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  #1  
Old 04-06-2013, 06:12 PM
ohbejuan ohbejuan is offline
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Default XM193 FTE Issues?

I just had a chance to shoot my M&P 15 OR today for the first time. I had several mags loaded up with the 5.56 Brown Box Federal XM193 and just about every single round (5-10) I tried to put through it, it was an FTE and the next round would get jammed up into the back of the previous. Has anyone else had a similar problem?

I switched to some of the .223 Federal 100 Round Value Pack stuff you used to get at Wal-Mart (AE223BL) and every single round out of the entire box had not a single issue.
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Old 04-06-2013, 06:27 PM
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AR-Getsome AR-Getsome is offline
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I never had a problem. I shot some last week @100 & 200 yards. They performed flawlessly.
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Old 04-07-2013, 11:22 PM
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Default XM193 Problems in a KelTec SU-16C

Hi,

I had a KelTec SU16C which refused to eject XM193. The rifle was brand new so I was not happy. One of the range officers was next to me shooting a Mini-14. I gave him a box of the XM193 to try and every one cycled in his rifle. Really pissed me off!

But... before destroying the rifle I drove to the nearest LGS and bought some expensive Hornady rounds. Every one fired and ejected perfectly.

From my understanding, XM193 rounds are Lake City military rejects. However, some of the reasons for rejection are supposed to be minor. Be that as it may, I will never buy another XM193 round.
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Old 04-07-2013, 11:46 PM
Rmag Rmag is offline
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Just put 100 rounds through my brand new M&P 15T, no problems.

You may want to load some rounds in the magazine, chamber one, and then slowly pull the charging handle back and watch the bolt retract. Maybe you can see what's going on. If the bolt isn't extracting the round, maybe you have an extractor pin/spring issue?

Last edited by Rmag; 04-07-2013 at 11:49 PM.
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Old 04-07-2013, 11:58 PM
ohbejuan ohbejuan is offline
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I think for the time being I'm going to stick to the 55 gr federal washed brass stuff (walmart cheap-o)...

I shot 100 rounds of it without a single issue yesterday after the 3-5 FTE problems with the 5.56. I did a thorough cleaning yesterday and put another 70 rounds of the .223 fed through it without a single hiccup. I may give it a try in the future, just a bit bothered by it, but I understand it's a slightly different round
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Old 04-08-2013, 12:22 AM
Rmag Rmag is offline
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Did you clean your gun before using it for the first time?
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Old 04-08-2013, 06:43 AM
MichiganScott MichiganScott is offline
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If it's not extracting the empty case, the rubber gizmo that usually is with the extractor spring may be missing and the higher port pressure of the milsurp ammo may be pulling the extractor over the rim before the brass springs back and releases its hold on the chamber walls.

I don't remember exactly which one S&W uses, but the gizmo is usually a rubber donut around the spring or a rubber plug inside the coils.

Along the same line of thought, is the buffer and buffer spring original and did you ever take the buffer apart?
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Old 04-08-2013, 10:01 AM
BillyJack2012 BillyJack2012 is offline
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As MichiganScott asks, is this a new, factory OR and were any modifications done to it? I shoot XM1193 almost exclusively unless I can find the Federal .223 stuff somewhere. I've never had a failure of any kind. I'd look into modifications or any issues you may have. 193 should cycle fine for you.
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Old 04-08-2013, 08:21 PM
ohbejuan ohbejuan is offline
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I did not clean it before using it for the first time, so there is a potential there.

I also did make a few modifications before using it (so I'm definitely not faulting S&W and their weapon). It very well could be the buffer/gas block/etc. I'll give it a shot next time I'm at the range or get a hold of some more of the lake city stuff. If all else fails, as long as I can manage to find it, I don't have any issue in shooting only 223, it worked flawlessly!

I'm just concerned that the brass itself of the XM193 was dirty, surely that adds (even microns?) to the thickness of the casing inside the chamber? From what I understand, this is standard of the XM193.
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Old 04-08-2013, 08:30 PM
BillyJack2012 BillyJack2012 is offline
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Clean and lube. Run it wet.
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyJack2012 View Post
Clean and lube. Run it wet.
And break it in then it should run smooth with the ammo..George
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:07 PM
MichiganScott MichiganScott is offline
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The AR15 is a battle rifle. They run dirty if lubricated with just about anything. There are pictures of them on the Internet with 5000+ rounds with nothing more than a couple of squirts of Vagisil Douche at regular intervals. Figure how well they will run if properly maintained.

