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  #1  
Old 01-15-2020, 04:55 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Default Constant FTF problems with S&W 22 compact

Well, I've had my S&W M&P 22 compact for a while now, and my wife and i shoot it every week. I have tried many different brands of ammunition but have not been able to find one that shoots reliably in this gun. I would estimate that it varies from 100% failure with Federal Auto Match which is supposed to be the best for semi auto pistols....total disaster !

Other ammunition fails at varying rates but I would say nominally I get at least 2 FTF (fail to feed) in every magazine. It would not be so bad if all I had to do was to rack it again to load another round, but probably 90% of those failures require the removal of the magazine and using a wooden dowel I made and always carry to dislodge the casing from the gun. Real pain in the butt.

So, I probably going to sell this gun and replace it with a Glock 44 which is the new Glock 19 sized 22 semiauto once I see what people say about it. Supposedly, Glock is selling this gun to be a highly reliable 22 pistol that will shoot pretty much any ammunition. They also tout that it will help people with the size of a Glock 19 since it is the same dimensions as the Glock 19. So, kind of a starter pistol for a larger Glock.

My wife likes the size and weight of the S&W but gets really irritated with all of the stopping and clearing required. I bought this gun originally because I seemed to see lots of people saying this gun will eat anything....it doesn't !

Last edited by HJBM&P22Custom; 01-15-2020 at 04:57 PM.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:22 PM
mckenney99 mckenney99 is online now
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I guess you can count me in the camp of not having any issues with my M&P 22 Compact as it has eaten everything I have put through it. Have you contacted S&W Customer Service reference your issues? What you are experiencing is definitely not normal and I'd bet they will provide a shipping label so you can return the pistol for exam and repair.
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Old 01-15-2020, 05:28 PM
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I have also never had an issue with my .22 Compact, FTF or FTE. It is my favorite can plinking/range gun.

I only run CCI Mini Mags in it though.
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Old 01-15-2020, 06:27 PM
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I had the same problem with a full sized S&W 22. It jammed on everything except CCI Mini Mags and Green Tags. Thankfully, the 22 drought ended and I got more CCI ammo. But I never trust it that much because I always know it won't work with any other ammo.
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Old 01-15-2020, 07:02 PM
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I've owned a GSG 1911-22 for years........It runs and runs and runs. With new magazine guts the mag holds 14....With one in the spout 15 rds. on tap......Cheaper than the Smith .22 too.
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Old 01-15-2020, 07:16 PM
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I ran well over 1k rounds thru my compact 33 from Fed to Cci with zero ammo issues. It was a great plinker, I just moved on as it wasnt nearly as accurate as my Buckmark (which I expected) and i stopped using it. But while I owned it, completely trouble free.

And that seems to be what many owners have found, so if someone is having a high fail rate then a call to SW seems warranted.
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Old 01-15-2020, 07:37 PM
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I would let the factory have a try at repairing it. From your description, if it is very clean the issues may be a rough or undersized chamber, or a bad extractor, if it has failed with multiple brands and fails to eject empties.
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Old 01-15-2020, 08:39 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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OK thanks I will contact S&W.
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Old 01-15-2020, 08:53 PM
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Be sure to send a detailed description of your issues with the gun, which may help them troubleshoot.
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Old 01-15-2020, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HJBM&P22Custom View Post
Well, I've had my S&W M&P 22 compact for a while now, and my wife and i shoot it every week. I have tried many different brands of ammunition but have not been able to find one that shoots reliably in this gun. I would estimate that it varies from 100% failure with Federal Auto Match which is supposed to be the best for semi auto pistols....total disaster !

Other ammunition fails at varying rates but I would say nominally I get at least 2 FTF (fail to feed) in every magazine. It would not be so bad if all I had to do was to rack it again to load another round, but probably 90% of those failures require the removal of the magazine and using a wooden dowel I made and always carry to dislodge the casing from the gun. Real pain in the butt.

So, I probably going to sell this gun and replace it with a Glock 44 which is the new Glock 19 sized 22 semiauto once I see what people say about it. Supposedly, Glock is selling this gun to be a highly reliable 22 pistol that will shoot pretty much any ammunition. They also tout that it will help people with the size of a Glock 19 since it is the same dimensions as the Glock 19. So, kind of a starter pistol for a larger Glock.

