Smith & Wesson Forum

Go Back   Smith & Wesson Forum > Smith & Wesson Semi-Automatic Pistols > Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols
Forum Register Expert Commentary Members List


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-13-2012, 11:04 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Thumb safety

I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.

Will I notice the saftey sticking into me if I carry on the waist at five o' clock?

Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #2  
Old 02-13-2012, 11:47 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Default

You've never fired a revolver? Not many of them with a manual saftey. I do understand where you're coming from though for holster carry. I personally prefer traditional da/sa autos with no external safety. Sig Sauers, 3rd gen Smith & Wessons and such. No safety to manipulate but a long double action trigger pull on the first shot.

Striker fired guns do seem to me to have an added risk factor. Police have switched to them enmase. It seems to me that there have been a much higher incidence of accidental discharges with such guns. Glocks are single action guns carried cocked and unlocked.

You have to decide for yourself. Oh, and no, you won't notice the safety digging into you when carrying the gun.

All firearms should be treated as if they are loaded and ready to fire. You daughter should never get ahold of any gun in your care, safety or not.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-13-2012, 12:08 PM
DGT's Avatar
DGT DGT is offline
SWCA Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oklahoma
Posts: 2,051
Likes: 2,870
Liked 954 Times in 311 Posts
Default

The fact that the absence of an external safety bothers you tells me that you're on the right track. This is just my personal opinion but, there are a lot of fine semi-auto pistols out there with safeties or the ability to de-cock once a round is chambered.

John3200 mentioned Sig Sauers, I love my P229. No thumb safety but a nice heavy DA trigger pull. Bottom line: Buy what you are comfortable with.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #4  
Old 02-13-2012, 01:11 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 2,839
Likes: 898
Liked 1,544 Times in 848 Posts
Default

As John3200 said, striker fired pistols like the M&P function very much like revolvers. That was one of the selling points when Glock started marketing their firearms to LE agencies. The transition from revolvers to Glocks would be much easier because Glocks were like revolvers in that there is no active safety device in either.

What prevents accidental firing of an M&P is what prevents accidental firing of any firearm. Know the four rules and follow them. Plus, don't leave firearms where kids or other untrained people can get them.

Get what you are comfortable with, but any safety device can be defeated, even by a 5 year old. Safe handling and storage are the real safety devices.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #5  
Old 02-13-2012, 01:34 PM
10mm Sonny's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
Liked 70 Times in 19 Posts
Default

You can always remove the safety if you don't like it.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-13-2012, 04:19 PM
RevDerb's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Middle of the Thumb of MI
Posts: 91
Likes: 8
Liked 7 Times in 4 Posts
Default

I have 2 Ruger semi-autos and a Remington R-1 1911; all with thumb safeties. These are the first S/A's I've ever owned with safeties but I've grown used to them and use them 100% of the time. The 1911 is holstered on my hip right now chambered and locked. I also have revolvers with the only safety being my brain and obedient trigger finger. There was a time when I pooh-poohed safeties on sidearms but now realize that they have their place. That being said: I hate safeties on my hunting rifles!
__________________
I don't have any guns.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-13-2012, 06:12 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RevDerb View Post
That being said: I hate safeties on my hunting rifles!
What on gods green earth would make you say something like that? In what shape or form would a safety on a rifle ever be a hinderence to anyone but a complete idiot? Sorry about being crass but seriously?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-13-2012, 07:07 PM
Arizona5906's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Posts: 79
Likes: 0
Liked 15 Times in 8 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.

Will I notice the saftey sticking into me if I carry on the waist at five o' clock?

Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
The safety lever is a personal preference feature. There is obviously no universal answer to this question. Many law enforcement agencies buy Glocks without the safety and depend on good training. Other agencies have a manual safety as a requirement for a firearm. The US Army chose the Beretta 92 in part because of the safety. I personally would chose the model with the safety and all of my pistols have a manual safety. But that's just my opinion.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #9  
Old 02-13-2012, 07:11 PM
J D Allen's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: hamilton ohio
Posts: 130
Likes: 14
Liked 7 Times in 5 Posts
Default safety or not