Google "Filthy AR15".
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiganScott View Post
If it's not extracting the empty case, the rubber gizmo that usually is with the extractor spring may be missing and the higher port pressure of the milsurp ammo may be pulling the extractor over the rim before the brass springs back and releases its hold on the chamber walls.

I don't remember exactly which one S&W uses, but the gizmo is usually a rubber donut around the spring or a rubber plug inside the coils.

Along the same line of thought, is the buffer and buffer spring original and did you ever take the buffer apart?
Ya what he said!! Easy enough to check to see if this is your issue without firing a single round. I also suggest you look.. George
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:31 PM
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Is there any way to check to see if the rubber part of the extractor is there/in good shape without taking the bolt apart? I watched a video on that and it would seem to be slightly out of my comfort zone...

I'll definitely try a 556 shell and watch the extraction closely
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:33 PM
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Oh, btw, I did Remoil it before firing, just not a thorough cleaning/brushing
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:44 PM
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Page 34 of the Safety & Instruction Manual M&P 15 Centerfire Rifles:

"Before using your firearm for the first time, it should be cleaned.
• Your firearm was treated at the factory with either a preservative or oil to protect it against corrosion during shipping and storage.
• Preservative and oil should be wiped from the bore, chamber and exposed areas using a clean swab or patch before using the firearm."

Not sure how much it matters but I did it.
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Old 04-08-2013, 09:45 PM
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If cleaning and lubricating it doesn't work, then try changing magazines. They are a "usual suspect" with AR problems.
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Old 04-08-2013, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
I also did make a few modifications before using it (so I'm definitely not faulting S&W and their weapon). It very well could be the buffer/gas block/etc. I'll give it a shot next time I'm at the range or get a hold of some more of the lake city stuff. If all else fails, as long as I can manage to find it, I don't have any issue in shooting only 223, it worked flawlessly!
What did you modify ?
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Old 04-08-2013, 10:48 PM
ohbejuan ohbejuan is offline
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Gas block/rails/compensator/buffer/buffer spring
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  #20  
Old 04-09-2013, 11:50 AM
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sounds like a can of worms


fear the free
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Old 04-09-2013, 01:13 PM
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Pull the extractor and check for what parts are there. Put original buffer and original buffer spring back in and start from there.. It sure as heck should run great with 5.56's too.. George
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Old 05-24-2013, 07:09 PM
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I know this is an older one, but I did finally seem to fix the problem. I changed the entire extractor assembly with the BCM extractor kit and had 0 problems firing Independence and Federal XM193 over 20-30 some rounds. My original extractor from S&W did have the rubber ring over the extractor spring, but the replacement seems to provide much more force than the original
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Old 05-24-2013, 07:56 PM
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Nice to here all is well and it worked out for you! good people here that know a lot and are willing to help always! George
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Old 05-24-2013, 08:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohbejuan View Post
I know this is an older one, but I did finally seem to fix the problem. I changed the entire extractor assembly with the BCM extractor kit and had 0 problems firing Independence and Federal XM193 over 20-30 some rounds. My original extractor from S&W did have the rubber ring over the extractor spring, but the replacement seems to provide much more force than the original
Good to hear, and must admit I am surprised. Did you compare the extractor with the original?
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Old 05-24-2013, 08:28 PM
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The original extractor looked fine. Smaller spring (than the BCM) and it was much much much easier to get the pin in/out of the original than it was this BCM version.

The original I was able to push down with my fingers relatively easily and insert the pin. The BCM model took channel locks to hold in place properly to compress the spring. The original looked perfectly in tact with no missing parts or damage that I see, but it was not pulling one single 5.56 out of there (while .223 was all working perfectly)
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Old 05-24-2013, 08:57 PM
ihaschzbrgr ihaschzbrgr is offline
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Maybe it's the magazine?
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Old 05-24-2013, 09:18 PM
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Nah, I think it was the extractor, all fixed up now. Was only using magpul mags
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