My wife likes the size and weight of the S&W but gets really irritated with all of the stopping and clearing required. I bought this gun originally because I seemed to see lots of people saying this gun will eat anything....it doesn't !
With Semi autos .22lr I think CCI stingers are the only ammo I would use.
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Old 01-15-2020, 10:34 PM
Jerry_B Jerry_B is offline
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Id be willing to bet you have a magazine issue. Let smith take look. I have three compacts that I use for plinking and new shooters, not a single problem, at least that I can remember.

I seem to remember something about the feed lips being out of spec causing a problem.
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Old 01-15-2020, 10:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry_B View Post
Id be willing to bet you have a magazine issue. Let smith take look. I have three compacts that I use for plinking and new shooters, not a single problem, at least that I can remember.

I seem to remember something about the feed lips being out of spec causing a problem.
i agree not a single problem with mine but I only shoot high velocity ammo.
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Old 01-15-2020, 11:56 PM
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My M&P 22compact eats everything except for Winchester Wildcats. Runs great suppressed too.
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:06 AM
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Mine eats absolutely everything, one of my favorites. Im sure Smith will get your running smooth!

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Old 01-16-2020, 04:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry_B View Post
Id be willing to bet you have a magazine issue. Let smith take look. I have three compacts that I use for plinking and new shooters, not a single problem, at least that I can remember.

I seem to remember something about the feed lips being out of spec causing a problem.
It's possible and I would send the magazines back with it...but that doesn't explain having to drive empties out of the chamber with a rod, I think.
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Old 01-16-2020, 09:51 AM
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I have very few problems with mine and I run the cheapest ammo I can find in it. What you are experiencing is definitely not normal.
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:16 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by murphydog View Post
It's possible and I would send the magazines back with it...but that doesn't explain having to drive empties out of the chamber with a rod, I think.
Yes, I went to home depot and got some wooden dowel and cut it in 8 inch lengths and use it to push the case back out of the barrel and sometimes it takes a good little poke. When the case sticks in the barrel, repeated racking of the slide does not case the case to eject.

Does anyone have a suggestion on who to best contact at S&W and a phone or e-mail for them to try to resolve this problem?
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:32 PM
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Here you go.

Smith & Wesson

By Telephone:

(USA) 1-800-331-0852
Mon-Fri 8:00AM-6:00PM Eastern Time

BY MAIL:
Smith & Wesson
2100 Roosevelt Avenue
Springfield, MA 01104
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:41 PM
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I have two M&P 22 Compacts and have never had any kind of ammunition related issue. They both feed standard velocity and high velocity like they were made for it. Wait... they were made for it.

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]
[IMG][/IMG]

As others have stated, your feed and ejection problems need to be resolved through factory service.

Best wishes for a successful repair!
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Old 01-16-2020, 01:41 PM
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You mention "other ammo" but didn't list any other the Federal Auto Match which is really not that great of ammo anyway. Several of my guns do not do well with it.


What other ammo did you use. Any High velocity.? CCI regular??

22 pistols are very finicky with ammo.

Try some other before go crazy with "fixes and mods" SW factory tests with CCI standard,
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:24 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
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You mention "other ammo" but didn't list any other the Federal Auto Match which is really not that great of ammo anyway. Several of my guns do not do well with it.


What other ammo did you use. Any High velocity.? CCI regular??

22 pistols are very finicky with ammo.

Try some other before go crazy with "fixes and mods" SW factory tests with CCI standard,
Yes I have fired some regular Federal Bulk, Blazer Brass, Winchester Gold Box, Aguila, and some CCI mini-mag. The CCi mini mag definitely runs the best with fewer problems but still stick in the gun sometimes and not eject the casing.
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Old 01-16-2020, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D Brown View Post
Here you go.

Smith & Wesson

By Telephone:

(USA) 1-800-331-0852
Mon-Fri 8:00AM-6:00PM Eastern Time

BY MAIL:
Smith & Wesson
2100 Roosevelt Avenue
Springfield, MA 01104
D Brown, thanks for that information.
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Old 01-16-2020, 04:31 PM
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I once had the S&W M&P 22 and had nothing but ammo issues, just about drove me nuts. I finally doused it in synthetic motor oil and it did better. I called &W on it and they told me guns each have their own personality. Well so do I! I sold it.