The safety is a good idea. If you don't want to use it , don't put it on. Its that simple.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #10  
Old 02-13-2012, 09:52 PM
cp1969's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,369
Likes: 279
Liked 41 Times in 26 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John3200 View Post
What on gods green earth would make you say something like that? In what shape or form would a safety on a rifle ever be a hinderence to anyone but a complete idiot? Sorry about being crass but seriously?
It depends on if you're talking about a safety on an M700 Remington (necessary) or the crossbolt safety on a Marlin lever action (not necessary). Many people hate the Marlin safeties.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-14-2012, 12:35 AM
10mm Sonny's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 258
Likes: 0
Liked 70 Times in 19 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John3200 View Post
What on gods green earth would make you say something like that? In what shape or form would a safety on a rifle ever be a hinderence to anyone but a complete idiot? Sorry about being crass but seriously?
How very Obama of you to start name calling when someone has an opinion that is different from yours.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-14-2012, 10:50 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizona5906 View Post
The US Army chose the Beretta 92 in part because of the safety.
Not true. The Sig Sauer P226 tied the Beretta M92 in the trials. The only reason the M92 was selected in the end was some priceing voodoo. Beretta had a lower price but also included less with the gun than the Sig Sauer bid. Both guns obviously meet the safety requirements of the trials.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-14-2012, 10:54 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 134
Likes: 0
Liked 12 Times in 9 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cp1969 View Post
It depends on if you're talking about a safety on an M700 Remington (necessary) or the crossbolt safety on a Marlin lever action (not necessary). Many people hate the Marlin safeties.
True, sorry, I hadn't thought of that. In the lever actions case the hammer is the safety. You shouldn't cock it untill ready to fire. Load it and then safely lower the hammer and carry it in the field with a round in the chamber but the hammer down
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-14-2012, 02:02 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,916
Likes: 212
Liked 819 Times in 444 Posts
Default

If you properly train to engage/disengage a manual safety instinctively, it will be no problem. If you feel safer with one, then get one. No one else's opinion matters when you're the one using it.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #15  
Old 10-31-2012, 10:52 PM
wolfpackpanther's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Southeastern N.C.
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

My M&P .40 does not have a manuel safety but I prefer it did. I didn't catch it when I bought it....I basically assumed all of them did due to the pic I saw of one before I bought it. Below is a current article I copied and pasted from WRAL TV in Raleigh, N.C. and I imagine the local law enforcement here use Glocks.

Fayetteville, N.C. — A Cumberland County Sheriff's Office deputy was wounded Wednesday morning when his service weapon accidentally fired as he was leaving home to drive to work, authorities said.

Maj. John R. McRainey, the chief jailer at the Cumberland County Detention Center, underwent surgery at Cape Fear Valley Medical Center and was in stable condition.

McRainey was putting a bag in his vehicle when his .40-caliber semiautomatic handgun, which was inside the bag, discharged, authorities said. Investigators said the gun apparently bumped against another item in the bag, which McRainey often used to transport the gun.

"Although it is always a tragedy anytime that anyone suffers a gunshot wound, we are just thankful that it was no worse than it was," Sheriff Earl "Moose" Butler said in a statement.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 10-31-2012, 11:27 PM
mgo's Avatar
mgo mgo is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Tucson, Az.
Posts: 334
Likes: 0
Liked 48 Times in 20 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. .
Important benefits are often overlooked with the S&W thumb safety (and many of the HK pistols, too)

- when loading and unloading the pistol, the safety can be left "on" to prevent accidentally actuating the trigger. (yes, that can happen)
- when holstering the pistol, the safety can be on to prevent snagging the trigger going in. (how many of us can twist and actually watch the pistol going into the holster?) The safety can then optionally be set to "fire" position after securely in the holster if the operator wishes.

No, the thumb safety will not cause discomfort. I carry my full sized M&P (with thumb safety) inside the waistband with no problems. The M&P series pistols are more rounded and smoother and cause less discomfort, even against the skin. That included the less rough grip sides. My holsters do have a sweat shield which isolates me from the thumb safety anyway.

