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Old 06-03-2012, 03:24 PM
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Default Storm Lake vs KKM

I'd like some opinions on which barrels you guys like over the other for the full size M&P 9mm, or if they're even worth it. Thinking of buying one, but a guy I saw yesterday at an USPSA match, who is an "A" shooter, was shooting the KKM in the 5" Pro model, and he didn't have much better groups than I did at 40 yards with my stock barrel.
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Old 06-03-2012, 05:57 PM
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I run the stock barrel in my 40pro, Ihave a friend who uses the storm Lake in his. He is angry that he wasted the money on the "precision " barrel. I still shoot better than he does... LOL

Bawhaha

I did use his weapon with the fancy barrel and noticed no difference in performance of the weapon.

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Old 06-03-2012, 08:42 PM
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KKM makes a better barrel but see no use for it in an M&P because the OEM barrel is fully supported, at least it is in my Shield, and no lead restriction. have KKM barrels for my glocks for the range but will only use OEM for carry. Both manufacturers make barrels that will shoot better than the shooter.
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:11 PM
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Have seen a couple of S&W barrels that benefited from a recrown but frankly have no urge to replace the barrels on my Pros.
Like texas48 said, KKM makes excellent aftermarket barrels, but why do you think you need it on your M&P?
With 1" ammo and a 2" gun in the hands of a 5" shooter, you still get a 5" group.
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Old 06-03-2012, 09:49 PM
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I'm waiting on KKM's 5" 357 Sig barrel for my 40L. They keep saying 2 more weeks.... Storm Lake doesn't make one in 357 for the 5" M&Ps, so I wait for KKM. My reason for aftermarket barrels is caliber conversion. I'm a big 357 Sig fan and like to shoot 357s in the 5" 40s. I've had very good experiences with Storm Lake barrels in a Glock 35, an XDm, and a Kimber 1911. Accuracy improved with the Kimber and Glock, and stayed the same in the XDm. I'm hoping for good performance from the 5" KKM M&P barrel, if I can ever get one......
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Old 06-04-2012, 04:36 AM
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Like thomasinaz said OKFC05, "if he can ever get one". They're sold out practically everywhere so thousands of people are buying them and replacing the OEM barrel. Why would this be? I think your hit and miss with accuracy on these guns with the tolerances they have. IMO They're built like an AK to run no matter what, but if you want target grade accuracy you're going have to do something with some of them. Maybe not all, but some if you read alot of the different forums. Otherwise thousands of people couldn't be wrong and htere wouldn't be a market for them. Don't get me wrong, the accuracy is "ok" and I love the M&P lineup, but necessity is the mother of invention.
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Old 06-04-2012, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hornet1022 View Post
.... people are buying them and replacing the OEM barrel. Why would this be? .... if you want target grade accuracy you're going have to do something with some of them. Maybe not all, ....
Unfortunately, sales popularity is no indication, as the Tarus Judge broke all handgun sales records.

By all means get the KKM if you want it, but here's a couple of tips from the OK competitors.
1. How accurate is the gun now? Not what you can manage in a USPSA match, but the basic gun accuracy?
2. If accuracy is lacking with all brands of quality ammo, what is causing it? Suggest a qualified person check the entire gun for a misfit: it might be the slide, not the barrel.
3. Don't just drop a KKM in the gun and expect improvement. Have it fit correctly.
4. Expect to use ammo that produces the desired accuracy and reliability in the new setup, and it probably will not be the cheapest.
If you plan to use white box ammo, forget the KKM. One of our shooters put in a tight-chambered KKM and found it would not feed his favorite ammo, so he had the chamber jugged out to improve feeding......
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Old 06-04-2012, 08:17 PM
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Frankly, I believe that all of the aftermarket barrel makers start with standard specs from the factory barrels. Their claim to fame may be because they use different or more precise manufacturing methods. The only exception to this rule would be Bar-Sto. They look at the gun and will improve on the factory design with longer lock up time or different rifling rate etc.

Now, for a S&W M&P which will run lead from the factory I doubt that you will see much of an improvement over the factory barrel. The only barrel that is worth it would be the Bar-Sto hand fitted by them.
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Old 06-04-2012, 10:19 PM
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Sounds like good advice. Thanks guys. Just curious, what would be YOUR acceptable group at 60 ft offhand.
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Old 06-04-2012, 10:34 PM
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I bought a Storm Lake for my Glock 17 Production gun. Had to send it back for refitting it was really out of specs. Pay the extra few dollars and go with the KKM
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Old 06-06-2012, 03:23 PM
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If yours gets 6-8" out to 25 yards __from a rest__ then yes I'd say get one for sure. There is a major problem with the M&P 9mm's, the compact not as much as a problem.