I since got the .22 compact and no issues, really a fun little gun. I do think some guns just have issues. It sounds like yours should be well broke in so I certainly would get hold of S&W about it.
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Old 01-16-2020, 04:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HJBM&P22Custom View Post
Yes I have fired some regular Federal Bulk, Blazer Brass, Winchester Gold Box, Aguila, and some CCI mini-mag. The CCi mini mag definitely runs the best with fewer problems but still stick in the gun sometimes and not eject the casing.
The fact that Mini-Mags sometimes fail to eject is a cause for concern, because I (along with many .22lr shooters) have found them to be the most reliable of .22lr rounds. However, there is one last-ditch remedy you can try before sending your .22 compact back to S&W. Some new semi-autos are "tight", and need to be broken in with high-powered ammo before they loosen up enough to work with regular ammo. I recommend getting some CCI Stingers and/or CCI Velocitors and running a couple of hundred of them through your gun. These are high velocity .22s, and if they don't make your gun run better, then you'll need to send it back. Good Luck!
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Old 01-16-2020, 05:21 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
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The fact that Mini-Mags sometimes fail to eject is a cause for concern, because I (along with many .22lr shooters) have found them to be the most reliable of .22lr rounds. However, there is one last-ditch remedy you can try before sending your .22 compact back to S&W. Some new semi-autos are "tight", and need to be broken in with high-powered ammo before they loosen up enough to work with regular ammo. I recommend getting some CCI Stingers and/or CCI Velocitors and running a couple of hundred of them through your gun. These are high velocity .22s, and if they don't make your gun run better, then you'll need to send it back. Good Luck!
Ah yes, CCI Stingers. I have shot 100 rounds of those too, but that is all.
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Old 01-17-2020, 04:28 PM
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Thanks for all the help and suggestions from everyone.

Sent e-mail off to S&W this morning. Return said they would answer in 3 to 5 days. Will see what they have to say.
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Old 01-23-2020, 09:12 PM
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Today I cleaned it, lubed it and put 60 rounds of Federal 36 grain 1260 FPS through it with 30 "failed to extract" and a few "failed to feed". So, 50% failure ! That's unacceptable.

FEDEX off today to Smith and Wesson with the pitiful details. Hope they fix it.
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Old 01-23-2020, 10:40 PM
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We have a M&P22 Compact, it's pretty reliable, but it does best with Remington 36 gr golden bullets and CCI Velocitor.
It did not like Winchester Wildcat 22 at all.
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Old 01-24-2020, 10:06 AM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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I have shot some of the Remington 36 grain Goldens through it and had unacceptable number of problems. CCI mini-mag goes right through it but that ammo is more than double what the bulk range ammos cost.

I see no reason why it should not shoot the Federal 36 grain hollow-point, 1260 FPS bulk ammo, and that is what I shot yesterday with an over 50% failure rate ! That's just not acceptable as far as I'm concerned.

Now, let's see what Smith and Wesson says about it. I furnished them that information when I shipped it back to them.

If that's the best it will do, then I'll be buying the Glock 44 soon I think.
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Old 02-01-2020, 10:24 AM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Well, I shipped it last Friday and they signed for it Monday morning at S&W.

It took them until today (pretty much a week) just to send me an e-mail to say they had received it and were beginning "processing" it.

Not too impressed with that really !

I would have expected that in that amount of time, they should be able to have at least inspected it and examined the problem.

