My buddy brought his Olympic Arms rifle to the range and I fell in love with the platform.

So now I am looking to either build an AR from scratch, which to be honest is my current preference but my local gun store seems to love the S&W ARs and was curious where they stand among manufacturers (Olympic, Bushmaster, Stag, etc). Any honest answers would be appreciated. I love my 40c and 22.

Also, I apologize if this is asked and answered... its and odd topic to search. I found one thread on thefiringline form 2009.

Olympic is like Charter Arms of the AR world. There are tons of people talking bad, but they're not complete junk.
S&W M&P-15s are probably in the upper mid-tier. On par with Rock River, Stag or Spike's, and a bit above Bushmaster, DPMS or Del-Ton.

Tier 2.
Well, it's not a Colt or Noveske that much I know.

Emory

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Hard To Kill

i have had my S&W ar15-x for about 3 years..****ns flawless...top shelf rifle for sure

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SWCA#2208
KK4EMO

scroll down a little bit to the thread called " what tier is the m&p15" and it addresses this topic and is pretty recent.

edit: it's on page 2, here is the link:
What "Tier" is the M&P AR-15?

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686/M&P9 Pro/M&P15X/M&P15-22

They are second tier. First tier are brands like larue, Jp, noveske. Second tier are S&W, colt, mossberg, stag. Then everything else would make up lower tiers.

Thanks for the link and input everyone. I will read the link provided.

If Colt is the rifle all others are compared to, how is it second tier?

S&W makes a good reliable rifle. It is not "mil-spec", but it it made to the same dimensions, so you can swap anything out. You will typically get more features for the money on a S&W than you will on a Colt. Things like free floated barrel, quad rail, Magpul furniture, etc.

this is an old argument...S&W makes a quality product....there are other forums that swear that unless you have dropped $2500 on your rifle you have bought junk. It is reassuring to see how much S&W's quality has increased their reputation. Even Colt is now manufacturing a rifle to compete against the S&W Sport.
As was stated in this months American Rifleman, no manufacturer makes 100% of the components in their AR platform. If you are buying the rifle as a status symbol then go ahead and buy one of the more expensive offerings. If you want a rifle that will give you excellent service, accuracy and cost with a great warranty then buy the S&W brand.
It wasn't that many years ago that I thought Colt was the end all of AR's, all it took was one trip out hunting to sway me to the Sport. I have shot a lot of different brands, just recently an LMT, nice rifles each and everyone of them but the tier system drives me crazy. These rifles are meant to be rebuilt, not last forever like a traditional rifle. So get whatever floats your boat and enjoy!!

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Grover Oathkeeper

I never said anything was wrong with second tier. I don't have $3000 for a larue or their equal. The M&P line of rifles and pistols are the cream of the crop as far as I'm concerned.

THE GUY ON POST 13 nailed it....

Buy something with a big name if you want to impress your friends,

Buy an M&P if you want to impress everybody at the range....


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Kirk / Spock 2020

there is no post #13
lol

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Grover Oathkeeper

There is on the referenced thread you weenie!!!!


BTW: Just so you don't have to go look, it was ME saying the M&P was a fine rifle.....


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Kirk / Spock 2020

LOL Ok I wasnt paying attention that closely...sorry

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Grover Oathkeeper

LOL!!!

I wouldn't dis you One eye.... You could probably hit me from where you are now!!!!


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Kirk / Spock 2020

I dunno, that guy's posts are questionable at best. He thinks that you have to have a forward assist and dust cover.

That's one of the problems with the tiers...How are they defined and who defines them? Some say the boutique makers are tier one, while others say Colt and other mil-spec rifles are top tier.

I have a Sport that does everything I could ask a rifle to do, so you know what I think of the tier system!

It really seems like "top tier" is user specific, much the same way handgun caliber is judged by some - whatever caliber the person uses is "big" enough while everything larger is over doing it and everything less is underpowered. i.e. if you carry a .40, .45 is overkill and 9mm isn't enough; but if you carry a 9mm, it's plenty while .40 and .45 are overkill but .380 is weak.

Tell me I'm wrong that people aren't the same way with thier AR-15's. If you have the uber exensive guns, anything less isn't something you can trust your life with. If you have something midrange priced, it's "top shelf" to you with those other guys spending needless money for a boutique rifle, but you'll still turn your nose up at a DPMS. But the guy whose DPMS or Olympic hasn't ever had a hitch is wondering what all the poo-pooing is about.

Granted those are generalizations and there are exceptions, plenty of which frequent this forum. More a commentary and the general state of things. Bottom line is get what you can afford and when it doesn't have a problem you'll consider it money well spent. If however you get a lemon WHICH CAN BE FOUND AT ANY PRICE LEVEL hopefully for all the money you spent you will have chosen a company with good customer service. I'm not saying they are the only one, but Smith and Wesson has exceptional customer service. A big part of the reason I keep buying their guns - that and the inherent quality.

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686/M&P9 Pro/M&P15X/M&P15-22

I been shooting AR's since the 1970's and back then
you had a choice of barrel lengths and that was it.
Started with a Colt A2 then bought a couple of H-Bars.
I've since bought Olympics, Bushmasters, and a Rock
River. I don't believe i have ever paid more than 1000
for any AR. I'll tell you this, a dead Groundhog, Prairie
Dog, Coyote, can't tell you how much the rifle costs
or what "tier" a rifle it was.
My advise is get your money in your barrel and glass.

Chuck

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They hold no Quarter

You don't have to have them....

But I want them.

It's how I was trained. Can't unteach an old horse old tricks, or something like that.

I'm going to get a Sport this year and probably even install the aftermarket forward assist. Maybe not the dust cover, but for sure the FA.


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Kirk / Spock 2020

My work gun is a Colt 10.5" M4. I have no regrets about purchasing a S&W M&P MOE as my personal AR. Smith functions and I actually enjoy shooting it more than the Colt.

Comparing apples to oranges but I have both Smith and Colt revolvers that are a hundred years old. I shoot them both regularly. How many of the boutique gun companies will be around in a hundred years?

I bought my first AR a week n a half ago, an M&P 15x. I have been putting money away for 3 years now to buy one. I went to the gun shop and they had almost all the "tiers" there. I picked them all up and handled each one, checking quality, build ect.. the M&P stuck out the most, it just felt right. I'm not a big fan of Colt, I'm currently in the Marine Corps and have shot a colt ar MANY times. I just don't know what the big deal is them, that's just me though. The way I saw it was I could get a high quality, reliable near mil spec rifle for around $1200 in the M&P. The rest of my savings now go towards the fun stuff: tangodown vfg, magpul ctr stock, magpul grip, troy ff rails ect....

In my opinion, S&W is not as good as Colt, but better than most of the others.

I always laughed about the "tiering" of AR rifles. Not that I would know, but do car guys "tier" sports cars? If so, could a Corvette beat an Ferrari on any given day? Could a BMW beat a Porsche on the other days? Of course.

I think the effectiveness of the rifle lies with the shooter. Although I am partial to Colts, Armalites, and Windham ME Bushmasters, I think S & W turns out a good product. Let's face it, the AR's design is well suited to mass production. Mass production drives down price and allows for a product to be produced on large scales.

I think you probably can't go wrong with a S & W AR style rifle. My state's Highway Patrol issues them to the troopers and they've been pretty impressive everytime I've seen one deployed.

Someone will come along and tell me how wrong I am, and that's fine. I suggest you shoot different brands if you can, and purchase what you can afford/what you like.

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Un-Reconstructed Southerner