"5 oclock" is a satisfactory position, even with only a loose tee shirt covering the firearm. That's also comfortable when in the car.
__________________
NRA Life Member
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #17  
Old 10-31-2012, 11:58 PM
Knightrider03m's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,104
Likes: 19
Liked 101 Times in 55 Posts
Default

Pros:

Great life saver if someone grabs your gun and try to use it on you, they may not know to turn the safety off

Reduces the odds of a ND

Con:

Might forget to turn off the safety if you really need to use it

Its all up to you. I've had an M&P with a safety and one without it. Its all on how you felt.
__________________
Don't look, reload and shoot!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-01-2012, 07:39 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Silverthorne CO
Posts: 148
Likes: 19
Liked 47 Times in 26 Posts
Default Define accidental discharge

So, just to make sure we're on the same page.

A striker fired semi-auto that does not have a manual safety as such still has safeties. All have internals that prevent a 'bumped' firearm from discharging under most circumstances. I.E. you put one in a paint mixer and turn it on it shouldn't fire. If the internals become worn then they can fail, and as anyone who has worked around machinery knows, stuff happens.

Glocks have a small tab on the trigger that must be pressed for the trigger to be depressed. Kinda counts like a safety.

Pistols with external safeties have some kind of lever or other device that interferes with the hammer hitting the firing pin. In a 3rd Gen that is a robust bar, in a 1911 that is a tooth that engages.

Now accidental discharge is an interesting term. IF you mean I drop the gun and it does bang, that doesn't happen much with non-messed with modern weapons.

Most 'accidental' discharges I think have been shown to be a situation when the trigger is pressed. The story above about the deputy, well I'd be interested to see what they figured pressed the trigger.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-02-2012, 10:00 AM
66snub's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: SouthWest Michigan
Posts: 384
Likes: 151
Liked 173 Times in 104 Posts
Default

Like previously stated, the selling point with guns like these, is the reduced manual of arms that must be learned. By all means, do what is comfortable, both physically and mentally, in choosing which version you want, but the very most effective safety for a gun is the one located between the ears. Good luck with your purchase.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-02-2012, 10:48 AM
Linejudgemick's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: South Central Kansas
Posts: 186
Likes: 20
Liked 41 Times in 33 Posts
Default

The "safety" for any firearm is what's between the ears of anyone holding it. As GaryS. mentioned - the 4 rules must always be observed. I have firearms with external safeties and others that don't. But, just because I'm using my Ruger SR40C that has every safety known to man, or my M&P9C that's only safety is the trigger; I know they should be treated exactly the same.

As for the jailer that shot himself. Why did he have a pistol floating free in a bag? I don't know about anyone else, but In a bag I'd have a hard time knowing where it was pointed. I obviously can't know this, but I suspect the firearm either came free from a holster covering the trigger, or wasn't in one to start with. There is one certainty though, it wasn't treated like it was loaded. If I transport my pistols in a car they are either secured in my holster with me, or unloaded in a case/box.

Everything else aside, you'll still have to decide what you are most comfortable with and then practice good safety habits.
__________________
1500 .243, M&P40, M&P9C
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #21  
Old 11-02-2012, 11:51 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 18
Likes: 1
Liked 7 Times in 4 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS View Post
As John3200 said, striker fired pistols like the M&P function very much like revolvers. That was one of the selling points when Glock started marketing their firearms to LE agencies. The transition from revolvers to Glocks would be much easier because Glocks were like revolvers in that there is no active safety device in either.

What prevents accidental firing of an M&P is what prevents accidental firing of any firearm. Know the four rules and follow them. Plus, don't leave firearms where kids or other untrained people can get them.