So, we'll see how the rest of this goes.
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  #31  
Old 02-01-2020, 10:35 AM
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What you describe is actually pretty quick turnaround, even for just an acknowledgement. Hopefully they will fix it quickly.
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Old 02-01-2020, 10:48 AM
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Keep in mind that S&W could sign for 50 firearms a day. Heck, it could be 100. I really have no idea. Just keep in mind that yours is not the only firearm that they signed for on that particular day.
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  #33  
Old 02-01-2020, 12:59 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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It was a generic form letter with a number assigned to it. Done by a clerk somewhere in service department. Actual time to process it probably less than 2 minutes. If they get 50 a day, they should have responded to all of them in about an hour and a half !
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  #34  
Old 02-01-2020, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by HJBM&P22Custom View Post
It was a generic form letter with a number assigned to it. Done by a clerk somewhere in service department. Actual time to process it probably less than 2 minutes. If they get 50 a day, they should have responded to all of them in about an hour and a half !
Ah, but that assumes they get an uninterrupted run at one task, and that's not the modern corporate way.
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  #35  
Old 02-01-2020, 02:42 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Ah, but that assumes they get an uninterrupted run at one task, and that's not the modern corporate way.
I don't know their process, but I can promise you that if it takes a week to send what is probably a system generated response with an ID number assigned to it, they really need to go look at their process.
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  #36  
Old 02-01-2020, 03:53 PM
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A couple of years ago, I sent my 10,000 round 40c back to S&W when it developed occasional failures to fire. They replaced every internal moving part except the extractor. There was no charge, of course. Total turnaround time was three weeks. Repairs were successful, and my 40c has worked perfectly for over 5,000 rounds since the repair. Given the volume of guns S&W works on under their lifetime service policy, I was very pleased with their performance. I expect that your experience will be just as positive.
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  #37  
Old 02-01-2020, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by HJBM&P22Custom View Post
It was a generic form letter with a number assigned to it. Done by a clerk somewhere in service department. Actual time to process it probably less than 2 minutes. If they get 50 a day, they should have responded to all of them in about an hour and a half !
As a firearms manufacturer Im pretty sure they have many regulations to follow, so I doubt it is the teenaged daughter of the shop foreman just slapping numbers on a form letter 50 times an hour for the repair process to start.
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  #38  
Old 02-01-2020, 05:56 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Originally Posted by swsig View Post
A couple of years ago, I sent my 10,000 round 40c back to S&W when it developed occasional failures to fire. They replaced every internal moving part except the extractor. There was no charge, of course. Total turnaround time was three weeks. Repairs were successful, and my 40c has worked perfectly for over 5,000 rounds since the repair. Given the volume of guns S&W works on under their lifetime service policy, I was very pleased with their performance. I expect that your experience will be just as positive.
Well I certainly hope so but we shall see.
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  #39  
Old 02-01-2020, 05:58 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Originally Posted by murphydog View Post
As a firearms manufacturer I’m pretty sure they have many regulations to follow, so I doubt it is the teenaged daughter of the shop foreman just slapping numbers on a form letter 50 times an hour for the repair process to start.
Regulations to send out a form letter via electronic e-mail, telling customer that they have received the unit you sent them ? I'm guessing very little regulations associated with that part of the process.

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  #40  
Old 02-17-2020, 04:11 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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OK, got notification that S&W has shipped my M&P 22 compact via FedEx today and it will arrive on Wednesday, so 3 weeks from the time they received it, they shipped it back.

Pretty good turnaround I guess.

Now, just have to see if they fixed it because I got no communication from them as to what was wrong or what they had to do with it. So, I assume if they found something they fixed it on their dime.

Looking forward to getting it and taking it out for a good acceptance test.
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  #41  
Old 02-17-2020, 04:42 PM
mckenney99 mckenney99 is online now
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Glad to hear that your pistol is on it's way back. Just to give you the best chance for success and less potential headaches. When you get it back, give it a thorough cleaning, focused on the breachface and chamber, followed up with a proper lubing in the locations shown on P.27 in the manual. If the techs test fired your pistol after any work they probably didn't clean it before shipping and I have seen some pretty cruddy guns sent back from repairs. (In their defense, if they clean them after test firing, some customers don't believe it was actually test fired. If they sent them back dirty, then some customers complained that they got a dirty gun back. No win situation.)
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  #42  
Old 02-17-2020, 05:36 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Hey thanks for that great suggestion. I never even gave it a thought but I sure will clean and lube it before I go shoot it.
Last time I shot it, I had 50% (30 out of 60) fail to extracts with it and had to shove a dowel down the throat to dislodge the round. Sure seems to be like a dimensional problem with the chamber.

I don't care if it doesn't always feed another round as long as I can eject the fired round by racking the slide and have it chamber another round.

Wife is primary shooter with it and she's pretty excited to get it back. I had just spent a good amount of time in zeroing in the sights...hope they didn't mess those up.

Thanks for the tip.

Last edited by HJBM&P22Custom; 09-02-2020 at 10:47 AM.
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  #43  
Old 02-17-2020, 10:19 PM
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My first thought was that in addition to the possibility of a tight chamber I'd be looking at the extractor too. Maybe the hook was not sharp enough to properly "grab" the rim, or maybe the spring was weak, etc...
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  #44  
Old 02-18-2020, 01:01 AM
mckenney99 mckenney99 is online now
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One additional recommendation. Start with CCI Mini-mags, either solids or hollow points or CCI Standard Velocity 40gr LRN (#0032). They are a known for their consistency of high quality and for just plain working in the 22 Compact. If you give the gun a good start and establish a baseline for (hopefully) reliable function with the Mini-mags, then start trying other ammo to see what works (maybe cheaper) and what doesn't. Good luck.

