Hey. Just purchased a new 9mm Shield w/o the safety. Immediatey upon getting it home, I read the Manual and watched a few YouTube videos re: field stripping, cleaning and lubricating a new Shield.

I enxountered no problems except S&W, as well as videographers, had trouble visualizing the switch that is pushed down into the handle. I finally located the "yellow" part and had no problem in moving it appropriately. Otherwise the procedures and parts were standard - a body, slide, spring assembly and barrel. And that little switch located in the back of the chamber.

Upon rebuilding the gun, one of the last steps is to slide the rack back and lock it with the notch. (The yellow switch automatically goes back into place when a magazine is inserted but I may have moved it back myself. And I did not follow the work around suggested by use of the trigger in striping it down).

The problem is that once you insert the magazine it causes the notch to release and a cartridge is chambered by the slide moving forward under pressure. The solution appeared to me to be easy; first release the rack by pushing the notch down which causes the slide to release to its normal position, all before the magazine is inserted. When I did so, however, the magazine would not load. It would jam in the handle about an inch before it should have snaped into place. I tried setting it with my palm to no avail.

Its hard for me to believe that the chambering of a round after stripping down a gun is mandatory, which would also be a requirement on each subsequent magazine. Add to that - there is no safety. Therefore, would this be cocked and unlocked rather than the P938's cocked and locked?

I suspect the design is proper but I erroneously rebuilt the gun. The dealer says he can't help because he never took down a Shield. You would think he would want to know the answer by doing his own research and his own viewing of the videos but that was not the case.

So, help please.

Chuck

This would be a lot easier to figure out with pictures. FWIW I have a NS 9MM Shield in my back pocket, in a pocket holster with a round chambered right now. It's been there all day, every day for a couple of months and i don't have any more holes in my butt than i did the day I was born

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Retired Career Security Guard

You should be able to do all of this as you first tried. You do NOT need to chamber the round for it to come back together. I've had mine apart many times. Make sure everything is aligned properly. With a full magazine, it takes quite a bit of pressure to get it locked in.

I hope you plan to carry with a round chambered. My Shield has a safety that I never use. It's clear it's there for those who have a fear of carrying a loaded weapon. I carry chambered, safety off without ever having a single issue or concern. It doesn't go bang unless I tell it to.

I encountered the problem of a mag not going in all the way after loading & reloading mags in the pistol many hundreds of times in my M&P40C. When I checked the mag I noticed the top round was protruding slightly. I normally tap the back of the mag to set the rounds but when I topped it off with the +1 round I must have forgotten to do that. I just gave the back of the mag a slap to set the round & all was well.

My 40C has no safety either & I've been carrying it for over a year - every day, all day as well as my older full size M&P which I carried for 2 years before that & never had a firing mishap. The M&Ps won't fire unless the trigger is pulled. That's why you must be careful to keep your finger off the trigger & there are no obstacles like a piece of clothing in the way when drawing or more importantly re-holstering.

Many M&Ps will chamber a round when you insert the mag with force like slapping it in sharply. I normally load a mag with the slide closed & chamber a round after it's in place by pulling the slide all the way back & letting it go. At the range with the slide locked back I'll either put the mag in gently & manually chamber a round or slap it in & about 90% of the time it'll chamber by itself.

I hope this answers your questions about what I think you were asking. If not then rephrase them & I or someone else will be more than likely be able to help.

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Former USN, Retired US Army

While some pistols do this by design, my Shield's slide does not automatically release when inserting a mag. Interesting.

This is not uncommon with the flush mag, as the springs are VERY tight at first and if the mag is full, one needs to really slam it home with gusto. You would experience this same problem if you racked the 1st round, topped off the mag (to +1 status) and reinserting the mag. The mag springs will loosen over time and seating a Full Mag will become easier.

If looking for an easy solution, why not manually moving the yellow bar to the 'up' position with your finger? Or... easier yet... Insert an Empty mag to move it to the 'up' position. With an Empty mag, if the slide still slams shut, there's a problem with the slide lock.

Chuck, if you are going to use a magazine for re-assembly, it should be unloaded, empty, and devoid of any cartridges. But you knew this and are winding us up...right?

Just to be clear, everyone needs to keep fingers well clear of the ejection port. Use a pencil to push down the little yellow lever. That dual spring on the Shield is strong enough to snip a finger right off! I always cringe when I see videos with people manually checking chamber with little finger.

