigger is fully pressed I am guessing, so would you be bending the tab down away from the sear or up? Or left to get it under the sear more??. Thanks
PS
My M&P 9 got this dead trigger problem a few times after installing the Apex hard also, but not before. Apex tells me it happens to the stock seared pistols too, but I have my doubts about that. I have alos had my pistol double fire since installing the Apex hard sear....I think they machined too much off the top of this sear and should have left a little more contact area for the striker to catch against the sear.
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Old 04-02-2011, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrwintr View Post
Can you be a bit more specific about bending the trigger bar tab? I am looking at it and wondering how what you are bending works for the Dead trigger. The trigger bar tab doesn't touch the the sear until you are back at least half way through the travel, but the Dead trigger would be happening when the trigger is fully pressed I am guessing, so would you be bending the tab down away from the sear or up? Or left to get it under the sear more??. Thanks
PS
My M&P 9 got this dead trigger problem a few times after installing the Apex hard also, but not before. Apex tells me it happens to the stock seared pistols too, but I have my doubts about that. I have alos had my pistol double fire since installing the Apex hard sear....I think they machined too much off the top of this sear and should have left a little more contact area for the striker to catch against the sear.
Thanks Stu for the info.

as for bending the trigger loop, when I installed my Apex sear, it appeared some material is removed around where the loop makes contact to the new sear. It appeared in my case, by the time the loop made contact with the sear and before it could fire, the trigger hit the frame. So I bent the loop just a tad closer to the sear to make contact a little sooner and everything has been perfect since. About 2,000 rounds.

hope that helps,
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Old 04-02-2011, 03:06 PM
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Originally Posted by turbo38gn View Post
Thanks Stu for the info.

as for bending the trigger loop, when I installed my Apex sear, it appeared some material is removed around where the loop makes contact to the new sear. It appeared in my case, by the time the loop made contact with the sear and before it could fire, the trigger hit the frame. So I bent the loop just a tad closer to the sear to make contact a little sooner and everything has been perfect since. About 2,000 rounds.

hope that helps,
Ok, I understand what you had to do there. Thanks
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Old 04-03-2011, 11:32 AM
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I just received my M&P40c and I am very impressed with this pistol.

http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/429/img15572large.jpg
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Old 04-04-2011, 09:30 PM
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Just got my M&P .40C back with the Apex trigger work done on it. What a difference. I highly recommend it. I also picked up a Streamlight TLR-3 which is perfect for it and very bright.

Last edited by Jaybird13; 04-04-2011 at 09:33 PM.
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Old 04-05-2011, 10:43 PM
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This is my 40c. The trigger was actually quite smooth I have an Apex DC kit and I am going to wait a few hundred rounds before I make the change.
I bought a Storm Lake Barrel for it so it will run 9 or .40 with the appropriate magazines of course.

I bought a C5L for it but haven't had it out yet. I went with the green laser thinking I can put it on a couple other semiautos if I don't like it on the C. Or even my AR.



It has an X-Grip on in this photo.
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Old 04-09-2011, 11:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MotorCityGun View Post
Here's my 40c with CTC grip. Once you get used to them, they work just fine. What is also nice about them is that they're always powered "on".
Have you had to replace the CT batteries yet? If so, have you found a good source? Does anyone make rechargeable for these?
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Old 04-10-2011, 12:18 AM
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CT was running a "free batteries for life" coupon a while back - I have two of their grip sets on a pair of 1911's, and have yet not needed (it's about two years) to replace either battery set.

Radio Shack stocks 'em, too.... Not insanely expensive but free is better.... I need to find the paperwork 'cause it's about time....

The 1911 version uses a 3025 or something like that - a coin battery - and has no provision for recharging without taking the grips off the gun. This can't be good for the zero.... Better to run 'em into the ground and schedule a range session after the replacement (OK - check 'em regularly and replace when they start to go dim .)

I don't know what's in the CT devices available for the M&P's, but it's got to be some sort of coin battery.... The rail-mounted lights, OTOH, could use just about any power source - more room .

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Old 04-10-2011, 11:15 PM
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Have you had to replace the CT batteries yet? If so, have you found a good source? Does anyone make rechargeable for these?
Yes, I did replace them after about a year. But as someone else posted, CTC provides a free pair of batteries per year, for life. It's not a coupon though. I recall that you send in your name, address and then your name is registered with CTC, then you call them every year to receive your batts. I've gotten two pairs from them so far. I believe the part no. of the batteries is 2023.

I don't believe these types of "coin" batteries are rechargeable.
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Old 04-11-2011, 01:29 AM
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MotorCityGun:

It's "2032" .... They were passing out a coupon when the promotion started. Asked for a copy of something (sales slip?). Then (you're correct), you call.... Can't find the fool number, naturally ....

(I did get a couple sets originally. Ain't gonna say what happened to those ....)

Actually, they fit Sammy's "don't bark" collar.... I bought him one that senses barking, and is supposed to make a nasty noise if he does. He liked it! Like a kid with a bike siren! The next one, the one that uses those batteries, depended on me to press a button. It would make some nasty noise, or shock him a little, at my choice. It worked somewhat.

Anyway, at least with my CT lasers, unless I'm playing with the cat with it (EMPTY the fool gun!), service life seems to be nearly infinite. I shoot once a week, and rarely use the laser, but visitors seem to fall in love with it. The only trick to remember (at least for me) is to shut the thing off before putting the gun into some sort of storage where the button could be pushed by the packaging.

("2035" won't fit - it's about twice as thick - but you can use a 2032 in many applications that call for it - less current available.)

I'm sure you can find a rechargeable version, but given the pain involved in recharging it for a CT laser, I'm not sure it'd be worth it.

DON'T lose that little allen wrench.... Lord knows where you'd get another one "over the weekend"....

Regards,
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Old 04-11-2011, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
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MotorCityGun:

It's "2032" .... They were passing out a coupon when the promotion started. Asked for a copy of something (sales slip?). Then (you're correct), you call.... Can't find the fool number, naturally ....

(I did get a couple sets originally. Ain't gonna say what happened to those ....)

Anyway, at least with my CT lasers, unless I'm playing with the cat with it (EMPTY the fool gun!), service life seems to be nearly infinite. I shoot once a week, and rarely use the laser, but visitors seem to fall in love with it. The only trick to remember (at least for me) is to shut the thing off before putting the gun into some sort of storage where the button could be pushed by the packaging.

("2035" won't fit - it's about twice as thick - but you can use a 2032 in many applications that call for it - less current available.)

I'm sure you can find a rechargeable version, but given the pain involved in recharging it for a CT laser, I'm not sure it'd be worth it.

DON'T lose that little allen wrench.... Lord knows where you'd get another one "over the weekend"....

Regards,
You're right it is part #2032. I actually saved their no. in my phone: 800.442.2406. Their customer service is excellent.

Now you tell me not to lose that little allen wrench! Of course I lost mine one day at the range but when I called CTC, they sent me 6 of the wrong ones. When I called again, they sent 6 of the correct ones...FREE each time.

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