To Safety or not to Safety?

[redbeard3569]

Looked thru a lot of the forums and the photos contained in them and wondered:
Am I the only one who opted for a thumb safety on my EDC?
I am very comfortable with a safety and sweeping it on and off is second nature to me so when I picked up a M&P 9c I chose the model with the thumb safety over the magazine safety.
I fully realize either can be disconnected easily so it wasn't a permanent choice but I don't see many that opted for a thumb safety.
Wondering if I stand alone in my choice.

[hpfenning]

I have the safeties on all my M&P's. I train with it and use it on my EDC Shield everyday. This is a hot topic on this forum, but do what you feel comfortable with. If you train using it-then use it in your carry as well.

[Lee in Quartzsite]

I have no thumb safety or mag safety on my 9c, but I do have a thumb safety on my Shield. That's the only way it came. The only time I use it on the Shield is when I am re-holstering...once it is in the holster the safety come Off. My reasoning is that if I have to draw my weapon it will be fired and I want it ready. Plus, I use a Crimson Trace on my 9c and it won't fit with a thumb safety.

I am going to buy a 45c whenever I can find one, and it too will NOT have a thumb safety. I am sure you will get many more Pros and Cons....just my personal preference...do what makes you feel good.

[robkarrob]

There have been many threads about this. It is a matter of personal preference. I primarily pocket carry, and have a modified lightened trigger on my Shield 40. The safety is mandatory for me. But those that carry holstered, where the trigger is covered, do not have to worry as much about a finger or something else catching the trigger, during the draw. They may feel the safety is unnecessary. The only place they have to be careful is when holstering the gun, so the trigger doesn't get caught on something when placed in the holster. Most that don't want a safety feel that their finger is the true safety, and no one would argue with that.

Those that do not want or like a manual safety have a major safety issue when they carry a gun with a safety. Since most of their guns do not have a manual safety, they generally carry with the safety off, but worry that it might get accidentally bumped on during carry. Should they need to use their weapon, they worry when they draw and pull the trigger, the gun may not go bang. That safety got accidentally bumped on, and they did not know that. The extra few seconds it takes to realize they need to swipe the safety off could mean the difference between life and death. This is the reason that many disable or remove the manual safety.

Bob

[DocSunShine]

IMO a safety on an M&P is useless.... With the caveat being if you want to have a modified trigger with little to no take up and a sub 4lbs. trigger weight, then it would seem reasonable to me to have a safety, but only if you train with the safety a lot and are comfortable with it. For me, it's one more thing that can go wrong so I refuse to use a safety. Thankfully the safety on the shield is pretty stiff and small so it's not really an issue, my safety has not been turned on by me except for once when I first got the gun just to ensure it functioned properly.

[RobzGuns]

I also prefer no external safety on a carry pistol, but alas, the Shield does not give a choice. I don't know why S&W feels striker fire pistols need an external safety when they put a 6lb trigger on it. But... I liked the Shield enough to buy it um... Anyway.

I also pocket carry, but I use a pocket holster in order to keep the pistol at a good angle (and the trigger is covered). I flip the safety off as soon as it's holstered.

[ginzo]

I chose a 40 FS w/thumb safety. Ordered and still waiting for a 40c w/thumb safety. 2 guns, both with safety. I DO PRACTICE TO INCLUDE the thumb safety. Teetered on whether to get or not, just felt a little better on having it. When I cc (always) just brush my hand by holster to check the mode (on), same as I would if I felt I might be in a less than optimal situation (off). Do practice my draw to include so as to refine my muscle memory. (Always triple safety checked).

P.S. No mag safety tho.......

[drolen]

I chose the FS M&P9 with safety. I prefer the safety.

[shawn mccarver]

Originally Posted by redbeard3569

Looked thru a lot of the forums and the photos contained in them and wondered:
Am I the only one who opted for a thumb safety on my EDC?
I am very comfortable with a safety and sweeping it on and off is second nature to me so when I picked up a M&P 9c I chose the model with the thumb safety over the magazine safety.
I fully realize either can be disconnected easily so it wasn't a permanent choice but I don't see many that opted for a thumb safety.
Wondering if I stand alone in my choice.

You probably do not stand alone. But, I would guess you are in the minority, based upon how many M&P models are shipped and routinely available from the distributor without either the manual safety or the magazine safety versus models with either of those features.