You could wait until Apex comes out with the new locking block which should fix the dwell time which IS causing accuracy issues with the 9mm's. The older M&P9's are fine though.

Or you could go with the oversized barrels that Grant is getting from Storm Lake. He is the only one getting them since they will be custom fitted to your slide. These are NOT out on the market yet, but hopefully very soon.

Or you could get the gunsmith required ones and also the semi-drop in ones coming out from Apex and Bar-Sto (IIRC they are coming out with 2 options, won't be for another 2-4 months though). I'd do research on both, have to use your Goog search Fu as my post on this subject was deleted last night to where you can actually find the info.

Last edited by PC Geek Shooter; 06-06-2012 at 03:25 PM.
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:45 PM
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PC-Geek, where are you getting the information that the locking block is bad and that older M&P 9's are OK???
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Old 06-06-2012, 09:14 PM
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I have a 10mm KKM bbl as well as a KKM 10mm - 40 S&W conversion bbl for my Glock 20. I've been very happy with the quality of the barrels. No experience with the Storm Lake bbls but I hear they too are top notch.
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Old 06-07-2012, 12:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by presspics View Post
Frankly, I believe that all of the aftermarket barrel makers start with standard specs from the factory barrels. Their claim to fame may be because they use different or more precise manufacturing methods. The only exception to this rule would be Bar-Sto. They look at the gun and will improve on the factory design with longer lock up time or different rifling rate etc.

Now, for a S&W M&P which will run lead from the factory I doubt that you will see much of an improvement over the factory barrel. The only barrel that is worth it would be the Bar-Sto hand fitted by them.
I have Bar-Sto 9mm conversion barrels for a SIG P226 and a P239, and they dropped in and work flawlessly. I can't find any info on Bar-Sto's site about making any barrels for the M&P line -- have you heard anything about Bar-Sto coming out with an M&P line of barrels?
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Old 06-07-2012, 03:31 AM
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I still want to know what are YOUR acceptable groups are at 60 feet. That is what you are willing to accept from your gun, whatever it is, and call that an accurate gun.
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Old 06-11-2012, 10:48 PM
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Nobodies willing to say huh?
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Old 06-12-2012, 12:16 AM
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Quote:
what would be YOUR acceptable group at 60 ft offhand.
Offhand shooting with a handgun is more of a test of the shooter than the gun. No offense, but you are essentially asking for a critique of your shooting ability, not your gun.

From a rest, about a 4 inch group at 25 yards is considered good for a service grade handgun. Any shooter that achieves this offhad is a superb shooter. A true target grade bullseye gun may have basic mechanical accuracy of 1 inch groups at 25 yards with its favorite ammunition. Some champions actually achieve such groups in competition on a good day.

I have shot my M&P Pro off a rest at distances up to 100 yards, and am satisfied that any misses of the "zero down" circle on an IDPA target up to the legal match distance of 35 yards will be my fault, not the gun's.

Regaring your observation at a USPSA match, the "A" shooter you watched probably was shooting as fast as he could go and still get acceptable hits on the targets, and was not trying for minimum groups sizes. There is a "sweet spot" in speed shooting where you still get pretty good hits at high speed, and a point past that where you go too fast and the hits are lousy.

Keep working at it, and take a class from a competition shooter if you get a chance.
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Old 09-29-2012, 12:31 PM
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As far as my experience tells me, there is a day and night difference between a drop-in KKM bbl vs the Gen1 S&W bbl. Pics of shooting results will tell the whole story: there's a clear cut difference, no smoke, no BS... just facts.

Please feel free to see the full thread started by me. I do not want to have to repeat the darn thing again.
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Old 09-30-2012, 06:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hornet1022 View Post
I'd like some opinions on which barrels you guys like over the other for the full size M&P 9mm, or if they're even worth it. Thinking of buying one, but a guy I saw yesterday at an USPSA match, who is an "A" shooter, was shooting the KKM in the 5" Pro model, and he didn't have much better groups than I did at 40 yards with my stock barrel.
IMHO, after market barrels that are drop in really aren't going to change your groups much (or at all). The only way to improve accuracy is with a fitted barrel.



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Old 09-30-2012, 07:34 PM
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I don't know about recently, but I believe Storm Lake used to say that a proper fitting was a requirement of their barrels.

It sounds as if, with these aftermarkets, you need a proper fitting or you're just taking your chances with both proper function and accuracy improvement.

Heck, buy one, try it, if it doesn't fit right, pay to make it so.
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