Get what you are comfortable with, but any safety device can be defeated, even by a 5 year old. Safe handling and storage are the real safety devices.
Actually, the M&P is closser in function to a 1911 than a revolver. Now the Glock has a striker that is at the forward "rest" position and as trigger pressure is applied, the striker is moved rearward until it reaches the point where the sear no longer engages the striker, flies forward and fired the cartridge. This is closer to a double action revolver in function but one with a shorter and lighter trigger pull.
Now the M&P (as well as the XD) do not have this double action feature where the striker is in the forward position. In both of these weapons, the striker is at full cock against the sear surface in much the same way the sear holds back the hammer on a 1911. In both the M&P and XD, the trigger be it with a tab like the XD or a hinged trigger in the case of the M&P does not allow the trigger to be pulled to the rear unless the shooters finger (or other object) depressed the tab (XD) or lower portion of the trigger (M&P) that allows the actual trigger to move to the rear, depress the sear, allows the firing pin to move forward and fire the cartridge. The 1911 accomplishes this in much the same way with a grip safety that must be depressed by the shooters hand that will then allow the trigger to move to the rear and fire the round.
What this basically means is that an M&P without a manual safety is more akin to carrying around a 1911 cocked and unlocked than it is to a revolver. Now while we know that shooters "should" keep their finger off the trigger, being a professional instructor, I have plenty of experience with shooters that have been trained to do just that yet somehow still manage to poop the bed and still leave fingers on triggers when they shouldn't be. Just a fact of life that it can and does happen. Even Glocks with an action that is more in line with a double action revolver has scads of stories about unintentional negligent discharges like the guy in the video that shoots himself in the leg, the female cop providing overwatch on the suspect proned out and caps a round off next to his head that was also caught on video to say nothing of the numberous reports (especially early on) about shooters that would shoot themselves in the leg when going to holster because a finger was on the trigger, hit the holster, finger stops moving, gun doesn't, trigger is depressed and a round goes off.
Finally in comparing all of these designs be it a Glock, M&P, XD, etc. to a double action revolver, in most every one of these cases, the trigger on the autos are shorter and lighter than they are on a double action revolver. A DA revolver lacks a manual safety because the longer, heavier trigger pull is less likely to discharge if a finger is left on the trigger. It's pull is heavy enough that you know you are pulling the trigger. Not so with the striker fired autos (short of a NY or NY2 trigger on a Glock) with a shorter and lighter trigger pull. There just isn't that margin for error a DA revolver has.
It's for these reasons that I prefer to have a grip safety on my XD rather than deactivate it, a manual safety on my 1911s and a manual safety on my M&P45 as well.
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Like Post:
  #22  
Old 11-02-2012, 05:30 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 65
Likes: 0
Liked 8 Times in 4 Posts
Default Thumb Safety

Personally I prefer a thumb safety on any Semi-Auto I own. I have no problem flipping the safety off as I draw. Get it with the safety and you can always leave the safety off if you want.
But there may be times when you want the safety on like maybe kids around.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-02-2012, 06:49 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 704
Likes: 297
Liked 214 Times in 123 Posts
Default

From your description of your previous experience with handguns, I think you answered your own question - get one with a thumb safety. I haven't carried an M&P with an external safety, but the ones I've handled did not seem as thought the safety lever was overly protruding. To carry any pistol comfortably, get a quality holster. Quality holsters go a long way to keep the gun rubbing uncomfortably against your skin, and quality holsters sometimes prevent unintentional discharges. Futhermore, proper training and regular practice while adhearing to the four rules of safety further aid in the safe and proficient handling and use of a pistol.

Police, regardless of what has been issued or authorized, have blown holes in police station walls, police cars, and other places not because the firearm did not have a proper manual safety, but because of some sudden lapse of judgement. The same thing has happened to civilians (although if a civilian was blowing a hole through a police station wall or a police car, there were other issues...), and to military, where the safe carriage of loaded firearms sometimes goes to the extreme based on a REMF's lack of understanding or other factors.... ADs have been around a lot longer than Glocks. I worked for an organization that allowed DA/SA Sigs, Glocks, and DA revolvers of Colt, Ruger, and S&W flavor. The ADs were pretty much evenly distributed between the three catagories.

I have carried Glocks for over 20 years, round in the chamber. I currently carry an M&P 45 full size in a Milt Sparks IWB, round in the chamber, no thumb safety. If the finger is off the trigger the pistol is pretty likely not to fire unexpectedly. Yes, things such as shirt tails, pull cords, and even junk holsters can get into a trigger guard and cause an AD, but as I said before, training and practice builds proficiencey and awareness...
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-02-2012, 07:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times in 2 Posts
Default

They have passive safeties.

1. Trigger safety (have to pull the whole trigger or the upper part of the trigger is blocked by the frame)
2. Striker/firing pin block - if you take the slide off and look toward the rear, there's a round chunk o' metal sitting there. That prevents the striker, if charged (round racked), from striking the primer on a round should some how it move forward without a trigger pull. The trigger, when pulled, moves this block upward and out of the way of the firing pin so that it can move forward to fire (i.e. you must pull the trigger for the gun to go bang). You can take the slide off and try to move the firing pin with your hand, and you won't be able to.... press that round chunk o' metal down and hold it and then you can move the firing pin forward.