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  #45  
Old 02-18-2020, 01:54 AM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
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My first thought was that in addition to the possibility of a tight chamber I'd be looking at the extractor too. Maybe the hook was not sharp enough to properly "grab" the rim, or maybe the spring was weak, etc...
If it were not for the fact that 50% of the rounds I fired last time not only "failed to extract" I could not remove them by racking the slide multiple times, or trying to pull them out of the chamber with a fairly large pocket knife. I actually had to insert a wooden rod I made just to be able to insert it into the barrel and push the round out of the chamber with a good push.

Not all ammo was 50% failure but I estimate 20% or so over the variety of ammo I fired. So, that makes me think that the extractor was able to grab the round and pull it out most of the time with most ammo.

I'm anxious to get it back and see if they include any paperwork that maybe tells me what they did to it, if anything. Hopefully they found something that they were able to make a change to help the functioning.
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  #46  
Old 02-18-2020, 01:56 AM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mckenney99 View Post
One additional recommendation. Start with CCI Mini-mags, either solids or hollow points or CCI Standard Velocity 40gr LRN (#0032). They are a known for their consistency of high quality and for just plain working in the 22 Compact. If you give the gun a good start and establish a baseline for (hopefully) reliable function with the Mini-mags, then start trying other ammo to see what works (maybe cheaper) and what doesn't. Good luck.
I do have some mini mags and will shoot some of those when I get it back, but honestly if it doesn't shoot some bulk range ammo, it's going back again !

Thanks for the suggestion.
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  #47  
Old 02-18-2020, 10:23 AM
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HJB

You can call S&W and if you're polite and persistent, and you get a
good rep, and the stars align just right, they will research the work order and tell you exactly what was done to your pistol.

Most times, they don't disclose exactly what was done. I sent them a M&P rifle last year and it came back with paper that said
"replace bolt" - nothing else. Naturally I wanted to know why.

I called them and the rep (Matt) researched the work order and
found the gas key screws had sheared off, giving the rifle a huge
gas leak and causing the jamming. This is why they replaced the entire bolt. Now if I hadn't gone further with them, I would
never had known what exactly they did to fix the rifle.

Made me feel a lot better in that I know why it failed and what to watch for going further, should it fail again. You can read
about it in the rifle section (M&P15 Short stroking)
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  #48  
Old 02-18-2020, 10:37 AM
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If you can't remove the spent case with a pocket knife it's got to have some problem with the chamber.

Lot of things can happen. I've seen it where the firing pin was just a skosh long. Even though there was a brass case there to absorb the impact it still peened the chamber mouth just ever so slightly.
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  #49  
Old 02-18-2020, 12:13 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noro View Post
HJB

You can call S&W and if you're polite and persistent, and you get a
good rep, and the stars align just right, they will research the work order and tell you exactly what was done to your pistol.

Most times, they don't disclose exactly what was done. I sent them a M&P rifle last year and it came back with paper that said
"replace bolt" - nothing else. Naturally I wanted to know why.

I called them and the rep (Matt) researched the work order and
found the gas key screws had sheared off, giving the rifle a huge
gas leak and causing the jamming. This is why they replaced the entire bolt. Now if I hadn't gone further with them, I would
never had known what exactly they did to fix the rifle.

Made me feel a lot better in that I know why it failed and what to watch for going further, should it fail again. You can read
about it in the rifle section (M&P15 Short stroking)
Thank you sir, that is good advice. I'm really anxious to get it back and see if it works. Then I might call them after I have that information, and especially if it still does not perform adequately. What number did you call to get to talk to the tech ?
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  #50  
Old 02-18-2020, 12:16 PM
HJBM&P22Custom HJBM&P22Custom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glenwolde View Post
If you can't remove the spent case with a pocket knife it's got to have some problem with the chamber.

Lot of things can happen. I've seen it where the firing pin was just a skosh long. Even though there was a brass case there to absorb the impact it still peened the chamber mouth just ever so slightly.
That is pretty much what I thought. And it had that symptom pretty much from the time I first bought it and the failure rate varied quite a bit depending on the ammo. Mini mags were almost 100% where as Federal Auto Match was a total 100% failure. Federal bulk failed at a 50% rate on the batch I shot and documented details that I sent back to S&W with the gun.
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