Initially, when re-assembling the new Shield, I gently inserted an empty magazine and then moved the slide back. During this process I gently locked the empty magazine in place so that the slide would be locked back by the empty magazine pushing up on the slide stop. At this point, I was free to rotate the take down lever to normal position and the gun was completely assembled.

Update: As a condition of use or breaking in the pistol, I am now pretty easily able to jack the slide back and push up the slide stop without the use of an empty magazine. Couldn't do that when the gun was new. Now it's a case of normal field stripping and re-assembly. Perhaps new owners should just jack the slide back on an empty magazine and leave the gun open in the "T" position for a day in the gun safe.

Are you using a full mag to push up the sear deactivation lever during reassembly? Eeeek! Use your finger, or an empty mag.

Not the finger, a pencil,pen, screwdriver is much safer. Unlikely the slide would be released, but what could a person do if the finger got caught in the ejection port? Call 911??

Use a pocket screwdriver for that lever. I've seen someone get a finger "nipped off". Messy, and broken bone or not, you'll loose a good handkerchief in stopping the bleeding.

But no, using a loaded mag to reassemble is not a good idea.

To field strip

• Remove the magazine
• Check chamber to make sure the gun is empty
• lock the slide back
• rotate the slide release lever
• release the slide lock
• pull the trigger and take the slide off the frame

To reassemble

• replace the slide on the frame
• lock the slide back
• rotate slide release lever to original position
• pull slide all the way to the rear and release

Gun is reassembled. You DO NOT need or want a round in the magazine or chamber to do any of this.

You do have to push "down" the disconnect lever before releasing the slide lock on the shield. More like moving from vertical to ~30 degrees (I also found it hard to find from the videos).

You left out a step for Shields with the mag safety. To do it this way, you need to insert a magazine before the trigger can be pulled to release the slide. Then the mag can be dropped and the slide taken off. It's still pretty simple, just one extra step. Obviously, a loaded mag SHOULD NEVER be use for this. I use an empty 7 rounder just for this.

Or...just use the sear takedown lever instead.

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M&P Shield 9MM

The finger groove mags also are difficult to load into the gun when new & fully loaded. You are totally right about how tight the springs are in a new M&P

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Don

Maybe I’m missing something, when I reassemble my Shield a magazine isn’t required at all but I do reload it after I put it back together. I think that may be what the OP is trying to say.

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Retired Career Security Guard

I agree...the yellow take down lever is not necessary. The ONLY purpose it serves is so you DO NOT HAVE TO PULL THE TRIGGER to disassemble. I never use it...like most people (and Glock owners) just make sure your weapon is empty. Their should not be any ammo or loaded mags in the same room when you are working on a gun...period....

I didn't think that was possible. I will need to reread the manual to see if the lawyers included that warning. Because they sure have thought of every other possible warning. Thanks for the heads up.

Didn't see anyone mention this, but sounds like some of you have the mag safety version.

I've never had ANY of my slides inadvertently slam shut by themselves, where I'd have been in danger of getting my finger nipped and thought 'Boy...I'm glad my finger wasn't in there!'... and this dates back to my Beretta 70S back in the early '70s, or the Military Issue 1911 (and those were in terrible condition). I haven't even seen it happen to anyone else either. Maybe I've simply been lucky, or maybe this phenomena only happens to those who use the Slide Lock as a 'Slide Release' and the notch (and/or lever) got worn down a bit by this repeated action... Who Knows?

Anyway... Since this seems to be a sore spot for some, perhaps I should clarify my earlier post, where I wrote:
I did not actually mean to try and reach down through the ejection port to manually move the yellow bar in to the 'up' position with his finger. I meant to manually move it before reassembly, While The Slide Is Still Off The Frame.
I can't actually reach deep enough into that area to snag the bar.

I accept the criticism. It's a learning process and I never had to deal with a magazine for reassembly (as will be explained below). I made the mistake in correctly another problem I was having with the spring/rod assembly (customer service thinks).

I have a feeling that another problem(s) was arising at same time and was getting somewhat frustrated (bad!) since the gun was brand new. In this regard, after field stripping it (with cleaning and light lube) and making certain that the spring was centered and in place (per YouTube videos), I could not rack the slide back.