Those are the two mechanisms you'd be relying on, which as I understand, are reliable - but they're still mechanical and nature and everything is prone to failure.

That being said, the human brain is prone to failure as well.... big time.... and mistakes happen. It's a combination of knowledge, training, safeties, what's between your ears, etc. that come together to help prevent ND's, but they can still happen. There's also things like the loaded chamber visual indicator (i.e. the hole on the top of the slide to look in and see if a round is chambered), and the sear deactivation lever for 'safe' disassembly.

I have a manual safety on my 9c, because I also have a very light trigger in there (apex, not the factory trigger, it too has a passive trigger safety) and it's a carry weapon.

Although there's varying opinion's on external manual safeties for "DAO" pistols, I like it. It stops the trigger bar from moving backward to disengage the striker block, and subsequently drop the sear to allow the firing pin to move forward and the gun to go bang.

It's just another level of precaution in this new shooter's mind, and is very easy to train for to make sure it's off when you need it to be off. I've found it's all in my grip, and is second nature to disengage the safety when I present. It's really up to the shooter to decide.

Hope that helps a little. I'm still learning myself, but I went with the safety and have no issues with it (also sits in a ccw holster no problem, don't notice it). You can take them off easily if you want, but if you get it with a safety, I personally wouldn't remove it. If you end up using your weapon, the courts could use it against you saying you deliberately removed the safety. They could also have no clue you took it off. Better safe than sorry in my book (no pun intended).
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 12-23-2012, 06:04 PM
cp1969's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 1,369
Likes: 279
Liked 41 Times in 26 Posts
Default

One of the strangest pistols I ever encountered was the Radom VIS 35 that my father brought home from WWII.

It was a single action automatic, with a decocker and a grip safety. No manual safety like a 1911 or High Power. If you carried it with the hammer cocked, the grip safety was all you had. If you carried it with the hammer down, you had to manually cock it and the hammer did not have a big spur on it.

I wouldn't have wanted to carry it, but being all steel and 9mm, it was practically recoil-free and very accurate considering the crude sights.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 12-23-2012, 07:46 PM
checkmyswag's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Austin, Texas
Posts: 261
Likes: 29
Liked 78 Times in 48 Posts
Default

Don't let anyone make you feel less competent for wanting an external safety. Its your gun and your responsibility. Go with what you for comfortable with.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #27  
Old 12-23-2012, 08:29 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 587
Likes: 95
Liked 362 Times in 170 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
Sounds to me that you're one of the folks S&W makes the thumb safety model for. I like them too!
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 12-24-2012, 12:55 AM
Rastoff's Avatar
US Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: So Cal (Near Edwards AFB)
Posts: 5,371
Likes: 479
Liked 3,235 Times in 1,564 Posts
Default

Just a note:
The thumb safety on the M&P is not like other pistols. On most guns a manual lever safety blocks the trigger and either disconnects or blocks the sear.

The safety on the M&P only blocks the trigger from moving. It makes no action on the sear at all.

I have one on my M&P 45 because that's all that's sold in CA. Given the choice I probably would not have opted to get it. Still, it's a non-issue. I'm used to a 1911 so, the safety is something I'm used to.

If I were you, I'd get the one with the safety. If you don't like it, you can just take it out. It can be removed easily in about 5 minutes.
__________________
Freedom isn't free.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Like Post:
  #29  
Old 12-24-2012, 04:31 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: NJ/NH
Posts: 36
Likes: 1
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by John3200 View Post
Not true. The Sig Sauer P226 tied the Beretta M92 in the trials. The only reason the M92 was selected in the end was some priceing voodoo. Beretta had a lower price but also included less with the gun than the Sig Sauer bid. Both guns obviously meet the safety requirements of the trials.
The Beretta 9s, the M9, and the M9a1 do not have safeties like a traditional thumb safety....they have decockers which then disable the triggerto hammer mechanism.