I am guessing, having not done any formal research, but I would imagine that those who like the manual safety are either shooters familiar with the 1911 pistol, shooters who do not trust the pistol without a manual safety for whatever reason or shooters who simply prefer the device.

For 100 years, we were all fine with revolvers having no manual safety (except the French, who ordered a batch of S&Ws with a manual safety). For most of that same 100 years, we preferred manual safeties on our semi-auto pistols (1911, High Power, Walther, etc.).

Along came the West German Police Pistol trial of the 70s, and one of the specifications was that the pistol be safe from inadvertent discharge if dropped, but instantly ready without the need to flick off a manual safety. I am not sure if they figured out that the undoubtedly under-trained police (I am not talking about the special hostage rescue teams here), just could not remember to take of the "safety catch" or exactly what prompted it, but suddenly when pistols meeting that spec became available, it was a "game changer."

Prior to the West German Police Pistol Trials, semi-autos were subject to discharge when dropped from a sufficient height, as the firing pins were inertial and merely held back from the primer by a spring. Once a device, ultimately called a firing pin safety, was introduced to prevent this, it became apparent that pistols could be handled in the same manner as revolvers - no manual safety, safe if dropped, would go bang if you pulled the trigger, but not otherwise.

The West German Police Pistol Trials resulted in the replacement of aging P1s, P2s, P3s, and P4s, as well as the PP, PPK and PP Super. Authorized were pistols from three major manufacturers, the Walther, adopted as the P5, the SIG Sauer, adopted as the P6 and the Heckler and Kock, adopted as the P7. Those pistols changed the landscape in that they were safe if dropped without the need for a manual safety lever.

Ultimately, other makers either came out with new designs or adapted old ones. Colt reintroduced a firing pin safety, this time keyed off the trigger, instead of the grip safety as theirs had been before WWII. Colt called theirs the Series 80. S&W introduced its 2nd Gen Pistols, and everyone came forth when the military testing started ramping up in the early 80s leading to adoption of the M9 Beretta in 1985.

So, a manual safety on a modern pistol is probably no longer the preferred method, but it has apparently been shown to have advantages if certain pistols are lost to an attacker. In any event, if you can train yourself to activate it just as quickly, then you should be OK with your selection. Some like the magazine safeties because of the ability to remove a magazine and make the pistol safe if kids are others have access.

Personally, I have no use for the manual safety on the modern DA pistol. As to magazine safeties, I prefer the ability to fire the one in the chamber even if the magazine is lost. As to safety, a lock box or vault is the only way to fly. If it is not on your person, it should be locked up.

[Hodgin]

I have an external safety on my 9c and will not remove it.

[webfarmer]

For my EDC, I chose the Shield because it has the safety. It may never be pulled to shoot for self defense (with any luck) so the vast majority of the time it is static. I can see both sides to the debate but personally feel "safer" knowing the safety is on. Old school perhaps......

[Smitty357]

It depends on who u ask.

For instance, i met this guy once who carried his EDC unchambered and on safety. Who would have thought. =-)

[B3500]

As far as safeties go, I prefer them to be of a passive nature, like the XDS grip safety.

If there is a safety on your carry piece that you have to swipe, whether you actually enable it or not, you must practice with it as if it is on in case it would ever get activated.

One safety type I never really warmed up to is the magazine disconnect. If I inadvertently hit the mag release I still would like to have one shot instead of it being put instantly into paper weight mode.

[marlin.357]

In my opinion, the primary benefit of a thumb safety is during re-holstring, especially when attempting to re-holster discretely after returning to your vehicle after leaving a 'gun-free zone'.

Remember all of the accidental discharges you've heard about with that other brand of pistol that starts with a G? Almost all were during re-holstering, sure there were contributing factors, clothing in the trigger guard while re-holstering, worn out holster snagged the trigger upon re-holsering, etc. A thumb safety would have prevented those--but so would extra care.

Thumb safety or not, your choice. If you have one, practice using it until it becomes automatic. If you decide not to have one, then take care re-holstering.

[millisec]

Safety on Shield and used. Like any other feature it takes a little practice to make second nature and is a non time penalizing part of my draw. Better safe than sorry and it borders on irresponsible not to learn and use it. For me I carry Shield IWB at Appendix where it carries best. Frankly, especially when driving or sitting, I would rather not have an accidental discharge, for whatever reason, that likely blows out my femoral artery (resulting in rapid bleed out and death), bladder, Johnson, nuts or other needed parts with a 147g Talon.