Customer Service had me hit the spring assembly rod with a mallet. The second tap and the spring recoiled under the muzzle and I was able to rack the slide back. So I took it down again. The spring looked fine BUT I noticed the rings of the spring were not parallel to each other. Looked odd but I was not sure if that was a defect. I reassembled the gun but now the slide locked back with ease but it would not release!! The spring assembly was not protruding but somehow I got the slide to release. I thing it might have been the magazine that "might have had" ammo in it.

So, the question is whether the spring should look as I described it. I don't want to take it down to the range and then hear that the spring should be parallel, like a slinky just separated by space. So, do the rings that make up the spring go out of alignment to each other when compressed. I hope this make sense; I only use the slinky example for imagery of a "spring" that is perfectly parallel which is not what I am expecting. But I just don't expect the rings to compress in a wavy manner rather than being identical to the adjacent rings.

If I cannot confirm that the spring is normal as described, I think I better return it under the shipping label I was already provided.

Thanks again,

Chuck

Youtube is both a blessing and a curse.

Some things you can not rectify watching a video.

There are a number of "noobs" coming on here with problems that are not problems. Those of us that have been around a while have experience to guide us.

You should find local experience, someone who can show you in first person how your new autoloading handgun works.

It truly is a matter of safety. If you don't know the minor nuances present in every autoloading pistol, ask around (in person) until you find someone who does...the person you may keep from getting accidentally shot is you

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M&P's and K Frames Pleeze!

Of course you are right, however, the story is incomplete. The manufacturer is in the best position to assist with safety issues. How can there be known "issues" when it comes to a gun. If a spring cannot be centered each and every time, unless the user made a glaring error, why is the unmodified gun on the market? It's almost like saying FTEs are okay even if using high quality ammo. The Manual does not address the issue, YouTube which does a better job than the Manufacturer's Manual addresses it to some degree, training courses in general with the same spring/rod assembly design do not address it, my Dealer was of no help, so the user has to find an instructor that is familiar with the proclivity of the Shield to, in essence, jam but in a way that is unusual.

Everything you say is 100% correct. I just believe that the person is the best position to address the issue - the spring may not be centered even if appears to be - should not be omitted from the conversation. When a well qualifed participant in the Forum advises that he has the same problem with the spring so when it jambs on him! he turns it 1/4 of a turn is not acceptable to me. I assume he knew what a centered spring looks like so he should never have had to develop the work around in the first place. Then there's the advice that a certain portion of the spring should appear at the end of the assembly.

These are the very same people that one would get advice from in person. A major manufacturer should be able to produce a gun that does not fail unless the user obviously did something wrong.

So, it remains, is the failure of the slide to lock back and then is the failure of the slide to release after being locked back caused by a failure to "center" the spring or is the wavy sping under compression at fault - a defective spring.

Thanks for the advice re: the loaded mag. Of course you are right. I was just wondering why I was dealing at all with a magazine despite having other guns with the same spring assembly. The answer is that the MANUAL tells you to release the lever with the magazine so you need to go get the magazines already removed from the area. They had already been loaded and the problem combined with the mistake could have cost me big time. Perhaps with having this lever that you are told to release with a magazine by the Manual, they should provide a magazine type device to accomplish the process; one that cannot be loaded. Or they can do away with the recommendation and move to the trigger usage which they shy away from and is only recommended by USERS not the manufacturer.

And now that we know of the "uncentered" magazine and have to wonder about whether we turned it by 1/4 turn, how well of a confined gun is this? I've read about how reliable the gun is yet it has a know defect; an inability to know whether the spring is centered and otherwise properly placed?

And I still don't know if my spring is normal looking.

Thanks,
Chuck

There are many reasons why an autoloading pistol may not work correctly. Probably more than half of those are user error. It is hard for us to tell you if the spring is fine without detailed pictures. If it is indeed not fine, and requires the famous 1/4 turn to work right, I would put it back in the box and send it to S&W to have them rectify it.

When I got my first semi auto, I would gingerly push the slide back and try to lock it back. Those ginger/hesitant motions caused me all sorts of issues. As time went on, I realized that these motions should be forceful. So maybe you are babying it instead of man-handling it.

If I were you, I'd sit in front of the TV, with an empty pistol ( ammo in another room ) and dry fire it 200 times. Reset the trigger, not by short stroking the slide, but by slingshotting it all the back and releasing. Basically, your fingers should be letting go of the slide as it hits the stop. Use this time to dry fire, or not. Up to you. But it will help familiarize yourself with your new gun.