Sig has a decocker, but nothing is disabled, the pistol then goes to D/A.
__________________
God Bless Our Troops

Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #30  
Old 12-24-2012, 04:51 PM
SWCA Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,530
Likes: 1,602
Liked 2,740 Times in 1,240 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.

Will I notice the saftey sticking into me if I carry on the waist at five o' clock?

Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
Just like a revolver, the M&P pistol is safe from accidental firing as a result of being dropped or jarred. It has automatic internal safety devices to prevent firing as a result of being dropped or jarred.

The M&P is, therefore, just as safe as a modern double action revolver if unmodified and in proper operating condition.

As you have already surmised, however, the pistol does not know the difference and if the trigger is pulled by you or anyone or anything, it WILL discharge if there is a round in the chamber. The thumb safety certainly provides an extra layer of security against such unintended discharge.

You must feel confident in your choice, and therefore, do what makes you feel confident.

If you feel you need more than the internal and automatic safeties, then by all means, get the thumb safety model.

Last edited by shawn mccarver; 12-24-2012 at 05:00 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #31  
Old 12-24-2012, 05:13 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Redwood City, Ca. USA
Posts: 281
Likes: 42
Liked 197 Times in 51 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cp1969 View Post
One of the strangest pistols I ever encountered was the Radom VIS 35 that my father brought home from WWII.

It was a single action automatic, with a decocker and a grip safety. No manual safety like a 1911 or High Power. If you carried it with the hammer cocked, the grip safety was all you had. If you carried it with the hammer down, you had to manually cock it and the hammer did not have a big spur on it.

I wouldn't have wanted to carry it, but being all steel and 9mm, it was practically recoil-free and very accurate considering the crude sights.
Great guns the P35. One the designers detested external safeties and so the decocker. To bring the gun into action you either racked the slide or carried one in the chamber and cocked the hammer. Designed for the Polish cavalry.

tipoc
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
  #32  
Old 12-26-2012, 05:33 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 4
Likes: 1
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default

A safety provides an extra margin of security. I prefer a safety. As others have stated it all comes down to personal preference.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12-26-2012, 06:15 PM
timn8er's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: TEXAS!!!
Posts: 4,910
Likes: 3,703
Liked 3,809 Times in 1,882 Posts
Default

Like others have said here, you've answered your own question. If that's
what you're used to, go with it! When I purchased my M&p40C, I wasn't
aware a thumb safety model was available, plus I was hot to trot after
already waiting several months for a 40 Shield. I'm trying to get in the
habit of carrying a round chambered, but its hard with the little voice
in my head saying "there's no safety". I realize what a slim chance I might have of drawing, racking & then firing in a bad situation...but there is still that little voice.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 12-26-2012, 10:27 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default

Both my 9FS and 9c had thumb safeties, but I removed them after one particular class showed me clearly that they'd slow me down in a life-or-death scenario. I removed the safeties from both and don't regret it (S&W sent me the plugs for free when I first purchased the pistols).


This may or may not be applicable to you, but make sure you train for real life scenarios and that the equipment responds the way you want. In my personal case, the safeties got in the way.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 12-28-2012, 12:59 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 87
Likes: 31
Liked 4 Times in 3 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wolfpackpanther View Post
My M&P .40 does not have a manuel safety but I prefer it did. I didn't catch it when I bought it....I basically assumed all of them did due to the pic I saw of one before I bought it. Below is a current article I copied and pasted from WRAL TV in Raleigh, N.C. and I imagine the local law enforcement here use Glocks.

Fayetteville, N.C. A Cumberland County Sheriff's Office deputy was wounded Wednesday morning when his service weapon accidentally fired as he was leaving home to drive to work, authorities said.

Maj. John R. McRainey, the chief jailer at the Cumberland County Detention Center, underwent surgery at Cape Fear Valley Medical Center and was in stable condition.

McRainey was putting a bag in his vehicle when his .40-caliber semiautomatic handgun, which was inside the bag, discharged, authorities said. Investigators said the gun apparently bumped against another item in the bag, which McRainey often used to transport the gun.