BTW at least on my Shield the safety is just tight enough that its a smooth thumb flick. When on I have never seen it get knocked off as others have said.

My Pro of course has no safety and has a <4# trigger. For the most part competition only and even at that my "load and make ready" loads are a little slow and exaggerated when it comes to holstering the loaded gun. Over the years I have seen a few holstering AD's like that.

[MSG Glenn]

My personal decision is no safety of any type on a striker-fired M&P 40 & 40C & before that a Sigma 40VE.

I've heard that some holsters will inadvertently activate or deactivate a thumb safety.

[shoots]

Since I am prior LE and military, my carry weapons are LEMs. But I instinctively swipe for the safety with my thumb, because of the 1911 .45 past experience. So I can go either way. Ultimately, your trigger finger is your safety. Be safe.

[OldGoat]

After finding a full sized M&P 9mm with a safety for a casual range and home defense gun, I began a 3 month fruitless search for a M&P 9c with the thumb safety. Gave up after finding an STI Spartan III in 9mm. Yes, I know it is a very different concept, but what a great shooting gun with a terrific out-of-the-box trigger....and (gulp) a manual safety. Regards, Ed

[miles71]

My new m&p has a safety, it gets in my way when shooting. When I get my had nice and high my thumb is right in line with the safety. I hit it more than once and engaged it while shooting. Makes me think real serious about its removal.
TD

[Mcwsky09]

My M&P 45 was purchased used from an LEO who bought it with no manual safety and no magazine disconnect. This is my bedside home defense weapon. So far I have not stores it with a round in the chamber but probably should.

For concealed carry I have a Boduguard 380 which I first carried with he safety off but no round in the chamber. I have since switched to round I the chamber with safety on. The safety is pretty stuff but not over difficult for me to operate and I have practiced a bit thumbing the safety off as I place my hand on the gun while stuff holstered. With the heavy and long double action only trigger the chance of something inadverdantly pulling the trigger seems quite unlikely.

[D-Hop]

No thumb or mag safety on my mp40c and I wouldn't have it any other way. In the event I have to use my weapon for protection I want it ready to fire when I draw it from my holster. My holster does cover the trigger and when I want a extra safety I just leave the chamber empty.

[Cartero]

Keep in consideration that I'm a noob and my M&P .45 is a full size with thumb safety, and it is not a carry gun. It is strictly for HD and goes to the range and back.

My buddy helped me get into shooting about a year ago. He loaned me one of his 1911's on many occasions for training and also let me use it to attend a four day handgun course. I got really comfortable engaging and disengaging the safety. When I bought my M&P I was indifferent about the thumb safety. I bought it when it went on sale and it just happened to come with a safety, which I was now used to.

In my practice drills drawing, shooting (or dry-firing), and re-holstering have been automatic BUT, during my malfunction drills I have accidentally engaged the safety on more than one occasion. My buddy taught me to ride the safety on the 1911, so I would immediately notice if I accidentally engaged it, but my instructor had me change my grip so I don't ride the safety anymore. The result of my grip change is that sometimes I am unaware that I have accidentally engaged the safety after a malfunction drill. For this reason I am going to remove mine as soon as my frame plugs arrive.

[Cousin Vinnie]

The M&P 357/40 is my first striker fired weapon and I do not have the thumb safety but would not mind having one for nothing more than an extra level of security against an AD. With that being said, I was surprised how much effort it does take to pull the trigger into discharge. IMHO the MA or NY version with a 10.5 lb trigger pull would give me a better level of safety without the thumb safety. Add the thumb safety to a NY/MA model and I would be golden. Maybe I'm old fashion but I get queazy around these new striker fired weapons. I never heard of a revolver or a 3rd generation S&W auto accidentally going off in ones holster or otherwise.

[.45goblue]

I opted for a safety when I purchased my .45, Then I removed it because it didn't work with my holster I use for work.

I wont buy another M&P with a safety. I like it without now that I'm use to it.

[TahoeDust]

Thumb safety on my FS9 and of course on my Shield. I practice sweeping the safety off every time I practice drawing either of them. I am much more comfortable carrying with safety on and am confident I will not have a problem sweeping the safety off if I ever have to use either weapon in an emergency situation.