As for the spring, we need pics. With it seated, unseated ( both ends ), whatever you can show us.

Also, what dullh said. Find someone local who can take a look and help you in person. And watch and help as you disassemble/reassemble.

If a manufacturer tells you that the centering of the spring is a known error, why do you need to go further. When qualified members have to devise methods of installing the spring is hope that it fires, what do you need to see.

If the slide is stuck back because the spring is not centered, you cannot open the gun unless you hit it with something per CS advice. So what would a picture do? It looks centered and it has been hit with a mallot right on the spring rod. But, again, it is admittedly an error - that only their customers don't know what center is? And how do we know that centering is the issue. When the gun has been taken down after hitting it with a mallet, how do we know its condition at the time of the jamb.

What I cannot get an answer to is whether a compressed spring's rings should look parallel to each other or is it okay if they are unaligned to the adjacent ring; something the user has no control of. Some of the rings gap further on one side of the rod and others gap further on the other side of the rod (Looking down on an open slide laying on its sights, the bottom of the slide and the top of the slide). There is no rhyme or reason. Maybe this is just normal. Now if that is not clear, I would be happy to attach an image.

Chuck

I deny limp wristing a slide. I have a P938, Beretta PX4 Storm full size, an XDM, a High Standard Victor Military (circa early '90s as a thank you from a Seal/Frogman), and I fully understand your point.

When a manufacturer admits to a problem with the slide and attributes the failure to the failure to center the spring assembly as the likely cause, you can pretty much bet that user error concerning the rack is NOT the issue. It, however, was the issue regarding the insertion of the flush magazine. The first few times I noticed my wrist was limp. After a few whacks, everything loosened up well.

Chuck

If I ever consider purchasing a Shield, I'm re-reading this thread to remind myself why I don't want one . . .

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Wisdom comes thru fear . . .

I can tell you that my recoil spring assembly has never looked even (made May '12). The spring itself looks 'wavy' (not straight at all) and the gaps between concentric rings are not evenly spaced.
This is how mine looks... When both uncompressed (out of the pistol) and compressed. When I first got it, I wondered about how weird the spring looked for a while, but it shot perfectly, so I shrugged it off.

As far as centering... It would have been nice if S&W would have made the 'shelf' the spring sits on just a bit concave, rather than flat. This would assure that the spring is properly centered, but it doesn't take long to learn the idiosyncrasies and let's face it... Every pistol on the market seems to have their own idiosyncrasies.

Or... Find someone in your area that OWNS on and see first hand if it's truly an 'issue', or not.

Or a concave area to hold the spring rod. If centering is so important, as it obviously is, and the rod/spring can be inserted improperly to the point that customer service readily admits it, what significant design change would it take to implement either of our concepts.

Thank you so much re: the concentric rings. I thought that physics would require such a situation but it looks like its inelegantly implemented. As I said, there's no rhyme or reason that appears to having the rings move in different directions to the point that it just looks bad.

I hoping to run down to the range for an hour and, hopefully, I will have no problem with the slide jamming for one reason or another associated with the spring. If it jams, I plan on releasing the magazine, laying it down chamber up ... and running like hell.

In this forum, I learned a lot including to look for, and clear finger, tips in addition to brass, when field stripping.

Thanks,
Chuck

LOL... Your reply is what I meant to write, but the words didn't make it to print quite right.

Below is a pic of one of my other barrels showing what we're basically agreeing on, with the 'socket/trough/concave area circled. If S&W did this, it might have eliminated Dozens, if not Hundreds of threads.
But then... Maybe not, as the forum focussed to the pistol this came from ALSO has 'barrel seating' issue threads.

Attached Images

RecoilSpringSocket.jpg (27.7 KB, 58 views)

In that the gun seems to operate fine (although it still has not been fired), I had a decision to make. S&W has already emailed me a FedEx label to return the gun for a 2 week turn around. So do I make the return especially in that it is to be used for personal defense?

So I went to my local gunshop/range. Although the gunsmith was not in, two seemingly knowledge regulars behind the counter were fine with going over the gun with me, as well as ammo. They confirmed that the gun racked properly and that the spring was centered. They also confirmed that the spring (which looked terrible in the shop) looked perfectly normal. They thought it was totally unnecessary to send the gun back in.