"Although it is always a tragedy anytime that anyone suffers a gunshot wound, we are just thankful that it was no worse than it was," Sheriff Earl "Moose" Butler said in a statement.
Most of my handguns do not have manual safeties, however, the ones that I carry in a bag (on the rare occasion that I do that) always have manual safeties for just this very possibility, or they are in a holster.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 12-28-2012, 09:13 PM
BigCityChief's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: New York State
Posts: 722
Likes: 574
Liked 289 Times in 184 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.

Will I notice the saftey sticking into me if I carry on the waist at five o' clock?

Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
Sir, do only what YOU are comfortable doing. It sounds as if you've already decided. Get the pistol with the thumb safety and train with it so that you'll have complete mastery of the firearm. Good luck - let us know what you've decided.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 12-30-2012, 05:46 PM
wilkoi's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Eastern Ma.
Posts: 142
Likes: 156
Liked 72 Times in 39 Posts
Default

For me, safety is a good feature, if you do not like it do not use it.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 05-27-2013, 07:49 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1
Likes: 13
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default

Interesting discussion Gentlemen. To change topics slightly, does anyone know what those plastic things that you can insert in the firing chamber/slide/opening and magazine opening to show that the weapon is unloaded? I think they are red, yellow or orange color for increased visibility. I think they hold the action open slightly. They might be useful if you are declaring a firearm while flying or transporting a weapon. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 05-27-2013, 08:03 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: MA
Posts: 2,839
Likes: 898
Liked 1,544 Times in 848 Posts
Default

I've always heard them referred to as chamber flags. Brownells has them in a variety of styles. I'm sure other places do as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by garyhope View Post
Interesting discussion Gentlemen. To change topics slightly, does anyone know what those plastic things that you can insert in the firing chamber/slide/opening and magazine opening to show that the weapon is unloaded? I think they are red, yellow or orange color for increased visibility. I think they hold the action open slightly. They might be useful if you are declaring a firearm while flying or transporting a weapon. Thanks.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 05-27-2013, 08:40 PM
ginzo's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: North Port, FL
Posts: 630
Likes: 582
Liked 189 Times in 130 Posts
Default

Thumb safety for me. Not a deal breaker if I didn't have it, but I do, got it on purpose, so it's part of my training.
__________________
Criminals don't register guns.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 05-27-2013, 10:34 PM
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Michigan
Posts: 521
Likes: 126
Liked 224 Times in 126 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryS View Post
I've always heard them referred to as chamber flags. Brownells has them in a variety of styles. I'm sure other places do as well.
Chamber flag or chamber safety flags. Many new guns come with them. My club requires that they be inserted between shooting sets during competitions.

During a stop at my LGS, I asked if they had any, and the salesman looked around on the floor behind the counter and came up with several, enough types and sizes to cover all of my pistols and one of my wheel guns.

The club supplied flags for those that didn't have them for last week's military rifle shoot. The other thing they'll accept as a flag is a length of florescent string-trimmer plastic "string", inserted through the breech into the barrel, so the range officer could easily see that the action was open and no round was in the chamber. This shows up even better than many of the purpose-made versions, which may be quite small, works very well as long as the slide/bolt is locked back, and is super fast to remove when the load command is given.

Last edited by Robotech; 05-27-2013 at 10:41 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 05-27-2013, 10:37 PM
Rastoff's Avatar
US Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: So Cal (Near Edwards AFB)
Posts: 5,371
Likes: 479
Liked 3,235 Times in 1,564 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by garyhope View Post
Interesting discussion Gentlemen. To change topics slightly, does anyone know what those plastic things that you can insert in the firing chamber/slide/opening and magazine opening to show that the weapon is unloaded? I think they are red, yellow or orange color for increased visibility. I think they hold the action open slightly. They might be useful if you are declaring a firearm while flying or transporting a weapon. Thanks.
Yes, they are called a chamber flag. Every new M&P is sold with one. In fact, I believe every new S&W pistol comes with one.
__________________
Freedom isn't free.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 05-27-2013, 10:52 PM
US Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 943
Likes: 21
Liked 186 Times in 64 Posts
Default