Having other guns to use, it just seems to me that logic requires an inspection of the gun by the manufacturer. What does it cost me other than 2 weeks. But I thought I would put a box through it and see if there were any failures but I got in line behind two people joining the range. Instead of letting me break in to pay for an hour of range time and a box of ammo, she was starting to go through their booklet/application forms. It made no sense as my purchase was two minutes while their's required going over the long form, explanation of different memberships, insurance, accessories, a photo of your dog with a gun, some checking of identification, etc. (10 min. each). I've learned not to be so sensitive about illogical behavior and so I just walked out. The people that helped me asked why I wasn't staying and I just told them it didn't make sense as to how the check-in was being handled and I didn't want to wait. I guess, maybe I was lucky because if the gun handled a box of ammo without a problem, I never would have sent it back. Now I can make the best judgment without being influenced by the gun that "seemed" to be working well.

Funny, when I saw the spring compressed in the store, I expected them to laugh it looked so bad to me. Nope, it's a beautiful thing!

Chuck

Does your spring look like this?
If so... Either It's normal, or mine needs work too, but it's been working fine for 2.5Yrs.

BTW: I don't know how far from the shop/range you live, but if my total reason for going to the range were to test the pistol after the store guys said it looked normal, I would have stuck it out and gotten the 'testing' portion out of the way.

Attached Images

ShieldSpringAsmbly.jpg (110.2 KB, 54 views)

My spring looks a lot worse than that, and passed their checks.

Likewise, at my range, you go early or plan an extra half hour to wait. You don't get to jump line, even with premium memberships, unless you are on-duty police/fire on a lunch or break.

Have any of you seen the YouTube videos on replacing the factory spring and the rod? The issues seem to be the difficulty of feeding the spring on the rod and reassembling it when the rod is so short. The standard spring which extends way past the rod may also be the cause of the "not centered" issue. I think the rod IS centered but perhaps the wavy part that extends past the rod is never straight. When uncompressed the assembly is obviously not in a straight line. I guess then the issue is whether it is a of centering once assembled absent an obvious, visual error.

When S&W received my gun back while the slide would not lock, they said it looked fine, not in centered. Therefore they had no explanation. But it no longer was "it wasn't centered " So that excuse is gone.

I have no issues in babying the rack or a magazine so I know that's not the issue.

Interestingly, Sig Sauer recommends a recoil spring replacement EVERY 1,500 rounds on the P938. This seems remarkably low especially from a manufacturer that prides itself on reliability. Their forums discuss the same spring issues from the quick wear and tear but never discuss a centering problem. Springs are cheap like oil changes but who wants to change their oil every 1,500 miles!

I think the modification of the spring and rod may be the best idea as S&W has no clue and after about 400 rounds the spring is getting harder to reassemble. Despite this it did shoot great and somehow I can now center the spring better once I can get it jammed back in? since the rack operates properly.

Does anyone have this reassembly problem with the spring? If so, has anyone developed a method of reassembling the spring without wearing out your hands?is anyone aware of a manufacturer standard as to number of rounds before replacement of the recoil spring?

Chuck

Mine used to be a bit temperamental too but it seems to have worked its way out of it. But before that happened what I did was to place the recoil spring in place and try locking the slide back...if no go...I rotate the spring a 1/4 turn and retry it...repeated as necessary until the slide will lock back.

Just remember that this defeats design of the firearm in field-stripping without having to pull the trigger, is less safe, and is not approved nor even mentioned in the manual. The 'Glock' method of field-stripping is rapidly becoming a thing of the past, due to ND in field-stripping/cleaning pistols. I highly recommend following the approved method of field-stripping the pistol.

And I was getting 'dizzy' reading through this thread. To reassemble the firearm, forget about the magazine.

To reassemble and lock the slide back, just hold the slide stop up through the process and it will 'find' the sweet spot and will lock. After only a few tries, one can easily do it blindfolded.

There's nothing but FUD in this thread.

Don't let it discourage you! I've been shooting over 25 years and the Shield may be my favorite 9mm shooter of all!

See underlined part, above.

I think that it's irresponsible and overly prudent in sending an unfired firearm back to S&W when all indicators are to the contrary.

Shoot the darn thing already. One will find the springs loosen a bit after only one range session. The firearm is a joy to shoot- believe it or not- less felt recoil and muzzle flip than with the Beretta 92 series!