A safety is a deal breaker for me. I regard a Glock as akin to a Browning HP cocked with the safety off. I have one Glock and I use the trigger block safety, that little hunk of plastic that you slip behind the trigger and just push out of the way when you want to fire. Got 6 of em, so if I lose one or two is no big deal. I have been packing weapons professionally fo very close to half a century and my worst fear is a gun grab. Been there, done that, not fun. Normally when in a crowd situation I pack my BHP with the weapon at half cock and the safety on. Let some gun grabber try to figure that out before I get my 940 out of my left pocket and into action-not likely. Since we are now carrying Walther PPQs, I drop the firing pin on a loaded chamber so that all I have to do is slip the slide back about 1/8th of an inch to fire, and do it while drawing, using the holster as a "shelf" to do it on. Works perfectly. I do have 2 M&Ps, a fullsize .357 and compact .45. We are going to be allowed either of them starting in July after we qualify with them-but they must have a safety! It is very easy to wipe the safety off while presentng the weapon. I am a definite safety fan.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 05-28-2013, 01:15 AM
thndrchiken's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: People's Republic of NJ
Posts: 849
Likes: 8
Liked 77 Times in 60 Posts
Default

I have the M&P 40C with the thumb safety, really wasn't an issue for me, I do use it when carrying. Now with that said I wouldn't have any issue carrying if it didn't have the safety, my Sigs don't have one and in today's striker fired handguns, there is enough safety built into the design of the gun that if you practice safe gun handling it should not be an issue.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 05-28-2013, 08:36 AM
Plinker99's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Florida
Posts: 126
Likes: 10
Liked 16 Times in 13 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.


Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)
Sounds like you've got enough concerns to justify the safety. A good holster will keep the lever from digging in...and as a BONUS it might keep you from blowing a hole in your back side!
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 05-28-2013, 10:03 AM
RussC's Avatar
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Utah
Posts: 880
Likes: 29
Liked 344 Times in 183 Posts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Loffmar77 View Post
I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've fired many but never owned one. Everything instilled in me tells me to get the one with the thumb safety. Every gun I've ever owned has had a manual safety and every handgun I've ever fired has had one. I'm just not sure how I safe I will feel if I don't get that option.

Will I notice the saftey sticking into me if I carry on the waist at five o' clock?

Non thumb safety models are ready to fire once the round is in the chamber, correct? What prevents accidental firing? What prevents someone from unknowingly firing it" God forbid if my 5 year ever got a hold of it... (yes, it will be in a bedside safe with ammo close by in another secure device.)


...I just don't want to regret my choice, and non of the shops around here carry a thumb safety model.
A good holster that covers the entire trigger is a safety.

Good meaning the material is ridged enough that you cannot make contact with the trigger while holstered.

Desantis is my favorite but there are plenty of good quality holsters.

The Shield thumb safety has grown on me.

I would recommend if you go with a thumb safety you acquire thumb safeties for all future gun purchases and you train sweeping trigger when you draw weapon. (Make sure weapon is empty)

I know some complained about the Shield safety but honestly if you practice sweeping it is no big deal and the safety is in the right place at the joint of the thumb. In all my practicing I have never missed sweeping safety.

Russ
Reply With Quote
The Following User Likes This Post:
Reply

Tags
1911, beretta, glock, p226, remington, ruger, sauer, sig arms, transition, universal

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols Thread, Thumb safety in Smith & Wesson Semi-Automatic Pistols; I'm going to purchase a M&P .40 Compact in the very near future. This will be my first handgun, I've ...
Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
WTS: S&W M&P 40 w/Thumb Safety(SOLD) and S&W M&P40C w/Thumb Safety (WITHDRAWN) (AL) cmr0323 GUNS - For Sale or Trade 8 09-03-2011 01:25 PM
M&P FS 9mm - With or without thumb safety Florida Shooter Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols 10 05-24-2011 04:04 AM
Safety issue with Apex parts thumb safety models. Szumi Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols 6 11-13-2010 06:10 PM
MP9 Thumb Safety too big Bob Crail Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols 2 05-22-2010 11:53 PM
M&P 45 Thumb Safety LennieT Smith & Wesson M&P Pistols 7 05-10-2010 04:47 PM

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
smith-wessonforum.com tested by Norton Internet Security smith-wessonforum.com tested by McAfee Internet Security

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:50 AM.


S-W Forum, LLC 2000-2013
Smith-WessonForum.com is not affiliated with Smith & Wesson Holding Corporation (NASDAQ Global Select: SWHC)